When you don't have enough in the first place 10% is huge.
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Xbox One UI vid w/Snap
- Thread starter PhatSaqs
- Start date
When you don't have enough in the first place 10% is huge.
quickwhips
Member
These are the silliest statements ever. Don't have enough what? Games will be fine on X1 everyone is just caught up in the console war right now.
Yeah, those 30 second reads at gaf on the tv screen...instead of doing it on your mobile wtih probably a much better redability...that's a KILLER feature. Guys, please...
Tripp Daily
Member
I don't think the video is showing an ideal use for the snap feature. There will be apps tailored to the snap feature to give you and much easier and accessible view of information.
I envision using this for live updated sports scores, skype calls and fantasy sports while playing or watching games. This works while playing a game or watching tv so I would imagine the skype call being the biggest item.
Good luck trying to watch a Youtube clip in that tiny 1/3 of a screen.
Caayn
Member
Every system reserves a certain percentage of power for their OS to use. The Xbox 360 and PS3 do that and so does the PS4. Devs don't have, and never will have, access to 100% of the power on either systems.
No, the 10% of the GPU power that is reserved isn't the biggest reason why the Xbox One is slower. It's that very same GPU in the first place, not the power reservation. The power reservation is just a slight increase to the power gap.
RedNumberFive
Banned
I just don't get this snapping thing.
Snapping a version of IE, with a borderline unusable aspect ratio, seems like an inferior experience to just pulling out my iPad. I get the use scenario for fantasy football stuff, but everything else just seems to be a poor solution to a problem that doesn't exist.
Snapping a version of IE, with a borderline unusable aspect ratio, seems like an inferior experience to just pulling out my iPad. I get the use scenario for fantasy football stuff, but everything else just seems to be a poor solution to a problem that doesn't exist.
What do you mean don't have enough what? The subject of those posts is that 10% of the GPU is used for Snap and other similar features, most of which many people have said they do not want.
The Xbone GPU is only 1.31TF in the first place, against 1.84 for its cheaper competitor. They are giving up an additional 10% for these features, making that gap even larger.
If the prices were swapped over almost ALL of this fighting and crying and shit that's been all over GAF for months wouldn't be close to as big an issue. People would really not care and just make the choice, cheaper machine, lower res, more expensive machine, higher res.
But that isn't where we are.
People that have an Xbone will, I'm sure, love the games they play, and will think they look great. That is not in question.
I forget where I said that any did. But 10% of a GPU (I'm totally guessing here) is substantially more than the PS3, the PS4, the Xbox, The 360 allocate to something other than gaming. Every system reserves CPU time and RAM for the Os and other tasks, but not that much GPU time, because they don't need to.
As I said above, people who have an Xbone will enjoy the games, think they look great, and I've no doubt that plenty will never even know that the PS4 is different. Their enjoyment shall not be spoiled, their lives shall not change, they will be happy with their purchase.
Maybe, I'll give it a chance though and seeing some of the apps like Machinima has me anxious to see what else can be developed in the future. As a programmer myself stuff like this is very interesting to me.
I agree I use my phone to browse the net when i'am playing,if i need a game guide or youtube tip videos.
The benefit of this interface is that it will make gaming more accessible.
When I game now, I boot up my PS3 and change my AV input then wait for the game to load, it probably takes about 1-2 mins total time to get into the game, and although this does not seem much, there are times when I intend to game but cant be bothered in waiting and rather just stay on PC and read gaf, watch movies,youtube etc (my PC is connected to my 40''tv by the way)
So in a way the XBOX one is trying to replace your av equipment, which will mean the xbox one will be switched on a lot of the time, personally this wont benefit me because I use my PC for movies/internet and the rest of my multimedia things, if I could hdmi passthrough my PC through the X1 it would be cool because then I could switch instantly into my paused game rather then have to wait a few mins.
Familys and people who dont have there pc attached to there main TV's would also benefit from the instant switching, with the X1 becoming the multimedia hub.
I think it will become a lot of ppls main hub, because this generation the only thing that made people switch off there PS3/360's was when they wanted to watch tv, now with the X1 its really makes your entertainment more accessible with instant access to every type of media you could want from your tv.
but having a PC attached to your tv kind of wrecks Microsofts vision of having there device always on when your using your TV.
In 20 years Microsoft and sony and maybe some other companies will offer a device that does everything that works with multiple screens wirelessly, and is designed to work for entertainment and work, consoles and PC's will be a dieing breed.
I think I have just described steam machines/steam OS, holy shit valve are ingenious .
GrizzleBoy
Banned
Been doing that for a year in Windows 8 already.
Doing it right now.
Problem? Nope.
Gonna be more of a problem on a bigger TV screen? Noooope. (37 inch TV for PC monitor in man cave, bigger TV in living room)
This discussion has happened a bunch of times. The 10% is not what I'm talking about. It's bigger than that. Here, once more:
Multitasking like this is a big reason why the Xbone had to have 8GB of RAM. A decision they made a long time ago and since they needed so much RAM and couldn't count on cheap GDDR5, they had to use slower DDR3 RAM. Which means they needed on chip cache to speed things up for graphics, which took away from their GPU budget on the chip.
Which left us with a 1.34 TFLOPS GPU.
THEN, you take off another 10% for some of the window scaling tricks and we have a machine with 600 GFLOPS less than the PS4.
Not really, this is an integrated implementation with options for tailored apps to snap on. And you have the option to bolt on apps being used on your Xbox One. We dont know the extent of this, but we know you can share game meta data in real time, where as the others dont offer nearly as much options.
30 seconds without looking anywhere is convenient and i suppose many more seconds while you wait for multiplayer games to be setup. I know many will be happy with this.
So you can read all that in the video? You think you'd be able to see the action (imagine watching Madden tips). You'll be able to see what options players would be choosing? I don't think so.
Wait it's now down to a, well we all have smart phones, tablets, etc. But I don't want to move my eye balls.
Insane.
TheLegendOfMart
Banned
Imagine that tiny window at 6-10+ feet away. Gluck trying to see any detail.
Been doing that for a year in Windows 8 already.
Doing it right now.
Problem? Nope.
Gonna be more of a problem on a bigger TV screen? Noooope. (37 inch TV for PC monitor in man cave, bigger TV in living room)
BronsonLee
Member
Nice. Figured something like this would come out before a true live demo after all the hubbub. I'd like to see all of it though.
But yeah, it's basically Windows 8. Oh for stuff like Twitter/Facebook/stuff that's an app that takes the size into account, it kicks ass. But if I wanted that on my TV, I'd just install it on my HTPC.
It works sweet for tablets too, but I don't really want to apply it to consoles. Navigating the app while playing sounds like hell on earth. Shit, the DS4 would work perfect for it with that trackpad
Also: How comes Windows 8 is so derided, but the same exact feature/OS on a console causes this sort of reaction? Have you guys not used it before? All your ideas are old hat.
But yeah, it's basically Windows 8. Oh for stuff like Twitter/Facebook/stuff that's an app that takes the size into account, it kicks ass. But if I wanted that on my TV, I'd just install it on my HTPC.
It works sweet for tablets too, but I don't really want to apply it to consoles. Navigating the app while playing sounds like hell on earth. Shit, the DS4 would work perfect for it with that trackpad
Also: How comes Windows 8 is so derided, but the same exact feature/OS on a console causes this sort of reaction? Have you guys not used it before? All your ideas are old hat.
I didnt say that, thats how you choose to put it.
I only take out my phone because thats the quickest option. This implementation seems to help with that.
clearly the text will scale, or be scaleable.
Caayn
Member
And how does my post neglect all of this?
TheLegendOfMart
Banned
Video windows won't, the whole point of using it is so you can watch TV or watch youtube walkthroughs, etc.. while you play.
If it's snapped in the way he showed if you are the recommended viewing distance away from a big TV how are you going to see the detail?
D'ultimate
Member
What is wrong with some of you people? Is it impossible for some to use their imaginations?
He is primarily on GAF while also having Youtube up. He can choose to watch the Video in that smaller window, and depending on the size of his monitor it is absolutely possible that he may see "detail" or whatever he wants to see in the Youtube video.
Or...or...wait for it....He could freaking switch them around. He could make the Youtube video bigger and shrink GAF for however long it takes for him to "see any detail". I know, I know. Amazing!! Who would have ever thought of that? :-/
Options. How do they work?
BronsonLee
Member
That is app specific and requires a custom layout set by the dev, if the apps I've used on Windows 8 are any indicator.
Possible, but unlikely for a browser
TheLegendOfMart
Banned
That's great if you sit up close to a monitor.
I use snap on 60" TV and I sit maybe 10 feet away from it and all you see is something moving in the top right of the screen, you can't see any detail just colour.
I REALLY don't see the point in snapping something to the TV, you can't see whats happening and you are compromising the real estate for whatever else you are doing on the console at the same time.
In an age where a lot of people have tablets and smartphones is this REALLY a killer feature?
I went to bed after this post. I stated my opinion, and moved on with the discussion, whereas you had to reiterate to everyone over and again why you hated it. Definition of thread shitting. Don't like it, don't use it.
I was still just speaking about your first post that I replied to, where you asked why someone would not want this feature as an option on PS4 even if we were to not use it. it was in response to someone who said that "thankfully" the PS4 does not do snapping of apps and multitasking
The reason why some of us are glad PS4 does not do this is because we know it would compromise other aspects of the machine that we happen to care more about.
that's pretty much it.
GrizzleBoy
Banned
I just tested your scenario with my 37 inch PC monitor/tv and if you can't make out anything on a 60 inch at ten feet, then my conclusion is that you could possibly do with some glasses imo.
To add to that, videos also have audio in them.
The screenshot I showed had a video of Total Biscuit running through big deals in the Halloween Steam sale while I was browsing GAF.
I didn't need to be watching it intensely to get the information I needed, but if I wanted to see what he was talking about, I could look over and see what he's talking about.
If there was something he talked about or that I saw that I wanted to see in greater detail, all it took was for me to resize the window as I shifted my primary focus to his video instead of GAFing. Once I saw what I wanted to see, made GAF my main focus again and continued to listen while I chatted.
Replace my TotalBiscuit video with podcasts, twitch streams, news outlets, youtube commentators where a lot of the time you're actually listening to them more than you're watching some random gameplay they put "under" voice and you can see where it could easily work well.
Just because you can't imagine a scenario where it would work, doesn't mean they don't exist. A feature also doesn't have to cater to you personally in order to have worth in the world. If its something you find not useful, that's okay.
So many posts in these kinds of threads basically amount to "I don't like this, so why should it exist?"
Companies are allowed to do things that interest people other than yourself, and you're allowed to be disinterested. Especially when its optional functionality that will present itself in many different ways to many different people.
MysticGoujon
Banned
You don't watch TV whilst playing a game, if you did the size of the screen would be irrelevant, you'd miss most of the content you're watching because you're trying to do two things at once. It's brilliant for watching sports, for example England football team. Unlike my beloved Liverpool, I don't want to watch every second of an England game, with snap I could snap the match to the side of the screen so I have an overview of what's going on, and then I could maximise the screen when something interesting happens, all with one voice command, beautifully elegant.
On a side point, do people really sit 10 feet away whilst playing a game? Even on big screens I have to sit within 5 foot.
yankeehater
Member
I need to post a picture of my man cave sometime. I have 2 TVs mounted right next to each other so I can watch TV while playing games.
MysticGoujon
Banned
Each to their own I guess, and do it!
yankeehater
Member
I found a pic of the man cave on my phone from when I first got the TVs mounted. Sorry it isnt a very good pic.
edit:I dont see how to upload the image.
If I include a link then it goes to everything in my skydrive account, which is not what I want.
I hope this works: http://www.flickr.com/photos/75565791@N04/10594115496/lightbox/
The setup in my living room is way better but I dont have a pic of that.
Been doing that for a year in Windows 8 already.
Doing it right now.
Problem? Nope.
Gonna be more of a problem on a bigger TV screen? Noooope. (37 inch TV for PC monitor in man cave, bigger TV in living room)
This is more akin to listening to the radio than being able to watch the clip.
Impeccable
Member
What you're implying is someone cannot effectively play a video game while simultaneously watching a Youtube video? Surely not!
Well, for starters it's not 1/3 of the screen, like it will be on x1.
If the PS4 had HDMi in or a streaming service for sports, sure.
Miles Quaritch
Member
It might still be true, but based on what we're seeing, it doesn't make the console crash when it's used in game as was claimed by a number of insiders. That's really my only issue, they made it sound like even attempting to use it would cause it to crash and yet here we have video evidence that directly contradicts that claim.
As do I, famous has been right on virtually everything he's leaked and yet...
gamechanger87
Member
What I'm confused by is how Snap is causing the games to crash. Aren't they run by different parts of the system?
BronsonLee
Member
Famous didn't talk about snap, iirc.
from what we've hear it has something to do with RAM management
Dragon Carr
Neo Member
In all fairness, It looks alright, but this is the major problem with it in IMO.
gamechanger87
Member
Hmmm. But aren't 3GBs reserved to cover the OS and deal with the snap? The other 5GBs deal with the game. If there is an issue (which there may have been, but is likely fixed) it must had been an issue with compressing the image.
Yes, many creative possibilities. The "CSI" type game could be a small Xbox Live game where you "scavenger hunt" and can browse the Web for clues....like viral marketing of sorts. Also, Indie developers can really take this "educational" angle and make games to help learn anatomy, chemistry, geography, etc.
Also, if it gets popular, this could plug into live TV game shows. You could vote for someone and/or participate in quizzes, matches, sports chat, etc.
I play Xbox World Poker Tour a lot. This would be very useful while waiting for my turn (esp those slllllooooow players). I could catch up on my streaming TV shows, study/read, chat with friends/family, or browse the net. That would be perfect for these types of games.
DING DING DING
We already had reports of this causing problem with games. Running both apps has to take some power away from gaming. Its just common sense.
They have yet to really show why this is worth it. Seem half baked....
Miles Quaritch
Member
diffusionx
Gold Member
Been doing that for a year in Windows 8 already.
Doing it right now.
Problem? Nope.
Gonna be more of a problem on a bigger TV screen? Noooope. (37 inch TV for PC monitor in man cave, bigger TV in living room)
What app do you have snapped there?
I don't think it would be a problem on my TV. It's a cool feature.