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11-yr-old Boy Bullied for Being A Brony Fighting for Life After Suicide Attempt

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Schools are getting better but still have a long way to go with the bullying problem.

I got a call to come pick up my 9 year old son from school recently because he had been in a fight after school and ended up missing the bus. I was surprised as he's easy going and gets along with everyone, and pretty much knows everyone since he plays so many sports. It seemed odd.

I get there and he's all upset - he gets very emotional, especially when he thinks things are unfair. Turns out some dirtbag kid was giving one of the kids in his class, who is a special needs kid, shit about being stupid or other shit related to his special needs. My son tells him to stop, the other kid tells him to fuck off and keeps doing it and my son sees red and pops him. Cue drama and the principal's office.

The principal lets me know that my son will be missing recess for the following week as punishment. I let the principal know that while I can't dictate what happens in school, his punishment on the home front was going to be along the lines of taking him out for ice cream right now and then congratulating him and letting him know how proud I was of him afterwards.

I understand you can't have kids belting other kids willy-nilly. I told him he had to take his punishment like a man. I also told him if it happens again to feel free to pound that kid again. Kids need to learn there are consequences to what they do. If you're gonna be a dipshit to kids weaker than you than you better be prepared if they have friends.

I guess my question is, am I crazy? Sometimes I feel very old-fashioned because, well, I am old. :) My wife was all like "violence isn't the answer", but I feel like sometimes yeah, it is. I'm pretty sure that kid is going to think twice about picking on that kid again. I grew up in a boys-don't-cry-rub-some-dirt-on-it era and worry that I'm out of touch. I don't know.

Your son stood up for the other kid in the ways he knew, first with words and then with action, when the school failed to. He's on the right path.
 
His parents should have done more.

They knew he was being bullied and was maybe pulling himself away from the other kids by being on his own and reciting parts of the bible he carried. Is that normal behaviour for an 11 year old? Yet they just said, you do what you want to do.

I can't help but think that these 'bullies' are just kids in his class not understanding that the boy was a little different and so done what kids do and made fun of him. And for him to decide to try to take his life, must mean he could have deeper issues.
 
Schools are getting better but still have a long way to go with the bullying problem.

I got a call to come pick up my 9 year old son from school recently because he had been in a fight after school and ended up missing the bus. I was surprised as he's easy going and gets along with everyone, and pretty much knows everyone since he plays so many sports. It seemed odd.

I get there and he's all upset - he gets very emotional, especially when he thinks things are unfair. Turns out some dirtbag kid was giving one of the kids in his class, who is a special needs kid, shit about being stupid or other shit related to his special needs. My son tells him to stop, the other kid tells him to fuck off and keeps doing it and my son sees red and pops him. Cue drama and the principal's office.

The principal lets me know that my son will be missing recess for the following week as punishment. I let the principal know that while I can't dictate what happens in school, his punishment on the home front was going to be along the lines of taking him out for ice cream right now and then congratulating him and letting him know how proud I was of him afterwards.

I understand you can't have kids belting other kids willy-nilly. I told him he had to take his punishment like a man. I also told him if it happens again to feel free to pound that kid again. Kids need to learn there are consequences to what they do. If you're gonna be a dipshit to kids weaker than you than you better be prepared if they have friends.

I guess my question is, am I crazy? Sometimes I feel very old-fashioned because, well, I am old. :) My wife was all like "violence isn't the answer", but I feel like sometimes yeah, it is. I'm pretty sure that kid is going to think twice about picking on that kid again. I grew up in a boys-don't-cry-rub-some-dirt-on-it era and worry that I'm out of touch. I don't know.
It sounds like your kid has a good head on his shoulders.
 

BocoDragon

or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
This actually makes me angry as hell. We might like to give Bronies a ribbing, but I honestly think they're on our team. It's cool to be into things.

I guess kids are stupid and cruel, as always. :/ They were when I was 11 too. Sucks.
 

Gannd

Banned
This actually makes me angry as hell. We might like to give Bronies a ribbing, but I honestly think they're on our team. It's cool to be into things.

I guess kids are stupid and cruel, as always. :/ They were when I was 11 too. Sucks.

This kid isn't a brony.
 

Mumei

Member
It is a myth that the school is not responsible for dealing with these issues. In fact, the school district is legally required to have a Title IX representative to deal with this sort of sexual harassment. These are the sorts of things that are covered:


  • A female student “hooked up” with a boy at her school, and now a group of girls are repeatedly texting her and tweeting about her at school, calling her a “slut” and a “whore.” This is gender-based harassment.
  • Another female student sent her boyfriend “sexts” and pictures of herself naked. Then they break up. The boyfriend shares these sexts and photos with his friends at school to get back at her. He also spreads rumors about her sexual behavior. This is sexual harassment.
  • A female student, who has short hair and wears T-shirts, baggy jeans, and sneakers, had a relationship with another girl at school, and now a group of students are repeatedly texting her and tweeting about her at school, calling her a “slut,” “whore,” “dyke,” and “butch.”
  • A male student has mostly female friends, he sings Lady Gaga songs in the hallway and is on the dance team. Fellow students call him a “fairy,” “gay boy,” or queer,” both in-person and online, and knock his books out of his hands in the hallway. He has also been physically assaulted and threatened on the school bus.
  • Students maliciously use “she” and “her” to refer to a transgender classmate, even though they know he identifies as a boy. The principal has told him to “just act like a girl.” The student enrolled in an auto shop class, and is being taunted by classmates, who make sexually suggestive jokes about the student’s “tool” and ask what’s “under the hood.”
  • In the locker room at school a group of boys surround a younger boy, grab his genitals, and tell him that they “heard he liked that.”

Title IX "prohibits gender-based harassment, which may include acts of verbal, nonverbal, or physical aggression, intimidation, or hostility based on sex or sex stereotyping. Thus, it can be sex discrimination if students are harassed either for exhibiting what is perceived as a stereotypical characteristic for their sex, or for failing to conform to stereotypical notions of masculinity and femininity. Title IX also prohibits sexual harassment and gender-based harassment of all students, regardless of the actual or perceived sexual orientation or gender identity of the harasser or target." You can find a similar statement on any school's legally required Title IX Notice of Nondiscrimination, and the OCR makes it exceedingly easy to report violations on their website.

In 2010, the OCR published this memo which said, among other things:

Some school anti-bullying policies already may list classes or traits on which bases bullying or harassment is specifically prohibited. Indeed, many schools have adopted anti-bullying policies that go beyond prohibiting bullying on the basis of traits expressly protected by the federal civil rights laws enforced by OCR—race, color, national origin, sex, and disability—to include such bases as sexual orientation and religion. While this letter concerns your legal obligations under the laws enforced by OCR, other federal, state, and local laws impose additional obligations on schools.7 And, of course, even when bullying or harassment is not a civil rights violation, schools should still seek to prevent it in order to protect students from the physical and emotional harms that it may cause.

Harassing conduct may take many forms, including verbal acts and name-calling; graphic and written statements, which may include use of cell phones or the Internet; or other conduct that may be physically threatening, harmful, or humiliating. Harassment does not have to include intent to harm, be directed at a specific target, or involve repeated incidents. Harassment creates a hostile environment when the conduct is sufficiently severe, pervasive, or persistent so as to interfere with or limit a student’s ability to participate in or benefit from the services, activities, or opportunities offered by a school. When such harassment is based on race, color, national origin, sex, or disability, it violates the civil rights laws that OCR enforces.8

A school is responsible for addressing harassment incidents about which it knows or reasonably should have known.9 In some situations, harassment may be in plain sight, widespread, or well-known to students and staff, such as harassment occurring in hallways, during academic or physical education classes, during extracurricular activities, at recess, on a school bus, or through graffiti in public areas. In these cases, the obvious signs of the harassment are sufficient to put the school on notice. In other situations, the school may become aware of misconduct, triggering an investigation that could lead to the discovery of additional incidents that, taken together, may constitute a hostile environment. In all cases, schools should have well-publicized policies prohibiting harassment and procedures for reporting and resolving complaints that will alert the school to incidents of harassment.10

When responding to harassment, a school must take immediate and appropriate action to investigate or otherwise determine what occurred. The specific steps in a school’s investigation will vary depending upon the nature of the allegations, the source of the complaint, the age of the student or students involved, the size and administrative structure of the school, and other factors. In all cases, however, the inquiry should be prompt, thorough, and impartial.

If an investigation reveals that discriminatory harassment has occurred, a school must take prompt and effective steps reasonably calculated to end the harassment, eliminate any hostile environment and its effects, and prevent the harassment from recurring. These duties are a school’s responsibility even if the misconduct also is covered by an anti-bullying policy, and regardless of whether a student has complained, asked the school to take action, or identified the harassment as a form of discrimination.

Appropriate steps to end harassment may include separating the accused harasser and the target, providing counseling for the target and/or harasser, or taking disciplinary action against the harasser. These steps should not penalize the student who was harassed. For example, any separation of the target from an alleged harasser should be designed to minimize the burden on the target’s educational program (e.g., not requiring the target to change his or her class schedule).​

If the school was aware of this (or "reasonably should have known"), the school has some legal responsibility here.
 

kirblar

Member
Schools are getting better but still have a long way to go with the bullying problem.

I got a call to come pick up my 9 year old son from school recently because he had been in a fight after school and ended up missing the bus. I was surprised as he's easy going and gets along with everyone, and pretty much knows everyone since he plays so many sports. It seemed odd.

I get there and he's all upset - he gets very emotional, especially when he thinks things are unfair. Turns out some dirtbag kid was giving one of the kids in his class, who is a special needs kid, shit about being stupid or other shit related to his special needs. My son tells him to stop, the other kid tells him to fuck off and keeps doing it and my son sees red and pops him. Cue drama and the principal's office.

The principal lets me know that my son will be missing recess for the following week as punishment. I let the principal know that while I can't dictate what happens in school, his punishment on the home front was going to be along the lines of taking him out for ice cream right now and then congratulating him and letting him know how proud I was of him afterwards.

I understand you can't have kids belting other kids willy-nilly. I told him he had to take his punishment like a man. I also told him if it happens again to feel free to pound that kid again. Kids need to learn there are consequences to what they do. If you're gonna be a dipshit to kids weaker than you than you better be prepared if they have friends.

I guess my question is, am I crazy? Sometimes I feel very old-fashioned because, well, I am old. :) My wife was all like "violence isn't the answer", but I feel like sometimes yeah, it is. I'm pretty sure that kid is going to think twice about picking on that kid again. I grew up in a boys-don't-cry-rub-some-dirt-on-it era and worry that I'm out of touch. I don't know.
The repriser always gets the punishment while the instigator gets a pass. An important life lesson, sadly. Totally agree with your stance here.
If the school was aware of this (or "reasonably should have known"), the school has some legal responsibility here.
Schools won't do jack because the people instigating it know how to avoid the watcher's eye.
 

bengraven

Member
Saw this on sites. Came to discuss it because I was spending all morning obsessing over a Karen Gillan dream I had last night. Thought it would take my mind off her.

Then I saw the op's avatar. I can't think.

Bullying sucks, is my only thought.
 

-COOLIO-

The Everyman
Schools are getting better but still have a long way to go with the bullying problem.

I got a call to come pick up my 9 year old son from school recently because he had been in a fight after school and ended up missing the bus. I was surprised as he's easy going and gets along with everyone, and pretty much knows everyone since he plays so many sports. It seemed odd.

I get there and he's all upset - he gets very emotional, especially when he thinks things are unfair. Turns out some dirtbag kid was giving one of the kids in his class, who is a special needs kid, shit about being stupid or other shit related to his special needs. My son tells him to stop, the other kid tells him to fuck off and keeps doing it and my son sees red and pops him. Cue drama and the principal's office.

The principal lets me know that my son will be missing recess for the following week as punishment. I let the principal know that while I can't dictate what happens in school, his punishment on the home front was going to be along the lines of taking him out for ice cream right now and then congratulating him and letting him know how proud I was of him afterwards.

I understand you can't have kids belting other kids willy-nilly. I told him he had to take his punishment like a man. I also told him if it happens again to feel free to pound that kid again. Kids need to learn there are consequences to what they do. If you're gonna be a dipshit to kids weaker than you than you better be prepared if they have friends.

I guess my question is, am I crazy? Sometimes I feel very old-fashioned because, well, I am old. :) My wife was all like "violence isn't the answer", but I feel like sometimes yeah, it is. I'm pretty sure that kid is going to think twice about picking on that kid again. I grew up in a boys-don't-cry-rub-some-dirt-on-it era and worry that I'm out of touch. I don't know.

punching can go badly depending on the strength and where it goes but... your son is a good kid.
 

besada

Banned
Something is wrong with our society.

Even being depressed at 11 years old I can't imagine how suicidal thoughts would creep into my mind.

Bullies are nothing new, but the effects of bullying for the victims have become far more serious. It makes me wonder why. It's sad, but far more worrying.

Kids have been killing themselves over bullying for a long time. The only thing new about it is the coverage it gets.
 

iammeiam

Member
This kid isn't a "brony" he's an eleven year old who watches cartoons. Kids are cruel.

I think the connection is actually pretty easy to understand--if you're 11, like something people make fun of you for, and then find out that not only are there groups of people out there that like the same thing, there are adults that like it, you're going to want to identify with the big group of adults. So the kid calls himself a brony because they exist, and because the kids around him are explicitly telling him it's not okay to like what he likes.
 
I find that most people who say "violence isn't the answer" have never been on the bad side of these things.

As a kid growing up who was taller, heavier and not into sports. I was picked on a lot as a kid. And even though I could have physically beaten the crap out of most of the kids that gave me shit -- I was always worried that I would have been the one to get in a lot of trouble.

In hind sight - a lot of the asshole kids that picked on me are now asshole adults. And I should have pounded them.
 

LuchaShaq

Banned
Schools are getting better but still have a long way to go with the bullying problem.

I got a call to come pick up my 9 year old son from school recently because he had been in a fight after school and ended up missing the bus. I was surprised as he's easy going and gets along with everyone, and pretty much knows everyone since he plays so many sports. It seemed odd.

I get there and he's all upset - he gets very emotional, especially when he thinks things are unfair. Turns out some dirtbag kid was giving one of the kids in his class, who is a special needs kid, shit about being stupid or other shit related to his special needs. My son tells him to stop, the other kid tells him to fuck off and keeps doing it and my son sees red and pops him. Cue drama and the principal's office.

The principal lets me know that my son will be missing recess for the following week as punishment. I let the principal know that while I can't dictate what happens in school, his punishment on the home front was going to be along the lines of taking him out for ice cream right now and then congratulating him and letting him know how proud I was of him afterwards.

I understand you can't have kids belting other kids willy-nilly. I told him he had to take his punishment like a man. I also told him if it happens again to feel free to pound that kid again. Kids need to learn there are consequences to what they do. If you're gonna be a dipshit to kids weaker than you than you better be prepared if they have friends.

I guess my question is, am I crazy? Sometimes I feel very old-fashioned because, well, I am old. :) My wife was all like "violence isn't the answer", but I feel like sometimes yeah, it is. I'm pretty sure that kid is going to think twice about picking on that kid again. I grew up in a boys-don't-cry-rub-some-dirt-on-it era and worry that I'm out of touch. I don't know.



Are you my dad?

Very similar thing happened when I was a freshmen in HS. A friend of mine who had a cleft pallet (but no mental issues) and was being called "retard" and other similar shit. After a week of this shit getting old I told him to quit it or throw down. Ended up getting suspended for a week after we had a pretty bad physical fight.

Principle/Dean were PISSED.

My parents/football coach were were proud.
Asshole's soccer coach was mad until I told him why we fought, and then he preceded to suspend him for the first 3 games.

I can't overstate much it means to know your parents have your back when shit goes sideways.
 

Mumei

Member
Schools won't do jack because the people instigating it know how to avoid the watcher's eye.

Did you miss this?:

A school is responsible for addressing harassment incidents about which it knows or reasonably should have known.9 In some situations, harassment may be in plain sight, widespread, or well-known to students and staff, such as harassment occurring in hallways, during academic or physical education classes, during extracurricular activities, at recess, on a school bus, or through graffiti in public areas. In these cases, the obvious signs of the harassment are sufficient to put the school on notice. In other situations, the school may become aware of misconduct, triggering an investigation that could lead to the discovery of additional incidents that, taken together, may constitute a hostile environment. In all cases, schools should have well-publicized policies prohibiting harassment and procedures for reporting and resolving complaints that will alert the school to incidents of harassment.10

When responding to harassment, a school must take immediate and appropriate action to investigate or otherwise determine what occurred. The specific steps in a school’s investigation will vary depending upon the nature of the allegations, the source of the complaint, the age of the student or students involved, the size and administrative structure of the school, and other factors. In all cases, however, the inquiry should be prompt, thorough, and impartial.

If an investigation reveals that discriminatory harassment has occurred, a school must take prompt and effective steps reasonably calculated to end the harassment, eliminate any hostile environment and its effects, and prevent the harassment from recurring. These duties are a school’s responsibility even if the misconduct also is covered by an anti-bullying policy, and regardless of whether a student has complained, asked the school to take action, or identified the harassment as a form of discrimination.

It is true that the school can't be responsible if the harassment was hidden and it was not reported. But if it is reported, the school has a legal obligation to investigate the issue and prevent it from happening in the future. "We just don't see it" is not a valid excuse, and it doesn't absolve them of their legal responsibilities.
 

-Deimos

Member
Yeah I don't think it's fair calling an 11 year old kid a brony. I used to watch care bears all the time as a kid, but then again, care bears are fucking awesome.
 

Yamauchi

Banned
Too bad about the boy.

The situation is so strange. I remember I was bullied after moving to a new school in the 9th grade. I was small for my age and there were two boys in particular who were friends that were giving me heck. One was really pissing me off one day so as we walked out of class I smashed his head into a locker. That boy never bothered me again and his friend ended up befriended me.

It'd be nice to say that violence is not the answer, but the social dynamics found in groups of adolescent boys are truly ugly.
 

hat_hair

Member
I find that most people who say "violence isn't the answer" have never been on the bad side of these things.

I most certainly have been on the bad side of these things. When I was 12, a kid I knew smacked me round the head with a bike lock chain while I was walking along the road. He was with a gang of about 4 teenagers, all much bigger than me. What I did was go to a house along the street and knock on the door. How exactly would violence have been the answer here? I would have received far worse than I did if I had fought back.

Luckily that kid actually went to a different school, and I never saw him again, but I was scared to go out for a little while.
 

Village

Member
I most certainly have been on the bad side of these things. When I was 12, a kid I knew smacked me round the head with a bike lock chain while I was walking along the road. He was with a gang of about 4 teenagers, all much bigger than me. What I did was go to a house along the street and knock on the door. How exactly would violence have been the answer here? I would have received far worse than I did if I had fought back.

Luckily that kid actually went to a different school, and I never saw him again, but I was scared to go out for a little while.

every situation is different

I beat the kids up who attempted to bully me each time it came up, It helped that i was and still am very big and strong. So I understand those who aren't in he same situation not being able to do the same.
While violence with more violence could sometimes be bad thing, sometimes smacking some kids up so they mess with you anymore also helps.
 
Poor guy I never got so depressed that I was contemplating suicide until a year or two ago and that a 11 year is at that point is sickening. Schools really don't do shit about bullying, my high school sure as hell never did. Unless you had proof they put their hands on you they wouldn't do a damn thing. Verbal abuse just kept on going on like nothing was happening.
 

Sheroking

Member
And some won't. It's absolutely true. I hope I'm getting roped into trying to find the singular solution to an incredibly complex issue with many causes, some of which are contradictory to one another. There is no one reason why bullies do what they do, there is no one way for them to bully, there is no one solution that will always make them stop. But I think there is always something to be said for teaching kids to not stand for bullying and to fight back if being physically attacked.

The reason they teach kids not to fight back, but to run or seek help from an adult, is because nine times out of the ten the Bully will beat the ever loving hell out of his victim. And that other time? Won't stop the bullying at all, you just humiliated someone who already despised you and probably has more friends than you, who will side with him regardless of the outcome. It will really never work out the way your vision of sitcom problem solving suggests it will.

When I was in high school, there was this bully who was probably 6'3 at 16. He was on his way to some special belt in some such martial art (I don't remember which) and he'd just drill into this obviously gay student every day (verbally). One day in the hallway between classes, he just stepped in front of the kid to stop him from walking past for no other reason than to be a tough guy in front of his friends. The gay kid was pissed off (rightly) most of the time with or without this fucking guy on his ass, so he unwisely pushed him as hard as he could. He got thrown down, a knee put on his shoulder and wild punches thrown at his head until a teacher bellowed at him to stop. The bully got suspended for a couple days came back and the bullying was just as bad if not worse until the gay kid dropped out.

You mentioned DARE as a failure, but DARE was forcing the issue and turning it institutional. When I talk about pop culture, I mean Sesame Street, boy bands, cartoons, and shows like Glee. Sending a message to kids about equality and acceptance, having them understand the implications and having their idols and heroes encourage them to embrace tolerance and acceptance. It wouldn't be the first time it worked to at least strongly decrease incidents of a sort.
 

Village

Member
The reason they teach kids not to fight back, but to run or seek help from an adult, is because nine times out of the ten the Bully will beat the ever loving hell out of his victim. And that other time? Won't stop the bullying at all, you just humiliated someone who already despised you and probably has more friends than you, who will side with him regardless of the outcome. It will really never work out the way your vision of sitcom problem solving suggests it will.
.

As a person that has beat up their bullies, that isn't exactly true.

However fully admitting what you said does happen to people.
 

Kimawolf

Member
Times have changed, when i was in school there was mo internet, so being bullied you had some recourse to avoid it. But these days with everyone addicted to the internet and used to using it at all times, its never a safe place for the bullied to go anymore. A shame really.
Good luck kid, hope ya pull through.
 

NervousXtian

Thought Emoji Movie was good. Take that as you will.
Can we stop with the victim blaming crap already? Do you have kids in school? I do.

2 facts:

I can't control what other peoples kids do.

I can control what my kids do.

Those are facts. If you live in the real world, you deal with real world problems. Is bullying bad? Yes.. should it be dealt with.. yes.

Do I trust anyone else to raise my kid and protect them from bullying at all times? No. The schools can only do so much.. so you do things to help protect them yourselves.

Besides, as I always tell them school is for learning, at home and with friends is for playing.

I wouldn't let my son wear a MLP bracelet to school, because you know what it's less damaging to not wear it then to wear.

I don't get extra parent points for letting my child be themselves at all costs. It's my job to parent my child, not other kids.

That's not victim blaming, that's living in reality.. and it's insulting as a parent to hear someone saying it's victim blaming any time it's brought up.
 

WanderingWind

Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
The reason they teach kids not to fight back, but to run or seek help from an adult, is because nine times out of the ten the Bully will beat the ever loving hell out of his victim. And that other time? Won't stop the bullying at all, you just humiliated someone who already despised you and probably has more friends than you, who will side with him regardless of the outcome. It will really never work out the way your vision of sitcom problem solving suggests it will.

When I was in high school, there was this bully who was probably 6'3 at 16. He was on his way to some special belt in some such martial art (I don't remember which) and he'd just drill into this obviously gay student every day (verbally). One day in the hallway between classes, he just stepped in front of the kid to stop him from walking past for no other reason than to be a tough guy in front of his friends. The gay kid was pissed off (rightly) most of the time with or without this fucking guy on his ass, so he unwisely pushed him as hard as he could. He got thrown down, a knee put on his shoulder and wild punches thrown at his head until a teacher bellowed at him to stop. The bully got suspended for a couple days came back and the bullying was just as bad if not worse until the gay kid dropped out.

You mentioned DARE as a failure, but DARE was forcing the issue and turning it institutional. When I talk about pop culture, I mean Sesame Street, boy bands, cartoons, and shows like Glee. Sending a message to kids about equality and acceptance, having them understand the implications and having their idols and heroes encourage them to embrace tolerance and acceptance. It wouldn't be the first time it worked to at least strongly decrease incidents of a sort.

I know we're both pulling from anecdotal evidence, but you probably ought to read the thread to see how fighting back has helped. I can't take you seriously when you say it's 10 times out of 10 an ineffective solution. It certainly was for me and quite a few others. I don't particular care for the insinuation that we're all just lying because we saw it on a sitcom once, either. It may shock you to learn that sometimes, things happen in entertainment that mirror real life. Sometimes.

And I don't feel as if I have to tell you this, but you can work multiple solutions. It's not a either or proposition. You can teach kids about tolerance and also about fighting back, should they be physically assaulted. I question your solution that pertains to pop culture. It's not as if pop culture since the 80s has glorified bullies. Quite the opposite.
 
Can we stop with the victim blaming crap already? Do you have kids in school? I do.

2 facts:

I can't control what other peoples kids do.

I can control what my kids do.

Those are facts. If you live in the real world, you deal with real world problems. Is bullying bad? Yes.. should it be dealt with.. yes.

Do I trust anyone else to raise my kid and protect them from bullying at all times? No. The schools can only do so much.. so you do things to help protect them yourselves.

Besides, as I always tell them school is for learning, at home and with friends is for playing.

I wouldn't let my son wear a MLP bracelet to school, because you know what it's less damaging to not wear it then to wear.

I don't get extra parent points for letting my child be themselves at all costs. It's my job to parent my child, not other kids.

That's not victim blaming, that's living in reality.. and it's insulting as a parent to hear someone saying it's victim blaming any time it's brought up.

In my opinion, it's kind of pointless doing that because the bullies in truth really don't care and will pick on whoever they like, calling attention to whatever they like. What might get you bullied one day can change the next. It could have been caused by the bracelet, it also could have been his shoes, what shows/movies the kid watches or doesn't watch, what they bring in for lunch, hair style, clothing, where they live, what car their parents drive, how they do in school, which teachers they like or are liked by, who their friends are. Bullies will find any excuse. If a child isn't harming anyone and is living in a way they enjoy without disrupting their education, why should they have to change because of some annoying peers? It's the bullies that should be changing their behavior.
 
In my opinion, it's kind of pointless doing that because the bullies in truth really don't care and will pick on whoever they like, calling attention to whatever they like. What might get you bullied one day can change the next. It could have been caused by the bracelet, it also could have been his shoes, what shows/movies the kid watches or doesn't watch, what they bring in for lunch, hair style, clothing, where they live, what car their parents drive, how they do in school, which teachers they like or are liked by, who their friends are. Bullies will find any excuse. If a child isn't harming anyone and is living in a way they enjoy without disrupting their education, why should they have to change because of some annoying peers? It's the bullies that should be changing their behavior.

For real. When I was a kid, I got picked on for being mixed, short, wearing glasses, and getting good grades. 3 of those are completely out of my control, and the last is what I was supposed to do. I liked the same cartoons, games, etc. that my classmates did. Bullying and logic don't go together.
 
The story is tragic, but there's nothing that suggest the kid was bullied more than other kids who are bullied everyday (without killing themselves). So it could be a case of an overly sensitive kid.who was one episode of adversity away from disaster. If not that, then something else later in life.

I do think his parents and uncle taught him the wrong lessons which left him ill prepared for real life. Sure, in a perfect world, everyone should be free to be themselves, but that's usually not that easy. It's a simple truth that often eludes places like NeoGAF. At 11, I sure as heck knew watching girly shows (and telling the world about it) would bring ridicule from my peers. I didn't watch those shows and even if I did, I would have kept my mouth shut.
 

NEO0MJ

Member
As a person that has beat up their bullies, that isn't exactly true.

However fully admitting what you said does happen to people.

I also fought my bullies, though I was often smaller and weaker. Had to rely on dirty moves, sudden attacks and a lot of acting crazy. A lot of them bought that image of me as a psycho that wasn't worth messing with and so I was often left alone by them and they moved on to messing with other kids. I don't like what I had to do but I felt I had no choice.
 

kirblar

Member
Did you miss this?:

It is true that the school can't be responsible if the harassment was hidden and it was not reported. But if it is reported, the school has a legal obligation to investigate the issue and prevent it from happening in the future. "We just don't see it" is not a valid excuse, and it doesn't absolve them of their legal responsibilities.
Do you honestly think a long-winded regulation is going to accomplish anything or change how kids have behaved for as long as we've been alive? I don't understand what you're trying to stay other than "laws, laws, we can just make more laws"...that won't actually have an effect except to allow people to collect damages after the fact in court. There are legal obligations to do all sorts of things that aren't actually done because no one's going to enforce them in the vast majority of situations.
 
For real. When I was a kid, I got picked on for being mixed, short, wearing glasses, and getting good grades. 3 of those are completely out of my control, and the last is what I was supposed to do. I liked the same cartoons, games, etc. that my classmates did. Bullying and logic don't go together.

In grade school, I got it for wearing glasses, doing well in class and having "a big head". Like literally what can you do short of becoming a whole other person?
 

broham

Member
It's pretty fucked up when you have to tell a kid to hide his love of a cartoon show to avoid getting shit on.
 

Mononoke

Banned
I must have gotten lucky, because I never experienced or saw bullying in my schools. I came from a small suburban town though (although I would think places like that could be just as nasty, due to cliques extending to even the adults).

The worst it got was middle school. People were moody assholes, but not outright bullying that I saw. But once I hit highschool everyone loosened up and stayed to their own groups/corners and were chill. These stories always break my heart, because I know how emotionally trying it is to go from a teenager to young adult. I can't fathom how awful bullying would be during this stage. You are already struggling regardless, and someone your age is going to make it harder?

I don't fully understand the motivation of wanting to break down another human being (especially one that is your own age).
 

Goliath

Member
I wonder if this kid was part of an online forum for people who love my little ponies?

I feel like moments like this is where being able to find a group of people online interested in your interest and going through the same things you go through would be very useful. I know in some parts of the country you might not meet another Brony in person but at least in an online forum you can meet and support each other.

Obviously he should get support from his family but it seemed that this wasn't enough. Maybe if he could vent and make online friends this would substitute the lack of friendship he was dealing with in real life.

Kinda off Topic: I just watched a Brony documentary and it was pretty interesting. Many of them deal with this kind of harassment and support and meet eachother online and go to Brony cons. They also are known for grouping for causes and donating to charity. Pretty interesting.
 

Jenov

Member
I agree with the poster that brought up uniforms. I never understood why US public schools didn't adopt nationwide uniforms... that could help curb a lot of bullying.
 

Mumei

Member
Do you honestly think a long-winded regulation is going to accomplish anything or change how kids have behaved for as long as we've been alive? I don't understand what you're trying to stay other than "laws, laws, we can just make more laws"...that won't actually have an effect except to allow people to collect damages after the fact in court. There are legal obligations to do all sorts of things that aren't actually done because no one's going to enforce them in the vast majority of situations.

... Did you even read my original post?

I did not say "laws, laws, we can just make more laws." I didn't even say anything close to that. What I said was that anyone asserting that parents should have no expectations that the school make an effort to deal with bullying (that meets the standards required by Title IX regulations, mind you) is wrong. School districts are required to have a Title IX representative. School districts are required to investigate claims and to address harassment in an efficacious and efficient manner. I am not saying we need these laws; I am saying that we have them. We not only have them, but we have an enforcement mechanism available through parents in the form of the OCR and the Title IX district representative.

No, we can't always expect that schools will proactively deal with these issues. This is precisely why we have these laws and why we have enforcement mechanisms. The law is not there simply for post-hoc redressment of a past wrong; it is for asserting the responsibility of the school to deal with the issue when it happens. The apathy and ignorance you are promulgating is precisely the problem in these discussions. We should demand that schools maintain a safe learning environment for students, and schools that fail to do so should be held accountable.

And yes, I honestly think that if schools believe that they are at risk for losing federal funding and liable for hundreds of thousands of dollars in damages for harassment faced by a single student, they will do a better job of dealing with this issue. But that requires that parents know their rights and advocate on behalf of their kids, and not make the assumption that they shouldn't have any expectations or standards for the school's responsibilities.
 
I agree with the poster that brought up uniforms. I never understood why US public schools didn't adopt nationwide uniforms... that could help curb a lot of bullying.

There tends to be a lot of parental opposition, and educational policy in the US is decided at the state level, not federally.
 
As someone who was bullied mercilessly through school, I wish I could tell all these kids to hang in there and gets so much better. It probably won't be much solace to these kids that in 10 years you will get great satisfaction when your bully hand you your McDonalds. One of the reasons I will never have kids is I could never stand seeing my kid going through that.

To those that say "it is the parents fault" of the bullies, that is only partial true. I have seen parents raise their kids right and they still turn out bad. That is another reason why I won't have kids.
 

jimi_dini

Member
Did you miss this?:

It is true that the school can't be responsible if the harassment was hidden and it was not reported. But if it is reported, the school has a legal obligation to investigate the issue and prevent it from happening in the future. "We just don't see it" is not a valid excuse, and it doesn't absolve them of their legal responsibilities.

I'm not from US, but he is absolutely right. School won't do shit.

I got beaten quite badly several times. Assholes also broke my bike. Once I even had to go to hospital. And the few teachers that knew it didn't do shit - they even saw me several times, WHILE I was beaten to a pulp. Legal obligation, seagull constipation.

The actual working solution was to get a statement from a doctor, that I wasn't able to attend sports class anymore. Problem partly solved.

Wouldn't have solved this case though.

Still it's not about ignorance. It's about finding a working solution in that situation.
I wouldn't even surprised if certain schools would remove the bullied student instead of removing the bully assholes. Because that's much easier.

Just take a look at how people react to school shootings. "was a crazy guy, a loner and he liked Call Of Duty, videogames!!!11" instead of taking care of bullying. Plenty of shootings were directly caused by bullying, that went on for years. The other extreme (but of course totally understandable) reaction to bullying is commiting suicide. And take a look at reactions to those. "well, he/she was bullied for a long time, but we can't really do anything about those and it was his/her own personal decision to commit suicide, it's quite sad, but well... case closed".

Which means in our system it's okay to fuck someone up mentally over years and destroy him psychologically, but it's not okay to kill people directly, even when it's someone who got that treatment over years and just snapped at some point. Which I find pretty crazy. It's sort of like abusing a dog over years. And when the dog finally bites, then it's the dogs fault (I don't consider anyone to be a dog, just an example for my point)

We should demand that schools maintain a safe learning environment for students, and schools that fail to do so should be held accountable.

Yeah, we should.
 

kirblar

Member
... Did you even read my original post?

I did not say "laws, laws, we can just make more laws." I didn't even say anything close to that. What I said was that anyone asserting that parents should have no expectations that the school make an effort to deal with bullying (that meets the standards required by Title IX regulations, mind you) is wrong. School districts are required to have a Title IX representative. School districts are required to investigate claims and to address harassment in an efficacious and efficient manner. I am not saying we need these laws; I am saying that we have them. We not only have them, but we have an enforcement mechanism available through parents in the form of the OCR and the Title IX district representative.

No, we can't always expect that schools will proactively deal with these issues. This is precisely why we have these laws and why we have enforcement mechanisms. The law is not there simply for post-hoc redressment of a past wrong; it is for asserting the responsibility of the school to deal with the issue when it happens. The apathy and ignorance you are promulgating is precisely the problem in these discussions. We should demand that schools maintain a safe learning environment for students, and schools that fail to do so should be held accountable.

And yes, I honestly think that if schools believe that they are at risk for losing federal funding and liable for hundreds of thousands of dollars in damages for harassment faced by a single student, they will do a better job of dealing with this issue. But that requires that parents know their rights and advocate on behalf of their kids, and not make the assumption that they shouldn't have any expectations or standards for the school's responsibilities.
I suspect we may have had either wildly different experiences growing up, or that we took vastly different things away from problems related to this issue. Mine was simple: No one cares. The teachers are overloaded. Reprisal gets you punished. Keep your head down and survive.

Yes, there are laws and rules there, but as a kid you quickly find that there a is a huge social cost to using them. You also find that that the bullies are really good at doing this behind the backs of authority figures, so that there's no "paper trail" for people to look into. You have a faith in the ability of governmental regulation and pressure to remedy this issue that I find incredibly naive, based on my ~14 years growing up through school. You call my viewpoint "ignorant and apathetic", but from my perspective, it's simply realism.
 

Ahasverus

Member
Fuck brony shaming, there are many things in this life that deserve shaming, a fucking tv show isn't. Fuck parents that don't teach tolerance.
 

RangerX

Banned
Bullies are some of the most disgusting vile human beings that exist. I hope the kid pulls through and lives his life the way he wants to live it, not how knuckle dragging neanderthals force him to.
 
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