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[DBT85]

Class never leaves you.

 

[EvB]

The facts speak for themselves

Do you know what a fact is?

 

[Slayer-33]

He states in the post that PAX stuff was on 1.6ghz...

Frame rate improvements were likely down to optimisations.

Even better news

 

[abadguy]

"PS4 is so powerful!" So why is Killzone running at 30fps and BF4 running < 1080p.

"Great CPU bump for Xbone!" Now enjoy janky Ryse and killer instinct @ 720p.

This gen sucks hard already. Specs are shit.

Ryse is not 720p though....

 

[Elios83]

Lastly - can I PLEASE finally get you over this "we're having production issues" thing that's going around? We increased the GPU 6%. We increased the CPU almost 10%. We have been showing retail boxes. We are now in full production.

If at this point these facts don't outweigh random rumors...

Albert you have to concede that at this point the facts are that we're still waiting for a release date and the launch was delayed in many european countries.
Rumors will go away when you can launch in November (possibly before BF) with enough units.
Also low yields aren't only dependent on clock frequency. Infact low yields can be due to the sheer complexity of the design of a certain component which causes a high fault rate which is not dependent on frequency.
That's not to say that I believe you're having problems or that you're not telling the truth, but that the small upgrades on the GPU and CPU clock speeds alone can't dismiss the rumors as you suggest.
Only facts will prove you're right when the product finally launches.

 

[DopeyFish]

Does a yield issue even mean anything? Lets say they have one and they still ship 1-2 million units this holiday. What then?

for the launch of everything, yields are ALWAYS an issue.

You don't really get perfect yields.

75%~, for example... is probably normal. Later... 90%+ is expected.

for retrospect... yields for 360 were around 25%

 

[tapedeck]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZHj78So8D4&t=28s

Spoiler

im sorry

Why did I click... :|

 

[bidguy]

Then that's a yes right?

dont be stupid now

 

[Dead Prince]

Ryse is not 720p though....

it's just janky Ryse and KI is 720p

 

[Troll]

Alright, which one of you was this

 

[Klocker]

I don't agree with your premise that Albert Penello is "good people": All I ever saw from him is blatant and meaningless PR, I've never gotten any real insight from his long-winded and often aggressive posts.

I challenge you to imagine being in his position and come here and put up with some of the shit he has to and do better at telling people the truth and being as forthright as possible. believe me it would look about the same to the people who wouldn't want to believe you either but it wouldn't mean you were not being forthright..


what in the world would he have to gain by coming here and lying to us? if anything they would just post random tweets and plant stories and other bullshit... they would not put their name on the line and try to CONVERSE directly with us.

We are not THAT important really in the scheme of things... the Xbone will sell millions without GAF loving it.

He is being polite and trying to be better with corporate communications than their previous attempts and realize they did not do a good job.

it's called trying to improve.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

This simply can't be true or they'd have more consoles available to pre order in tier one countries and more tier 1 countries at that. If stocks are awry with the pre order numbers as low as they are comparative to the competition, something is awry.

I respect Alberto for towing the Microsoft line in the thick of it, but it won't be that easy. The sales/pre order figures and stock numbers will ultimately speak for themselves.

Maybe Microsoft are making more of a strategic decision based on where they think they require more units, and not necessarily a decision based on them not having the required supplies, I don't know. I sure as heck wouldn't hesitate to shift many more units to the USA in anticipation that, at some point, PS4s may run dry, leading to people opting to grab themselves an Xbox One. When I was desperate to get my hands on a 360 in 2005, I would've damn near bought any new videogame console at that point just to tide me over, but there was no other alternative. Microsoft could be stuffing the USA with more units to pounce on when PS4s are out of stock.

They may not outsell the PS4, but they may steal a few sales around the margins. Needless to say, he does have a point that they're showing real units at many of these shows, and increases in clock speed aren't something you generally do when you have serious production issues. it seems like production is going a lot better than thought, but we don't know how many units that translates to. Either way, the PS4 possibly outselling the Xbox One won't somehow suggest that the production issues were true, but they should at least, in addition to the availability of xbox Ones in stores give us an idea of how production went for Microsoft.

Alright, which one of you was this

Showing us your dirty work

 

[mgcastro]

Dat Microsoft momemtum.

 

[Fyrebrand]

I don't see any proof the rumors are wrong, can you provide them?

The facts I see is that the Xbox One is releasing only in 13 countries I will never believe that MS original plan involved releasing their system in less than 21 countries. Either there were HW issues or the system was intended to release later.

I think what he is saying is they would not be upclocking things if there were yield issues. I think many people just heard yield issues and have no idea what that really means. Or maybe I don't.

 

[GeoramA]

Wonder if he's a gaffer. "FUCKING SUCK IT SONY FUCK YOU SONY" would make a great tag.

 

[Spongebob]

Ryse is not 720p though....

The post says that Ryse is janky and that KI is running at 720p.

 

[DragonSworne]

Why is MS insistent on convincing people there is no supply constraint?

 

[Osiris]

If chip yields are not the reason for the low number of tier 1 countries, then what is?

Because you do have to admit, the number of launch countries is woefully lacking compared to previous generations.

I'll happily believe yield issues are not the reason, but obviously something has affected manufacturing for the launch country list to be so anemic.

 

[Finalizer]

Xbox just went SSJ2

RELEASE THE DBZ GIFS

THEY'RE POWERING UP

 

[Chobel]

Just think what Tim Dog would say if 140 characters was not the limit of a tweet.

 

[BlazingDarkness]

Alright, which one of you was this

It was Fake Kaz's alt account, tying to make MS look bad by association.

 

[Brashnir]

Isn't yields completely unrelated to heat issues anyway, its the amount of useable area on wafer? To produce the units, How would any heat issues effect yields

A lot of things can affect yields. It's pretty common that a portion of the chips on a wafer are usable at 100% clock rate, while another portion is usable at a lower clock rate, and another portion usable at higher clock rates.

So let's say that (just throwing out a random group of numbers here) 20% of the chips on each wafer were coming out stable at 2GHz, while 60% are stable at 1.75GHz and 62% are stable at 1.6 GHz.

In this scenario, You don't gain a great deal of usable chips if you drop from 1.75 to 1.6GHz, but you lose a ton if you commit to 2GHz.

Stability is affected by both voltage and heat, so in a sense yield rates are impacted by heat, as instability in a chip is often encountered at certain voltage/heat thresholds.

 

[DopeyFish]

If chip yields are not the reason for the low number of tier 1 countries, then what is?

Because you do have to admit, the number of launch countries is woefully lacking compared to previous generations.

I'll happily believe yield issues are not the reason, but obviously something has affected manufacturing for the launch country list to be so anemic.

translation issues... you know... what people from MS have been saying?

it's like everyone assumes they are lying lol

 

[EvB]

I challenge you to imagine being in his position and come here and put up with some of the shit he has to and do better at telling people the truth and being as forthright as possible. believe me it would look about the same to the people who wouldn't want to believe you either but it wouldn't mean you were not being forthright..


what in the world would he have to gain by coming here and lying to us? if anything they would just post random tweets and plant stories and other bullshit... they would not put their name on the line and try to CONVERSE directly with us.

We are not THAT important really in the scheme of things... the Xbone will sell millions without GAF loving it.

He is being polite and trying to be better with corporate communications than their previous attempts and realize they did not do a good job.

it's called trying to improve.

Great post

 

[Majanew]

Some of the posters here... It's like reading YouTube comments sometimes.

 

[Guymelef]

Why is MS insistent on convincing people there is no supply constraint?

"We are listening"

 

[iMax]

That passion.

So much greatness.

 

[statham]

Thank you sir.

I think I've admitted it a bunch. It's one of the reasons I came here - lots of questions, and in some cases the level of detail you guys needed/wanted wasn't going to happen in traditional PR channels.

So I can understand the skepticism. I generally look for those opportunities to clarify or add texture to what's going on.

We’ve been clear – our HW program is in really good shape. We’ve also said that due to the DRM change, it put pressure on our SW schedule which is why you’ve seen some features slip.

That said - the ESRAM thing is particularly frustrating because the only reason to believe it anymore is either because of people's natural tendency to want to be right, or just a blind belief that we should be mistrusted just because we are MS. At this point, for a community that holds itself to a high standard of “source” or “proof” – there is far more proof this rumor was wrong then proof it was right. Holding on to that belief anymore seems misguided at this point.

Thanks for coming here, and not losing your mind.

 

[Robbler]

So the system's in full production, but we don't have a release date yet?

Watch them spring it Monday morning to counter any Sony TGS announcements...

 

[KillerTravis]

Good news.

 

[nib95]

Maybe Microsoft are making more of a strategic decision based on where they think they require more units, and not necessarily a decision based on them not having the required supplies, I don't know. I sure as heck wouldn't hesitate to shift many more units to the USA in anticipation that, at some point, PS4s may run dry, leading to people opting to grab themselves an Xbox One. When I was desperate to get my hands on a 360 in 2005, I would've damn near bought any new videogame console at that point just to tide me over, but there was no other alternative. Microsoft could be stuffing the USA with more units to pounce on when PS4s are out of stock.

They may not outsell the PS4, but they may steal a few sales around the margins. Needless to say, he does have a point that they're showing real units at many of these shows, and increases in clock speed aren't something you generally do when you have serious production issues. it seems like production is going a lot better than thought, but we don't know how many units that translates to. Either way, the PS4 possibly outselling the Xbox One won't somehow suggest that the production issues were true, but they should at least, in addition to the availability of xbox Ones in stores give us an idea of how production went for Microsoft.

I would agree with you IF they weren't already having stock issues on pre orders despite tracking far less sales than their competitor (both consoles have sold out on pre orders in many places). Final sales, stock numbers etc will tell the true story.

 

[Albert Penello]

Thanks for coming here, and not losing your mind.

Oh, some days...

 

[QaaQer]

I don't agree with your premise that Albert Penello is "good people": All I ever saw from him is blatant and meaningless PR, I've never gotten any real insight from his long-winded and often aggressive posts.



There's no reason to "believe in rumours" in regards to the Xbone suffering heavy production issues: The amount of launch countries and features cancelled speak for themselves.

In general, people get the warm fuzzies when socializing with famous people, even teeny tiny micro-celbrities. I'm not slagging anyone off, just stating a fact.

 

[miDnIghtEr20C]

dont be stupid now

Easy on the call outs. I didn't see the responses from the others when I made the other post.

 

[EmptySpace]

Does a yield issue even mean anything?

not if cassidy releases a console in 13 countries instead of 21. obviously production issues would go away if cassidy sells his/her product in less locations.

 

[Metfanant]

this is great news for the Xbone...now we will see if Sony comes out and says anything about their clock speed now...

as for the ESRAM yields...the proof will be in the sales numbers...both consoles will be sold out for months...if both are sold out...and the PS4 has significantly higher sales numbers...then obviously Sony's manufacturing went much better than MS'

 

[Klocker]

And who pays your salary.

not cool dude...

 

[SEGAvangelist]

So much greatness.

I'm hurting from laughter right now. Greatness for sure.

 

[Moral Panic]

I'm sorry, but again, you're wrong. The only real reason someone should take in account the ESRAM problems rumor was because an industry insider, who is almost always right said outright that your company had problems with it.

It's the same guy who almost 10 years ago had the 360's specs right. It's not because someone wants to be right, but because it is a trusted source.

EDIT: Unfortunately I know my post will not be answered to, anyway.

A trusted source who GETS THINGS WRONG. Albert says he is wrong, there is 0 evidence to say Albert is lying, there is more evidence he is telling the truth. Let it go.

 

[benny_a]

They'll definitely have the standard 2.4GHz frequency (WiFi and Bluetooth) but I'm unsure if they'll carry the 5GHz frequency (would be nice). It does seem an odd number but the FCC filing specifically states:

"Maximum clock frequency in the system: 2.75GHz"

I'm wrong, see here:

It is low for GDDR5... to be exact it is the Green Clock (low power consumption).

It's because GDDR can read and write at the same time they double it.

 

[netBuff]

I challenge you to imagine being in his position and come here and put up with some of the shit he has to and do better at telling people the truth and being as forthright as possible. believe me it would look about the same to the people who wouldn't want to believe you either but it wouldn't mean you were not being forthright..


what in the world would he have to gain by coming here and lying to us? if anything they would just post random tweets and plant stories and other bullshit... they would not put their name on the line and try to CONVERSE directly with us.

We are not THAT important really in the scheme of things... the Xbone will sell millions without GAF loving it.

He is being polite and trying to be better with corporate communications than their previous attempts and realize they did not do a good job.

it's called trying to improve.

Companies are extremely interested in social media and forums marketing, Albert is doing exactly that. He's seems to be trying to feed us PR lines, he's probably not really interested in having a conversation with us but probably wants to push Xbone on forum people. The fact Penello is doing a mediocre job at marketing doesn't change that.

 

[Fyrebrand]

A lot of things can affect yields. It's pretty common that a portion of the chips on a wafer are usable at 100% clock rate, while another portion is usable at a lower clock rate, and another portion usable at higher clock rates.

So let's say that (just throwing out a random group of numbers here) 20% of the chips on each wafer were coming out stable at 2GHz, while 60% are stable at 1.75GHz and 62% are stable at 1.6 GHz.

In this scenario, You don't gain a great deal of usable chips if you drop from 1.75 to 1.6GHz, but you lose a ton if you commit to 2GHz.

Stability is affected by both voltage and heat, so in a sense yield rates are impacted by heat, as instability in a chip is often encountered at certain voltage/heat thresholds.

That was my understanding as well I think people just read yield issues and think they cant make enough of something or whatever. What Albert is saying is that these upclocks prove that there are no yield issues because if there were they couldn't upclock the faulty chips.

 

[Osiris]

translation issues... you know... what people from MS have been saying?

it's like everyone assumes they are lying lol

translation issues, yet some countries who are seeing delays speak the same languages as those in confirmed launch countries? - Yeah, not buying that.

 

[SiRatul]

It is low for GDDR5... to be exact it is the Green Clock (low power consumption).

How is it low? A 7970 has the same GDDR5 clock. I mean the max we have at the moment is 6Gbits/s with the Titan.

 

[shinobi602]

I don't agree with your premise that Albert Penello is "good people": All I ever saw from him is blatant and meaningless PR, I've never gotten any real insight from his long-winded and often aggressive posts.

What posts are these? He's always been polite here and very insightful compared to what PR we'd get mainstream.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

I would agree with you IF they weren't already having stock issues on pre orders despite tracking far less sales than their competitor (both consoles have sold out on pre orders in many places). Final sales, stock numbers etc will tell the true story.

Yea, you're probably right.

 

[netBuff]

What posts are these? He's always been polite here and very insightful compared to what PR we'd get mainstream.

(Probably, not absolutely not)

 

[DopeyFish]

translation issues, yet some countries who are seeing delays speak the same languages as those in confirmed launch countries? - Yeah, not buying that.

see what i mean?

 

[EvB]

this is great news for the Xbone...now we will see if Sony comes out and says anything about their clock speed now...

as for the ESRAM yields...the proof will be in the sales numbers...both consoles will be sold out for months...if both are sold out...and the PS4 has significantly higher sales numbers...then obviously Sony's manufacturing went much better than MS'

Exactly, I'm sure they will be quite happy to express the number of units shipped when the day comes

 

[BRocknRolla]

translation issues... you know... what people from MS have been saying?

it's like everyone assumes they are lying lol

Sweden, Austria... Supported languages, unsupported countries. It's about markets, not languages.