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[MechaX]

Well Akane knows Ace's actions because Junpei saw them. The events of the Nonary Game are a fulfillment of what she had seen in the Nonary Project.

Such is Time Paradox plot-points, I guess.

Also, I don't think we can trust that Akane's personality toward Junpei (which is mostly what the player sees) is her real one.

"Real" personality is a strange way to put it. I mean, in Akane's position, you essentially learn that the key to your existence depends on a person that you already had deep feelings for solving a life-and-death puzzle nine years in the future. I would imagine that Akane probably obsessed over Junpei to a ridiculous extent, which would lead to her acts around him and him alone.

But regardless, we don't really know exactly what was the share of responsibility between Santa and Akane. Sure, Santa calls himself more of a "secretary," but more than once Santa has been shown to be a lot more clever and smarter than he seems. Akane could have been Zero mostly in name only, while Santa was the one who set most of the events in motion (and even that couldn't really prepare either of them for the reality of their actions, such as the sight and smell of a dead body like the 9th Man and Not-Snake).

 

[AniHawk]

^ my quote?

seriously how has no one got this yet.

 

[Korigama]

Yup, June was Murasaki in the J version aka "purple" There were some puns regarding that in the game that obviously had to be changed for the localized version

Snake/Light had to have known that Akane survived, since he was there when she completed the puzzle and reunited with Aoi, not to mention escaping the ship. If he had told Junpei that she survived, it probably would have thrown a wrench into Akane/Aoi's plans to save past Akane, since the heightened sense of Danger would have been lowered, thus lowering the chances for an epiphany and/or weaking the connection between Junpei and past Akane.

Snake knew she had survived, but he didn't know the identity of Zero. That's why Akane threatened to blow up Clover, and presumably also one of the reasons he was removed from the game for a while.

I didn't quite understand why he was chosen, but I guess it was because of his physical resemblance to what's-his-face. And then Clover would have been there to ensure his silence.

Hmm, okay, I think I follow now. It does make sense that Snake would continue to err on the side of caution in order to protect Clover (which would take priority over anything else for him), therefore eliminating his chances of potentially compromising Zero's plan and allowing the conditions created by the Nonary Game to be maintained. Thanks.

I wish Snake never brought up that theory. There's no way of proving it or disproving it since it would always have the same effect.

Personally, I think everyone's bracelet was displaying the correct number (or letter), I don't see Akane as a cheater.

The way I see it, the only point this could have compromised anything was when Junpei tricked the group into going through 3. If Snake's theory were true, then Lotus and Clover beating Santa to the RED would've meant entering [59784] (5+9+7+8+4 = 33 = 3+3 = [6]), therefore proving he and June were using different numbers and potentially ending the game right there by casting suspicion upon the two. The only other excuse for Santa caring so much about seeing to it that he reached the RED first would've been to make sure that, as Zero's assistant, he never let June out of his sight by having there be any numbered door that she went through that he didn't enter as well.

That said, I agree with preferring the simplicity of the bracelets being whatever number they were said to be. I see it as questionable that they would be careless enough to potentially get caught by leaving such a thing to chance.

 

[Sputnik Sweetheart]

Hmm, okay, I think I follow now. It does make sense that Snake would continue to err on the side of caution in order to protect Clover (which would take priority over anything else for him), therefore eliminating his chances of potentially compromising Zero's plan and allowing the conditions created by the Nonary Game to be maintained. Thanks.

I'm kindy hazy on the exact sequence of events now, but I don't think Seven gives you the full rundown of his involvement in the first game in the presence of Snake does he? Snake telling you unprompted that Akane died is a bit of a stretch to me, given he's revealed his entire story at that point without concern for Clover. I don't know what prompted him to hold back and tell an outright lie at the end.

Also note that Snake privately tells Junpei some stuff about the previous game while Seven and Clover are elsewhere. At this point Snake hasn't recognised Santa as Aoi, and wouldn't have recognised June as Akane for the same reason. He wouldn't know that either was involved until the incinerator.

"Real" personality is a strange way to put it. I mean, in Akane's position, you essentially learn that the key to your existence depends on a person that you already had deep feelings for solving a life-and-death puzzle nine years in the future. I would imagine that Akane probably obsessed over Junpei to a ridiculous extent, which would lead to her acts around him and him alone.

It makes the sections where Akane from the past is controlling what Junpei says the present day Akane seem quite strange with hindsight!

 

[Tricky I Shadow]

I got the True Ending last night. Here are some of my questions:

1. What was the significance of June telling the story about when the rabbits got murdered in school?

2. Was it ever explained who destroyed/fixed the RED’s? Or are we to simply assume it was probably June, Santa or Seven?

3. And I’m still so confused in regards to the True Ending. So did June not actually die 9 years ago in the first Nonary Game?

If someone could please summarise the ending in dot point form that would be really fantastic.....I'm still completely lost! :lol

4. Why was the ‘0’ bracelet a 6? And why did June end up having the 9 bracelet? Did that mean two 9 bracelets existed? 0_o

 

[The Technomancer]

I got the True Ending last night. Here are some of my questions:

1. What was the significance of June telling the story about when the rabbits got murdered in school?

2. Was it ever explained who destroyed/fixed the RED’s? Or are we to simply assume it was probably June, Santa or Seven?

3. And I’m still so confused in regards to the True Ending. So did June not actually die 9 years ago in the first Nonary Game?

If someone could please summarise the ending in dot point form that would be really fantastic.....I'm still completely lost! :lol

4. Why was the ‘0’ bracelet a 6? And why did June end up having the 9 bracelet? Did that mean two 9 bracelets existed? 0_o

Ending summary: June survived the game nine years ago. Santa and June and Seven were in on the whole plot, Seven was faking his amnesia. June only survived nine years ago because she saw the present day game taking place, so after she lived the three of them had to set up the present day game in order to ensure that the events that she saw would occur Its a closed time loop paradox thing.

 

[Nishastra]

4. Why was the ‘0’ bracelet a 6? And why did June end up having the 9 bracelet? Did that mean two 9 bracelets existed? 0_o

It's not actually a 0, it's the letter O. Remember the piece of paper with all the base-whatever number systems on it? O is 24, which adds up to 6.

I'm not sure about the 9s.

 

[vall03]

It's not actually a 0, it's the letter O. Remember the piece of paper with all the base-whatever number systems on it? O is 24, which adds up to 6.

I'm not sure about the 9s.

it was upside down so they thought it was 6

 

[Nishastra]

it was upside down so they thought it was 6

Yeah, I know that much. I'm just not sure on the multiple-9s and the Santa's-3-is-0 that's required for June's 9 to work.

I remember Santa's being explained, but I've forgotten the explanation

 

[vall03]

Yeah, I know that much. I'm just not sure on the multiple-9s and the Santa's-3-is-0 that's required for June's 9 to work.

I remember Santa's being explained, but I've forgotten the explanation

when getting the digital root they both basically cancel each other which is why it was difficult to notice. In Santas case, 3 - 3, for June it was 6 + 3. It basically means they can enter any room.

 

[bababouille]

Don't know if this has been said already but man... My mind was utterly blown when I had to flip my DS for the last puzzle.

Who would've thought the player (bottom screen) is actually Young Akane transmitting solutions to Junpei all game long? At the last puzzle, the roles are reversed, hence the screens swap.

It also shows that the narration, which is always done in the bottom screen, is made by Young Akane finding out about the all the different possibilities the game might go; she is probably having projections of the future and reading them like they were books or something.

Man, I really love when games tie in story and gameplay like that!

Also, about Alice, after reading the wikipedia page on the mandrake plant, I came to a conclusion. When Ace reveals that all he found was a mandrake root in Alice's coffin, it hints that Alice is nothing more than fiction; the Wikipedia page states that mandrake contains powerful hallucinogenic components and its roots have the shape of a human being. So yes, Alice at the end is probably just a mirage. I think why Alice was inserted in the game is because of its serious tone about all the pseudoscience stuff, Alice is there to remind the players that much of it is fabrication, just like the Nonary Game the characters go through... There are various ways to intrepret the mandrake metaphor, and it's really fun to think about them!

 

[AniHawk]

Don't know if this has been said already but man... My mind was utterly blown when I had to flip my DS for the last puzzle.

Who would've thought the player (bottom screen) is actually Young Akane transmitting solutions to Junpei all game long? At the last puzzle, the roles are reversed, hence the screens swap.

It also shows that the narration, which is always done in the bottom screen, is made by Young Akane finding out about the all the different possibilities the game might go; she is probably having projections of the future and reading them like they were books or something.

Man, I really love when games tie in story and gameplay like that!

This was the best twist in the game. One little thing revealed a lot.

And the great thing is that it was a design decision. The designers already took advantage of the fact that they were telling a story in a video game by actually doing something new with branching paths and multiple endings. Then they took it to an entirely different level by making the way the story was told dependent on the hardware. Incredible thinking process and execution, seriously.

 

[LiK]

Don't know if this has been said already but man... My mind was utterly blown when I had to flip my DS for the last puzzle.

Who would've thought the player (bottom screen) is actually Young Akane transmitting solutions to Junpei all game long? At the last puzzle, the roles are reversed, hence the screens swap.

It also shows that the narration, which is always done in the bottom screen, is made by Young Akane finding out about the all the different possibilities the game might go; she is probably having projections of the future and reading them like they were books or something.

Man, I really love when games tie in story and gameplay like that!

Also, about Alice, after reading the wikipedia page on the mandrake plant, I came to a conclusion. When Ace reveals that all he found was a mandrake root in Alice's coffin, it hints that Alice is nothing more than fiction; the Wikipedia page states that mandrake contains powerful hallucinogenic components and its roots have the shape of a human being. So yes, Alice at the end is probably just a mirage. I think why Alice was inserted in the game is because of its serious tone about all the pseudoscience stuff, Alice is there to remind the players that much of it is fabrication, just like the Nonary Game the characters go through... There are various ways to intrepret the mandrake metaphor, and it's really fun to think about them!

yea! good stuff. the final puzzle forcing us to flip the DS was really cool. they took advantage of the dual screen setup really well.

 

[timetokill]

Yeah, the way the flip actually enhances the story is brilliant. It's a fantastic touch and is something that could only be done in an interactive setting. It's the kind of touch that shows just how far Heavy Rain is from hitting the mark.

 

[AniHawk]

Also, that final twist is one of those things I've come to expect from modern designers that feel video games need to tell a story. They have so much power at their fingertips and all most can muster is cutscene -> game -> cutscene? Please. Just goes to show what a little critical thinking can do.

 

[The Technomancer]

Also, that final twist is one of those things I've come to expect from modern designers that feel video games need to tell a story. They have so much power at their fingertips and all most can muster is cutscene -> game -> cutscene? Please. Just goes to show what a little critical thinking can do.

It reminds me a lot of Silent Hill: Shattered Memories in that respect. Another game where I feel the integration of the story with the "gameplay" produced an effect you couldn't just get from a book or movie.

 

[Ferrio]

Crisis Core's game system tied into the ending.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Does someone want to explain to me why everyone says Seven was involved in the actual planning?

It didn't seem to me like he was and Santa was more than willing to let him die.

 

[timetokill]

Does someone want to explain to me why everyone says Seven was involved in the actual planning?

It didn't seem to me like he was and Santa was more than willing to let him die.

- In the true ending, it is strongly implied that Santa was faking his amnesia.
- If he didn't have amnesia, he definitely saw that Akane hadn't died, and yet he lies to Junpei about it, saying she did.
- If he did actually have amnesia, nothing would have prevented him from telling Junpei about what actually happened and how Akane escaped.

 

[The Technomancer]

Does someone want to explain to me why everyone says Seven was involved in the actual planning?

It didn't seem to me like he was and Santa was more than willing to let him die.

There's no way that Seven didn't know that Akane survived, yet even after he recovers his memories he "recalls" her death. There's a line right at the end where Junpei speculates about whether Seven had amnesia at all, and he "whistles innocently" or something.

 

[hipgnosis]

Just got the True Ending and read through this topic. Holy shit at this game! So mindblowing.

Got a couple of questions though: where did Santa and June disappear from the incinerator? Why were they driving ahead of the others? Why didn't they just wait for the others to come out of that building?

 

[AniHawk]

Just got the True Ending and read through this topic. Holy shit at this game! So mindblowing.

Got a couple of questions though: where did Santa and June disappear from the incinerator? Why were they driving ahead of the others? Why didn't they just wait for the others to come out of that building?

Santa left with Ace with a gun to his head and presumably stuffed him in the car. June probably disappeared through some hatch or secret escape route while no one was looking. It's never explained, but it's the only thing that made sense considering she was the mastermind and had nine years to plan this thing out.

As for the last one, I dunno.

One thing I thought was pretty dark was despite everyone not being in any real danger (no bombs in their stomachs except for the 9th Man), the incinerator actually worked. And like, everyone actually would have burned to death.

 

[timetokill]

Santa left with Ace with a gun to his head and presumably stuffed him in the car. June probably disappeared through some hatch or secret escape route while no one was looking. It's never explained, but it's the only thing that made sense considering she was the mastermind and had nine years to plan this thing out.

As for the last one, I dunno.

One thing I thought was pretty dark was despite everyone not being in any real danger (no bombs in their stomachs except for the 9th Man), the incinerator actually worked. And like, everyone actually would have burned to death.

I think they noted that Ace would've had a bomb in his stomach as well? If they were willing to do it with the 9th Man I'm pretty sure Ace would've been an easy candidate to choose as well.

 

[Korigama]

I'm kindy hazy on the exact sequence of events now, but I don't think Seven gives you the full rundown of his involvement in the first game in the presence of Snake does he? Snake telling you unprompted that Akane died is a bit of a stretch to me, given he's revealed his entire story at that point without concern for Clover. I don't know what prompted him to hold back and tell an outright lie at the end.

My only guess for this comes back to what I mentioned about erring on the side of caution: knowing the truth, but leaving that part out due to not knowing why Zero would care one way or the other and whether telling Junpei would cause Zero to make good on the threat against Clover (the significance of whether anyone knew Akane lived likely a lingering question on Snake's mind, but one that he chose not to get into just to be sure). That said, I do agree that it counts as one of the more confusing parts, regardless of the ultimate explanation for it.

As for the last one, I dunno.

I'm tempted to say in order to give themselves a head start in case anyone was still pissed about the whole ordeal. :lol

I think they noted that Ace would've had a bomb in his stomach as well? If they were willing to do it with the 9th Man I'm pretty sure Ace would've been an easy candidate to choose as well.

Don't forget Nijisaki (Guy X/Fake Snake). With that in mind, it's probably safe to assume Musashidou (Cap/Fake Zero) had one as well, thereby covering all four founders of the Nonary Project with real bombs.

 

[timetokill]

Don't forget Nijisaki (Guy X/Fake Snake). With that in mind, it's probably safe to assume Musashidou (Cap/Fake Zero) had one as well, thereby covering all four founders of the Nonary Project with real bombs.

Yep, exactly, and especially taking into account the note re: the purpose of the video camera, etc.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

One thing I thought was pretty dark was despite everyone not being in any real danger (no bombs in their stomachs except for the 9th Man), the incinerator actually worked. And like, everyone actually would have burned to death.

The incinerator had to be real. The danger of death had to be there for Junpei to communicate the answers to Past-Akane.

 

[timetokill]

The incinerator had to be real. The danger of death had to be there for Junpei to communicate the answers to Past-Akane.

But couldn't the perception of danger be enough? If Junpei didn't know it wasn't real, wouldn't the perceived danger of the situation cause him to be able to communicate?

(that said, it was real because of the snake/ace ending)

 

[ZealousD]

But couldn't the perception of danger be enough? If Junpei didn't know it wasn't real, wouldn't the perceived danger of the situation cause him to be able to communicate?

(that said, it was real because of the snake/ace ending)

I thought it was implied that it couldn't be merely perception. Just like how there had to be the possibility for Akane to survive in order for her to use the field to speak with Junpei.

 

[Roto13]

I don't see how it could be anything BUT perception. I know it's pseudoscience but it's not magic.

 

[ZealousD]

Here's another morsel to chew on.

One thing I noticed is that everybody was perfectly intent on letting Junpei do all the heavy lifting with the puzzle solving. Nobody makes much effort in solving the puzzles themselves. This makes sense from a gameplay standpoint, but it also connects on a story level.

Ace already knew all the solutions, so he didn't want to blow his cover.

Snake knew the solutions from before, but he was held down by Zero's threat and was also blind.

Santa, June, and Seven didn't want to blow their cover.

In any room where you're with Clover, she's too depressed about Snake to help.

Lotus is the only exception. But she is partially blocked from helping in some cases (freezer) and contributes greatly in others (laboratory).

 

[timetokill]

I thought it was implied that it couldn't be merely perception. Just like how there had to be the possibility for Akane to survive in order for her to use the field to speak with Junpei.

That really doesn't make sense, though. There is no way for Junpei to know whether the danger is real, only to know whether he believes it's real or not. If the danger has to be real, it suggests that the true possibility of an occurrence is enough to cause the field, not the participant's awareness of it -- which means you could hypothetically have somebody in a dangerous situation they're not aware of and still have the field work, and that probably would've been an easier test to run.



I did like that they basically explained why the others didn't do much helping, too

 

[cosmicblizzard]

Might've already been mentioned, but is everyone cool with the fact June indirectly killed 3 people? It seems like "got mah revenge" is being equated to "all's well that ends well" here.

 

[Korigama]

Might've already been mentioned, but is everyone cool with the fact June indirectly killed 3 people? It seems like "got mah revenge" is being equated to "all's well that ends well" here.

In truth, I'm more willing to blame Santa for baiting Ace into killing the 9th Man and Nijisaki. Regardless of June's intentions of the Nonary Game being survivable for all participants, I believe the potential liability resulting from Ace's skepticism of the legitimacy of the threat posed by noncompliance was something brought up at some point (hence Ace lying to the 9th Man and seeing what happened as a test). As for Musashidou...well, I think I'll blame whichever one of them thought it would be a good idea to leave an ax in the captain's quarters in the first place.

 

[cosmicblizzard]

Makes sense I guess. Still seems odd to me that they would just accept it. I mean June was trying to saver her own life, so it was justified I suppose.

Got a couple of more things I'm not sure about. With the safe ending, what happened to Junpei after he got gassed? Are we just to assume things rewound and whatever happened next is irrelevant?

Also, was June or Santa the one in the Zero mask?

 

[timetokill]

I think most people are pinning the "killings" on Santa as the vengeful one, but to be fair, none of the deaths had to happen, and Ace made each one of them occur. He could've confessed or whatever and nobody would have died. It doesn't remove all responsibility but the fact remains that while they loaded the gun, they didn't pull the trigger, so to speak.


Whatever happened after Junpei got gassed is irrelevant/didn't happen to Akane, so it kind of makes sense that it just fades out. Whether Junpei lives or dies really doesn't matter, since Akane died 9 years ago in that situation.


I think it could have been one or both of them in the zero mask. They purposefully drew Akane with the same framing as Zero so that seems likely that she was wearing it, and to be honest it would've been more important to protect her identity than Santa's.

 

[MechaX]

I think most people are pinning the "killings" on Santa as the vengeful one, but to be fair, none of the deaths had to happen, and Ace made each one of them occur. He could've confessed or whatever and nobody would have died. It doesn't remove all responsibility but the fact remains that while they loaded the gun, they didn't pull the trigger, so to speak.

Nobody is denying that Ace shared most of the responsibility for his murders, but some of the real crucial elements of the second Nonary game (9th Man, Cap, and Not-Snake) really hinged on whether or not Ace was still a colossal douche (and they fully expected Ace to still be a colossal douche). Not killing the 9th Man would have altered some things, but not killing Cap or Not-Snake would have really thrown a monkey wrench into the entire game,

 

[Tricky I Shadow]

Ok, so I did the True Ending again yesterday and things have become much clearer to me now. Correct me if I'm wrong. But basically June did not die 9 years ago. Seven lied when he told Junpei the story. During the first Nonary Game she contacted Junpei 9 years into the future and he helped her with the incinerator puzzle. Now June had to make sure that happened again 9 years in the future, and that's why her, Santa and Seven did the second Nonary Game. I'm pretty sure that's the very basic plot, but I still have some more questions:


1. So no one here knows who destroyed/fixed the RED’s?

2. What was the point of June telling Junpei about the Titanic sinking being predicted? Was she simply giving him hints about how people could communicate that's not visible to the naked eye?

3. Does that also go for Ice-9? How it was communicating that’s not visible to the naked eye? Then what was the whole point to it not melting at room temperature?

4. What's the significance of the sock/boat explanation from Clover? I mean I understand that Snake has a fake left arm, but surely that's not it?

5. Was June the narrator the whole time? And the bad endings just her exploring all the possible paths that Junpei could have taken....so they don't actually happen when looking at the bigger picture?

6. What was the point in saying that June died 9 years ago?

7. Why was June with Santa 9 years ago? I mean they were supposed to be split up. She was a receiver I think they said. Was it explained why she was accidentally on the Gigantic and not in Nevada?

8. Where did June go in the present time when they were all in the incinerator? They look to the spot she was laying and then she is simply gone? What happened?

9. June and Junpei on the hill at the end - was that when Junpei saved June 9 years into the future and this was a flashback to when she was in the past with Junpei not even knowing yet that he had saved June's life?

10. Why did Junpei know who the bunny killers were on the hill when 9 years later in the shower room they never knew/caught the killers? Basically I'm having a hard time figuring out what timeline them on the hill is!

 

[abstract alien]

5. Was June the narrator the whole time? And the bad endings just her exploring all the possible paths that Junpei could have taken....so they don't actually happen when looking at the bigger picture?

I hadn't thought about that, but it is a very interesting theory...

 

[cosmicblizzard]

I hadn't thought about that, but it is a very interesting theory...

The safe ending pretty much confirms that none of the bad endings actually happened.

 

[Zaraki_Kenpachi]

Might've already been mentioned, but is everyone cool with the fact June indirectly killed 3 people? It seems like "got mah revenge" is being equated to "all's well that ends well" here.

But she never did much. There were ways for them to not be hurt at all and walk away fine but Ace's own delusions caused them to die.

Ok, so I did the True Ending again yesterday and things have become much clearer to me now. Correct me if I'm wrong. But basically June did not die 9 years ago. Seven lied when he told Junpei the story. During the first Nonary Game she contacted Junpei 9 years into the future and he helped her with the incinerator puzzle. Now June had to make sure that happened again 9 years in the future, and that's why her, Santa and Seven did the second Nonary Game. I'm pretty sure that's the very basic plot, but I still have some more questions:


1. So no one here knows who destroyed/fixed the RED’s?
It's never explicitly said. It's believed to be either Santa or June since one of them had to be there for the switching of snake.


2. What was the point of June telling Junpei about the Titanic sinking being predicted? Was she simply giving him hints about how people could communicate that's not visible to the naked eye?

Ya, partly that and partly to talk about the boat and how it ties in with other plotlines of ALICE and such. Hinting at the whole concept of a field and how could these people have predicted these events so closely if there wasn't something like the field or something telling them it would happen.

3. Does that also go for Ice-9? How it was communicating that’s not visible to the naked eye? Then what was the whole point to it not melting at room temperature?

Again, partly both that and tying up other story lines.
4. What's the significance of the sock/boat explanation from Clover? I mean I understand that Snake has a fake left arm, but surely that's not it?



5. Was June the narrator the whole time? And the bad endings just her exploring all the possible paths that Junpei could have taken....so they don't actually happen when looking at the bigger picture?

Not sure.

6. What was the point in saying that June died 9 years ago?

I think it was to create the mindset needed to tap into the field. The subject needed to be "distressed" for lack of a better word and his connection to the field would be stronger trying to save her, also why people think June is faking some of the times she's so nice to Junpei to make him care enough about her so he can tap into the field and save her.

7. Why was June with Santa 9 years ago? I mean they were supposed to be split up. She was a receiver I think they said. Was it explained why she was accidentally on the Gigantic and not in Nevada?

It was just a mixup. She was actually a sender not a receiver thus she should have been in Nevada.

8. Where did June go in the present time when they were all in the incinerator? They look to the spot she was laying and then she is simply gone? What happened?

Not sure.

9. June and Junpei on the hill at the end - was that when Junpei saved June 9 years into the future and this was a flashback to when she was in the past with Junpei not even knowing yet that he had saved June's life?

On the hill is just when they were kids wasn't it? It was just back story to when they were kids.

10. Why did Junpei know who the bunny killers were on the hill when 9 years later in the shower room they never knew/caught the killers? Basically I'm having a hard time figuring out what timeline them on the hill is!

Junpei said in the shower that they never caught the killers?

 

[abstract alien]

The safe ending pretty much confirms that none of the bad endings actually happened.

Yeah, I figured they never happened...but I guess I never made the connection that it could be June going through possible outcomes outside of the events that actually took place.

 

[cosmicblizzard]

But she never did much. There were ways for them to not be hurt at all and walk away fine but Ace's own delusions caused them to die.

It just doesn't sit right with me that the possibility was given and even expected. Kind of makes Santa and June out to be much more evil than they're treated by the story.

Yeah, I figured they never happened...but I guess I never made the connection that it could be June going through possible outcomes outside of the events that actually took place.

I actually didn't even figure out that the narrator was Akane from 9 years ago the whole time. I read about it afterwards and thought "oh duh, that's why you have to turn the DS upside down for the sudoku puzzle". I felt pretty dumb after that :/

 

[abstract alien]

I actually didn't even figure out that the narrator was Akane from 9 years ago the whole time. I read about it afterwards and thought "oh duh, that's why you have to turn the DS upside down for the sudoku puzzle". I felt pretty dumb after that :/

It's ok, there was quite a bit of mind screwing going on so its was easy to miss something lol

 

[Zaraki_Kenpachi]

It just doesn't sit right with me that the possibility was given and even expected. Kind of makes Santa and June out to be much more evil than they're treated by the story.



I actually didn't even figure out that the narrator was Akane from 9 years ago the whole time. I read about it afterwards and thought "oh duh, that's why you have to turn the DS upside down for the sudoku puzzle". I felt pretty dumb after that :/

Yes and No, they weren't to lose sleep if they died after all the things they did but they were always given the chance to go either way just like every other member in the story. Ax Clover, gun in the coffin, it's not like just Ace was tempted it was always about choice.

 

[AniHawk]

Ok, so I did the True Ending again yesterday and things have become much clearer to me now. Correct me if I'm wrong. But basically June did not die 9 years ago. Seven lied when he told Junpei the story. During the first Nonary Game she contacted Junpei 9 years into the future and he helped her with the incinerator puzzle. Now June had to make sure that happened again 9 years in the future, and that's why her, Santa and Seven did the second Nonary Game. I'm pretty sure that's the very basic plot, but I still have some more questions:

Yeah, you're on the money there.

1. So no one here knows who destroyed/fixed the RED’s?

It was presumably Santa, Seven, or June before anyone ever got there. The search for the REDs was a way to remove Snake from the game and have Ace kill one of his former colleagues.

2. What was the point of June telling Junpei about the Titanic sinking being predicted? Was she simply giving him hints about how people could communicate that's not visible to the naked eye?

3. Does that also go for Ice-9? How it was communicating that’s not visible to the naked eye? Then what was the whole point to it not melting at room temperature?

It's all about the morphogenetic field stuff that comes about at the very end of the game. The Gigantic in particular (which in real life became the HMHS Britannic and was supposed to be the ship everyone was on) was one of the sister ships of the Titanic. All the pseudoscience stuff was done to set up the final twist in the game. Also, the thing about "Futility" in particular was explained probably to set up the idea that details of things even years apart can be sent through the field.

4. What's the significance of the sock/boat explanation from Clover? I mean I understand that Snake has a fake left arm, but surely that's not it?

So you have a sock with a hole. Then you fix it and there's a patch, and if it kept getting holes and you kept fixing it, you would have a sock that consisted entirely of patches. So that sock consisting entirely of patches couldn't be the same sock that it originally was. The point behind her explaining this was to explain the biology behind the morphogenetic field.

So if you have cells that were generated from the energy of a burger, and that cow had had its cells generated thanks to the cells of a plant, and the plant had its cells grown from whatever was in the ground, etc etc, we'd also be a patchwork of various things. And I think the idea is because of this, it connects everyone/everything through the field.

5. Was June the narrator the whole time? And the bad endings just her exploring all the possible paths that Junpei could have taken....so they don't actually happen when looking at the bigger picture?

Yes, basically.

6. What was the point in saying that June died 9 years ago?

Presumably so Junpei would be in a heightened state so he could receive June's transmission at the end and everyone.

7. Why was June with Santa 9 years ago? I mean they were supposed to be split up. She was a receiver I think they said. Was it explained why she was accidentally on the Gigantic and not in Nevada?

It was a mistake and that was it. It's never explained why it was a mistake.

8. Where did June go in the present time when they were all in the incinerator? They look to the spot she was laying and then she is simply gone? What happened?

Secret hatch somewhere. I mean, she was Zero so she had 9 years of prep time to know she was going to be gone at that point. It's the only thing that makes sense.

9. June and Junpei on the hill at the end - was that when Junpei saved June 9 years into the future and this was a flashback to when she was in the past with Junpei not even knowing yet that he had saved June's life?

EDIT: Actually, this happens before she's kidnapped. That scene is there to show us what Junpei gave her that she drops during the Nonary Project as a kid.

10. Why did Junpei know who the bunny killers were on the hill when 9 years later in the shower room they never knew/caught the killers? Basically I'm having a hard time figuring out what timeline them on the hill is!

Good question.

 

[The Technomancer]

1. So no one here knows who destroyed/fixed the RED’s?

2. What was the point of June telling Junpei about the Titanic sinking being predicted? Was she simply giving him hints about how people could communicate that's not visible to the naked eye? Think so

3. Does that also go for Ice-9? How it was communicating that’s not visible to the naked eye? Then what was the whole point to it not melting at room temperature?

4. What's the significance of the sock/boat explanation from Clover? I mean I understand that Snake has a fake left arm, but surely that's not it?

5. Was June the narrator the whole time? And the bad endings just her exploring all the possible paths that Junpei could have taken....so they don't actually happen when looking at the bigger picture? That's what most of us think

6. What was the point in saying that June died 9 years ago? Junpei had to really believe that her life was on the line for the final part to go properly. They needed that pressure on him

7. Why was June with Santa 9 years ago? I mean they were supposed to be split up. She was a receiver I think they said. Was it explained why she was accidentally on the Gigantic and not in Nevada? Yeah, they do. Kinda. I think Santa says "there must have been some kind of mix-up, because she was put in with us"

8. Where did June go in the present time when they were all in the incinerator? They look to the spot she was laying and then she is simply gone? What happened? Seriously. This one bugs me

9. June and Junpei on the hill at the end - was that when Junpei saved June 9 years into the future and this was a flashback to when she was in the past with Junpei not even knowing yet that he had saved June's life? Yeah, think so

10. Why did Junpei know who the bunny killers were on the hill when 9 years later in the shower room they never knew/caught the killers? Basically I'm having a hard time figuring out what timeline them on the hill is!

.

 

[AniHawk]

Also, I gotta say that as someone who was super interested in the Titanic as a kid, that was another unexpected piece of awesome to come from this story. I learned things about the Titanic I'd never known.

 

[Tricky I Shadow]

Thanks a lot for answering my questions! It's good to see that a lot of you seem to not know some of the answers. It makes me feel a little smarter LOL!

Junpei said in the shower that they never caught the killers?

Yeah.....in Door 3 a flashback happens and June and Junpei hide behind the bunny cage hoping that the people who killed the bunnies in elementary school would come back again, but they never did.

Yet at the end when they are both sitting on the hill it's hinted that Junpei saw some kids pouring gasoline on a cat and they were the one's who killed the bunnies. So yeah, I don’t really understand it.

 

[cosmicblizzard]

Yes and No, they weren't to lose sleep if they died after all the things they did but they were always given the chance to go either way just like every other member in the story. Ax Clover, gun in the coffin, it's not like just Ace was tempted it was always about choice.

Yes, but the chances of the previous Nonary game staff members dying was much higher than everyone else dying since they all had bombs in them while the rest of the game players were safe, at least from blowing up. In fact, the guy in Snake's clothes was pretty much guaranteed to die and Santa and/or June were well aware of this. Ace might've been the one to directly kill him, but it's the same thing as throwing some guy into a hungry lion's den. They're still guilty.

 

[Akselziys]

Yes, young Akane was the narrator on the bottom screen

Spoiler

so sayeth the source