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Address the Sess - Machinima/MS YT Scandal with Leaker, TotalBiscuit, J Schreier
- Thread starter SwiftDeath
- Start date
SwiftDeath
Member
Yeah that really confused me. Adam basically said that the internet's reaction was overly due to the ads themselves and not the non-disclosure part but then went onto say how the nondisclosure part was the real issue. It was certainly odd
Yeah pretty much. Anytime I've seen Adam address some topic that has a general collective notion about it, he seems to distance himself from whatever the prevailing opinion is more or less
SwiftDeath
Member
Not to double post but video is now available for those who missed it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDz1EWfVqHk
There is a sort of timeline in the video description. Shows how tangential it was but some great parts there like 1:20:00 TotalBiscuit: "Cut the bullshit, these kinds of deals and agreements are insulting to everyone"
*Updated OP*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDz1EWfVqHk
There is a sort of timeline in the video description. Shows how tangential it was but some great parts there like 1:20:00 TotalBiscuit: "Cut the bullshit, these kinds of deals and agreements are insulting to everyone"
*Updated OP*
Interesting show since everyone on the panel has a stake in what is going on and experience to some extent with all this to talk about but since they also have to protect their own interests, it didn't necessarily get as open of a discussion as it could have been except when opinions about other sectors kind of forced people to defend their sector.
Nevertheless, for an impromptu discussion just diving right into an issue that goes pretty deep and can have far reaching effects in the industry, it was good and I agree with everyone's sentiment that this coming to light was a good thing.
Hopefully, changes for the better are made going forward. Unfortunately, the cynic in me says that the systems in place may be too far gone, especially since the burden of accountability must fall somewhere and it may be too big of a beast to tame, there are still large gray areas, there are many young and naive "professionals" getting involved, and there is a whole lot of money at stake here.
Nevertheless, for an impromptu discussion just diving right into an issue that goes pretty deep and can have far reaching effects in the industry, it was good and I agree with everyone's sentiment that this coming to light was a good thing.
Hopefully, changes for the better are made going forward. Unfortunately, the cynic in me says that the systems in place may be too far gone, especially since the burden of accountability must fall somewhere and it may be too big of a beast to tame, there are still large gray areas, there are many young and naive "professionals" getting involved, and there is a whole lot of money at stake here.
Really enjoyed it, Jason. You did your best.
Had to step out during live stream but just finished watching it. Damn, was it just me or was Sessler really annoying? He keep on talking about random bs instead of the issue. God, so frustrating. Jason and TB were really good especially Jason. He learned a lot of respect from me. The pr guy, Erik, was kind of useless and didn't really add anything useful to the discussion but what did I expect, he's still in the pr business and probably didn't wanna piss anyone off too much. Too bad, they couldn't get a lawyer on (I know TB has a JD but its probably been years since his law school days) would've made the conversion more interesting.
LifEndz
Member
Nice discussion, but Adam didn't do enough to keep me as a viewer/subscriber. He's been different since last E3 (to put it mildly), and it's only gotten worse with the new consoles. Maybe it's him trying to straddle the fence and appear neutral. I don't know. But the stammering stuttering guy with a wealth of video game knowledge and objective perspective is now just a stammering stuttering guy that resorts to _____ too rather than talk the issue at hand.
Plus is I never heard of total biscuit and I'll def check his stuff after this.
Plus is I never heard of total biscuit and I'll def check his stuff after this.
We also need to get you a lamp but you were great regardless.
jim2point0
Banned
He's knowledgeable about quite a lot of stuff. He's also extremely opinionated. So there's that. But he does a great series called "WTF IS..." where he does first impressions of games. Basically videos on what you can expect a few hours into a game. Usually indie games. I've discovered a lot of cool stuff from that series and is mostly why I follow him on youtube.
Anywho, I watched this live but had no idea there was a GAF thread. Heh. That PR guy. Fuck. I did not like him. Won't say much about Sess but I'm glad he put this all together. All in all though it was a good video with tons of stuff that needed to be said regardless of how long this kinda crap has been going on for.
Imperfected
Member
GillianSeed79
Member
Just got finished watching. (Had to work late tonight). Props to Jason and Total Biscuit for laying down the truth bombs. Jason does great work and I'm always humbled when he shows up here on GAF. I love how he is totally transparent and honest with us. I've only been introduced to Total Biscuit in recent months, but he seems like a totally trustworthy guy. I gained much respect for him after tonight.
After watching the full video I have come to gain a lot of respect for Jason and TB for speaking the truth. Erik on the other hand just didn't want to say anything bad about Microsoft. At one point it was on the tip of his tongue when naming companies that could make this mistake but held back. Towards the end says he spoke to Microsoft before the start and it all made sense why he wouldn't blame them. I don't want to say he was paid to say good things without evidence but it sure looked like it.
Jason seems to be the one journalist in the industry that doesn't make me feel dirty using the word journalist. Seems like a good guy who approaches it rationally. We're lucky to have him here. No offense to other journalists, but there's not a lot of accountability, objectivity, and honest reporting anymore and it's depressing. The industry is just like the cable news network market where they all appeal to different bullshit and make sure to run what they want for their own narrative.
Adam confuses me anymore. I used to respect quite a bit back in the day but now he leaves me disappointed time and time again and it annoys me even more when he think it's all related to the console wars instead of dealing with shady business practices and holding a company accountable. This time, we're supposedly upset that the YT'ers are getting paid? Really? That's the issue? If that was the case, we should probably stop watching YT altogether. I don't hate the guy personally or anything, but I find his opinions less appealing to me since they usually miss the point of the story in the first place. Not to mention some of his previous outbursts being downright embarrassing for an industry that needs to grow up.
TB can be a real dick sometimes but he at least speaks the truth here.
Adam confuses me anymore. I used to respect quite a bit back in the day but now he leaves me disappointed time and time again and it annoys me even more when he think it's all related to the console wars instead of dealing with shady business practices and holding a company accountable. This time, we're supposedly upset that the YT'ers are getting paid? Really? That's the issue? If that was the case, we should probably stop watching YT altogether. I don't hate the guy personally or anything, but I find his opinions less appealing to me since they usually miss the point of the story in the first place. Not to mention some of his previous outbursts being downright embarrassing for an industry that needs to grow up.
TB can be a real dick sometimes but he at least speaks the truth here.
NullPointer
Member
TB was the most straightforward in terms of keeping audience expectation in check. He gave himself the space to make the best monetary decisions for his channel as long as he always acts above board with his viewers. I appreciate the candor.
Jason got a little more idealistic even though he also seems more than willing to discuss the need for his articles to not only have integrity, but also to draw an audience, because Kotaku needs those clicks to keep this kind of content going.
Basically Jason didn't feel the need to point out that we're not friends, and Biscuit hurt my feelings by saying so, forcefully.
I thought we were cool Biscuit.
Jason got a little more idealistic even though he also seems more than willing to discuss the need for his articles to not only have integrity, but also to draw an audience, because Kotaku needs those clicks to keep this kind of content going.
Basically Jason didn't feel the need to point out that we're not friends, and Biscuit hurt my feelings by saying so, forcefully.
I thought we were cool Biscuit.
Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
Well, I liked him from watching him on Extended Play and Xplay as a kid. And I think he can be VERY articulate in game reviews. He approaches games from a unique perspective as an English major who probably never intended from a young age to even enter the industry. His recent rev3 reviews of Bioshock Infinite, Last of Us, and GTAV for example, are probably some of the most entertaining reviews ever. SO MUCH lavish praise given with such eloquence. Way over the top (hilariously so even), but engaging imo.
Great job by the way. Some really poignant points you brought up.
CosmicGroinPull
Member
Ever since he mentioned in his meltdown that this job is his livelihood, I've realised how important it is to him. And really, who wants to offend the almighty MS over an issue that'll likely be forgotten in a week or two?
ChiliManiac
Banned
Didn't Marcus Beer say this on one of his very first episodes and that he experienced it himself when he was working PR?
IAmRandom31
Banned
Just got done watching the video. Have to say it simply sounds like no one knew it was illegal not to disclose they were being paid to promote a product . Simple. Too much talk about " if you hit 10,000 " subscribers then you need to be bound by ethical obligation to disclose your opinion is being paid for. Nope, it does not matter if no one sees you video, if you are being paid by a company to form an opinion about their product, promoting that product, then you are immediately bound by FTC regulations to disclose that you are being paid.
But not only were they forced by this contract to not disclose, they were also forced to not form any negative opinions. Pretty much killing any chance this opinion has of being genuine while doing everything thy can to make the opinion appar genuine. It is deceit at its most basic and unethical level.
But not only were they forced by this contract to not disclose, they were also forced to not form any negative opinions. Pretty much killing any chance this opinion has of being genuine while doing everything thy can to make the opinion appar genuine. It is deceit at its most basic and unethical level.
I don't care what TB says, he's my friend =D
Jason, I've disagreed a lot with you in the past and criticized your articles / website a lot but I have to say, you did an excellent job in this video and brought up a lot of excellent points.
Maybe it's the topic in particular or the fact that this was perhaps a bit more personal than your Kotaku articles, but respect +10 in any case.
adam sessler's attempt to be "neutral" is so mindnumbingly forced
that entire talk was like the ones you see on cnn/msnbc/fox where one extreme talks, the other extreme says his bs, and the moderator (sessler) goes oh well, there you have it folks!
no real conclusion or any insight or any delving into the actual details or discussion.
i'm embarrassed to even see sessler like this.
that entire talk was like the ones you see on cnn/msnbc/fox where one extreme talks, the other extreme says his bs, and the moderator (sessler) goes oh well, there you have it folks!
no real conclusion or any insight or any delving into the actual details or discussion.
i'm embarrassed to even see sessler like this.
la flama blanca
Banned
You'd be stupid to think that things would go any other way when you have a hobby that covers such a huge demographic.
So childish that people who follow it still can't manage to understand that there are many different people on the internet with a wide variety of opinions. Believe it or not, it's not just you and that one guy who always contradicts himself.
It means we care about the actual issues, not about blindly following personalities. Sounds like a good thing to me.
Everyone agrees. Hopefully you will have a good one that will last a long time before the next event you have.
Thank you for trying to keep things on topic and drive the points home.
KingFire said:
I still loathe TB for the DRM nonsense. That said he did good today, if I criticized him I'd be crazy, why would I? We judge opinions and facts, not people; for example if Sessler or Gies had done something great lately, I'd totally support that. Too bad they keep shitting the consumers.
No shit.
OMG I left right before the best part!
What is childish is blindingly following one guys opinion no matter what he says. Hell, even TB says that you shouldn't trust his opinion and that he's just one guy with a prospective. So I can disagree with him about the DRM stuff but agree with him on this. That's called being an adult and coming to conclusions about things yourself and not based on what some gaming commentator says.
It's also annoying that people say, "Sony was going for DRM, too!," etc. without any concrete proof.
Something needs to be done about that.
I've been critical of you in the past, but you really did a great job of not letting the others off the hook.
Me too. We need more people like Jason & Total Biscuit, not more people like Adam Sessler or Erik that wants to either dodge the issues or constantly defend a company that does shit wrong, or to bring other companies into this mess.
I think that poster was referencing how people go after others personally when they don't agree on a particular issue, resorting to name-calling and various forms of smearing.
Yes, costumers align with people that express pro-consumer views, what a bunch of fucking hypocrites we are, arent we?
clutch.as.it.gets.
Member
Jason Schreier is definitely one of the few good guys this industry has to offer.
Triggerhappytel
Member
I've watched about 35 minutes so far, and what's really standing out is that any time someone says something really strong against this controversy/MS/Machinima Sess tries to make excuses or goes off topic (ie talking about Macy's doing similar things in the fashion industry, pointing out that FEC guidelines were created five years ago and did not have YouTube in mind, so maybe they need updating, etc). So far the others are having an interesting discussion, and all I'm hearing from him is excuses.
Edit - ha ha, now he's blaming YT, saying it's a hard platform to make money on therefore it's natural that the users themselves would want to opt into these schemes!
Edit - ha ha, now he's blaming YT, saying it's a hard platform to make money on therefore it's natural that the users themselves would want to opt into these schemes!
yeah, he was very anti-consumer on the xbox one drm stuff, and is pro-consumer on this issue.
frying him on the first thing and then praising his opinion on the 2nd is not being contradictory.