• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

AMD's "tressfx" unveiled; Lara can take care of her own hair [DX11 compute]

S

SapientWolf

Trucker Sexologist
SpinningBirdKick said:
I can appreciate a good bit of tech as good as the next nerd/geek.

I just find it kind of sad that with all this horsepower available the best thing the developers decided effort should be expended upon was improving things that pretty much amounts to fluff in the big scheme of things. Yet we're likely left with the same tired old gameplay mechanics that we're been saddled with for generations now.

Apologies for disrupting the thread, this wasn't really the best place for my whining on the creative state of the industry.

As you were...
Click to expand...
People clearly aren't tired of those mechanics. In fact, making something completely original on a AAA budget would be a huge financial risk.

But as graphics get more realistic people are going to have less tolerance for things that look incredibly unrealistic. Hair being one of them.
 
L

Lime

Member
I NEED SCISSORS said:
So is it working on Nvidia cards sort of similar to how Nvidia's FXAA is cross compatible with AMD cards? I like it that they share some tech.
Click to expand...

Don't know if this relates to the cross-compatibility of the tech between AMD and Nvidia cards:

AMD's sophisticated hair tools are based on its previous work with Order Independent Transparency (OIT), making use of Per-Pixel Linked-List (PPLL) data structures to manage memory usage and rendering complexity. TressFX also leverages the massively-parallel processing power afforded by DirectCompute, taking full advantage of AMD's GCN-based hardware.

Although AMD doesn't say specifically, Nvidia's line-up also supports DirectCompute and OIT (pdf). This may suggest TressFX will work across a broader variety of GPUs than just AMD Radeons. However, it's a safe bet that TressFX will work best, if not exclusively, with Radeon GPUs.
Click to expand...

Check the link for referrals to resources: http://www.techspot.com/news/51765-amd-unveils-tressfx-hair-rendering-technology-pics.html
 
N

NBtoaster

Member
SpinningBirdKick said:
I can appreciate a good bit of tech as good as the next nerd/geek.

I just find it kind of sad that with all this horsepower available the best thing the developers decided effort should be expended upon was improving things that pretty much amounts to fluff in the big scheme of things. Yet we're likely left with the same tired old gameplay mechanics that we're been saddled with for generations now.

Apologies for disrupting the thread, this wasn't really the best place for my whining on the creative state of the industry.

As you were...
Click to expand...

New gameplay mechanics is not the responsibility of AMD or the pc porters.
 
A

AndyBNV

Nvidia
As we suspected, AMD's press release has been very carefully worded. 'TressFX is not exclusive to AMD,' a spokesperson for the company has told us. 'It works on any DirectX11 card, similar to some other AMD-built technologies - for example Order-Independent Transparency (OIT) or High Definition Ambient Occlusion (HDAO).' Thus is the truth revealed: any DirectX11-capable graphics hardware, including those from rival Nvidia, will be able to make use of AMD's hair-rendering know-how.

Devon Nekechuck, product manager for high-end discrete desktop graphics at AMD, offers a bit more detail - and a sneaky plug for his company's GCN-based Radeon HD products: 'TressFX will definitely work on any DirectCompute-enabled device. This has roots in the core of Gaming Evolved, where we want to enable technology for all gamers, and not create proprietary features that lock out gamers that use our competitor's products. That said, TressFX is very computationally intensive, and hence games that use TressFX will really be able to benefit from high DirectCompute performance. Because of that, you will see Graphics Core Next-based GPUs excel when it's enabled.'
Click to expand...

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/hardware/2013/02/26/amd-tressfx/1
 
D

Durante

Member
Megasoum said:
NVIDIA will have had time to create its own hair tech before we get a video from AMD...ffs
Click to expand...
Nvidia has been creating hair demos for a long time. I think their Apex stuff can be used for hair as well. But they never got it into a game, and for that I commend AMD.
 
C

charsace

Member
dr_rus said:
TBH NVIDIA had such "tech" in 2004.

This isn't "tech", people, and it's not an algorithm. It's an implementation of hair physics done for Tomb Raider by AMD via DX11 and DC5. The same can easily be done by anyone via PhysX or Havok or OpenCL or OpenGL etc.
Click to expand...

It sounds like they came up with their own algorithm to get this thing running. There are other algorithms that are really similar to A*. Doesn't mean A* isn't a new algorithm.

I wonder if the physics for the hair is verlet based.
 
P

plagiarize

Banned
Durante said:
Nvidia has been creating hair demos for a long time. I think their Apex stuff can be used for hair as well. But they never got it into a game, and for that I commend AMD.
Click to expand...

Interestingly, Alice, which supports physX on PC, doesn't use PhysX at all for it's great hair implementation.
 
D

Durante

Member
SpinningBirdKick said:
Hair physics is a genuine unique selling point these days?

Really?

I have no words...
Click to expand...
Are you kidding? In an age of active IQ worsening features such as chromatic aberration and tons of pointless post-processing being praised as the next graphical frontier, better hair is an enormous leap in realtime graphics. I've been waiting for decent hair in games for almost a decade. Naive as I was, I thought it might happen this gen when I saw the first FF13 video.
 
M

Meccanical

Member
Durante said:
Are you kidding? In an age of active IQ worsening features such as chromatic aberration and tons of pointless post-processing being praised as the next graphical frontier, better hair is an enormous leap in realtime graphics. I've been waiting for decent hair in games for almost a decade. Naive as I was, I thought it might happen this gen when I saw the first FF13 video.
Click to expand...


FFXIII, setting everyone up for disappointment since 2006.
 
C

charsace

Member
Felix Lighter said:
They're acting like they caught AMD being sneaky. They seem pretty upfront about it not being AMD only. They're not going to point out Nvidia products by name.
Click to expand...
They are confusing AMD with Nvidia who does mostly create things for their tech only.

Durante said:
Are you kidding? In an age of active IQ worsening features such as chromatic aberration and tons of pointless post-processing being praised as the next graphical frontier, better hair is an enormous leap in realtime graphics. I've been waiting for decent hair in games for almost a decade. Naive as I was, I thought it might happen this gen when I saw the first FF13 video.
Click to expand...

Yep. I'm surprised that people don't care about this. Hair is something that can add a lot of life to a character. Its why animators love to give characters hair or have the clothes of chracters be active when they move. Even in this gen they give characters scarves, jackets, etc. that procedurally animate as a character moves about.
 
T

ThoseDeafMutes

Member
Lest we forget.

dat_hairpceyy.png
 
G

gundamkyoukai

Member
Durante said:
Are you kidding? In an age of active IQ worsening features such as chromatic aberration and tons of pointless post-processing being praised as the next graphical frontier, better hair is an enormous leap in realtime graphics. I've been waiting for decent hair in games for almost a decade. Naive as I was, I thought it might happen this gen when I saw the first FF13 video.
Click to expand...

Yep i agree FF13 was a real let down when it comes to hair .
Can wait to see a video if this tech , final this gen we might have great hair and clothing in 3d fighting game or so i hope .
 
T

ThoseDeafMutes

Member
While they're at it, they should make some new technique to render glasses full of liquids well. Maybe there have been some good, recent examples I haven't seen but they've been pretty poor in my experience. Also, melting ice.
 
D

DieH@rd

Banned
"AMD and Crystal Dynamics developers will present their works on TressFX along with other advanced visual effects using DirectX 11 in the upcoming GDC 2013 conference. "
-SemiAccurate

That's three weeks after game ships. Give us video before release date!!!
 
D

Dictator93

Member
Perkel said:
DICE completely changed rendering engine. Calling it UE3 is like calling COD4 engine IDTECH2
Click to expand...

if by completely changed you mean just through in enlighten for baking GI and the light maps... then yes. Other than that it still uses the same shading model and other stuff...
 
P

Perkel

Banned
Dictator93 said:
if by completely changed you mean just through in enlighten for baking GI and the light maps... then yes. Other than that it still uses the same shading model and other stuff...
Click to expand...

They used external renderer called Beast for beaking which was used later in Bioshock and Sindicate. They tweaked render to get better effects with baked effects.

Guess i was wrong. Still their final output can't be really described as best case of UE3 since most of what we love about it is not thanks to UE3 but Beast render.
 
K

Kysel

Member
Why are they marketing hair physics as a singular entity, this should be a small part of a larger variety of improved physics effects.
Grass, cloth, skin movements, trees, wind. Thats the bigger picture that needs to be addressed
 
L

Lucius86

Banned
Kysel said:
Why are they marketing hair physics as a singular entity, this should be a small part of a larger variety of improved physics effects.
Grass, cloth, skin movements, trees, wind. Thats the bigger picture that needs to be addressed
Click to expand...

Baby steps. We don't know the performance impact of the hair yet, let alone duplicating that to other surfaces and visual elements.
 
E

Eideka

Banned
Kysel said:
Why are they marketing hair physics as a singular entity, this should be a small part of a larger variety of improved physics effects.
Grass, cloth, skin movements, trees, wind. Thats the bigger picture that needs to be addressed
Click to expand...

I agree with that, and hopefully next-gen will improve upon all those things.
 
T

The Abominable Snowman

Member
Kysel said:
Why are they marketing hair physics as a singular entity, this should be a small part of a larger variety of improved physics effects.
Grass, cloth, skin movements, trees, wind. Thats the bigger picture that needs to be addressed
Click to expand...

To my understanding, I thought TressFX was just part of a larger physics engine AMD is pushing?

Was it not?
 
dr_rus

dr_rus

Member
Uncle Rupee said:
Then why haven't we seen anything that looks as good in a real game?
Click to expand...
Because consoles. They don't have the power needed to do anything like this. I hope that this will change in the next generation. And I hope that this TressFX will be made available to all PS4/Xb3 developers and won't be known as a feature that only TR had.

Kysel said:
Why are they marketing hair physics as a singular entity, this should be a small part of a larger variety of improved physics effects.
Grass, cloth, skin movements, trees, wind. Thats the bigger picture that needs to be addressed
Click to expand...
Because they don't have a larger variety. For that you need to have your own physics API like PhysX/Bullet/Havok.
 
J

JaseC

gave away the keys to the kingdom.
The Abominable Snowman said:
To my understanding, I thought TressFX was just part of a larger physics engine AMD is pushing?

Was it not?
Click to expand...

Not by any official measure, although the full name being "TressFX Hair" may very well imply that future specialised rendering/physics techniques are on the cards and will also fall under the TressFX banner.
 
X

xenist

Member
It is impressive but it seems they didn't push for it at all. And an implemented tech is worth more than one that simply exists in demos, even if it looks better.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

the nvidia and amd sides of the gameworks story
31
4K
Kezen replied
TressFX 2.0 by AMD - Now with hair, fur and grass physics
2
72
19K
FACE replied
Conan Exiles Early Access |OT| You shall be my Thrall
4 5 6 7 8
350
68K
IbizaPocholo replied
AMDs Future of Compute: CARRIZO APU, 5 Samsung UHD FreeSync displays + more
2 3 4
171
26K
Datschge replied
How much prettier is Tomb Raider: Definitive Edition? [Preview]
3 4 5 6 7
342
55K
G_Berry replied
Top Bottom