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[marmoka]

Don't know if someone already commented this yet, but anyway.

I noticed yesterday that the force attacks are called "Garu" in P5, meanwhile they were called "Zan" in SMT IV and SMTIV:A. If we go further in the past, we find "Garu" again, this time in Strange Journey. And even further, "Zan" again in Nocturne (correct me if I'm wrong here).

Is there an explanation to this?

Also, we have "Pyro Jack" in SMT IV, but "Jack O'Lantern" in P5. I don't know if this is Atlus Japan's fault, of if Atlus USA has problems standardizing different terms and names.

 

[thetrin]

Perhaps it's because I am not English native but... I don't see any problem with the examples shown in the OP?

Like, what would you replace your examples in the OP with? Can you give an example?

As someone that has worked in localization, I can tell you that that's what text looks like before an editor gets their hands on it. It's really stilted, dry, and lacking flow.

 

[Nictel]

Don't know if someone already commented this yet, but anyway.

I noticed yesterday that the force attacks are called "Garu" in P5, meanwhile they were called "Zan" in SMT IV and SMTIV:A. If we go further in the past, we find "Garu" again, this time in Strange Journey. And even further, "Zan" again in Nocturne (correct me if I'm wrong here).

Is there an explanation to this?

Also, we have "Pyro Jack" in SMT IV, but "Jack O'Lantern" in P5. I don't know if this is Atlus Japan's fault, of if Atlus USA has problems standardizing different terms and names.

It was Garu in the other Persona games too. Perhaps it was a translation choice by different translators back then and they kept with it in the series for consistency.

 

[Mendrox]

Don't know if someone already commented this yet, but anyway.

I noticed yesterday that the force attacks are called "Garu" in P5, meanwhile they were called "Zan" in SMT IV and SMTIV:A. If we go further in the past, we find "Garu" again, this time in Strange Journey. And even further, "Zan" again in Nocturne (correct me if I'm wrong here).

Is there an explanation to this?

Also, we have "Pyro Jack" in SMT IV, but "Jack O'Lantern" in P5. I don't know if this is Atlus Japan's fault, of if Atlus USA has problems standardizing different terms and names.

That's because Garu is wind and Zen is force (except for P2). They are different spells.

 

[Caim]

Don't know if someone already commented this yet, but anyway.

I noticed yesterday that the force attacks are called "Garu" in P5, meanwhile they were called "Zan" in SMT IV and SMTIV:A. If we go further in the past, we find "Garu" again, this time in Strange Journey. And even further, "Zan" again in Nocturne (correct me if I'm wrong here).

Is there an explanation to this?

Also, we have "Pyro Jack" in SMT IV, but "Jack O'Lantern" in P5. I don't know if this is Atlus Japan's fault, of if Atlus USA has problems standardizing different terms and names.

Personas don't give you their real name until they join you like "Menacing Owlman" is actually Andras.

 

[duckroll]

Garu and Zan are not the same spell. Garu is the wind spell, Zan is the force spell. Zan traditionally appears in SMT games, while Garu appears in Persona games. Sometimes both exists in a game because they just want ~more spells~ but it is rare. The effects are similar so people are often confused, but it's not a translation issue.

 

[Scrooge McDuck]

Don't know if someone already commented this yet, but anyway.

I noticed yesterday that the force attacks are called "Garu" in P5, meanwhile they were called "Zan" in SMT IV and SMTIV:A. If we go further in the past, we find "Garu" again, this time in Strange Journey. And even further, "Zan" again in Nocturne (correct me if I'm wrong here).

Is there an explanation to this?

Also, we have "Pyro Jack" in SMT IV, but "Jack O'Lantern" in P5. I don't know if this is Atlus Japan's fault, of if Atlus USA has problems standardizing different terms and names.

They are actually different types of attacks. "Garu" is Wind while "Zan" is Force. The first Persona has both. The Pyro Jack thing is weird, though. One day they just suddenly changed "Jack O'Lantern" to "Pyro Jack" in one of the games, used that ever since, and now apparently changed it back.

 

[ChrisD]

Personas don't give you their real name until they join you like "Menacing Owlman" is actually Andras.

Nah, he's right with Pyro Jack being renamed/changed back to Jack'o'Lantern in P5. I know because that bugged me more than any text lines I've seen have, lol.

 

[Mendrox]

The USA only named two states after the name, what the fuck do they know?

I don't think a Red Sox game would work if Sweet Caroline was pronounced like Gasoline.

Yeah well and Caroline has a different pronunciation in different countries. Caro-LINE is American for me and Caroliiiin is German/Danish for me.

 

[marmoka]

Understood the issue of Garu and Zan, Wind and Force. I remember that they both had the same sound in SJ and SMTIV, even the same icon. Thanks guys!

I suppose all this would be less confusing if they also translated the attack names. In the end, you get used to Bufu, Agi, Zio, and all the rest. But the first time, it was really confusing.

 

[ChrisD]

Understood the issue of Garu and Zan, Wind and Force. I remember that they both had the same sound in SJ and SMTIV, even the same icon. Thanks guys!

I suppose all this would be less confusing if they also translated the attack names. In the end, you get used to Bufu, Agi, Zio, and all the rest. But the first time, it was really confusing.

Still remember reading Media as "Mee-Dee-Uh" like the news media for hours on end when I first played P4G. Can't remember when I realized my error.

The system is really uniform with all the roots and suffixes, maybe translating things would have looked off or would require too much renaming? Mawind Malightning doesn't sound very cool. Or perhaps it's just a case of being accustomed to what we have?

 

[Earthpainting]

A lot the names are pronounced the way you would in French, but with English accents. It's odd especially if you don't speak French. I imagine it's because of Arsenne Lupin being a frenchman and all, and there's other influences like the cafe LeBlanc, and the French style of the velvet room.

Haven't started the game yet, but this seems like the most logical explanation. Justine and Caroline are French names, and given the references the games wears on its sleeve, it's clear what the intent was. Hard to gauge how successful they were at it using English phonetic text though.

I'm a little surprised by some of the examples in the thread. Normally Atlus has a level of polish to their script that seems to be missing here.

 

[Balphon]

The USA only named two states after the name, what the fuck do they know?

Hate to break it to you, but the Carolinas were named after Charles I.

 

[Iva Demilcol]

I noticed something today: I already played the Japanese version and started playing the US version today... and subtitles don't match what characters say in the Japanese version. It's not that bad though but it's noticeable. There's that infamous scene of Ryuji

Spoiler

asking himself if what he just did was his Persona, and in the English version they localized it as "Waddup persona",

so it stands out when the Japanese script says one thing but the subtitles say other. Oh, and before someone suggests it: I'm not talking about doing a literal translation, I meant there are lines in the Japanese script that are just one word and an entire phrase in English or vice versa.

I gave shit to Atlusprime about it a few weeks ago to see if they planned to alter the subtitles to actually match the Japanese script or if they'd let it intact as I saw it in the stream where they annnounced the last delay.

I really wonder if they really "polished" the localization or if they just wanted to release the game in April because of the fiscal year.

Granted, It's an issue that not many people would notice but it's a thing.

 

[Matt Attack]

I noticed something today: I already played the Japanese version and started playing the US version today... and subtitles don't match what characters say in the Japanese version. It's not that bad though but it's noticeable. There's that infamous scene of Ryuji

Spoiler

asking himself if what he just did was his Persona, and in the English version they localized it as "Waddup persona",

so it stands out when the Japanese script says one thing but the subtitles say other. Oh, and before someone suggests it: I'm not talking about doing a literal translation, I meant there are lines in the Japanese script that are just one word and an entire phrase in English or vice versa.

I gave shit to Atlusprime about it a few weeks ago to see if they planned to alter the subtitles to actually match the Japanese script or if they'd let it intact as I saw it in the stream where they annnounced the last delay.

I really wonder if they really "polished" the localization or if they just wanted to release the game in April because of the fiscal year.

Granted, It's an issue that not many people would notice but it's a thing.

Is there much precedent in games for altering the script depending on which dub track is active? And I do understand why dubtitles would be distracting if you're able to recognize what the Japanese VA are saying. I feel like I've been seeing this sort of complaint more frequently lately, but considering how many changes end up being made to a localized script, it seems like it would be a logistical nightmare to offer a radically different script for those who use the Japanese dub.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

I noticed something today: I already played the Japanese version and started playing the US version today... and subtitles don't match what characters say in the Japanese version. It's not that bad though but it's noticeable. There's that infamous scene of Ryuji

Spoiler

asking himself if what he just did was his Persona, and in the English version they localized it as "Waddup persona",

so it stands out when the Japanese script says one thing but the subtitles say other. Oh, and before someone suggests it: I'm not talking about doing a literal translation, I meant there are lines in the Japanese script that are just one word and an entire phrase in English or vice versa.

I gave shit to Atlusprime about it a few weeks ago to see if they planned to alter the subtitles to actually match the Japanese script or if they'd let it intact as I saw it in the stream where they annnounced the last delay.

I really wonder if they really "polished" the localization or if they just wanted to release the game in April because of the fiscal year.

Granted, It's an issue that not many people would notice but it's a thing.

They would have had to release in March to make it into last fiscal year.

 

[duckroll]

Is there much precedent in games for altering the script depending on which dub track is active? And I do understand why dubtitles would be distracting if you're able to recognize what the Japanese VA are saying. I feel like I've been seeing this sort of complaint more frequently lately, but considering how many changes end up being made to a localized script, it seems like it would be a logistical nightmare to offer a radically different script for those who use the Japanese dub.

Yes. Zelda BotW does this. Depending on what language you want the voice in, the text is also in that language.



Sorry, couldn't resist.

 

[Curufinwe]

I played the first two hours last night and took a picture of this clunker since I hadn't seen an image of it elsewhere.

 

[muteki]

I noticed something today: I already played the Japanese version and started playing the US version today... and subtitles don't match what characters say in the Japanese version. It's not that bad though but it's noticeable. There's that infamous scene of Ryuji

Spoiler

asking himself if what he just did was his Persona, and in the English version they localized it as "Waddup persona",

so it stands out when the Japanese script says one thing but the subtitles say other. Oh, and before someone suggests it: I'm not talking about doing a literal translation, I meant there are lines in the Japanese script that are just one word and an entire phrase in English or vice versa.

I gave shit to Atlusprime about it a few weeks ago to see if they planned to alter the subtitles to actually match the Japanese script or if they'd let it intact as I saw it in the stream where they annnounced the last delay.

I really wonder if they really "polished" the localization or if they just wanted to release the game in April because of the fiscal year.

Granted, It's an issue that not many people would notice but it's a thing.

Playing Valkyria Chronicles with JP audio was like this. Are there many games that don't have dubtitles? For some reason I just have never expected two translations.

Persona 5 isn't as bad, from what I've played so far.

 

[Hades Hotgun]

So I finally got to play for a few hours last night, and yeah the localization is just generally bad throughout. It isn't a few cherry picked issues, but rather a frequent occurrence that is pretty much present in every scene to varying degrees.


Interestingly for me, there are a few moments, particularly with Ryuji, where his dialogue actually sounds pretty good and I wonder if maybe some parts were better translated than others or if it is just the general quality of storytelling shining through despite the poor localization.

While I don't imagine it is based on anything more than my own perception, I did find the Velvet Room stuff to generally work better due to the other worldly nature of the setting. Because of the tone those scenes are less jarring than stuff like:

"It is a confession under your name." When it should just be, "It's a confession."

or

"His life was never in danger." When, given the context, it should almost certainly be, "His injuries were not life threatening."

This isn't Wild Arms 2 or Suikoden 2 or FF Tactics in terms of poor quality.

But it doesn't feel anywhere close to the quality of top tier localizations like FFXII or Nier Automata.

 

[Nachos]

Nah, he's right with Pyro Jack being renamed/changed back to Jack'o'Lantern in P5. I know because that bugged me more than any text lines I've seen have, lol.

It was likely done because of character limits in Nocturne, and it just stuck until now. He's always been Jack O'Lantern in Japanese, and I guess Atlus figured a high-profile release would be their best chance to set the record straight.

 

[hughesta]

I played the first two hours last night and took a picture of this clunker since I hadn't seen an image of it elsewhere.

This is the worst one in the game by far imo

 

[tariniel]

I've played through the "tutorial" (I just got told I can spend my time how I wish, haven't beat the first palace yet though) and for the most part it's not as bad as I was expecting. Sure it could be better though, I laughed when a couple of the lines in the OP came up.

I'm also enjoying the English dub far more than I expected to except for the odd pronunciations of some places and names. The VA for Ryuji has done a really great job so far, in fact all of the named character have been good. The only VA's that haven't been great are generic teachers or other characters.

It's also pretty funny how they decided to translate some of the lines directly. There was some scene where some generic characters were talking about Ann, and they said "Isn't she Kamoshida's bitch?" - just that they used bitch there made me laugh for some reason because it was so unexpected.

 

[iRAWRasaurus]

I played the first two hours last night and took a picture of this clunker since I hadn't seen an image of it elsewhere.

English native speaker, at first glance i didn't see anything wrong with this. However once you mention it, yeah I agree with you.

 

[Inferno313]

I've played through the "tutorial" (I just got told I can spend my time how I wish, haven't beat the first palace yet though) and for the most part it's not as bad as I was expecting. Sure it could be better though, I laughed when a couple of the lines in the OP came up.

I'm also enjoying the English dub far more than I expected to except for the odd pronunciations of some places and names. The VA for Ryuji has done a really great job so far, in fact all of the named character have been good. The only VA's that haven't been great are generic teachers or other characters.

It's also pretty funny how they decided to translate some of the lines directly. There was some scene where some generic characters were talking about Ann, and they said "Isn't she Kamoshida's bitch?" - just that they used bitch there made me laugh for some reason because it was so unexpected.

This line got a very prompt: "excuse me?" from my fiancé. I'm sure some of it stems from cultural differences, but there's a lot of casual sexism in this game that's a bit disappointing. I guess it fits, since these are shitty highschool kids, but it's frustrating nonetheless.

 

[Nimby]

Second dungeon right now, and the spoken lines sound really great. Most issues people point out seem to be with non-spoken lines. Matt Mercer is doing an excellent job on Yusuke.

 

[tariniel]

This line got a very prompt: "excuse me?" from my fiancé. I'm sure some of it stems from cultural differences, but there's a lot of casual sexism in this game that's a bit disappointing. I guess it fits, since these are shitty highschool kids, but it's frustrating nonetheless.

Yeah I was genuinely surprised by that one. Maybe I shouldn't have been since Ryuji says bastard or asshole every other line.

I'm sure someone else has also asked, but early in the game they imply that Kamoshida

Spoiler

is in a relationship with Ann and at least 1 other student

as if that was perfectly normal. Does that fly in Japan? It seems so odd to me, or maybe I just misunderstood?

Also Igor's English voice sounds almost like they applied some kind of digital distortion to it. Anyone else notice that?

 

[Dangansona]

Yeah I can't agree with people saying the localization is "generally bad."

 

[mdubs]

This line got a very prompt: "excuse me?" from my fiancé. I'm sure some of it stems from cultural differences, but there's a lot of casual sexism in this game that's a bit disappointing. I guess it fits, since these are shitty highschool kids, but it's frustrating nonetheless.

I don't know if times have changed since I was in highschool, but that sounds like a more polite version of what shitty kids would regularly say

 

[patrickthehedgehog]

Sometimes the lines are poorly localized, but the pronunciation of the names is what really baffles me.

 

[depths20XX]

This line got a very prompt: "excuse me?" from my fiancé. I'm sure some of it stems from cultural differences, but there's a lot of casual sexism in this game that's a bit disappointing. I guess it fits, since these are shitty highschool kids, but it's frustrating nonetheless.

How is it frustrating? It's a thing I've heard highschool kids say in real life, just as you've said.

 

[Terra_Ex]

I also have to echo these sentiments, noticed it first in the early exchange between Kawakami & Kamoshida - felt needlessly wordy and really lacked a natural flow and cadence to the dialogue, it just didn't feel like a conversation two humans would have, let alone teachers. Certain moments are highly reminiscent of well-intentioned, yet overly literal fan translations of visual novels and such. It's disappointing, I thought it was just me being overly picky but apparently not.

Igor's recast is also needless and really took the wind out of my sails early on. I get why Japan's had to change, but the change for the english VO is senseless, the previous actor was iconic as Igor.

I'm about 3 hours in.

Atlus USA clearly put a lot of work into the localization, but a few things turned me off the English dub:

- Pops and sibilance all over the English VA. Did they not use pop filters? I don't know what their recording studio and engineering situation is like, but something's off.
- Too much direct translation, not enough interpretation.

Yep, this too. It doesn't bother me enough to want to switch to the Japanese dub, but it's certainly not up to the standard I was expecting given the monumental wait for this game.

 

[Iva Demilcol]

Playing Valkyria Chronicles with JP audio was like this. Are there many games that don't have dubtitles? For some reason I just have never expected two translations.

Persona 5 isn't as bad, from what I've played so far.

I wasn't expecting two translations either but I thought that "the reason to delay the game is that we want to be absolutely sure that the quality of the translation is on par with the Japanese release" meant that they would work on the pronunciation of Japanese words and rework some lines that felt off when I watched the November stream.

I've played through the "tutorial" (I just got told I can spend my time how I wish, haven't beat the first palace yet though) and for the most part it's not as bad as I was expecting. Sure it could be better though, I laughed when a couple of the lines in the OP came up.

I'm also enjoying the English dub far more than I expected to except for the odd pronunciations of some places and names. The VA for Ryuji has done a really great job so far, in fact all of the named character have been good. The only VA's that haven't been great are generic teachers or other characters.

It's also pretty funny how they decided to translate some of the lines directly. There was some scene where some generic characters were talking about Ann, and they said "Isn't she Kamoshida's bitch?" - just that they used bitch there made me laugh for some reason because it was so unexpected.

That line for example, also at the beginning when that drunk politician says "the police are my bitches" I genuinely laughed because the original script wasn't as "offensive", the politician says the police were his dogs, and that student says Ann is Kamoshida's woman for example and then you have those weird phrases everyone is pointing out in this thread, it's weird that in some cases they gave themselves some freedom to adapt some parts of the script and they were so "faithful to the original" in others that some lines are just weird to native English speakers.

 

[Captainbojanglesiii]

This line got a very prompt: "excuse me?" from my fiancé. I'm sure some of it stems from cultural differences, but there's a lot of casual sexism in this game that's a bit disappointing. I guess it fits, since these are shitty highschool kids, but it's frustrating nonetheless.

I mean, it's realistic dialogue in that sense. I said woah when I heard it, but the player is supposed to see most of your teachers and students as being pretty shitty, so it works imo.

 

[crimnos]

Objectively it's needlessly wordy in spots and just generally not up to par, especially for a game at this level, but I find it kind of charming despite all that. It's hard to explain, but I've always enjoyed the sense of "otherness" in the atmosphere of Persona games and the language oddities just heighten that for me.

I am curious to see a better translation, though, and see if some things are being lost. I could see coming back to a Persona 5 Crimson with a cleaned-up translation to get "the full story" someday.

 

[.JayZii]

With the names like Sakamoto, it sounds like they were trying to take the stress off the first syllable and have the syllable stresses more uniform like it would be said in Japanese, but ended up overcorrecting a bit. Even if they'd gotten it right, actual Japanese intonation (not just pronouncing the individual syllables correctly) sounds awkward in English, anyway. They probably should have just stuck with the standard "correct" English pronunciation of Japanese names overall.

Good thing they included the Japanese audio if you're craving authenticity.

 

[dan2026]

Just managed to do the 3rd dungeon in one go.

Was tough but at some point I just wanted to see if I could do it, so I powered through to the end.

Edit: Whoops put this in the wrong thread. So many Persona threads, got confused.

 

[IrishNinja]

igor's English VA doesn't seem to fit. but i don't remember what he sounded like in previous games lol

I remember and it's still jarring. I do kinda wish they got the previous VA back for him.

seriously, that's my only real knock on the game so far - it's weird whenever Igor talks. if that VA is gone, why not at least get someone like him?

 

[XiaNaphryz]

seriously, that's my only real knock on the game so far - it's weird whenever Igor talks. if that VA is gone, why not at least get someone like him?

I'm guessing they'd rather have it sound closer to the new Japanese VA.

 

[.JayZii]

I thought I would miss Igor's old voice, but I'm already pretty much used to it. My head canon is that Igor can change along with the Velvet Room and its attendants, and his new voice and setting are certainly more imposing.

 

[Gideon Zhi]

My issue with Igor's voice is more that it sounds like it was put through digitized obfuscation. He sounds like someone who's trying to hide what they really sound like via software. A lot of his lines crackle weirdly too.

I've played a bit more of the game now, about four hours in, and the translation has definitely gotten better, though it's still noticeably spotty in a number of places. But damn, that first hour is *rough*.

 

[wamberz1]

I haven't noticed any issues at all. In fact I thought it was pretty great so far... not to far in though.

And I love Igor's new voice. Makes him a lot more menacing, which he should be.

 

[Linkura]

I played the first two hours last night and took a picture of this clunker since I hadn't seen an image of it elsewhere.

Holy shit. That's bad.

 

[Curufinwe]

They are serious to take our base.

 

[Meffer]

Catherine took place in the US.

Or in Space Station USJapan. I don't fucking know.

 

[indigo-cyclops]

After playing 4-5 hours I definitely see some issues with the localization. Which is incredibly unexpected coming from Atlus. Lots of oddly phrased lines, etc. Also the sound quality of the dub is definitely off.

Doesn't really hamper my enjoyment of the game tho. I am loving it.

 

[mollipen]

I suppose all this would be less confusing if they also translated the attack names. In the end, you get used to Bufu, Agi, Zio, and all the rest. But the first time, it was really confusing.

I might be misunderstanding you, but those aren't untranslated Japanese terms, they're made-up terms for the SMT universe. Similar to how Phantasy Star also uses different terms for elements and whatnot.

And I love Igor's new voice. Makes him a lot more menacing, which he should be.

I can't agree at all that Igor should ever sound menacing. Mysterious and a bit devious? Yes. But not menacing.

 

[Korigama]

They are actually different types of attacks. "Garu" is Wind while "Zan" is Force. The first Persona has both. The Pyro Jack thing is weird, though. One day they just suddenly changed "Jack O'Lantern" to "Pyro Jack" in one of the games, used that ever since, and now apparently changed it back.

Are people certain of Garu and Zan being treated as separate spells in every instance? I could swear that SMT IV and IV:A associated Zan spells (and Zan bullets) with Force yet described them as wind-based, as with Zan spells like Deadly Wind. Seemed more like Wind and Force being synonymous there.

 

[SOLDIER]

I was really hoping that this was going to end up a matter of personal preference, but so far between this and the whole streaming fiasco (which has also killed the Super Best Friends' LP, something I was anticipating almost as much as the game itself), I feel like the launch of P5 has been ruined for me.

I used to put Atlus among the very top of localization groups, better than XSEED and 8-4. I'm honestly shocked and perplexed why they went with such a noticeably lower quality straight translation for what was undoubtedly their biggest game in ages.

Yes, it's not as bad as the worst offenders, and is technically serviceable...but it's still a lower quality translation. The fact that so much of it is spoken English dialog is also off-putting to me, even reminding me of something like:

I now wonder if this is going to get widespread attention, and if it does, will Atlus now be yet another studio who puts out the usual "Thanks for buying our game, we love you fans, so here's our patching plans for the next six months" response.

Frankly I'm kind of hoping they don't, because it'll just tempt me to shelve the game before I even started it.

 

[duckroll]

Are people certain of Garu and Zan being treated as separate spells in every instance? I could swear that SMT IV and IV:A associated Zan spells (and Zan bullets) with Force yet described them as wind-based, as with Zan spells like Deadly Wind. Seemed more like Wind and Force being synonymous there.

Yes they are absolutely different, but you're not wrong about how it feels similar. Atlus has always been somewhat confusing about this. Force and Wind don't coexist very often at all, but Force represents impact from range, ie: bullets or something generating force from a distance, while Wind is literally the element itself. The fact that both tend to use the same icon since usually when one exists the other doesn't just confuses matters more.