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[Bazztek]

Indeed.

This design got a pass, and Fran is considered one of the sexiest FF characters:



It's not that different from Mevius main character's design. Cidney from FFXV got a lot of praise for her design, but she looks even more stupid if you consider that she works fixing cars and she's basically naked at the top, for no reason at all:

It's not like real female mechanics dress lightly and even lighter than Cidney does.


Oh wait.

It's commonplace for women to dress like this as mechanics, especially in southern American states, I don't see how it's "stupid" that Cidney, who is quite clearly taking basis from southern greasemonkey women, is also dressing like a greasemoney from southern America.

They wear light clothes, have cleavage exposed, wear daisy dukes and have plenty of bare skin exposed because it's hot, Cidney's design is clearly based on this concept of southern mechanic women, even her dub accent is a nod to this, and it's one through a Japanese filter so you have the Zettai Ryouiki with the daisy dukes, she's not any more "stupidly" dressed than real female mechanics are.

http://www.stangtv.com/news/mustang-girl-monday-shop-owner-erin-picklesimer-and-her-dream-cars/
https://www.facebook.com/TeamMustan...19438.-2207520000.1420356063./875993522411362

And you can find just as much images of women like this but with topless men, older fat men at that.

 

[Banana Aeon]

I don't know why my post is there, seeing that in the same post I praised FFXV on it's sexualized male designs. I like sexualized designs of both genders, but Mevius's design is atrocious.

 

[Pennywise83]

Those girls do not wear any jacket though because it's non-sense to wear such a dress when it's so hot. So you wear a jacket, and you unzip 90% of it to show cleavage, because it's hot, but you still have a leather jacket on it... smh. Furthermore, the fact that they chose to dress her like that is obvious; they could have chosen, I don't know, a mechanic stereotype from Chicago, where I doubt mechanics are dressed as lightly.

Also, nice to see that girls are dressed lightly in pictures of a FB page targeted towards men (and the picture from the interview is clearly taken only for the interview, btw)

 

[Ombala]

My comment is there

 

[AlucardGV]

but i don't see girls screaming at the sexualisation of this poor oppressed and objectified mevius guy, so i guess we can call it a draw

It's not like real female mechanics dress lightly and even lighter than Cidney does.


Oh wait.

add his for equality

 

[dripdripsplash]

The thing is, we’re waaaaay past the “badly designed sexy female armor” quota, so there’s lots of “badly designed sexy male armor” quota to meet.

What a stupid argument.

 

[Bazztek]

Those girls do not wear any jacket though because it's non-sense to wear such a dress when it's so hot. So you wear a jacket, and you unzip 90% of it to show cleavage, because it's hot, but you still have a leather jacket on it... smh. Furthermore, the fact that they chose to dress her like that is obvious; they could have chosen, I don't know, a mechanic stereotype from Chicago, where I doubt mechanics are dressed as lightly.

Also, nice to see that girls are dressed lightly in pictures of a FB page targeted towards men (and the picture from the interview is clearly taken only for the interview, btw)

Cidney is wearing a jacket because it's clearly her work uniform jacket, same as her hat since they both have the same logo on it, she unzips it because even though it's her work uniform she is hot, do you even posses logic?

You also haven't explained how this is somehow "stupid" when it's something a real person would also do, are you saying because they based Cidney on a real existing representation of female mechanics in south American that it's somehow bad because she also happens to have a revealing outfit?

And what does it matter if it is targeted towards men or not? How sheltered do you even have to be to think that is a problem? Are you saying that pictures of fat shirtless balding men fixing cars is also for sexualization purposes?


And how do you know Erin doesn't dress like that on a daily basis at her shop? Why does it matter in the slightest even if it were true that that picture were only taken for the interview? How does that change a single thing? Face it, it doesn't.

And the fact that how Cidney is dressed is based on real female mechanics from Southern america already disputes any of your counter claims, I guess when evidence is posted that destroys your delusions you have a hard time coming up with counter arguments so you just outright ignore them, eh?

 

[BumblebeeCody]

I'm not to fussed. I think the design looks terrible, but even if I saw that on a girl it'd look terrible. That being said, I'm not offended by this at all and whether it is on a man or woman, I just find it silly and couldn't really care too much about it. Yes, women sometimes (Without even cherry picking I can give a list) have bad armour designs, but at the same time, I'd like to see this shite character design stay. Let the women have their fun for once.

 

[sechsterangriff]

When I start to think Neogaf can't get any more like tumblr, we actually start discussing specific posts...

Anyway, if you really think about it bikini armour is stupid no matter who wears it. But people are just reading too much into it. My guess is he's designed to appeal more to women and that's about it. It's not really something that detracts me from playing the game. I honestly think more variety is a good thing and if there are those who like the design good for them.

 

[Manus]

I think it's a pretty cool look for a design.

 

[MilesTeg]

Had never even heard of this game. Honestly it looks pretty weak. Exactly what I expect out of SE these days. At least it's not the next numbered FF game, but still.

 

[Banana Aeon]

When I start to think Neogaf can't get any more like tumblr, we actually start discussing specific posts...

Anyway, if you really think about it bikini armour is stupid no matter who wears it. But people are just reading too much into it. My guess is he's designed to appeal more to women and that's about it. It's not really something that detracts me from playing the game. I honestly think more variety is a good thing and if there are those who like the design good for them.

I would like bikini armor a lot more, if it consistent for both genders. If females wear it, I want males to wear it.

Problem is, they don't, and it's stupid.

 

[CambriaRising]

I want sexy armor for all genders.

But it has to be well designed.

 

[Pennywise83]

Cidney is wearing a jacket because it's clearly her work uniform jacket, same as her hat since they both have the same logo on it, she unzips it because even though it's her work uniform she is hot, do you even posses logic?

You also haven't explained how this is somehow "stupid" when it's something a real person would also do, are you saying because they based Cidney on a real existing representation of female mechanics in south American that it's somehow bad because she also happens to have a revealing outfit?

And what does it matter if it is targeted towards men or not? How sheltered do you even have to be to think that is a problem? Are you saying that pictures of fat shirtless balding men fixing cars is also for sexualization purposes?


And how do you know Erin doesn't dress like that on a daily basis at her shop? Why does it matter in the slightest even if it were true that that picture were only taken for the interview? How does that change a single thing? Face it, it doesn't.

And the fact that how Cidney is dressed is based on real female mechanics from Southern america already disputes any of your counter claims, I guess when evidence is posted that destroys your delusions you have a hard time coming up with counter arguments so you just outright ignore them, eh?

My first point is, Cidney and those girls are not dressed the same. You have a point in saying that some female mechanic might dress as lightly because of the climate and whatever other reason; on the other hand, though, Cidney's design is ridiculous because it doesn't mimic real-life people, but takes them to the extreme: those mechanics dress lightly because it's hot working there; if it's hot, you don't wear a leather jacket, period. SQEX could have decide to put the logo of the team on her top, or on the hat only. They decided to put a jacket on her, to unzip it and show the cleavage. That's ridiculous and nonsense. The design is not clever enough to be a good one, nor it's realistic enough to be justified by the fact that real people wear the same in similar situations.

The second point is, the fact that SQEX consciously decided to dress Cidney as such already calls to a clear intention: attract male gamers with a sexualized character... which is fine, I mean, this always happens. The fact that real people wear the same (which is not true, btw, since a leather jacket if it's hot is by no means a realistic outfit) doesn't justifiy the use of sexualization of the character; it's like justifying having always prostitutes in video games using the fact that prostitutes exist... Yeah, ok, but why should every software house put prostitutes in every game?

 

[Twookie]

I don't dislike his(Mevius) outfit because it is sexual/showing skin(whatever you wanna say), I disliked his outfit because it looked really weird and quite frankly, dumb. I don't really mind female or male character outfits being sexual as I don't think there's anything wrong with being sexual. I'll admit that if a game only has sexual outfits for one gender I might frown upon it though

e: I also like that one of my comments was chosen, all I wrote was "the hell is this" and somehow that made me a hypocrite as if I would like that design if it were on a female character :|

 

[The Technomancer]

This is hilarious

 

[AlucardGV]

SQEX could have decide to put the logo of the team on her top, or on the hat only. They decided to put a jacket on her, to unzip it and show the cleavage. That's ridiculous and nonsense.

there's no winning, cidney with a top will cause even a greater commotion.
Solution: move final fantasy 15 to the arctic

The second point is, the fact that SQEX consciously decided to dress Cidney as such already calls to a clear intention: attract male gamers with a sexualized character... which is fine, I mean, this always happens. The fact that real people wear the same (which is not true, btw, since a leather jacket if it's hot is by no means a realistic outfit) doesn't justifiy the use of sexualization of the character; it's like justifying having always prostitutes in video games using the fact that prostitutes exist... Yeah, ok, but why should every software house put prostitutes in every game?

i missed lots of them, i remember them only in gta and in some war game as parody of full metal jacket long long love scene

 

[Platy]

I have to agree with the blog post ..... the tears ARE delicous

 

[Pimpwerx]

I think it's pretty sad when people sit around and shit on other people's art.

You may not like the character design, but chances are it's better than anything any of us could come up with. Yeah, you might have a "better" design in your head, but when you try to draw it, does it come out looking terrible? There's plenty of fully-clothed character designs that aren't exactly aesthetically pleasing too.

The point is that artistic license is a thing. If you're incapable of doing the same thing, then it's pretty pathetic to sit around and call a design shitty, because even creating this "shitty" male character took some real effort and talent. As someone who's never had the talent to draw the images in my head, I'll always respect the effort. The results are always going to be subjective, but what's not is the time and energy committed to creating a unique character design.

So yeah, I find those comments hypocritical, and as big a fan of skimpy female outfits as I am, I have no issue if designers want to do the same for male characters. Hell, wasn't Tidus in FFX mostly eye-candy for females anyway? I liked his character and his design, so it's whatever to me. People need to lose their insecurities. PEACE.

 

[Kinyou]

The thing is, we’re waaaaay past the “badly designed sexy female armor” quota, so there’s lots of “badly designed sexy male armor” quota to meet. And until balance of the two is restored, I don’t really think anyone is in the position to request male sexyness to be up to some arbitrary design quality standard.

I don't really like the idea of this being a quota battle, and that only after there are as many bad male armors as female ones you have a right to complain (if I'm interpreting her argument right). Just say what you think.

 

[The Technomancer]

I think it's pretty sad when people sit around and shit on other people's art.

You may not like the character design, but chances are it's better than anything any of us could come up with. Yeah, you might have a "better" design in your head, but when you try to draw it, does it come out looking terrible? There's plenty of fully-clothed character designs that aren't exactly aesthetically pleasing too.

The point is that artistic license is a thing. If you're incapable of doing the same thing, then it's pretty pathetic to sit around and call a design shitty, because even creating this "shitty" male character took some real effort and talent. As someone who's never had the talent to draw the images in my head, I'll always respect the effort. The results are always going to be subjective, but what's not is the time and energy committed to creating a unique character design.

So yeah, I find those comments hypocritical, and as big a fan of skimpy female outfits as I am, I have no issue if designers want to do the same for male characters. Hell, wasn't Tidus in FFX mostly eye-candy for females anyway? I liked his character and his design, so it's whatever to me. People need to lose their insecurities. PEACE.

Brianna Wu is, among other things, an animator and a graphic designer.

I mean your argument is wrong on its face anyway

But its worth pointing out that she probably could

 

[FunkyLounge]

So personal tastes and opinions are bad now? You want to normalize them and put restrictions on what people like based on forced equality?

 

[The Elite]

Most of the comments I have seen are about how bad the design is, not about the fact that it's revealing.

No one complains about topless Shulk because at least he looks good.

 

[Pennywise83]

i missed lots of them, i remember them only in gta and in some war game as parody of full metal jacket long long love scene

There are basically... Everywhere. Prostitutes or strippers or both; Dishonoured, Mafia II, Deus Ex, Yakuza, Just Cause 2, Fallout, Hitman: Absolution, The Darkness II, Metro, Sleeping Dogs, Watch Dogs... Just to name a few of the most recent ones.

 

[SillyEskimo]

She cherry picked quotes to suit her narrative. Sigh. Oh well.

 

[Kintaro]

I don't mind the design personally. <shrug> It's no more goofy than FF has always been in my eyes.

 

[General Lee]

I don't get why games should only have practical and non-sexy armor. It's fantasy, and you're mostly doing stuff that's highly irregular and has nothing to do with reality anyways. If it's supposed to mimic reality then fine, you can critize it doesn't do a good job of it, but otherwise you can sod off if it's not your thing. Do you also go to fashion shows to mock the designs they show that no person would actually wear outside the runway?

 

[Alucrid]

it looks like they took the armor of light and make it look stupid

 

[aeolist]

This is hilarious

yup

the armor looks stupid either way but i can't help but laugh at the people who finally get to understand how women feel every time there's aother one of these:

 

[Altairre]

I think it's pretty sad when people sit around and shit on other people's art.

You may not like the character design, but chances are it's better than anything any of us could come up with. Yeah, you might have a "better" design in your head, but when you try to draw it, does it come out looking terrible? There's plenty of fully-clothed character designs that aren't exactly aesthetically pleasing too.

The point is that artistic license is a thing. If you're incapable of doing the same thing, then it's pretty pathetic to sit around and call a design shitty, because even creating this "shitty" male character took some real effort and talent. As someone who's never had the talent to draw the images in my head, I'll always respect the effort. The results are always going to be subjective, but what's not is the time and energy committed to creating a unique character design.

So yeah, I find those comments hypocritical, and as big a fan of skimpy female outfits as I am, I have no issue if designers want to do the same for male characters. Hell, wasn't Tidus in FFX mostly eye-candy for females anyway? I liked his character and his design, so it's whatever to me. People need to lose their insecurities. PEACE.

That argument doesn't work. You don't need to be capable of doing better to criticise something. You're right in that I don't think it's necessary to shit on everything. If you don't like a design you can say so but I like to avoid insulting it.

I think the quota line is a bit misguided even though I see where she is coming from. That being said I am one of the poeple that dislike this particular character design just as I dislike most of the stuff that is in TERA. In the case of Cid I don't really have a strong opinion either way. It's not good, it's not terrible.

 

[Dylan Sexbang]

In a world of MMA, tights wearing superheroes, Dante's chest strap thing, Shulk, and Solid Snake's ass I don't think men care as much about being sexualized.

Spoiler

Oh but those are power fantasies or some shtick

In fact, we kind of embrace it. I've never heard my group of friends gripe about overly attractive men in anything ever.

That design is just awful, like what is even going on with his legs.

 

[Bold One]

The original argument is a parody of itself.

basically amounts to 'See how it feels?'

which is sad because all the stuff like MGSV Quiet and Cindy are being called out en masse

 

[captainpat]

I don't get why games should only have practical and non-sexy armor.

Nobody is saying that. Yea sure there are some people that would like that from now on but that has to due with the fact that there's just so much bikini armor and very little else.

 

[Pimpwerx]

Brianna Wu is, among other things, an animator and a graphic designer.

I mean your argument is wrong on its face anyway

But its worth pointing out that she probably could

Who? I have no idea who she is. I don't think my argument is wrong at all. Art IS subjective. Once you've crossed the threshold into the subjective, you just come off as an ass trying to dictate taste. If someone is capable of doing better, and has done so, then at least it gives more weight to criticism. So yeah, I'd say this person you mentioned would be in a better position to levy criticism of a piece of art, but it wouldn't make it any less douchey. After all, there's such a thing as professional courtesy. People in the same field should have a better understanding of what is required for the job, so they don't step on each others' toes.

Really, the problem comes down to people feeling justified in their shitty opinions. Opinions are like assholes; everyone has one and blah blah blah. The internet makes people feel more secure in sharing their dumb opinions, but it doesn't make them less dumb. People try to make points in the name of discussion most of the time, but when it comes to subjective material, there's no right or wrong, so the argument just spins in circles and gets nowhere. So I just avoid the critiques altogether. They're usually different from mine anyway. PEACE.

 

[Ganzlinger]

I'm a straight male and I don't feel offended by it, It's just a fanservice armor in a fantasy game. I don't particularly like it but it must appeal for other people.

 

[Taruranto]

I think it looks awful, but I also think these "armors" looks awful.

We should monitor the next RPG featuring bikini-armors and the like for females and see if there is a similar outrage from the same people. :C

 

[Stone Ocean]

My problem with it is not that it's supposed to be sexy or some shit, it's that it just looks fucking weird. Vaan was just as pandering but he didn't make me scratch my head trying to understand what the fuck is he supposed to be

Spoiler

In a way that's kind of hypocritical of me but then again I don't participate in this type of discussion for a reason

 

[Kinyou]

Nobody is saying that. Yea sure there are some people that would like that from now on but that has to due with the fact that there's just so much bikini armor and very little else.

When people even take issue with a normal boob plate it sure sounds like that sometimes though (the whole argument about how it would direct blows to the middle of the chest).

I think it looks awful, but I also think these "armors" looks awful.

If you look at the thread of Lightning's new armor reveal, people sure didn't like it

http://neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=504448

 

[Banana Aeon]

I think it looks awful, but I also think these "armors" looks awful.

We should monitor the next RPG featuring bikini-armors and the like for females and see if there is a similar outrage from the same people. :C

The two Lightning designs are serious downgrades from her original design, but the bunny girl from FFXII doesn't look bad. I actually kinda of like it.

 

[The Elite]

She cherry picked quotes to suit her narrative. Sigh. Oh well.

We've been defamed on tumblr!

 

[Finaika]

yup

the armor looks stupid either way but i can't help but laugh at the people who finally get to understand how women feel every time there's aother one of these:

Its a robot though.

 

[stump sock]

I think it looks awful, but I also think these "armors" looks awful.



We should monitor the next RPG featuring bikini-armors and the like for females and see if there is a similar outrage from the same people. :C

I don't really have any problem with the second one except for the dumb thing sticking off her left arm. Frankly I think Lightning in general is one of Nomura's least stupid character designs.

e: I didn't notice the lack of pants until someone pointed it out. fix that and I'm fine with it still.

 

[aeolist]

When people even take issue with a normal boob plate it sure sounds like that sometimes though (the whole argument about how it would direct blows to the middle of the chest).

i think if boob plate were the exception rather than the rule you'd have far fewer people complaining about it, myself included

as the situation stands it's extremely difficult to find non-sexualized female characters in games at all, much less fantasy-style games which tend to be much worse overall

Its a robot though.

are you seriously suggesting that it makes a difference?

 

[……forgetit]

i think if boob plate were the exception rather than the rule you'd have far fewer people complaining about it, myself included

as the situation stands it's extremely difficult to find non-sexualized female characters in games at all, much less fantasy-style games which tend to be much worse overall



are you seriously suggesting that it makes a difference?

And this is why dragon age exists lol

 

[captainpat]

Its a robot though.

Doesn't that just make it worse?

 

[SolidSnakex]

i think if boob plate were the exception rather than the rule you'd have far fewer people complaining about it, myself included

as the situation stands it's extremely difficult to find non-sexualized female characters in games at all, much less fantasy-style games which tend to be much worse overall

Nirolak made a thread last year about female cahracters in the biggest western releases last fall, and none of them were sexualized

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=912581

 

[captainpat]

Nirolak made a thread last year about female cahracters in the biggest western releases last fall, and none of them were sexualized

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=912581

That's nice and all but those are a drop in the bucket.

 

[JDSN]

Yeah, blog makes some very good points and its futher demostrated because dudes are getting salty and rushing to look hard for The same 3 or 4 examples they can find about male characters meant for The female comsumption.... And aparently some think female mechanics actually dress like Cid because they found some catalog photos in the internet.

Its okay to accept the hypocrisy at your reaction bros, the point of The article is that the female battle bikini is the accepted normal while the male one is getting being considered grotesque.

Its a robot though.

Its still gross tho.

 

[Winterfang]

Who is that supposed to appeal to? I'm genuinely curious.

Is a shonen manga, so I believe it's 14 years old Japanese males from the 80's.

 

[Lethe82]

Can we see the original thread and how many comments were like that?