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[Handy Fake]

You have the answer under your quote. If you are not sensible to those 'details', well, it's your problem. There is nothing of conspiracy here.

I'm going by things SAID in the article. If the article isn't about that, why mention it at all?

No need to get arsey, chief.

 

[Ushay]

People are irrational and dogmatic on this issue. Sure it matters. No it doesn't matter that much.

This gen's two best-looking games are both sub-1080p on consoles (Ryse and The Order). Would they look even better at 1080p? I guess. But the fact of the matter is that resolution is only one of many many factors. Since it's an easy one to put a number to, people on these boards get silly and make it a deal breaker.

The article's most important findings was not expanded on, but it was the blind test. I fully suspect a large majority of people would not tell the difference between a game at 1080p and 900p, all other IQ settings being equal.

Couldn't have put it better myself, well said. Both Ryse and Order are graphically incredible games, really outstanding to look at.

Resolution hasn't crossed my mind once this generation, while I play. When I get onto forums it suddenly becomes a point of contention.

 

[Seanspeed]

I agree with you that it would largely be wasteful, but I'm not so sure the consoles are going to make a push for it. They might tout it early on as something they can do, but I could see developers largely sticking to 1080p. At the distance I sit from my TV I don't think I would get much benefit from 4K unless I got a 90-100" TV, and I am someone who has a much better eye for resolution differences than the average consumer. I really don't think 4K is going to be enough of a reason for most people to buy a new TV. The jump to HDTV's not only brought a resolution increase, but it also brought much larger, thinner, lighter, and "smarter" TV's. At this point most people are fairly happy with the size of their TV's in relation to the size of their viewing areas, and I don't think the jump to the ~100" that will be needed for the resolution difference to take real effect is practical for most people.

I would rather see the next console generation stick to 1080p and focus on better AA methods instead of a jump in resolution. I just think about what they could manage on consoles five years from now when they can focus all of the added power on increasing the graphical quality and physics instead of throwing most of it at a resolution that simply won't make a difference for most people. 4K makes perfect sense for PC gaming at a desk, but I just don't see it making sense in the console space for many years.

I hope you're right, but sense might not prevail when they start salivating over the marketability of '4k gaming'. Look at how big the resolution buzz has gotten with this generation.

 

[chromatic9]

900p is very much like 720p when upscaled to 1080p. The improvement is small while native 1080p is a clear winner. I really can't stand upscaling from a low resolution. Ryse is just one game and its super blurry anyway. AC Black Flag is super blurry on Xbox One

1080-900-720

Looking 10ft away I can still see many differences. I generally sit 5-7ft away and its so clear.

I have to question the suggestion of diminishing returns past 900p. Sure 1440p going to 1620p might not be not much but wouldn't go in thinking it would, the greater the number the more you need to increase. That doesn't tail off at 1600x900. I hope Turn 10 don't go the 900p route for Forza 6, its bloody awful on a 1080p HDTV even from 8ft away.

The problem for PS4 is it will do native 1080p but sometimes they add some standard FXAA or have no AF.

 

[letaint]

How is current gen stacking up with 1080p+60FPS AAA titles?
Last I saw Nintendo was still in the lead with 6. XBO had one title (forza iirc) and PS4 with zero.
Of course, people could build gaming PCs if they want the best graphics.

 

[RowdyReverb]

I appreciate what he said about performance being paramount. I think that the performance drop vs IQ gain from boosting "1080pr" to 1080p is often not worth it. I really hope that dynamic resolutions like that seen in COD:AW on XB1 or Wolfenstein:TNO in which resolution is lowered to preserve framerate during demanding scenes becomes a common trend in this generation. For me, it was very difficult to notice if the resolution had dropped below 1080p in this titles, but a drop in framerate was quite noticeable.

If this technique was brought about by the resolution/performance warz then at least something good came out of it.

How is current gen stacking up with 1080p+60FPS AAA titles?
Last I saw Nintendo was still in the lead with 6. XBO had one title (forza iirc) and PS4 with zero.
Of course, people could build gaming PCs if they want the best graphics.

I know at least MGS:GZ was 1080p60 on PS4 and the Master Chief Collection is mostly 1080p60 on Xbox One

 

[omonimo]

I'm going by things SAID in the article. If the article isn't about that, why mention it at all?

No need to get arsey, chief.

The choice of the time to write this article it's very strange. I don't understand the necessity of this kinda of article. It's not even informative. Or better I know perfectly the intent of Leadbetter but it's just a conspiracy theory.

 

[RPGam3r]

Im baffled that he thinks over a year into the consoles that resolution isnt really a deciding factor. Im pretty sure that a dual console owner looking to buy the best version for thier buck will look at both specs of the game and see 1080p and 900p and buy the 1080p version.

I know of the difference, own both consoles, and still buy most multiplatform games on X1.

If resolution was such a big deal for me I would put more emphasis in returning to PC gaming. My friends all own X1, even in single player games the new acheivements leaderboard adds a degree of competition.

 

[Synth]

How is current gen stacking up with 1080p+60FPS AAA titles?
Last I saw Nintendo was still in the lead with 6. XBO had one title (forza iirc) and PS4 with zero.
Of course, people could build gaming PCs if they want the best graphics.

I'm going to assume you're being rather selective with what games qualify. Because Resogun would have stopped the PS4 having zero day one.

Then you'd have stuff like Minecraft, Guilty Gear, Dead or Alive, etc. I'd actually imagine the Wii U trails both consoles pretty badly.

 

[nelsonroyale]

Another reality check hopefully for the world. Resolution has never been such an issue until this generation. It's embarrassing. 1080p was available last gen for pc players but no one seemed to care. Biggest load of bollox this gen and I think games are suffering because of it

It has been overblown, just like many other issues here, but there is a difference, and I would question your eye sight if you didn't notice it. I have tried to avoid going below 1080p on PC for over 5 years, largely because I don't like the hit in image quality.

 

[Handy Fake]

I just said the choice of the time to write this article it's very strange. I don't understand the necessity of this kinda of article. It's not even informative.

That I agree with.

 

[On Demand]

Of course it does, who the fuck wants scaling? This is one bizarre generation. My wow.

 

[stryke]

People are irrational and dogmatic on this issue. Sure it matters. No it doesn't matter that much.

This gen's two best-looking games are both sub-1080p on consoles (Ryse and The Order). Would they look even better at 1080p? I guess. But the fact of the matter is that resolution is only one of many many factors. Since it's an easy one to put a number to, people on these boards get silly and make it a deal breaker.

The article's most important findings was not expanded on, but it was the blind test. I fully suspect a large majority of people would not tell the difference between a game at 1080p and 900p, all other IQ settings being equal.

You clearly don't understand the issue of resolution and fixed pixel displays if you're equating Ryse and The order to be sub HD.

 

[KKRT00]

I just said the choice of the time to write this article it's very strange. I don't understand the necessity of this kinda of article. It's not even informative.

This research just came out, thats why they wrote about it today.
We even had thread about it:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=999710

And i agree that article is very rushed and not very informative.

 

[icecold1983]

How is current gen stacking up with 1080p+60FPS AAA titles?
Last I saw Nintendo was still in the lead with 6. XBO had one title (forza iirc) and PS4 with zero.
Of course, people could build gaming PCs if they want the best graphics.

maybe you should learn how to count

 

[On Demand]

People are irrational and dogmatic on this issue. Sure it matters. No it doesn't matter that much.

This gen's two best-looking games are both sub-1080p on consoles (Ryse and The Order). Would they look even better at 1080p? I guess. But the fact of the matter is that resolution is only one of many many factors. Since it's an easy one to put a number to, people on these boards get silly and make it a deal breaker.

The article's most important findings was not expanded on, but it was the blind test. I fully suspect a large majority of people would not tell the difference between a game at 1080p and 900p, all other IQ settings being equal.

There's no scaling in The Order.........

 

[dgrdsv]

It does. Next question?

 

[Handy Fake]

This research just came out, thats why they wrote about it today.
We even had thread about it:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=999710

And i agree that article is very rushed and not very informative.

Giving them the benefit of the doubt, I'll go with this.

 

[dragonfart28]

Just buy a PC and get both?

 

[letaint]

I'm going to assume you're being rather selective with what games qualify. Because Resogun would have stopped the PS4 having zero day one.

Then you'd have stuff like Minecraft, Guilty Gear, Dead or Alive, etc. I'd actually imagine the Wii U trails both consoles pretty badly.

Found that old article: As far as AAA, it appears that only Smash Bros, Bayonetta 2 and Rayman Legends were 1080p60 at the time. As someone who has seen the dip in FPS on Mariokart when the fourth player joins, I KNOW that higher FPS is very helpful for immersion. Or maybe it's just really distracting to watch a game dip from 60fps to 30. Dark Souls 2 on PC at 60fps is dazzling compared to the PS3.

 

[mejin]

And he never wrote otherwise, so where is that Xbox bias?

---


I'm very sensitive to it, but most people arent, thats the point. Even most people on GAF arent, going how people defended The Order's post-processing.

---

But this article isnt about comparison between multiplatforms.
It is comparison between spending GPU buget on fidelity over resolution and which gives higher returns. If You checked few links that were posted in article, one shows Ridge Racer 1080p next to Avatar framegrab. One has higher resolution and clarity, but is looking significantly worse.

His intention is as clear as a blue sky in my opinion.

 

[omonimo]

Found that old article: As far as AAA, it appears that only Smash Bros, Bayonetta 2 and Rayman Legends were 1080p60 at the time. As someone who has seen the dip in FPS on Mariokart when the fourth player joins, I KNOW that higher FPS is very helpful for immersion. Or maybe it's just really distracting to watch a game dip from 60fps to 30. Dark Souls 2 on PC at 60fps is dazzling compared to the PS3.

Sorry but Bayonetta 2 1080p 60fps where coming from?

 

[Synth]

You clearly don't understand the issue of resolution and fixed pixel displays if you're equating Ryse and The order to be sub HD.

There's no scaling in The Order.........

He didn't mention scaling though. Even if scaling doesn't apply to The Order, the point still works equally well for Ryse.. and The Order is still sub-1080p, even if it isn't being scaled. Either way, the resources freed has allowed both games to look a lot better than other games on the same platform.

In regards to scaling actually... other than BF4 which was 720p, the two games with the worst IQ I've so far played on Xbox One are both actually 1080p native (Forza 5 and Dead or Alive 5). Games like Ryse, Sunset Overdrive and the like running at 900p look a lot better on my screen. That being said, my screen is a plasma... but either way, native res is definitely not my primary concern when it comes to image quality.

Found that old article: As far as AAA, it appears that only Smash Bros, Bayonetta 2 and Rayman Legends were 1080p60 at the time. As someone who has seen the dip in FPS on Mariokart when the fourth player joins, I KNOW that higher FPS is very helpful for immersion. Or maybe it's just really distracting to watch a game dip from 60fps to 30. Dark Souls 2 on PC at 60fps is dazzling compared to the PS3.

Bayo 2 is 60fps, like Titanfall on X1 is 60fps... as in, it seriously doesn't count.

 

[Hawaii Jeff]

It's a bit funny to see such a conclusion in a DF article and then recall them seeing clear sharpness differences between X360 and PS3 on resolutions like 1280 vs 1174 by 720 in games.

Yup this is such a garbage article. Of course it matters.

Well I have my PS4. Being quantifiably less powerful is just one of many reasons I have no interest in buying an XB1.

 

[klee123]

Oh god. Of course it matters.

Well at least MS can rest easy that they have many members of the gaming media so blatantly biased to them.

 

[Purest 78]

He didn't mention scaling though. Even if scaling doesn't apply to The Order, the point still works equally well for Ryse.. and The Order is still sub-1080p, even if it isn't being scaled. Either way, the resources freed has allowed both games to look a lot better than other games on the same platform.

In regards to scaling actually... other than BF4 which was 720p, the two games with the worst IQ I've so far played on Xbox One are both actually 1080p native (Forza 5 and Dead or Alive 5). Games like Ryse, Sunset Overdrive and the like running at 900p look a lot better on my screen. That being said, my screen is a plasma... but either way, native res is definitely not my primary concern when it comes to image quality.



Bayo 2 is 60fps, like Titanfall on X1 is 60fps... as in, it seriously doesn't count.

The order has a 1to1 pixel ratio within a letter box. So it's the exact same picture quality as 1080p.

 

[Synth]

The order has a 1to1 pixel ratio within a letter box. So it's the exact same picture quality as 1080p.

Um, yea? I think I covered that in my post. It can still do more by not having to fill the pixels it's discarded.

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

So I take it this guy is on Microsoft's payroll and that's why he is downplaying resolution differences this generation when the Xbox is losing compared to last gen when the 360 generally outperformed the PS3?

 

[letaint]

For fast paced motion, a low FPS is much worse than a lower resolution. I couldn't play Nidhogg at lower an 30fps (maybe more like 60fps), but I can comfortably dungeon crawl through Etrian turn-based-strategies at probably 10FPS.

 

[Ehker]

And he never wrote otherwise, so where is that Xbox bias?

How about a tech article where it actually uses phrases like "well-handled" regarding XB1 dropping the resolution and when they actually choose to say "better than their counterparts" it's applied to the Xbox One despite all the times the PS4 is?

"What's crucial in this case is that not only are both COD and Far Cry 4's res reductions well-handled on Xbox One, they also have performance profiles equivalent to or even better than their PS4 counterparts - and we're firmly of the belief that frame-rate difficulties have much more of an impact on the overall experience than resolution."

 

[DemonCleaner]

the study asked a poorly formualted question. for the broad audience more resolution in this context is synonymous with more powerful. yet i bet 90% of them wouldn't be able to tell the difference when shown in motion.

 

[justsomeguy]

Ryse is ... super blurry .

It really, really isn't.

 

[RedNumberFive]

It amazes me that this insane narrative is still being pushed.

 

[justsomeguy]

So I take it this guy is on Microsoft's payroll and that's why he is downplaying resolution differences this generation when the Xbox is losing compared to last gen when the 360 generally outperformed the PS3?

Only if everyone in GAF in the old "resolution vs frame rate" thread who voted "frame rate" is also on payroll.

 

[Seanspeed]

You clearly don't understand the issue of resolution and fixed pixel displays if you're equating Ryse and The order to be sub HD.

I think you're the one not understanding 'the issue' here. Its mostly about how developers choose to improve visuals with a fixed power budget. Reducing pixel count(resolution) is one obvious way of freeing up resources to push the graphics and the best looking games on both platforms use this to obviously very impressive effect.

Nobody is saying resolution doesn't make a difference, but its a question of is it worth prioritizing at the expense of pushing the graphics?

I think its an interesting question to ask.

 

[Dunlop]

the study asked a poorly formualted question. for the broad audience more resolution in this context is synonymous with more powerful. yet i bet 90% of them wouldn't be able to tell the difference when shown in motion.

pretty much, I downloaded the BF Hardline beta to my PS4 and XB1 and switched inputs on my 65" to try and see the diffences and I really could not

I know they are there, but I am glad my eyes do not seem to perceive the difference, the game being fun is my Metric.

There are definitely people this is an issue for, while others just like to spout the numbers for their console war quotas of the day

 

[JAYSIMPLE]

It has been overblown, just like many other issues here, but there is a difference, and I would question your eye sight if you didn't notice it. I have tried to avoid going below 1080p on PC for over 5 years, largely because I don't like the hit in image quality.

Man I can totally tell the difference between 1080p and other rresolutions. I will choose the best performing version of a game (pc. While I can notice iit i personally don't think it's that important. Or really a major factor in the grand scheme of things. Anyone who actually cares about this shit is a hypocrit if they don't own a pc imo. Sometimes I would rather get a game on xbone if my friends are getting it. I didn't mind 900p watchdogs on Ps4 as I wanted to play on the couch with my Ps4 with that one.

I am very sensitive to all graphical things. Af resolution. Tearing. I just can actually enjoy games despite these things tho

 

[Maintenance]

 

[EatMyFace]

Do technical analysis articles even matter? You just buy the game on the console you have anyway.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

So a thing just happened to me recently that has me questioning the whole resolution thing.

When I played Sunset Overdrive and Ryse I could immediately tell they were softer than KZ and Infamous. They didn't have a crispness about them.

However, I just found out recently that Bayonetta 2 and Mario Kart aren't 1080p and that has kind of shattered my religion. I would have bet money they were both 1080.

 

[JAYSIMPLE]

The majority of vita games aren't native resolution. Who owns a vita and enjoys games on it?

 

[stryke]

He didn't mention scaling though. Even if scaling doesn't apply to The Order, the point still works equally well for Ryse.. and The Order is still sub-1080p, even if it isn't being scaled. Either way, the resources freed has allowed both games to look a lot better than other games on the same platform.

He does allude to scaling though. He speculates whether these games would look better at 1080p.

Ryse would and we can see it on PC. If there were to be a PC version of The Order in hypothetical land, getting rid of the black bars would not improve picture quality. You just now have a bigger view.

 

[Feindflug]

So a thing just happened to me recently that has me questioning the whole resolution thing.

When I played Sunset Overdrive and Ryse I could immediately tell they were softer than KZ and Infamous. They didn't have a crispness about them.

However, I just found out recently that Bayonetta 2 and Mario Kart aren't 1080p and that has kind of shattered my religion. I would have bet money they were both 1080.

60hz is your answer.

 

[Dictator93]

So a thing just happened to me recently that has me questioning the whole resolution thing.

When I played Sunset Overdrive and Ryse I could immediately tell they were softer than KZ and Infamous. They didn't have a crispness about them.

However, I just found out recently that Bayonetta 2 and Mario Kart aren't 1080p and that has kind of shattered my religion. I would have bet money they were both 1080.

Those games have like little to no AA, right? Maybe you confuse edge smoothing with "softness."

 

[Azriell]

I would agree that resolution isn't the end all be all. FPS is frequently more important. Letterboxing is a perfectly valid option in my eyes, and a much better one than upscaling in many cases.

All in all, I would prefer to have letterboxed games that shave a dozen or so lines of resolution to run at a locked 60 with no screen tearing, and then better graphics if possible.

With that said, resolution is still a valid metric. I believe that when it comes down to comparing the resolution of a game across multiple platforms, it is assumed that the more important metrics are more or less even on both platforms. When this is not the case, certainly a more important metric should be used. If a game was 1080/30 on PS4 but 900/60 on XB1 we would be having a different conversation.

 

[nib95]

It's always mattered, at least to me any many other people. I bought many multiplatform games on the 360 over the PS3 because of it, and it'll be no different this time around. Really the fact any game could be 720p on these new systems is ridiculous to me. We shouldn't have to put up with the same resolution we've been accustomed to for the last 8 years, over what was also the longest console gen we've ever had.

I think it has more relevance because I game on larger screens now too. Years ago I used a 42", but now I game on a 50" and 65", so the resolution differences are more apparent.

 

[Justice_Bolt]

Yes it matter! With a big TV ,I clearly see the difference easily when it's not 1080p. So yeah..

 

[MMaRsu]

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2015-does-resolution-really-matter

Guess the author...





Lots more on the link discussing how changes in filters and scaling techniques are hiding the resolution deficit.

What the fuck? DF lost all credibility within an instant. Fuck this shit.

 

[Purest 78]

The majority of vita games aren't native resolution. Who owns a vita and enjoys games on it?

Resolution has nothing to do with enjoyment of a game. It's has to do with better picture quality. If you're comparing the same game, what's wrong with choosing Better picture quality?

 

[GnawtyDog]

Resolution has nothing to do with enjoyment of a game. It's has to do with better picture quality. If you're comparing the same game, what's wrong with choosing Better picture quality?

Nothing.