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[TheRagnCajun]

I approve of the title change.

 

[tehrik-e-insaaf]

 

[affableamerican]

So production values should automatically amplify the score?

Wait, production value shouldn't contribute to a game's score? It should be about core gameplay mechanics, art style, etc? You're saying that executing in an exceptional way on the core features of a game should not be taken into account? Question mark?

"Production value" is critical to the quality of the overall package. A mediocre game with mediocre production value absolutely should score lower than a mediocre game with high production value (such as, Pince of Persia). I don't think PoP had great gameplay mechanics, but absolutely the delivery on art style, animations, character conversations and (often) impressive and glorious set pieces made the game much more enjoyable, as a whole, for me. Elevated it from an utterly average experience to a somewhat entertaining experience.

 

[TTG]

Probly helps that i only own one of those games, LocoRoco 2 (although will be buying Patapon and some others still) one of the highest scoring titles and am not really looking for validation of my purchase.

That does not matter. A review's quality is directly proportional to how close its score is to the one you dish out with your objective opinion. Let's apply this way of thinking to PoP.

Edge gave it a 5, which is corrected to a 7 to match the scale of your average review site. Then I take the score I've decided to give PoP based on some trailers and screen shots, that would be a 9. 9 minus 7 is 2, we take the 2 and multiply it by 3 because my opinion is atleast 3 times more objective than theirs. That makes it 6. Starting with a pefect 10 we take away the 6 and then 2 more so we can convert my review of the review to the Edge scale. We are left with the final score of 2 out of 10. It's plainly obvious and objective that Edge's review of PoP deserves a 2 out of 10.

 

[Graphics Horse]

and not try to say their use of the entire scale somehow elevates their opinions to be more objective

Are they actually saying that? I wouldn't put it past them!
Personally I think their scores as likely to be swayed by publisher pressure as any other magazine, but that's another topic.
Anyway, nobody reads a magazine for the numbers, right?

 

[Rufus]

"Production value" is critical to the quality of the overall package. A mediocre game with mediocre production value absolutely should score lower than a mediocre game with high production value (such as, Pince of Persia). I don't think PoP had great gameplay mechanics, but absolutely the delivery on art style, animations, character conversations and (often) impressive and glorious set pieces made the game much more enjoyable, as a whole, for me. Elevated it from an utterly average experience to a somewhat entertaining experience.

So it's about what makes you feel like you're playing a good game? Suddenly, this whole thread makes a lot more sense, especially keeping people in mind who might not even have played the games in question. (Actually, a part of gaming culture in general makes a lot more sense to me now.) Because those games sure look like better games, eh? Interesting.

 

[tehrik-e-insaaf]

Are they actually saying that? I wouldn't put it past them!
Personally I think their scores as likely to be swayed by publisher pressure as any other magazine, but that's another topic.
Anyway, nobody reads a magazine for the numbers, right?

well said brother. i mean at the end of the day - people should simply enjoy the games for what they are worth it to them. there are lots of people that enjoyed assassin's creed, but it received a lot of criticism and was panned in the press. conversely there are a lot of people that didn't enjoy LBP but it received almost universal acclaim in the press.

people should simply accept that no matter the magazine or person, human biases, pressure, and a number of other things influence judgment and reviews and that's what it comes down to. if we pretend otherwise, then we aren't being true to ourselves as human beings.

 

[WizardHowl]

Production values bullshit.

While you do make somewhat of a valid point that the art etc. should be considered in the review score does it really make a difference if the game has a lower production value and is average then a game that has a large production value but still has average gameplay? Average gameplay is still average gameplay no matter what the production value.

A mediocre game with mediocre production value absolutely should score lower

I think if the game is mediocre the score will be low anyways. Plus generally a mediocre production value is represented in the crappiness of the game.

 

[FartOfWar]

Castlevania is the only one I really disagree with. The rest I can sympathize with or are completely oblivious about. I wonder why Patapon 2 scored so low. And what For Answer did to get a 7.

Castlevania has so much going for it, but it's too fucking hard for many of us. Include an easy mode or stay content selling copies to the exclusive few who say everyone else with the wallets full of money suck.

 

[affableamerican]

So it's about what makes you feel like you're playing a good game? Suddenly, this whole thread makes a lot more sense, especially keeping people in mind who might not even have played the games in question. (Actually, a part of gaming culture in general makes a lot more sense to me now.) Because those games sure look like better games, eh? Interesting.

I'm saying that I appreciate clever details, polished visuals and gameplay, and all the improvements and refinements that come from a game that has been given the extra TLC (and money) to 'pretty it up.' Gameplay is king and always should be (although I look forward the oft-promised days when so-called 'interactive fiction' begins to blur the lines between games and cinema), but why should this mean that details and polish and over-delivering on a concept or initial design are pointless?

Some very simple examples that brought me enjoyment. The credits in the opening cinematic for GTA4 were a great touch and helped set a grand, cinematic tone of the game. The opening scenario in the latest Banjo game was wonderfully endearing although, ultimately, completely irrelevant to the game. The 'overworld' in SMG was spectacular and fun to explore. The vastness and minutiae found in Mirror's Edge solidified that original design concept of "a character on the run against an unseen, omnipresent enemy, in a city of silence and oppression."

Perhaps the term "production value" means different things to different people, but I absolutely appreciate high production value in all entertainment media.

 

[affableamerican]

While you do make somewhat of a valid point that the art etc. should be considered in the review score does it really make a difference if the game has a lower production value and is average then a game that has a large production value but still has average gameplay? Average gameplay is still average gameplay no matter what the production value.

You call my comment on production value "bullshit" then say it's a somewhat valid point. Make up your mind -- am I talking all bullshit or only somewhat bullshit?

Anyway, I'm not sure you've disagreed with me. I'm not saying that higher production value, all other things being equal, makes gameplay better (how could it?), I'm just saying that a game with an average core gameplay mechanic will probably keep my attention longer if it also has high production value. And I do believe that it should contribute to a review score in some way. The art direction of a game may be nailed down years before the game releases, but all the effort put in during the production phase don't manage to meld perfectly together, you won't have a truly great, cohesive aesthetic for the game.

 

[Amneziak]

This is a bit off-topic, but I'm glad Play got rid of scores altogether.

 

[timetokill]

That Castlevania score is practically criminal. CRIMINAL.

Seriously though, it's the first Castlevania I was compelled to buy since Symphony of the Night. The other ones just didn't do it for me. And even though I got Portrait of Ruin as a gift, I couldn't finish it :lol Stupid anime art style.

Ecclesia is AWESOME. A 7 I could let slide. A 6 is ridiculous.

 

[Mr.City]

the only problem i have is with the discrepencies in their scores

when they give certain games like halo 3, orange box, etc. perfect 10s when clearly a significant portion of the commuity and even edge-lovers disagree with that... then it brings their credibility into question

halo 3 is a good game, but definitely not a perfect 10 by any stretch of the imagination, especially given the very, very evolutionary step up from the xbox iterations

orange box had ep2 and portal as its redeeming features, with some saying tf2 was good, but frankly, i don't see where the perfect 10 comes from?

call of duty 4's 9 was also pretty insulting, as was gta4's 10 (i mean it's not a BAD game. but it left much to be desired frankly)

if edge was being objective with those games, halo 3 deserved a 7 at best, orange box was a solid 8, cod4 was a 6, and gta 4 was at most a 9 despite being terribly crippled compared to the other games

oh yes, LBP as best game, please. i was one of the biggest supporters of the game and bought it day 1 (i have the unedited version infact).

biggest dissappointment in a long time. the gameplay just isn't there. it's briefly interesting, but it just lacks clever level design from MM and compelling gameplay like mario where you want to replay it over and over again. the collectathon crap really killed the experience as well.

just because you can "build and share" isn't enough to make this game the best. otherwise we should go back and award doom 1 game of the year over and over again since WADs significantly advanced the user-creator community onto online (from dial up BBS).

i could go on but the point i am making is that it seems they make execeptions when it comes to being objective, and when they are especially harsh on certain games, you begin to wonder whether they are playing favorites?

 

[WizardHowl]

You call my comment on production value "bullshit" then say it's a somewhat valid point. Make up your mind -- am I talking all bullshit or only somewhat bullshit?

:lol My mistake will specify next time.

Anyway, I'm not sure you've disagreed with me. I'm not saying that higher production value, all other things being equal, makes gameplay better (how could it?), I'm just saying that a game with an average core gameplay mechanic will probably keep my attention longer if it also has high production value. And I do believe that it should contribute to a review score in some way. The art direction of a game may be nailed down years before the game releases, but all the effort put in during the production phase don't manage to meld perfectly together, you won't have a truly great, cohesive aesthetic for the game.

I'm not sure if I've disagreed with you either. I think I actually do agree somewhat, I mean if were talking about Prince of Persia then yeah I would... It depends on the game if the art direction is generic and regular then I wouldn't add or take away from the score, but if the art direction is amazing then yeah I guess I would add to the score.

What did Edge say about PoP graphics/art?

 

[batbeg]

I don't see any reason to complain here. LocoRoco 2 is cream of the crop of these scores, so all is well. Last Remnant might be a bit low for my liking, but I'm more than used to this games reviews.

 

[Roxas]

Just got my magazine this morning, the OP missed out the "Alternate Awards"!

Best Flop

- Boom Blox

Most Special Special Editions

- EA, with Mirror's Edge & Dead Space

Best Old Edge Forum Aftershock

(Basically a phrase which an old Edge forumer used made it into a game)

- "Bummed in the Gob" Grand Theft Auto IV

Best Chewed Scenery

- Gears of War 2

Most unsatisfactory Whoring

- Fallout 3

Most Cunningly Engineered HUD

- Dead Space

Best Creators Intentions

- Peter Molyneux, Fable II

Wettest Hats

- Brothers in Arms : Hell's Highways

Hardest Sell

- Penumbra: Black Plague

Literary Achievment

- Far Cry 2

Best Immoral Act

- Fallout 3, Megaton

Best Prolonged Inactivity

- Metal Gear Solid 4

Dumbest thing in Condemned 2

- Overcoming the walking suit of Armour, an army of exploding dolls, a mad magician, and a rampaging Grizzly bear.

Best Worst Game

- Alone in the Dark

Most Accidental Pies

- Fable II (Accidently hitting "Eat pies" instead of patting your dog) :lol

 

[acm2000]

Just got my magazine this morning, the OP missed out the "Alternate Awards"!

:lol cheers, i dont have the issue, my friend does, only did the thread cause everyone was busy hyping and wetting themselves over the really shitty trailers/teasers we got from spike awards

 

[Yagharek]

Edge reviews that are low scoring (below 5) are great reading. Any time they slam a game for being uninspired is worth buying the issue for imo.

Interesting to see so many games get low-ish scores though. I cant remember the last issue where the highest scoring game got a 7. Lately they have had a number of 8s and 9s each issue. Might just be that its the end of the release season so the games coming out arent the better ones.

Also, so not surprised to see the usual suspects out in force in this thread. You can guarantee that most of the people whinging about Edge reviews never read the magazine. They just care about the metacritic average.

 

[Ashhong]

Indeed. I can't possibly think POP is a 5 game, even if I haven't played it myself yet. And lol about Lips, a singstar rip-off scores better...

wtf :lol how can you disagree about something without playing it?

 

[TheGreatDave]

wtf :lol how can you disagree about something without playing it?

Production values!

 

[shongololo]

Best Old Edge Forum Aftershock

(Basically a phrase which an old Edge forumer used made it into a game)

- "Bummed in the Gob" Grand Theft Auto IV

It's referring to the old Edge forums, as opposed to an old Edge forumite. Edge shut down their 'Old' forums a little over five years ago, in the interim most of that forum moved to what is now rllmuk. Edge then started their forums up again a few years ago but it's a very different crowd. Margeret Robertson AKA Mugla, Edge's ex Editor, started out as part of the old Edge forum - fact fans.

This place could do with being bummed in the gob sometime, I'm sure Rab could accommodate.

 

[Rlan]

It's a difficult thing to go by for EDGE this month. Certainly I'm looking forward to Patapon 2 and Loco Roco 2, and I've enjoyed Prince of Persia and Castlevania: OOE greatly so far.

My main concern is the score for Sonic. I really cannot understand how someone can honestly enjoy this game at all. The Werehog stages were really poorly designed and not suited to the death pit gameplay those levels had, and while I was expecting the combat to be above par, certainly above Crash of the Titans, I couldn't help but find the enemies incredibly stupid and the combat to be incredibly dull.

I didn't even like the Sonic levels! At all! And I'm one of those stupid Sonic fans who's grabbed most of the games over the years (I never picked up Sonic '06 mind you). It was the first game in over a year that I've actually taken back to the store to get my money back.

And to consider EDGE being one of the more critical magazines out there, I just don't see how it could have possibly scored a 6. Certainly reading the review would let me know their own thoughts on the game, but from my own experience I just can't see how it could get an above average score.

Castlevania has so much going for it, but it's too fucking hard for many of us. Include an easy mode or stay content selling copies to the exclusive few who say everyone else with the wallets full of money suck.

I've only started playing Castlevania games since the DS titles, and while there are some points which are quite difficult (Crab Boss) it's essentially trying to tell you to go back and find some other paths, and find secret passages in previous levels, to level grind a little more while doing so, and then hitting the bosses. Switching up the weaponry would certainly help as well.

It's gotten a lot more RPGish in nature with the level grinding and whatnot. Still, I've found the Metroidvanias to be a better kind of game than Castlevania IV and Dracula X Chronicles.

 

[D4Danger]

Most Accidental Pies

- Fable II (Accidently hitting "Eat pies" instead of patting your dog) :lol

:lol

 

[batbeg]

Dumbest thing in Condemned 2

- Overcoming the walking suit of Armour, an army of exploding dolls, a mad magician, and a rampaging Grizzly bear.

I thought this part was fucking awesome. But then again, I liked this game, so...

 

[luiggi_oasis]

Sorry for the off topic:

how much does it cost in UK? Where can i have one in london?

BTW, the february edition is available after january 15, isnt it ?

 

[shongololo]

Sorry for the off topic:

how much does it cost in UK? Where can i have one in london?

I fiver I believe and almost any newsagent/bookshop will stock Edge.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

EDGE Jan 09 Scores - come for the review scores, stay for the amazingly awesome alternate awards, then leave again when you realise the thread will revert back to whining!

 

[domlolz]

Reading the review of Sonic,I tend to agree with Edge.
They loved the Sonic levels and praised the visuals,the departure from the usual j-rock that is on most of the Sonic games soundtracks and platforming.

What they didn't like is how boring the werehog levels are and how they seem so much more boring when compared with the Sonic levels.And the hub worlds and some cheap platforming later on in the game

 

[luiggi_oasis]

I fiver I believe and almost any newsagent/bookshop will stock Edge.

cool thanks hope it's not too expensive for a sudaka to buy!

 

[Vorador]

As always, i think Edge gives low scores to good games in order to look like the "badasses of the block"

Duh.

 

[Kintaro]

As always, i think Edge gives low scores to good games in order to look like the "badasses of the block"

Duh.

It couldn't be because they actually believe the games reviewed are only that good. No...couldn't be. Everyone must toe the line!

 

[Vorador]

It couldn't be because they actually believe the games reviewed are only that good. No...couldn't be. Everyone must toe the line!

Well, i'm still butthurt (AND I ALWAYS BE ) over the Zone of the Enders 2 review score.

They scored it 4, lower than the first that was far worse game. Elitist pricks

 

[neight]

The scores get posted online... that's really all you read EDGE for? Yeah, and the cover

All the articles get posted online. http://www.edge-online.com/