These are two entirely unrelated ideas, though.
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Effective character design: Sonic now vs Sonic then
- Thread starter Ran rp
- Start date
These are two entirely unrelated ideas, though.
Isn't Sonic 2 the best selling Sonic game though?
The coolest for school
Not saying a character cant be blue, miku hatsune is a thing and alot of her is blue. However, his color along with every design past sonic being better than sonic, makes him being blue, worse.
partyphone
Banned
Uh. Dante is red because he's a demon not because he's cool.
Also he's kind of a tool.
Too cool for tool school.
Also he's kind of a tool.
Too cool for tool school.
baphomet
Member
New sonic is nearly 15 years old. The majority of the fans of new sonic weren't even born when his design was changed. To them he's just sonic.
BlazeHedgehog
Member
That first picture on the bottom left has more personality than the whole of the top part of this image.
That's just, like, your opinion, man.
Modern Sonic's design follows the exact same design trend all other characters have taken. That does not necessarily mean it's better, it just means that it is following trends.
Which is to say... taller, thinner, and less "cute" (even Pikachu, which is sort of disturbing to me). Assuming these characters still exist in 15 years, they'll probably have trended towards whatever was current in design then, too.
"Personality" as you put it is just what the character is doing at that point in time, which is defined by posing and action, not actual design itself.
Wickerbasket
Member
I wouldn't say the games are niche, but I'd say the fan base surrounding them is. It's a very vocal minority that write the fan fiction and visit fan sites, compared to the majority who buy the games.
While the franchise isn't niche, Sonic's lost a lot of popularity from when I was younger. In the 90s in the UK, Sonic was as popular as Mario; I guess in part it was due to the Sega vs Nintendo console competition and they were the mascots. There was Sonic merchandise and advertising everywhere.
Nowadays, Sonic is largely irrelevant and you'd be hard pressed to find anyone who says differently (unless your on a Sonic fan site echo chamber).
Sonic's popularity peaked with the Genesis and it's been going downhill ever since.
Also, Genesis Sonic is still the best Sonic.
SpikedGunner
Member
like the rest, he has lost some of his chubby-ness...the smaller (barely visible) nose doesn't help either.
BlazeHedgehog
Member
You've got some awfully big strawmen kicking around in this post.
That's just, like, your opinion, man.
Modern Sonic's design follows the exact same design trend all other characters have taken. That does not necessarily mean it's better, it just means that it is following trends.
Which is to say... taller, thinner, and less "cute" (even Pikachu, which is sort of disturbing to me). Assuming these characters still exist in 15 years, they'll probably have trended towards whatever was current in design then, too.
"Personality" as you put it is just what the character is doing at that point in time, which is defined by posing and action, not actual design itself.
I wouldnt say all, because toon link and the slew of different mega man, then the fact that bomber man..is well bomberman. Then the fact that mario is still short and cute. And tall teenage link has been a thing before the wii.
Character design is more than just looks.
baphomet
Member
Absolutely untrue. Walk through an elementary school and see how many kids are wearing sonic the hedgehog tshirts. Tons of them. Compared to how much smaller the game industry was in 1994 as to now, more people know who sonic is than ever did back then. Kids love sonic.
Head's too round. Also, Pikachu was so much better in his chubby days.
Wickerbasket
Member
What is it you disagree with?
Sonic was huge in the 90s, he's not anymore.
AwakenedCloud
Member
Where did this Modern Sonic artwork come from? It looks much more refined compared to the dreamcast era artwork. I like it!
If I was to guess, that looks like it came from the Sonic Advance era.
Lightning Lord
Banned
That's what I'm thinking. Fat is the best. We need more fat characters in modern games.
baphomet
Member
He's much larger now sales-wise and far more recognizable than he was in the 90's. Hes larger now than he's ever been no matter what metric youre using to judge how huge he is.
I don't think this can be emphasized enough. Sonic was BIG in the 90s. Top tier franchise, a system seller and a video game icon on top of it all. He had 2 tv shows and his own brand of fucking spaghetti o's that I remember eating with the biggest shit eating grin.
edit: Sonic may still sell units but he is not nearly as relevant as he used to be, this cannot be argued.
Wickerbasket
Member
I just think it's funny that Sonic's best selling console game since the Genesis was a Mario cross over game.
Honest question, do you remember the 90s? It's like trying to explain the pokemon craze to someone who wasn't there.
Yeah, thisThat's just, like, your opinion, man.
and also, I fucking love that pic of Sonic, he's all, "Consider the following"
I get why Pikachu would slowly start to look like a lightbulb, but I stil don't like it
and now I am stealing that and putting that text over it.
BlazeHedgehog
Member
You shit on "Sonic Fans" an awful lot for little reason. While there are some outspoken crazies, you'd be surprised how many of them are reasonable people.
Which is why Sonic X has remained on the air every Saturday morning for nearly a decade straight even though no new episodes have been produced since 2005
Which is why Archie's Sonic the Hedgehog comic has the distinction of being the longest running licensed comic book series (with no signs of slowing down any time soon)
Which is why Sega still puts out at least one Sonic game a year and cites the franchise as one of their top selling properties
There's no denying that Sonic isn't anywhere near the "bigger than Mickey Mouse" character he was in the 90's, but I think your perspective on the subject is completely off base regardless.
http://blogs-images.forbes.com/johngaudiosi/files/2012/10/Wreck-It_Ralph_Sonic.jpg
An advertising cameo ooh. I liked Wreck it Ralph but Sonic didn't do shit in that movie. Sonic used to be the headliner, the main event! Not a shitty cameo. Hell the fact they could get Sonic and not Mario in that movie is telling enough, Sonic hasn't been up to Mario's level for ages.
An advertising cameo ooh. I liked Wreck it Ralph but Sonic didn't do shit in that movie. Sonic used to be the headliner, the main event! Not a shitty cameo. Hell the fact they could get Sonic and not Mario in that movie is telling enough, Sonic hasn't been up to Mario's level for ages.
SpikedGunner
Member
He also made appearances in the Macy Thanksgiving Parade.
baphomet
Member
I got sonic the hedgehog day 1, so yes I remember the 90's, and I remember sonic. I know you couldn't purchase sonic clothing in every town in the us. I know every gas station didn't carry sonic ice cream. When 3d blast came out it sold for shit and no one really cared anymore. By 95 sonic couldn't have been more uncool.
Unrelated question, do you like batman?
Wickerbasket
Member
I wasn't shitting on anyone, I was just saying that if you hang around on Sonic fan sites and surround yourself in that culture then you're obviously going to think he's more popular than he really is.
I never said it wasn't a money maker for Sega, I said Sonic was huge in the 90s and he's not anymore. And it's true Sonic's popularity is no where near where it was in the 90s. There's not even any comparison between his popularity then and now, it's that magnitude of a difference. The first Sonic game sold over 15 million copies over it's lifetime, there hasn't been a game even half as popular other than maybe the Mario & Sonic Olympics cross over.
The UK had all that stuff in the 90s, Sonic was huge here. Now the Sonic tshirts are in the retro section next to the atari tshirts. Seriously though, I get why you don't understand now, Sonic wasn't big in the US back then (compared to the UK and europe).
Lightning Lord
Banned
Of course, we need to clone Wario and insert him into every single game imaginable!
Hmm well that's too bad, I appreciate you giving it a read though.
Not quite yet. Marvel's Conan the Barbarian series made it to 275 issues before finally giving out.
I've never read the comics, nor seen the Christopher Nolan movies, but Batman: The Animated Series is a great show which I adore so It's kinda hard to say.
I'm going to guess this is going to talk about the early and modern character designs, right?
Sonic has 2 comics out, does that mean he beat it.
I just find when people complain about edgy , they like batman, or the punisher, or wolverine or "insert edgy badass here".
I am not going to harp on you for it, you have an opinion. I just wanted to know, a lot of people choose what is an edge and what isnt an edge and cut their hands in denial
The coolest for school
Not saying a character cant be blue, miku hatsune is a thing and alot of her is blue. However, his color along with every design past sonic being better than sonic, makes him being blue, worse.
I wonder if there's another character introduced in DMC that's colored blue that's actually supposed to be the cool, slick and refined character.
Nope, I'm drawing a blank. I can't think of anyone like that.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
Ugh... this thread. I'm not sure if its possible to disagree more with an OP.
No. Marvel had another Conan series running simultaneously with the first that went to 235 issues, which is more than everything else Sonic-related Archie has put out put together, excluding reprints.
Professor Beef
Banned
You don't mention a main character in the post Noi quoted.
But it's ok, move the goalposts some more.
Personality only works when you are doing a character for a game with focus on story.
Mario and Sonic don't need personality, they need to represent the feeling of the game and being easily seeing in the chaos of the screen.
That said, chubby Sonic fits more Green Hill Zone and slim Sonic fits more the city stages
The biggest problem with Sonic design is that people don't know what to do with his spikes and mouth when he is looking front like that Wreck It Ralph poster
also
Best sonic ^
Powered Up is the best Megaman
Mario and Sonic don't need personality, they need to represent the feeling of the game and being easily seeing in the chaos of the screen.
That said, chubby Sonic fits more Green Hill Zone and slim Sonic fits more the city stages
The biggest problem with Sonic design is that people don't know what to do with his spikes and mouth when he is looking front like that Wreck It Ralph poster
also
Best sonic ^
Powered Up is the best Megaman
Meh, they wrote Sonic Balls Z and that is the #1 reason why Sonic and friends are the subject of all those fanfics. The design itself is updated, but really not that radical if you compare it to the original Sonic. All key elements are present in the original design, he's just taller and a bit more refined.
So I disagree with the OP, you can't dismiss the original design when the new one has built nothing new on top of it. It's a natural progression fueled by general design trends. One might argue, that Sonic has not changed at all.
So I disagree with the OP, you can't dismiss the original design when the new one has built nothing new on top of it. It's a natural progression fueled by general design trends. One might argue, that Sonic has not changed at all.
Personality only works when you are doing a character for a game with focus on story.
Mario and Sonic don't need personality, they need to represent the feeling of the game and being easily seeing in the chaos of the screen.
That said, chubby Sonic fits more Green Hill Zone and slim Sonic fits more the city stages
also
Best sonic ^
I disagree with that, personality comes from having a story. Which sonic has had in the past ( though its just the illusion of one, he is a mary sue magoo)
Wickerbasket
Member
I've always thought when people called Sonic too edgy that it was about the designers trying too hard to be cool by pushing the boundaries and failing at it. It happens a lot in comics too, especially when writers write stories I don't feel fit the theme at times and it can become cringe inducing.
I don't really understand how liking "edgy" characters really contradicts not liking failed attempts at being an "edgy" character though. The Simpson's episode about Poochie the dog illustrates it pretty well, if you try to hard to push your character as edgy and hip, it becomes the opposite of that.
It does have something to with someone saying an attempt has failed, when it hasn't.
Failed would imply that shadow isn't the reason for like half the frig fan base. You can not like them, they haven't failed anything.
Then again we have multiple ways to measure quality and success. Commercial success is one of them for sure, but if we only look at it that way, the discussion can become quite stagnated. Angry Birds is the new Mickey Mouse!
Wickerbasket
Member
If that was even remotely true you would be seeing more Shadow the hedgehog games. When was the last Shadow game released, 2005? And no sequel?