Support NeoGAF

[Vulcano's assistant]

Generally from what I've read here, comic characters > anime

I think it is mostly to comics at least trying to give some explanation and rules and commit somewhat more to them, so the reader ends with a more concrete power level, while an anime may throw a "he is moving faster than light" at one point but never really state if that was more than hearsay since it didn't look that different from other things they were doing (Saint Seiya comes to mind). If a comic character moved faster than light, the comic makes a big deal out of it so you are aware. But both have various of those "there nothing more powerful in any universe".

The more and better you explain the powers, the more the reader/viewer accepts them, thus you see Dr. Manhattan always being brought up even if there is a whole tier of characters in his level that are somewhat ignored in comparison.

 

[zulux21]

Generally from what I've read here, comic characters > anime

a lot of that is that a number of the comics have been going on so long and keep upping the scales that at some point the comics get to a power level that is just stupid high before they reset.

I mean if dragon ball super manages to stay on the air for 10-20 years goku actually might be able to beat superman some day unlikely given how broken super man gets at some points but still might be able to given how fast they continue to up the powers.

that being said, gag characters trump all

 

[Haly]

Gagforce > your favorite fiction power

 

[1st Course]

Serious question. Can Luffy from One Piece beat Thor? I mean Luffy is completely immune to lightning.

http://vsbattles.wikia.com/wiki/Thor_(Marvel_Comics)

There's your answer

 

[Antiwhippy]

I think it is mostly to comics at least trying to give some explanation and rules and commit somewhat more to them, so the reader ends with a more concrete power level, while an anime may throw a "he is moving faster than light" at one point but never really state if that was more than hearsay since it didn't look that different from other things they were doing (Saint Seiya comes to mind). If a comic character moved faster than light, the comic makes a big deal out of it so you are aware. But both have various of those "there nothing more powerful in any universe".

The more and better you explain the powers, the more the reader/viewer accepts them, thus you see Dr. Manhattan always being brought up even if there is a whole tier of characters in his level that are somewhat ignored in comparison.

If you want to read something that explains abilities to a ridiculous degree you should read medaka box.

Also i think it's more because comics tries to connect everything into a multiverse while manga and anime are more standalone to their creator.

 

[True Savior]

Kenshiro at the top. The rest at the bottom.

 

[archreaper93]

http://vsbattles.wikia.com/wiki/Thor_(Marvel_Comics)

There's your answer

I'll do you one better.

https://outskirtsbattledomewiki.com/index.php/8-character-profiles/1485-character-profile-thor

 

[Mortemis]

this shit is so weird yet a little fascinating

If you want to read something that explains abilities to a ridiculous degree you should read medaka box.

Also i think it's more because comics tries to connect everything into a multiverse while manga and anime are more stone to their creator.

reading about all this stuff, I was wondering where medaka box fits in, but then I thought it doesn't matter, it's just some crazy fun shit that probably doesn't matter to people who run around blowing up worlds

 

[Vulcano's assistant]

If you want to read something that explains abilities to a ridiculous degree you should read medaka box.

Also i think it's more because comics tries to connect everything into a multiverse while manga and anime are more stone to their creator.

Yeah and this somewhat relates with having a more concrete idea of the power levels, since it gives room to exploit The Worf Effect against characters that have been defined for decades.

Say you have Hulk, whose powers are well understood, then in your comic you have someone that beat hulk, now you are you piggybacking on that accepted power to define the one of your character.

 

[Voras]

Comic characters are as weak or as strong as the plot demands. Most characters will vary dramatically in power depending on who is writing them. Generally it's the reality manipulators that top the charts though.

 

[Wolf Akela]

Gag characters like Saitama don't belong in discussions like this. His literal feat is that he's simply much stronger and can never be negatively affected by his enemy. It's the entire premise of this character.

 

[Slayven]

People think Mjornir is just for lightening?

 

[LotusHD]

Gag characters like Saitama don't belong in discussions like this. His literal feat is that he's simply much stronger and can never be negatively affected by his enemy. It's the entire premise of this character.

One Punch Man can't be negatively affected by your rules... so yea.

 

[Nuu]

Who are the most powerful characters in all of medium in general? Including comic, anime, and game.

Shulk from Xenoblade.

Wat!?

Gag characters like Saitama don't belong in discussions like this. His literal feat is that he's simply much stronger and can never be negatively affected by his enemy. It's the entire premise of this character.

Duder just said Superman would beat him because Saitama's serious punch just parts clouds not dimensions like Superman.

 

[TCKaos]

See, general tier lists are difficult at the upper level of imaginable power because a great deal of it involves reality warping. There are multiple multiple characters that have abilities that involve rewinding time or resetting reality until they are victorious, or abilities that involve eliminating causation, or stopping time, or moving through stopped time.

Like, look at Goku when he fights Hit. At that time we thought that hit was capable of stopping time and moving through it, colloquially referred to as a "Time Skip." When using Super Saiyan Blue Kaioken x10, Goku is capable of moving so quickly that he can move through stopped time without having the ability to actually stop time. He is moving through 0 time, which necessarily means he's moving at infinite speed. Moving at infinite speed means that any blow Goku lands necessarily has INFINITE FORCE.

Granted, he could already do this. He can teleport. Goku can move a distance instantaneously, meaning that technically he's already capable of moving at functionally infinite speed, though his use of it is very limited.

Even so Goku is incredibly weak compared to the likes of Gold Experience Requiem:

Nullification of Cause and Effect: Gold Experience Requiem's ability is to turn anything, including its opponent's attack and willpower, back to the state of "zero". Hence, it is virtually invincible, as all "supposed" actions created by an opponent would have been reset (back to point zero). It is mentioned by Giorno himself that he is unsure of the exact workings and limits of Requiem's powers, but it has been shown that its range of influence extends from finger beams, surface contact, and to even being in the mere attention of Requiem.

Requiem's abilities are seen by some fans to be the opposite of King Crimson's: King Crimson erases the "cause" and keeps the "effect" (i.e. time where a bullet would hit him is erased, causing the bullet to warp past him), while Requiem keeps the "cause" but erases the "effect", causing endless scenarios where actions and initiatives are started, but the effects of such does not occur (as shown when Requiem completely halted King Crimson's cause erasing ability).

If the opponent is "killed" by the Stand itself, then they will also continuously experience death, as they will die but repeatedly return to point "zero" (i.e Diavolo's endless death loops).

This ability renders Giorno essentially and absolutely untouchable by anything that would try to hurt or kill him and is perhaps the absolute strongest form of defense in existence.

 

[archreaper93]

Who are the most powerful characters in all of medium in general? Including comic, anime, and game.

The strongest people are the ones who are omnipotent. Examples being The One Above All from Marvel comics and Man of Miracles from Image Comics.

Wat!?

Xenoblade spoilers.

Spoiler

At the end of Xenoblade Chronicles, Shulk effectively becomes a god and resets the universe.

 

[Arcia]

Duder just said Superman would beat him because Saitama's serious punch just parts clouds not dimensions like Superman.

Doesn't matter. Simple explanation would be that Saitama was just not putting in as much effort at that point, which is plausible because he is often shown as being bored with his opponents and not even using any fancy attacks. If he had to he could punch harder than Superman though. He can beat anyone and anything and shrugs off all attacks, that's the joke.

The only characters who might be able to beat him are ones who can time travel. In that case they could go back in time to before he had done his training and kill him, sine he was just a average dude then.

 

[archreaper93]

Doesn't matter. Simple explanation would be that Saitama was just not putting in as much effort at that point, which is plausible because he is often shown as being bored with his opponents and not even using any fancy attacks. If he had to he could punch harder than Superman though. He can beat anyone and anything and shrugs off all attacks, that's the joke.

The only characters who might be able to beat him are ones who can time travel. In that case they could go back in time to before he had done his training and kill him, sine he was just a average dude then.

Yeah, no.

You can say he wasn't putting in as much effort, but you can't say him putting in that effort would put him above Superman. Because he hasn't shown power or speed that puts him even close to the Man of Steel.

You go by what he's shown, and with what Saitama has shown so far in the series, Superman would destroy him with a finger flick.

 

[Arcia]

Yeah, no.

You can say he wasn't putting in as much effort, but you can't say him putting in that effort would put him above Superman. Because he hasn't shown power or speed that puts him even close to the Man of Steel.

You go by what he's shown, and with what Saitama has shown so far in the series, Superman would destroy him with a finger flick.

Well the Roadrunner or Bugs Bunny were never shown doing anything close to anything in Man of Steel, but I bet both of them could beat Zod. Why? Because gag characters can do literally anything if the writer wants them to. Same with One Punch Man, Squirrel Girl, Arale, and most Looney Toons cartoon characters.

 

[blakep267]

Ok, so how broken is itachi compared to western heroes. I don't expect him to beat cosmic entities or anything, but dude has an impenetrable walking fortress in yata mirror & Susanoo, a sword that can seal your soul, amaterasu fire that burns for a week, he can trap you into an infinite loop where your trapped in your own mind ( izanami) and he also "had" shisuis eye with perfect mind control

 

[archreaper93]

Well the Roadrunner or Bugs Bunny were never shown doing anything close to anything in Man of Steel, but I bet both of them could beat Zod. Why? Because gag characters can do literally anything if the writer wants them to. Same with One Punch Man, Squirrel Girl, Arale, and most Looney Toons cartoon characters.

Road Runner and Bugs Bunny have literal toonforce as their power. The ability to do anything as long as it's funny IS their power. Saitama has a serious powerset that's played for laughs. I'd say those are different.

Also, I'd say Bugs Bunny defying his own cartoonist is greater than anything Superman has ever done.

Ok, so how broken is itachi compared to western heroes. I don't expect him to beat cosmic entities or anything, but dude has an impenetrable walking fortress in yata mirror & Susanoo, a sword that can seal your soul, amaterasu fire that burns for a week, he can trap you into an infinite loop where your trapped in your own mind ( izanami) and he also "had" shisuis eye with perfect mind control

In terms of Western comics, Itachi is on the lower scale of things. Thor, Superman, Iron Man, Hulk, etc. would all crush him.

 

[Nuu]

Doesn't matter. Simple explanation would be that Saitama was just not putting in as much effort at that point, which is plausible because he is often shown as being bored with his opponents and not even using any fancy attacks. If he had to he could punch harder than Superman though. He can beat anyone and anything and shrugs off all attacks, that's the joke.

The only characters who might be able to beat him are ones who can time travel. In that case they could go back in time to before he had done his training and kill him, sine he was just a average dude then.

This is an interesting way to put it.

See, general tier lists are difficult at the upper level of imaginable power because a great deal of it involves reality warping. There are multiple multiple characters that have abilities that involve rewinding time or resetting reality until they are victorious, or abilities that involve eliminating causation, or stopping time, or moving through stopped time.

Like, look at Goku when he fights Hit. At that time we thought that hit was capable of stopping time and moving through it, colloquially referred to as a "Time Skip." When using Super Saiyan Blue Kaioken x10, Goku is capable of moving so quickly that he can move through stopped time without having the ability to actually stop time. He is moving through 0 time, which necessarily means he's moving at infinite speed. Moving at infinite speed means that any blow Goku lands necessarily has INFINITE FORCE.

Granted, he could already do this. He can teleport. Goku can move a distance instantaneously, meaning that technically he's already capable of moving at functionally infinite speed, though his use of it is very limited.

Even so Goku is incredibly weak compared to the likes of Gold Experience Requiem:

If this is true then why wasn't this brought up in the Deathbattle episodes?

 

[archreaper93]

This is an interesting way to put it.


If this is true then why wasn't this brought up in the Deathbattle episodes?

Dragonball Super wasn't airing at the time of the Deathbattle, was it?

 

[Megalosaro]

Ideon wins.

Came in to say this.

Out of curiosity, how does the mech from ttgl compare stat wise to the Ideon in SRW.

 

[archreaper93]

Came in to say this.

Out of curiosity, how does the mech from ttgl compare stat wise to the Ideon in SRW.

TTGL is a robot who can throw galaxies like frisbees and has pretty strong reality warping powers.

What can Ideon do?

 

[Nuu]

Dragonball Super wasn't airing at the time of the Deathbattle, was it?

It JUST began airing.

...are they going to have to do a THIRD Deathbattle episode of Goku vs Superman!?

 

[Slayven]

See, general tier lists are difficult at the upper level of imaginable power because a great deal of it involves reality warping. There are multiple multiple characters that have abilities that involve rewinding time or resetting reality until they are victorious, or abilities that involve eliminating causation, or stopping time, or moving through stopped time.

Like, look at Goku when he fights Hit. At that time we thought that hit was capable of stopping time and moving through it, colloquially referred to as a "Time Skip." When using Super Saiyan Blue Kaioken x10, Goku is capable of moving so quickly that he can move through stopped time without having the ability to actually stop time. He is moving through 0 time, which necessarily means he's moving at infinite speed. Moving at infinite speed means that any blow Goku lands necessarily has INFINITE FORCE.

Granted, he could already do this. He can teleport. Goku can move a distance instantaneously, meaning that technically he's already capable of moving at functionally infinite speed, though his use of it is very limited.

Even so Goku is incredibly weak compared to the likes of Gold Experience Requiem:

Goku can only move at instant? LOL broke bitch

 

[Nuu]

Goku can only move at instant? LOL broke bitch

So doesn't this mean that Flash is top tier?

 

[Servbot24]

With Dragonball Super coming out and being canon, Goku would be considered one of the strongest people on Earth. Same tier as Thor and Hulk.

Dang, didn't know Thor was that strong. I don't follow comics outside the movies, where would the mainstay comics characters (Superman, Thor, Thanos, Galactus, Doom, let's say) fit into the list below?

The current DBS power tier is basically this (not bothering to list characters that are a wash, like Champa and Vegeta)

Zen'o
Grand Priest
Whis
Beerus
Goku

I actually can't think of someone that is a reasonable next step down from Goku/Vegeta... the drop-off after him is enormous. I'd have to think current Goku would whip even the strongest form of Buu pretty easily. Beerus can wipe out an entire universe if provoked, and Goku is (guessing) around 70% his level.

I assume Iron Man, Captain America, Batman and those types are nobodies.

 

[Slayven]

So doesn't this mean that Flash is top tier?

Yes

 

[BigDes]

Does anime have a character on the same power level as Grant Morrison?

 

[ChouGoku]

Popeye with spinach solos fiction, hes gonna be knockin people out left and right. Hes gonna knock the god of your favorite universe the fuck out as well. He ko'd his own animator. Goku, Superman, Saitama all are getting a spinach falcon punch in front of their girls

 

[Big One]

Tier list are dumb, but Dark Schneider from Bastard!! takes the cake for being one of the strongest anime/manga characters ever. I don't really count people like the Omniking cause their power is so out there it isn't really quantifiable by normal means when they can literally do anything.

 

[Raonak]

What about sports anime characters? Kagami in Direct Drive Zone with Kukuro assisting could probably beat superman.

 

[Manmademan]

I'm operating under the assumption that the One Above All doesn't exist post-SW until I see evidence to the contrary. Its absence from the crazy fuckery of Ultimates 2 makes me think it died with the old universe

Same. Either it doesn't exist or is in a position where it simply doesn't care.

Molecule Man is top dog right now and running around with levels of power up there with classic Beyonder.

 

[Alanae]

suprised this didn't get posted yet

 

[Manmademan]

suprised this didn't get posted yet

If this is supposed to be a power chart, it's the worst I've ever seen.

 

[Riposte]

Generally from what I've read here, comic characters > anime

If you are talking shonen, there tends to be an underlying, albeit limited, logic to power tiers within a single story. In comics they will talk a lot of game, basically unlimited, undefined power, but the Thors and Supermans fall in line when the plot wants them to, which is pretty much always outside the occasional panel or two which is the basis of all these silly discussions. If Flash or Dr. Stranger worked as comic nerds said they did, there simply wouldn't be a story for all the team books they show up in. Constant jobbing goes on, especially when it's time for yet another bi-annual crossover event (with an even stronger bad guy than last time! He can beat up Thor!) that's going to derail a bunch of ongoing stories. This extends all the way up to cosmic beings (He can beat up God!). They are also greatly limited by the status quo, as SUPER SMART characters don't actually accomplish much in 60 years. Basically, if the comics themselves don't take the power levels seriously, neither should the fanboys. None of this shit matters enough to argue about unless it's internally inconsistent, within the same book/series.

 

[Slayven]

If this is supposed to be a power chart, it's the worst I've ever seen.

So random

 

[BLOODED_hands]

So for the anime buffs, who is the anime/manga version of Doctor Doom with prep time?

 

[thefatness16]

I'm not sure if any characters can beat Giorno's Gold Experience Requiem. That said it doesn't enhance his strength, so he would stalemate with any character that could take a punch.

 

[Parallax]

I often wonder how giorno and ger would react to Jesse Custer and the word

 

[RK9039]

So for the anime buffs, who is the anime/manga version of Doctor Doom with prep time?

Aizen

Spoiler

I have no idea

.

 

[Slayven]

Aizen

Spoiler

I have no idea

.

Aizen needed to be let out of hell. Doom clawed his way out.

 

[Silent Chief]

There used to be an RPG called Marvel Super Heroes published in 1984 that had complete stats for the characters.

2 Feeble
4 Poor
6 Typical
10 Good
20 Excellent (Olympic athlete)
30 Remarkable
40 Incredible
75 Monstruous
100 Unearthly

Nightcrawler has Remarkable Agility, Colossus has Monstrous Strength, Thor has Unearthly Fighting ability.

That's there's an other tier for entities and being beyond that.

150 Shift X
200 Shift Y
300 Shift Z

And you find Galactus somewhere in the last tier.

1000 Class 1000
3000 Class 3000
5000 Class 5000
Infinity Beyond

 

[BLOODED_hands]

Aizen

Spoiler

I have no idea

.

Lol, Aizen's cool, badass but yeah he is nowhere near Doctor Doom's prep level.

 

[Parch]

Road Runner and Bugs Bunny have literal toonforce as their power. The ability to do anything as long as it's funny IS their power.

Also, I'd say Bugs Bunny defying his own cartoonist is greater than anything Superman has ever done.

Absolutely. Bugs Bunny took some bumps, but he always came back with the best revenge. "Of course you know, this means war."

As for anime vs western comics, it might be a valid question if the majority of comic fans actually gave a shit about anime.

 

[Megalosaro]

TTGL is a robot who can throw galaxies like frisbees and has pretty strong reality warping powers.

What can Ideon do?

Destroy the universe

 

[Manmademan]

I'm not sure if any characters can beat Giorno's Gold Experience Requiem. That said it doesn't enhance his strength, so he would stalemate with any character that could take a punch.

without going the "abstract power" route:

The Quiz: "Every power you haven't thought of yet."

You could also go this route:

"

"

unlimited probability manipulation. If there's a possibility an event does, has, or could have happened, even if that possibility is a trillion to one or less, or happened decades ago- it occurs. This is anything from the probability that your powers don't work, or backfire on you, to the probability that your parents never met and you were never born in the first place. Can even reverse death if she wants to.

Scarlet witch at "House of M" or "AVX" levels is really, really difficult to kill.

There used to be an RPG called Marvel Super Heroes published in 1984 that had complete stats for the characters.

2 Feeble
4 Poor
6 Typical
10 Good
20 Excellent (Olympic athlete)
30 Remarkable
40 Incredible
75 Monstruous
100 Unearthly

Nightcrawler has Remarkable Agility, Colossus has Monstrous Strength, Thor has Unearthly Fighting ability.

That's there's an other tier for entities and being beyond that.

150 Shift X
200 Shift Y
300 Shift Z

And you find Galactus somewhere in the last tier.

1000 Class 1000
3000 Class 3000
5000 Class 5000
Infinity Beyond

This isn't all that uncommon. Marvel handbooks and Trading cards did the same shit all the time.
The problem is that the authors of those things usually made that shit up on the fly, completely at odds with what was being published. It wasn't authoritative by any means, and power shifts happen so frequently in comics that the information was likely outdated as soon as it saw print.

 

[Chezzymann]

Goku can only move at instant? LOL broke bitch

thats an awful art style