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[Net_Wrecker]

I hear complaints about the shooting in Sleeping Dogs, but honestly, I feel like the guns all feel and sound great and are all very diverse in the way they handle. The AI is bare bones and flat nonexistent in shootouts; however, the way enemies react to being shot is impressive and gives a little weight to the after effect of taking a life. The game is bloody as shit, which I found enjoyable.

The gunplay in Sleeping Dogs definitely isn't as "bad" as people make it out to be. It's infinitely more manageable than GTAIV or any of its expansions, feels better than Just Cause 2 and Saints Row 3, and even has better hit reactions than a purer shooter experience like Uncharted 3. Once you got the hang using the bullet time-esque mechanic, I dare to say it even became sort of fun. The real issues I had with the shootouts, besides AI, were that they were too short and lacked good build up beforehand. They just happened, then it was over. Except for the

Spoiler

hospital mission.

That still could've been executed better, but it was pretty memorable.

 

[Ballistics]

Has anyone ever heard the word "protagonists" said so many times!?

 

[Death Dealer]

Maybe he should watch these. Who cares if he's trying to do his own thing? The characters and story in each of his games have been trite bullshit. These games could be so much better with some decent writing.

I didn't like GTA 4's story or characters as much as past GTAs, but the writing in the GTA games is better than 95% of other video games. You want to talk about trite BS, look at a Bethesda RPG. Compared to that, Rockstar is oscar worthy.

I don't think it's a big deal they aren't cribbing from whatever shows people are so mad about Houser not watching for input.

 

[Ballistics]

Imagine this, you call one of the two characters and arrange to meet up...not for bowling or darts but just to drive around. You pick them up and set your destination (right across the map). You are driving as Michael with Trevor in the passenger seat and you switch characters, leaving you as Trevor. It would be exactly like a taxi ride, but faster and without the fear of the driver running away. Imagine doing drive-bys this way. Or turning off the GPS and seeing where Micheal goes on his own. Or what happens if you are Trevor giving Micheal a heli ride and you switch to Michael and jump out...do you see Trevor turn around and go home? Or can you call Trevor up and he'll pick you up? The possibilities are very interesting.

 

[Net_Wrecker]

I don't think it's a big deal they aren't cribbing from whatever shows people are so mad about Houser not watching for input.

You're missing the point. Houser says he doesn't watch contemporary shows that are too close in subject matter to the type of stuff Rockstar does, presumably so that he doesn't ape ideas and themes, consciously or not. The issue with this is that while he does remain free from being heavily influenced or more blatant "homages," it also means he isn't actively looking to LEARN from the best of modern television storytelling which is much, MUCH more applicable to 40+ hour video game narratives in terms of pacing, and character arcs than whatever classic crime film they're getting inspired by. It's not about making Breaking Bad: The Game, it's about learning how to map out the story in these sprawling games that tend to lose focus, usually around halfway through.

 

[Dragnet]

Imagine this, you call one of the two characters and arrange to meet up...not for bowling or darts but just to drive around. You pick them up and set your destination (right across the map). You are driving as Michael with Trevor in the passenger seat and you switch characters, leaving you as Trevor. It would be exactly like a taxi ride, but faster and without the fear of the driver running away. Imagine doing drive-bys this way. Or turning off the GPS and seeing where Micheal goes on his own. Or what happens if you are Trevor giving Micheal a heli ride and you switch to Michael and jump out...do you see Trevor turn around and go home? Or can you call Trevor up and he'll pick you up? The possibilities are very interesting.

This all rides on whether or not the 3 characters can exist in the same world. I fear Rockstar will just phase the other two out of the world whenever you switch characters. If they do all co-exist, I wonder if the other characters will show up on the map?

 

[Fried Food]

This all rides on whether or not the 3 characters can exist in the same world. I fear Rockstar will just phase the other two out of the world whenever you switch characters. If they do all co-exist, I wonder if the other characters will show up on the map?

They said in the GI cover that you can go see the other characters doing stuff when your not controlling them.

 

[Dragnet]

They said in the GI cover that you can go see the other characters doing stuff when your not controlling them.

I just thought they said you might find them in cool situations when you switch to one?

 

[7he Talon]

So you can switch characters whenever, wherever?

 

[maquiladora]

So you can switch characters whenever, wherever?

Outside of missions, yes. Its restricted inside missions.

 

[7he Talon]

Outside of missions, yes. Its restricted inside missions.

Ah awesome! So much potential.

 

[Ballistics]

Outside of missions, yes. Its restricted inside missions.

I don't remember them saying it was restricted to certain missions? Just that certain missions used all three. It's more power consuming moving fast across the map than it is to move a couple of feet. How many times have you driven around with a gang of people (in SA and IV), what's the difference between them and the other two in this?

 

[NoSkillz187]

I don't remember them saying it was restricted to certain missions? Just that certain missions used all three. It's more power consuming moving fast across the map than it is to move a couple of feet. How many times have you driven around with a gang of people (in SA and IV), what's the difference between them and the other two in this?

In missions when two or all three of them are together there are certain moments when you can switch between them or choose not to. Read the mission about rappelling down the building.

 

[maquiladora]

I don't remember them saying it was restricted to certain missions? Just that certain missions used all three. It's more power consuming moving fast across the map than it is to move a couple of feet. How many times have you driven around with a gang of people (in SA and IV), what's the difference between them and the other two in this?

They said the player is free to switch between characters at any time off-mission.

Inside missions, the switching is restricted.

 

[matrix-cat]

I hear complaints about the shooting in Sleeping Dogs, but honestly, I feel like the guns all feel and sound great and are all very diverse in the way they handle.

Sleeping Dogs has some really draconian auto-aim that makes it feel like you're wrestling with your reticle at times (on the PC version with a 360 controller, at least), but the shooting controls are totally fine. You move freely, aim and shoot the way you'd expect to; it handles like a well-tested game made by a bunch of human beings experienced in video game shooting. I don't know who or what coded GTA IV's gunplay, but they had some bizarre ideas. When you're in cover in GTA IV, the left trigger makes your character lean forward slightly, and the right trigger makes him take a slow step to the side, move the aiming reticle away from the shot you'd just lined up and then, a full second later, a literal One Mississippi, fire the gun. And then immediately step back, so when you miss it'll take another full second to fire again.

Foregoing the cover system is slightly more bearable, but then you have to deal with your character walking at a snail's pace (you can't hold the jog button and aim at the same time without two right thumbs), the reticle freaking out whenever you come near a wall or doorway, and no shoulder-switching. This is to say nothing of cycling through all of your weapons, one-by-one, waiting for the lengthy animation of each gun being pulled from nega-space, and the fact that the control scheme has you shooting variously with the right trigger, left bumper, X or A buttons depending on whether you're on foot or in different vehicles.

All GTA V has to do is make character control less of an ordeal and just take the standard shooting controls from every modern game and it'll be glorious. Thesedays the casual crowd that GTA has to appeal to to sell its 30 million copies is well-versed enough in COD-esque left trigger/right trigger controls that all Rockstar's half-trigger-pull auto-aiming nonsense will just make it harder to adjust to.

 

[Fjordson]

Maybe he should watch these. Who cares if he's trying to do his own thing? The characters and story in each of his games have been trite bullshit. These games could be so much better with some decent writing.

Couldn't disagree more. Think they have really strong writing actually.

I hear complaints about the shooting in Sleeping Dogs, but honestly, I feel like the guns all feel and sound great and are all very diverse in the way they handle. The AI is bare bones and flat nonexistent in shootouts; however, the way enemies react to being shot is impressive and gives a little weight to the after effect of taking a life. The game is bloody as shit, which I found enjoyable.

The only drawback to the combat and driving are the controls. I don't want to fire a weapon with RB/R2. And I definitely do not want to gas a car with RB/R2. The fact that you can't change this on consoles is abhorrent to me in a game that is likely 30+ hours long.

Hopefully, Rockstar will continue to offer their two basic layouts of control because the Classic scheme in GTA IV is right up my alley. I do not mind holding R1 and firing with L1 at all.

The driving in Sleeping Dogs is an entirely different beast. In my opinion, it's flat out poor. I can understand why some people may prefer that style of driving to what was found in the last GTA, but for me, GTA IV may be the most underrated racing game - on or off line - of all time. I found it to be that good in certain situations. The GI article makes it sound as if they've heard the criticisms and are going to hopefully find a balance between the two by adding additional physics. I trust they know what they're doing. .

Yeah, Sleeping Dogs driving is all bad. The handling, the shaky cam when you start to speed up. Bleh.

I was fine with everything on foot, though. Some neat shooting mechanics with the sliding over cover and the melee combat.

I also loved jumping off a motorcycle and blowing it up in slow motion as it sped away.

 

[Ballistics]

They said the player is free to switch between characters at any time off-mission.

Inside missions, the switching is restricted.

True actually, but in a mission things will naturally have to be done in a certain order. It's no use Franklin sniping people before Michael gets there.

But my example still stands, because it's outside of a mission.

 

[maquiladora]

True actually, but in a mission things will naturally have to be done in a certain order. It's no use Franklin sniping people before Michael gets there.

But my example still stands, because it's outside of a mission.

Yep, I agree. Should be lots of fun setting up stuff to happen with multiple characters.
Looking forward to hearing more details on Monday.

 

[AgentOtaku]

Sleeping Dogs has some really draconian auto-aim that makes it feel like you're wrestling with your reticle at times (on the PC version with a 360 controller, at least), but the shooting controls are totally fine. You move freely, aim and shoot the way you'd expect to; it handles like a well-tested game made by a bunch of human beings experienced in video game shooting. I don't know who or what coded GTA IV's gunplay, but they had some bizarre ideas. When you're in cover in GTA IV, the left trigger makes your character lean forward slightly, and the right trigger makes him take a slow step to the side, move the aiming reticle away from the shot you'd just lined up and then, a full second later, a literal One Mississippi, fire the gun. And then immediately step back, so when you miss it'll take another full second to fire again.

Foregoing the cover system is slightly more bearable, but then you have to deal with your character walking at a snail's pace (you can't hold the jog button and aim at the same time without two right thumbs), the reticle freaking out whenever you come near a wall or doorway, and no shoulder-switching. This is to say nothing of cycling through all of your weapons, one-by-one, waiting for the lengthy animation of each gun being pulled from nega-space, and the fact that the control scheme has you shooting variously with the right trigger, left bumper, X or A buttons depending on whether you're on foot or in different vehicles.

All GTA V has to do is make character control less of an ordeal and just take the standard shooting controls from every modern game and it'll be glorious. Thesedays the casual crowd that GTA has to appeal to to sell its 30 million copies is well-versed enough in COD-esque left trigger/right trigger controls that all Rockstar's half-trigger-pull auto-aiming nonsense will just make it harder to adjust to.

Nailed it

 

[Syphon Filter]

Los Santos in GTA V is bigger than the worlds of RDR, San Andreas, and GTA IV combined.

how?

 

[gnarlyxcharlie]

Los Santos in GTA V is bigger than the worlds of RDR, San Andreas, and GTA IV combined.

how?

Has to be some kind of PR nonsense, I don't see that being even slightly possible. Didn't GTA IV fill up the disc?

 

[Derrick01]

Los Santos in GTA V is bigger than the worlds of RDR, San Andreas, and GTA IV combined.

how?

Ocean, Sky and specialized interiors. The actual visible landmass probably won't be that size though it should still be pretty big since they have to incorporate jets and god knows what else.

Didn't GTA IV fill up the disc?

Yeah one of the Housers was interviewed and he was not pleased about the 360's disc format. But a lot has changed since then. They've likely learned new tricks, MS has increased the space by at least 1gb through some kind of streamlining process, and it could still be a multiple disc game that utilizes installing to the hard drive.

 

[Rekki-Maru]

I mostly care about the gameplay. Remove the janky controls from GTA and only then I can start caring about the story.

yea, i hope it controls smooth as butter! just like RE6..

 

[GQman2121]

Sleeping Dogs has some really draconian auto-aim that makes it feel like you're wrestling with your reticle at times (on the PC version with a 360 controller, at least), but the shooting controls are totally fine. You move freely, aim and shoot the way you'd expect to; it handles like a well-tested game made by a bunch of human beings experienced in video game shooting. I don't know who or what coded GTA IV's gunplay, but they had some bizarre ideas. When you're in cover in GTA IV, the left trigger makes your character lean forward slightly, and the right trigger makes him take a slow step to the side, move the aiming reticle away from the shot you'd just lined up and then, a full second later, a literal One Mississippi, fire the gun. And then immediately step back, so when you miss it'll take another full second to fire again.

Foregoing the cover system is slightly more bearable, but then you have to deal with your character walking at a snail's pace (you can't hold the jog button and aim at the same time without two right thumbs), the reticle freaking out whenever you come near a wall or doorway, and no shoulder-switching. This is to say nothing of cycling through all of your weapons, one-by-one, waiting for the lengthy animation of each gun being pulled from nega-space, and the fact that the control scheme has you shooting variously with the right trigger, left bumper, X or A buttons depending on whether you're on foot or in different vehicles.

All GTA V has to do is make character control less of an ordeal and just take the standard shooting controls from every modern game and it'll be glorious. Thesedays the casual crowd that GTA has to appeal to to sell its 30 million copies is well-versed enough in COD-esque left trigger/right trigger controls that all Rockstar's half-trigger-pull auto-aiming nonsense will just make it harder to adjust to.

Sleeping Dogs definitely does have some wonky auto aim, but I feel like once it zooms you onto a target you're on your own and can move about freely. I prefer to aim freely myself, but I understand why the auto aim is there.

And although you actually can switch shoulders in GTA IV, you're pretty spot on with your description of how most shootouts played out. There certainly was a slight delay and the cover system was beyond buggy. Neither of which I remember being mentioned in reviews.

Has to be some kind of PR nonsense, I don't see that being even slightly possible. Didn't GTA IV fill up the disc?

Have you seen the images? Like...all of them?

Also, it sounds like you'll be able to search the ocean floor, so you have to factor that in when trying to judge what they're referring to.

 

[notoriousKTR]

Los Santos in GTA V is bigger than the worlds of RDR, San Andreas, and GTA IV combined.

how?

Hard work.

 

[Ballistics]

Los Santos in GTA V is bigger than the worlds of RDR, San Andreas, and GTA IV combined.

how?

Procedural Synthesis no doubt. Take one house, apply different values to it and it makes it look like a different house (or just the same house over and over again). Yet it only takes up the space of the original house. Or one tree makes a whole forest (Speed Tree). Also SA loaded much quicker than 3 and VC because the map used less data despite being larger, so the same could be true here. And that helps with the 360 too, as does the removal of security restrictions on the 360s disc, giving it more space. Note, I am comparing what the did last gen to this gen where they have a completely different engine, they might not do any of it I do wonder about the variations of NPCs, something that IV dealt with really well was rarely seeing the same person twice.

 

[GQman2121]

Hard work.

More like.....

 

[Neverwinter27]

What Im wondering is how they can pull off those unbelievable draw distances now. Anyone know the trick behind this?

 

[notoriousKTR]

More like.....

http://i.minus.com/ihgYzANJU37ds.gif

Still the result of hard work.

 

[maquiladora]

What Im wondering is how they can pull off those unbelievable draw distances now. Anyone know the trick behind this?

Witchcraft.

 

[Ballistics]

What Im wondering is how they can pull off those unbelievable draw distances now. Anyone know the trick behind this?

Lying

 

[Mr. Enigma]

Side-missions that Rockstar mentioned include: yoga, triathlons, tennis, and golf.

 

[Fjordson]

Quit lyin', you know you're hyped for yoga.

 

[Cyborg]

What Im wondering is how they can pull off those unbelievable draw distances now. Anyone know the trick behind this?

It was running on a PC, like MGS Ground Zeroes! No way the screens are current gen

 

[EdibleExplosives]

Quit lyin', you know you're hyped for yoga.

Yoga means yoga pants. Virtual yoga pants. Unf.

 

[MormaPope]

Those already sound much better than all the minigames in GTA IV and Red Dead combined. I love GTA IV and Red Dead Redemption but the minigames were abysmal in both. GTA San Andreas even had some really bad minigames as well.

Plus those 4 mentioned aren't all the minigames in GTA V.

 

[MormaPope]

It was running on a PC, like MGS Ground Zeroes! No way the screens are current gen

Compare GTA IV on consoles to Red Dead Redemption and Max Payne 3. GTA IV on consoles looks like a cartoon compared to Rockstar's latest games. Also some screens look much better than others.

 

[Derrick01]

I put hours into Yakuza 4's golf course, there was something strangely addictive about it. If GTA 5's is like that but hopefully tougher to master I'll go nuts. Even better if we can play friends on free roam.

 

[Buckethead]

Those already sound much better than all the minigames in GTA IV and Red Dead combined.

How dare you blaspheme against the name of Poker and Liar's Dice?

shakeheadno.gif

 

[Fjordson]

Yoga means yoga pants. Virtual yoga pants. Unf.

Lmfao, this is true.

Also, I think the wording was a bit weird calling those side missions. Basically just sound like mini-games, like what darts and bowling and stuff were in GTA IV.

Side missions are probably going to be unique things for each character (I bet there'll be something related to cars with Franklin) and the dynamic missions out in the world they mentioned.

 

[MormaPope]

I put hours into Yakuza 4's golf course, there was something strangely addictive about it. If GTA 5's is like that but hopefully tougher to master I'll go nuts. Even better if we can play friends on free roam.

Rockstar did a fantastic job with Table Tennis, so the tennis minigame will probably be fantastic. The driving range in GTA IV felt really clunky, so hopefully they learned how to make a good golf type of game.

 

[abundant]

Side missions are probably going to be unique things for each character (I bet there'll be something related to cars with Franklin) and the dynamic missions out in the world they mentioned.

They did say that they're working on having at least one unique side mission for each character. Probably Franklin = Repo/Car theft, Trevor = Mayhem or Flying, and Michael = ?.

 

[Ballistics]

There's got to be snooker and pool, proper pool too not 9 ball (which I still love) 8 ball, yellow and reds. Snooker is a much more refined game than pool. And of course snooker, pool and golf mean something else too...weapons Trevor with snooker balls in a sock...not a case of who breaks first but what

 

[maquiladora]

I put hours into Yakuza 4's golf course, there was something strangely addictive about it. If GTA 5's is like that but hopefully tougher to master I'll go nuts. Even better if we can play friends on free roam.

Fully realized, full size golf course.

 

[Ballistics]

Rockstar did a fantastic job with Table Tennis, so the tennis minigame will probably be fantastic. The driving range in GTA IV felt really clunky, so hopefully they learned how to make a good golf type of game.

There was a driving range in IV!? Missed that!

 

[Lakitu]

I had no idea there was a driving range in GTA IV.

 

[MormaPope]

There was a driving range in IV!? Missed that!

It was only in The Ballad of Gay Tony DLC.

 

[Ballistics]

It was only in The Ballad of Gay Tony DLC.

That explains it, I haven't got around to it yet.

 

[Buckethead]

Well the driving range was in IV you just couldn't do the activity until TBOGT.

 

[harrytang]

Still confused how Vice City borrows so much creatively from tv and movie fiction, yet acting now like breaking bad, the wire, sopranos should be completely excluded when developing a modern day gangster story. Why was it ok then, and I would argue that it even elevated the story of VC, but not now?