I agree.The corporate apology in this topic is disgusting.
Though I'd call it corporate ballwashing to more luridly express what I think of it.
I agree.The corporate apology in this topic is disgusting.
Exactly. Which is silly. The end user is not being served.To take a fast look at the most recommended games for example. Which is not GTA V case nowadays.
Absolutely, I just wish it wasn't so. We need more reliable tools to help the consumer in making wise purchasing choices for themselves. Complaining about Take2's actions is just, but the way people are doing it is contributing (not the cause) to the problem with user reviews. While this isn't nearly the worst reason to downvote a game, it still completely ignores the game itself. We shouldn't review Skyrim to be 10 because you can mod it fun (some people do), we wouldn't credit the devs for the work that others have done.That is another issue entirely. When you don't have "protest reviews", then it's a bunch of kids trying to be funny or edgy. Steam reviews are hot garbage for actually informed opinions on games, have always been. This is actually a constructive use of the feature compared to the average game.
I agree.
Though I'd call it corporate ballwashing to more luridly express what I think of it.
What's really strange is that I see very few people defending Take-Two's actions.
The bulk of the push-back seems to be against the abuse of the Steam User Review system and the ethics of review-bombing.
It is possible to be angry at Take-Two for their actions while sanctimoniously viewing protest-reviews as fundamentally disingenuous and/or unethical.
Shame so many only view it as a black and white / 'with us or against us' proposition, as it's anything but.
The weirdest thing for me is that I actually see where the protest-reviewer's are coming from. I personally don't think it's right (use of the User Review system), but I understand their rationale. That doesn't automatically absolve Take-Two, they're jerk-holes for their part.
This makes the whole Corporate Apologist accusations ring hollow, imo. It's a complex issue, but people would rather pick a side an lob grenades rather than consider the shades of gray.
Q. Can I write a negative review?
A. Yes. If you are unhappy with the product, or don't believe that it is delivering on what it promises, you may write a review and tell other customers why you do not recommend it.
Recent updates to GTAV PC had an unintended effect of making unplayable certain single player modifications. This was not intentional, no one has been banned for using single player modifications, and you should not worry about being banned or being relegated to the cheater pool just for using single player PC mods. Our primary focus is on protecting GTA Online against modifications that could give players an unfair advantage, disrupt gameplay, or cause griefing. It also bears mentioning that because game mods are by definition unauthorized, they may be broken by technical updates, cause instability, or affect your game in other unforeseen ways.
Were mods officially supported to begin with? I understand if something that was advertised ends up getting removed after you paid your money, but the reviews should be based on what Rockstar delivered. Steam reviews don't seem like the right platform for this.
Yo are we pretending that this update didn't affect the game and people have no reason at all to leave negative reviews?What's really strange is that I see very few people defending Take-Two's actions.
The bulk of the push-back seems to be against the abuse of the Steam User Review system and the ethics of review-bombing.
It is possible to be angry at Take-Two for their actions while simultaneously viewing protest-reviews as fundamentally disingenuous and/or unethical.
Shame so many only view it as a black and white / 'with us or against us' proposition, as it's anything but.
The weirdest thing for me is that I actually see where the protest-reviewer's are coming from. I personally don't think it's right (use of the User Review system), but I understand their rationale. That doesn't automatically absolve Take-Two for their part, they're the jerk-holes who brought it on themselves.
This is why the Corporate Apologist accusations ring hollow, imo. Being invested in legit use of the Steam User Review system has little to do with coddling up with Big Publishers. I think it's more of a desire to see fair representation of a product from an actual game/developer standpoint rather than a political-stand perspective. While I do in truth understand that the lines blur sometimes, I'm fundamentally against abusing the system as it is in place now. Maybe I'm wrong, but it's how I feel and it has nothing to do with trying to protect Big Publishers.
It's a complex issue, but it seems people would rather just pick a side an lob grenades rather than consider the shades of gray.
Why are you being so hostile, can't you play nice? You don't seem like a person who should be listened to. And why are you quoting things that nobody has said? Don't make stuff up to validate your own argument, it's again something that doesn't make you look good. If you can't handle people being critical, you shouldn't participate in forum discussions.
Agreed, especially since people aren't going to follow through and actually start to boycott them. Talk is cheap.
I do worry for those smaller studios under Paradox though.
Steam reviews tend to be pretty bad. More of a general problem than anything specific to this situation.Because people aren't reviewing the game anymore. I need to spend way more time than just few seconds to even find a review that not only complains about the mod bans but also tells what they think about the game. Review isn't really helpful if I only hear about the problem(s), where does it succeed is also important information. Someone who isn't looking for a game to mod but just to play isn't getting any help from these reviews.
What is there to read in review like this "You ban our mods, we ban your income.".
Take-Two is being greedy and vindictive because they feel their precious Shark Cards micro-transaction scheme is being encroached on. That's it. There's no real nuance to it.
Exactly. Which is silly. The end user is not being served.
Right. So if you aren't worried about it affecting their bottom line, why do you even care that people are voicing their discontent?
Absolutely, I just wish it wasn't so. We need more reliable tools to help the consumer in making wise purchasing choices for themselves. Complaining about Take2's actions is just, but the way people are doing it is contributing (not the cause) to the problem with user reviews. While this isn't nearly the worst reason to downvote a game, it still completely ignores the game itself. We shouldn't review Skyrim to be 10 because you can mod it fun (some people do), we wouldn't credit the devs for the work that others have done.
I'd consider the issue of negative Steam reviews due to the game being made worse, making the game seem worse than it is to people who don't care about the game having been made worse in this particular fashion, and/or who don't care to scroll down to find out whether that is the case, to be a minor one. In this case, I should say. Bigger issue for smaller games.
Steam reviews tend to be pretty bad. More of a general problem than anything specific to this situation.
You can filter "most helpful positive all time", but for whatever reason not on the store page, only on the page you get to when clicking the tiny link at the bottom of the review block.
Like half of these are still garbage reviews.
Eh, I never got the impression that negative Crusader Kings/Europa Universalis reviews were only about the regional pricing update. For a lot of people, it was just the straw that broke the camel's back.
It's not silly. As relentlessly said in this thread, it's the only meaningful way people can express their concerns and disappointement with Take 2 position.
I think we should be more real here; some of you are trying to create a situation where Rockstar / Take Two is a victim here, and this is absolutely not the case. Many people bought the PC version because of mods, it was no problem to mod the game until now. The mods doesn't affect the MP game. Take 2 / Rockstar sold a huge ammount of this game already and monetizes on those Shark cards, which is their main concern now although they take no action against cheaters and hackes in the online community and are knocking out modders that actually helps them to sell legit copies of their games for those interesed in the SP game (but they don't make so much income from the SP mode anymore, cause they already sold the hell out of it).
So user reviews should be a referendum on the publisher then.
I've had a big mouth in this thread so I'll state for the record I don't play GTA, I couldn't care less about Rockstar. What I care about is user reviews. If they are primarily a platform to campaign for/against publishers, then let's establish that. This issue is not just about Rockstar, it has happened to other games made by other companies and I imagine it will happen again.
It's not just a campaing against a publisher. It's a legitimate critic since it is affecting the game in a negative way. People are not negativating because "Take Two is bad", they're negativating because "GTA V mods are now prohibited". You're missing the point. The PC version of GTA V, after that decision, just became worse. They literally knocked down a feature that made people buy the game for.
I've yet to read one of those reviews that actually make a case for the (what was it, 97 Metacritic?) game being actually _bad_ now, If anything they admit the game is good. it's all just invective aimed at the publisher.
If a game needed mods to be good, it probably didn't deserve positive reviews in the first place. But of course that''s not the case.
It's not just a campaing against a publisher. It's a legitimate critic since it is affecting the game in a negative way. People are not negativating because "Take Two is bad", they're negativating because "GTA V mods are now prohibited". You're missing the point. The PC version of GTA V, after that decision, just became worse. They literally knocked down a feature that made people buy the game for.
I don't see any shades of gray here.It's a complex issue, but it seems people would rather just pick a side an lob grenades rather than consider the shades of gray.
I don't see any shades of gray here.
What we have is a massive mega-corporation deciding to completely shit on a part of their fanbase for no other reason than because they think it will help them eke out a sliver more profit off some "whales". It's utterly disgusting.
People, who are clearly in the much weaker position, choosing any and all (legal) methods to voice their discontent in such a situation is something that I will invariably applaud and support.
We are not talking about some independent developer being victimized by an angry mob, we are not talking about an overreaction to some temporary issue, and we are not talking about a violent reprisal to some complex multi-faceted topic. There is only one facet, and it's a huge company fucking over consumers.
They'll sure care lol.
Fuck mods.
They'll sure care lol.
Fuck mods.
They'll sure care lol.
Fuck mods.
No, it's hypothetical. Do try and actually understand what words mean before criticizing someone for using them, thanks.It's called being hyperbolic actually.
And nah, I like to follow and participate in this thread since there's a good discussion going on. But I'll try to skip your responses from now on, thanks for the advice.
But think of the poor corporation getting hit with negative reviews! How would they ever survive? Oh, and also reviews totally don't matter guys, lol stop wasting your time doing that.I don't see any shades of gray here.
What we have is a massive mega-corporation deciding to completely shit on a part of their fanbase for no other reason than because they think it will help them eke out a sliver more profit off some "whales". It's utterly disgusting.
People, who are clearly in the much weaker position, choosing any and all (legal) methods to voice their discontent in such a situation is something that I will invariably applaud and support.
We are not talking about some independent developer being victimized by an angry mob, we are not talking about an overreaction to some temporary issue, and we are not talking about a violent reprisal to some complex multi-faceted topic. There is only one facet, and it's a huge company fucking over consumers.
UhhhhThey'll sure care lol.
Fuck mods.
No, it's hypothetical. Do try and actually understand what words mean before criticizing someone for using them, thanks.
I guess I need to hone my English skills then. Live and learn.I bet if a game was to literally self-destruct and destroy your hardware everytime you got a game over, there would be legions of dribbling fanboys saying "B-but how dare people give this a bad review for that! At least the gameplay is good! It's the company's right to piss off their paying customers!"
They'll sure care lol.
Fuck mods.
SP mods? awesome
I'm playing GTAO on PS4 and it's clean, fair, no bullshit. There are already ten other mod menu's that affect gtao on pc. It's disgusting, kill it with fire.
OpenIV is mod that only uses the SP portion of GTA. On the PC. Which you would have known if you bothered to read anything in this thread.SP mods? awesome
I'm playing GTAO on PS4 and it's clean, fair, no bullshit. There are already ten other mod menu's that affect gtao on pc. It's disgusting, kill it with fire.
ReadSP mods? awesome
I'm playing GTAO on PS4 and it's clean, fair, no bullshit. There are already ten other mod menu's that affect gtao on pc. It's disgusting, kill it with fire.
Nah. A game with publisher that try to do this kind of shit deserve negative reviews.
What?
Is this not the clearest and easiest method for pushback?
Yeah you're right, where are the times where we ignited some cars to draw attention.
Right?
No its perfect. Having power over evil corps feels good, they are like our bitches now.
People do what they can with the tools available to them.
SP mods? awesome
I'm playing GTAO on PS4 and it's clean, fair, no bullshit. There are already ten other mod menu's that affect gtao on pc. It's disgusting, kill it with fire.
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Fanboys aren't fond of basic reading comprehension.Read
The
Fucking
Thread
And a lot of people have. It's one of the most aggravating part of this story. The mods are actually selling more copies of their game. Free advertising.Well I won't be buying any take 2 products again anytime soon. I'm willing to give up xcom, civ, and rdr... and I LOVE civ games.
I bought a 2nd copy of GTAV just to play with sp mods
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Glorious clean console where you can mod on PS3 and carry it over to PS4 as an example? Which don't even matter as this is about a SP thing.
I love my clean GTAO on ps4 (so far, fingers crossed but it wouldn't really matter as we're nearing the end if a map expansion isn't coming). Lastgen is a shithole and I wouldn't touch pc with a 10 foot pole either.
They'll sure care lol.
Fuck mods.
SP mods? awesome
I'm playing GTAO on PS4 and it's clean, fair, no bullshit. There are already ten other mod menu's that affect gtao on pc. It's disgusting, kill it with fire.
I agree.
Though I'd call it corporate ballwashing to more luridly express what I think of it.
SP mods? awesome
I'm playing GTAO on PS4 and it's clean, fair, no bullshit. There are already ten other mod menu's that affect gtao on pc. It's disgusting, kill it with fire.
What are user reviews there for in the first place?
are they
a) to register your satisfaction/dissatisfaction to the publisher
or
b) to help your fellow users?
Well I won't be buying any take 2 products again anytime soon. I'm willing to give up xcom, civ, and rdr... and I LOVE civ games.
I bought a 2nd copy of GTAV just to play with sp mods