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Halo |OT5| Believe, Again

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daedalius

Member
Well, running Metroid Prime on Dolphin seems like way too much of a giant pain in the ass for what its worth. You have to have a absolute beast of a CPU to not get slowdown, and even my 2.7ghz Quad-core doesn't seem to be up to the task. I get skipping audio and massive slowdown constantly; and from the Dolphin forums THIS IS NORMAL.

Heck Metroid Prime 3 isn't even playable on Dolphin at all it seems.

I think I'll just keep playing it on my 60" TV and stereo at low-rez...
 

darthbob

Member
Well, running Metroid Prime on Dolphin seems like way too much of a giant pain in the ass for what its worth. You have to have a absolute beast of a CPU to not get slowdown, and even my 2.7ghz Quad-core doesn't seem to be up to the task. I get skipping audio and massive slowdown constantly; and from the Dolphin forums THIS IS NORMAL.

Heck Metroid Prime 3 isn't even playable on Dolphin at all it seems.

I think I'll just keep playing it on my 60" TV and stereo at low-rez...

It takes quite a bit of horsepower to forcibly emulate a custom built CPU.

Hell, even the N64 isn't running at full speed with emulators nowadays, and the Xbox V1? lol, never going to happen.
 

daedalius

Member
It takes quite a bit of horsepower to forcibly emulate a custom built CPU.

Hell, even the N64 isn't running at full speed with emulators nowadays, and the Xbox V1? lol, never going to happen.

Well, it looks great on Dolphin.

Its just mostly/totally unplayable.
 
Some choice sections of Jaime's design presentation:
If you get one thing from me, it’s this:
--
Crank them to 11 Don’t do half measures, if you find something that works, CRANK IT! This is especially true of strength

-- Make everything overpowered If you do this to every part of the game, balance will still be attainable --

To paraphrase The Incredibles… If everything is overpowered, nothing is

Again, you can’t make things too powerful!

God where has this balance philosophy gone?
 

Fuchsdh

Member
It takes quite a bit of horsepower to forcibly emulate a custom built CPU.

Hell, even the N64 isn't running at full speed with emulators nowadays, and the Xbox V1? lol, never going to happen.

Sadly the only decent GameBoy Advance emulator for Macs also causes massive skipping in most ROM audio. I keep getting outbid for the damn cartridges on eBay too. Thank god the original hardware is still solid.
 
Does anyone else want the H4 menu to be an actual .map with a model and a camera than pans through an some sort of landscape or space scene ala H1-H3 as opposed to the picture menus from Reach?
 

Falagard

Member
I don't understand why 343 wants to keep the weapons like DMR and BR at 5 shot kills rather than 4 shots.

It was one of the things that was frustrating about Halo Reach, the fact that it took so many shots to kill someone.

Factor in that lag can cause you to miss kills more often when there are more shots, the fact that previous Halos played fine with less shots, it speeds up the gameplay and the COD audience they're catering to prefers less shots, the decision is mind boggling.

You can argue it takes more skill, but that's not exactly who they're targeting, I think.

You can also tune kill times to be the same as they are now with just less shots required, and if they really wanted to increase required skill levels they could make it so it only kills in 4 shots if X number are headshots.
 

Louis Wu

Member
You're correct, I don't like where the index for aiming in Halo has been set recently. I strongly disagree that making the aiming harder would have an adverse affect on the general populace's enjoyment of the game for a multitude of reasons.
What is your opinion based on? (More simply: why do you think making aiming harder wouldn't decrease enjoyment for the general populace?)
 

daedalius

Member
I don't understand why 343 wants to keep the weapons like DMR and BR at 5 shot kills rather than 4 shots.

It was one of the things that was frustrating about Halo Reach, the fact that it took so many shots to kill someone.

Factor in that lag can cause you to miss kills more often when there are more shots, the fact that previous Halos played fine with less shots, it speeds up the gameplay and the COD audience they're catering to prefers less shots, the decision is mind boggling.

You can argue it takes more skill, but that's not exactly who they're targeting, I think.

You can also tune kill times to be the same as they are now with just less shots required, and if they really wanted to increase required skill levels they could make it so it only kills in 4 shots if X number are headshots.

Guns shoot faster than other Halo games, kill times still being tweaked, etc.

4sk Halo 4 would be the fastest killing BR; maybe not as fast as 3sk H1 pistol though
 

Falagard

Member
Guns shoot faster than other Halo games, kill times still being tweaked, etc.

4sk Halo 4 would be the fastest killing BR; maybe not as fast as 3sk H1 pistol though

Miss the part where I said the kill times could be tuned? This would be done by slowing the rate of fire but increasing the bullet power.
 
Guns shoot faster than other Halo games, kill times still being tweaked, etc.

4sk Halo 4 would be the fastest killing BR; maybe not as fast as 3sk H1 pistol though

Someone did an estimate of kill times based on the videos.
Came out for be ~1.45 for DMR and Carbine, and then 1.8 for BR.
But if the BR was a 4 shot kill, it'd be down to ~1.45 as well.

(Those timings might be off, I didn't do them, but I read them in several places.)
 
Hire Jamie campaign time?
I can get behind this. HIRE JAMIE!
It was one of the things that was frustrating about Halo Reach, the fact that it took so many shots to kill someone.

Not too long ago someone on here measured the amount of time it took to kill someone in Halo 4 and compared it to the kill times across all Halo games. The difference is less than half a second, IIRC. Personally not sure if I have a problem with 4sk compared to a 5sk because everything else about Reach is so slow, so for me, it's a wait and see approach.
 

BigShow36

Member
What is your opinion based on? (More simply: why do you think making aiming harder wouldn't decrease enjoyment for the general populace?)

Because of the fact that every game has had different levels of aim assist. The popularity of the game seems to be in no way correlated to how difficult it is to land shots. I also believe that in a competitive setting, which is what VS matchmaking is, players get enjoyment when they feel they've earned success rather than have it handed to them.

So why not allow the game to have a deeper skill gap, more longevity and allow the matchmaking system to keep players from feeling outclassed?

The lack of difficult aiming is a barrier to long-term, competitive minded players, not new players or players just concerned with having a "fun" time.
 

daedalius

Member
Miss the part where I said the kill times could be tuned? This would be done by slowing the rate of fire but increasing the bullet power.

No, just was re-emphasizing that they have actually said the weapons are still indeed being tweaked.

I'd say the ZBDMR kills pretty damn fast at 5sk. Nothing wrong with 5sk if your gun shoots fast enough.

As for the design decision whether its more skillful to have more shots to kill or less shots to kill; obviously that's a bit different discussion.

Personally, I think more shots in the same amount of time works out to be more skillful.
 

BigShow36

Member
No, just was re-emphasizing that they have actually said the weapons are still indeed being tweaked.

I'd say the ZBDMR kills pretty damn fast at 5sk. Nothing wrong with 5sk if your gun shoots fast enough.

As for the design decision whether its more skillful to have more shots to kill or less shots to kill; obviously that's a bit different discussion.

Personally, I think more shots in the same amount of time works out to be more skillful.

Why not have some variety though? We already have tons of low-damage, high-rof weapons. Why can't the DMR be 3-shot kill with a slower ROF and hard to use while the BR gets a 4sk with comparable a kill time? Wouldn't that add a lot more variety to the loadout theme?

There's nothing inherently wrong with high-rof, low damage precision weapons, but in the context of Halo 4, with the Carbine, Pistol, BR, DMR and Light Rifle, it would make more sense to cover the spectrum.
 

darthbob

Member
why? Remakes are of only good maps. new maps are often garbage.

You can't have a Halo game without new maps. Whether the maps are shitty or god, new maps need to exist so as to fulfill their role.

Plus, we wouldn't have gems like Lockout, The Pit, or Sword Base without these sort of risks.
 

daedalius

Member
Why not have some variety though? We already have tons of low-damage, high-rof weapons. Why can't the DMR be 3-shot kill with a slower ROF and hard to use while the BR gets a 4sk with comparable a kill time? Wouldn't that add a lot more variety to the loadout theme?

That'd be fine with me; just needs to be balanced properly is all.
 

Louis Wu

Member
I also believe that in a competitive setting, which is what VS matchmaking is, players get enjoyment when they feel they've earned success rather than have it handed to them.
This actually made me chuckle.

In every Halo game I've ever played, people are always looking for ways of playing people they can poop on - from deranking in Halo 2, through playing on the guest account when logged in with a second person, to simply suiciding over and over again. It happens all the time. Folks don't WANT a win they've earned - they want to kick some ass.

(The Halo 3 sniper had WAY less aim assist than the Halo 2 sniper. And I know that I, for one, stopped even picking the damn thing up. (It comprised 550 of my nearly 50,000 kills in Matchmaking.) Why? Because it was frustrating to try and get a kill with it. Aim assist is back with a vengeance in Reach, and my use of it is way up, too - 2000 kills (of 45,000 - a nearly fivefold increase).)

Anectodal evidence? Yep. But I bet it's way more common than yours.
 

Falagard

Member
I'd say the ZBDMR kills pretty damn fast at 5sk. Nothing wrong with 5sk if your gun shoots fast enough.

...

Personally, I think more shots in the same amount of time works out to be more skillful.

I disagree.

I think the time to kill is important (if it's within 1/2 second of Halo 2 or 3 then great) but kill time is not everything.

I think more shots in the same amount of time takes more skill. I also think it means that there's more chance for the player being attacked to dodge at least one of those shots, or that lag can come into play and make you miss shots more frequently than with 4 shot kills.

Now, I like the skill based play of Halo, but more skill does not equate to more fun. Taking 7 shots to kill a player would take more skill, but does not make it more fun.

I think that 4 shots is the sweet spot, and was proven to be fun in Halo 2 and Halo 3.
 

Overdoziz

Banned
You can't have a Halo game without new maps. Whether the maps are shitty or god, new maps need to exist so as to fulfill their role.

Plus, we wouldn't have gems like Lockout, The Pit, or Sword Base without these sort of risks.
Please make your bait attempts a bit less obvious next time, thanks in advance.
 

Falagard

Member
Posted on new page, because I'm egotistical:

I'd say the ZBDMR kills pretty damn fast at 5sk. Nothing wrong with 5sk if your gun shoots fast enough.

...

Personally, I think more shots in the same amount of time works out to be more skillful.

I disagree.

I think the time to kill is important (if it's within 1/2 second of Halo 2 or 3 then great) but kill time is not everything.

I think more shots in the same amount of time takes more skill. I also think it means that there's more chance for the player being attacked to dodge at least one of those shots, or that lag can come into play and make you miss shots more frequently than with 4 shot kills.

Now, I like the skill based play of Halo, but more skill does not equate to more fun. Taking 7 shots to kill a player would take more skill, but does not make it more fun.

I think that 4 shots is the sweet spot, and was proven to be fun in Halo 2 and Halo 3.

This actually made me chuckle.

In every Halo game I've ever played, people are always looking for ways of playing people they can poop on - from deranking in Halo 2, through playing on the guest account when logged in with a second person, to simply suiciding over and over again. It happens all the time. Folks don't WANT a win they've earned - they want to kick some ass.

(The Halo 3 sniper had WAY less aim assist than the Halo 2 sniper. And I know that I, for one, stopped even picking the damn thing up. (It comprised 550 of my nearly 50,000 kills in Matchmaking.) Why? Because it was frustrating to try and get a kill with it. Aim assist is back with a vengeance in Reach, and my use of it is way up, too - 2000 kills (of 45,000 - a nearly fivefold increase).)

Anectodal evidence? Yep. But I bet it's way more common than yours.

I agree with everything in this post. There's a sweet spot, for sure. People might want to be able to kill others easily, but they don't like being killed themselves too easily. If the sniper had super auto-aim then when someone picked it up, you'd get destroyed with no chance of picking it up yourself. But if there's a balance, then I think that having some auto-aim on the Sniper is better than having none or very little.
 

Karl2177

Member
This actually made me chuckle.

In every Halo game I've ever played, people are always looking for ways of playing people they can poop on - from deranking in Halo 2, through playing on the guest account when logged in with a second person, to simply suiciding over and over again. It happens all the time. Folks don't WANT a win they've earned - they want to kick some ass.

(The Halo 3 sniper had WAY less aim assist than the Halo 2 sniper. And I know that I, for one, stopped even picking the damn thing up. (It comprised 550 of my nearly 50,000 kills in Matchmaking.) Why? Because it was frustrating to try and get a kill with it. Aim assist is back with a vengeance in Reach, and my use of it is way up, too - 2000 kills (of 45,000 - a nearly fivefold increase).)

Anectodal evidence? Yep. But I bet it's way more common than yours.
Louis pls
 

Risen

Member
This actually made me chuckle.

In every Halo game I've ever played, people are always looking for ways of playing people they can poop on - from deranking in Halo 2, through playing on the guest account when logged in with a second person, to simply suiciding over and over again. It happens all the time. Folks don't WANT a win they've earned - they want to kick some ass.

(The Halo 3 sniper had WAY less aim assist than the Halo 2 sniper. And I know that I, for one, stopped even picking the damn thing up. (It comprised 550 of my nearly 50,000 kills in Matchmaking.) Why? Because it was frustrating to try and get a kill with it. Aim assist is back with a vengeance in Reach, and my use of it is way up, too - 2000 kills (of 45,000 - a nearly fivefold increase).)

Anectodal evidence? Yep. But I bet it's way more common than yours.

Wu... he said "I also believe that in a competitive setting, which is what VS matchmaking is, players get enjoyment when they feel they've earned success rather than have it handed to them."

That does not exist to the exclusion of all else. Your example does not negate his statement. Everyone playing wants to "kick some ass", and many don't want a difficult match at all - true. Many... even if you said MOST love kicking ass, as you say - this doesn't mean folks don't get enjoyment by earning their success.

One can both like instant and easy gratification and enjoy earning success.

If matchmaking worked well, and you were in a room full of "you's" would you have stopped picking up the sniper? In that room full of "you's", I bet you would have had more success, which would mean you pick it up more.
 
Here's an idea: How about all-new maps that are good instead of retreading old grounds that weren't built with AAs in mind?

because that worked out so well with Reach.

He's saying that since you mentioned all remakes are good and new maps are crap, that we should only have remakes

I said new maps are often garbage, which in recent Halo (Reach) is true. I never said all new maps are bad. All maps were new once.
 
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