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Hideki Kamiya: "Multiple publishers turned down Bayonetta 2"
- Thread starter Zalman
- Start date
Can't wait to play this game!!!!
It's his opinion! Why do you have to bring up console wars? Leave it be.
Is your avatar a console warrior?
It's his opinion! Why do you have to bring up console wars? Leave it be.
Astral Dog
Member
Oh, im sure some will say that Kamiya lied, Platinum didnt put enough effor for their fans, or that Nintendo are stupid for publishing this niche game, whatever, its what it is, i hope Scalebound does better,and im sure there awill be more next gen games from them anyways, but many will be bashing Platinum for working with MS too.
James Scott
Banned
Please don't bring in games like TLOU, Tomb Raider, etc into the conversation. They have nothing to do with the topic and will only sour the thread further by making people upset.
A couple things I feel are worth mentioning: The Wii U is not an expensive investment, it's just not. It's the cheapest of the 3 by a wide margin so it's not like PG/Nintendo is "forcing" you to buy the most expensive console you weren't interested in just to continue the franchise.
The Wii U is also not a piece of trash that's not worth buying for anything more than 200 bucks. It's a fine system that does what it does well and all version are bundled in with a game. It likely won't be "spending 360 for just one game" if you look well. If you are a fan of Bayonetta, you'll likely enjoy the wonderful action game: The Wonderful 101 which is like 20 bucks on amazon. If you're open enough to enjoy gameplay focused action games you'll likely find a lot of stuff from Nintendo to enjoy as well like the recently released Hyrule Warriors and 3D World.
I've become a pretty big fan of PG over the years with the fantastic Vanquish and Bayonetta 1 on the 360, even madworld on the Wii was pretty fun, and I'm personally very excited for Bayonetta 2. Looks like it's going to be an amazing game and I hope you guys try it out.
I get why some people are upset, but I'd just be happy that the series is continuing. I know this pretty well being a KH fan having to buy a ton of different platforms to stay up to date. I had no interest in buying a PSP, but KHBBS came out and I gave in, it turned out to be my favorite platform last gen with a lot of variety, maybe some of you will get the same experience of what is my current favorite platform of this generation.
A couple things I feel are worth mentioning: The Wii U is not an expensive investment, it's just not. It's the cheapest of the 3 by a wide margin so it's not like PG/Nintendo is "forcing" you to buy the most expensive console you weren't interested in just to continue the franchise.
The Wii U is also not a piece of trash that's not worth buying for anything more than 200 bucks. It's a fine system that does what it does well and all version are bundled in with a game. It likely won't be "spending 360 for just one game" if you look well. If you are a fan of Bayonetta, you'll likely enjoy the wonderful action game: The Wonderful 101 which is like 20 bucks on amazon. If you're open enough to enjoy gameplay focused action games you'll likely find a lot of stuff from Nintendo to enjoy as well like the recently released Hyrule Warriors and 3D World.
you can probably get W101, 3D World, Nintendo land, Bayonetta 1, Hyrule Warriors, and Bayonetta 2 for less than the price of a fully functional X1/PS4+1 game without looking too hard
I get why some people are upset, but I'd just be happy that the series is continuing. I know this pretty well being a KH fan having to buy a ton of different platforms to stay up to date. I had no interest in buying a PSP, but KHBBS came out and I gave in, it turned out to be my favorite platform last gen with a lot of variety, maybe some of you will get the same experience of what is my current favorite platform of this generation.
Really great controller. The battery life is insane, and it's really comfortable. The triggers don't feel great, but they are responsive. Glad I bought 4 of them when they were 20 bucks each before anyone wanted them.
Is your avatar a console warrior?
All that is totally subjective, so it makes no sense debating, but if you ask me, my personal honest opinion is that right now it does.
This time next year, with Sunset Overdrive, Halo MCC and 5 (hopefully), Phantom Dust and Scalebound (hopefully), Bloodborne, Persona 5, MGSV:TPP, Deep Down (hopefully), The Evil Within, and all the upcoming Nintendo games, we'll have a real debate about which platform has the best games.
Ofc, the winners will always be those who game on all platforms.
It is a sad thing, but there is just not a lot of interest in the series. It has always been a niche title. For the people that dig this niche it is one of the best things ever, however. So I am happy that the fans get a sequel. But even multiplat this title would not have done much I am afraid, like most Platinum titles. I can understand that publishers did not want to invest in this series, regardless of the quality. I do not think it will do much for Nintendo either, but I would not mind being proved wrong at all.
I can understand why they choosed PSP to keep costs down. That's unfortunate, but better than nothing. There was some
Still, beside the platform change... In Valkyria Chronicles 2:
- the technology tree is just plain stupid: you need more than one hundred hours farming missions including tutorial ones just to gather enough randomly dropped materials to unlock the whole thing. It wouldn't have been so bad (90% of the tree is just useless) if they hadn't lock a character behind unlocking 100% of the game
- there's as much good things as bad things with the new system, many improvements but many broken mechanics at the same time (some classes can be as much broken as Alicia in the first one, such as fencer with 2x 2x mouvement)
- the story is... strange, especially the classroom bit, and I can understand why many were disappointed by the settings
and the didn't even bother releasing Valkiria Chronicles 3 outside of Japan, and didn't developped it in-house either (maybe for the best, seeing VC2)
It could have been a great game on PSP or elsewhere, but it's a real waste of a license overall (and that come from a big fan of both the Valkyria games and the teams behind it)
Pro controller is godlike. I need to get mine working on my PC. Gamepad can be uncomfortable to use for long periods with certain genres - W101 was fine for some reason. Maybe because the constant shape drawing let my hands rest a bit, even though for most shapes I used the right stick.
it wouldn't be any deader than it was before
it wouldn't be any deader than it was before
Salt?
I bought a WiiU because of this and The Wonderful 101. Any games on top of that was just extra goodness.
As evidenced by this very thread, yes. People are still saying that somehow Bayonetta 2 bombing on the WiiU is worse for the franchise than there being no Bayonetta 2, and will somehow "kill it".
timetokill
Banned
I love that this game exists. Thank you Nintendo, thank you Platinum.
I've said it before but it's a shame there aren't more Platinum fans, but it is what it is. In the meantime the rest of us will be enjoying a stellar game.
I'm not sure what's more ridiculous to me, though -- the fact that these threads keep getting dozens of pages, that Kamiya is still getting boneheaded gamers demanding ports on twitter, or that people think that the Wii U doesn't have enough fantastic games to justify a purchase along with Bayo2.
I've said it before but it's a shame there aren't more Platinum fans, but it is what it is. In the meantime the rest of us will be enjoying a stellar game.
I'm not sure what's more ridiculous to me, though -- the fact that these threads keep getting dozens of pages, that Kamiya is still getting boneheaded gamers demanding ports on twitter, or that people think that the Wii U doesn't have enough fantastic games to justify a purchase along with Bayo2.
Astral Dog
Member
I think it would be very stupid to divulge that information anyways.
If you liked Bayo 1 story, you are going to like this, the cutscenes look a lot better too, and more are animated,the dialogue is awesome, what i didnt like were some voice changes and a so so main antagonist.
But you know, not any videogame story can be Destiny.
I dare to bet that most Nintendo users that dwell on forums and other dedicated gaming sites do buy these games, but that they are a minority, and the rest are more casual Nintendo gamers that only buy and play more known Nintendo franchises and IPs
Oh yes, i can agree with that. But even among those 'internet dwellers' there are enough that don't though.
Astral Dog
Member
I think its because the Wii U is a machine that doesnt cater to their tastes,isnt cool, only has shitty kid friendly games, etc.it would be good if more high quality family games were sold to hardcore gamers (like Zelda, Mario,Splatoon,Donkey Kong,Pikmin 3, Kid icarus,Wonderful 101,etc.) but, they arent willing to even buy their systems.
On the other hand, the Wii U is too hardcore for the families, so it doesnt really have an useful userbase, part of the blame lies on Nintendo and clearly something went wrong, but thats another already discussed topic.
Just think about of which demographic the majority of Wii U owners belong to. It's families and casual gamers of which a lot were on the Wii and are now on nothing worth being called a proper gaming platform. The so-called "Nintendo fans" are just a little minority and probably only a part of them deserve the name. The rest of them are the only ones with a broad enough taste to not miss out on exclusive Wii U games and are wlling to invest in them.
Quite sad because that means there is no real market for gamers that like variety and simply good games. Sucks for such gamers that are broke or have intolerant parents, though.
Really?
I think the Wii U owners are mostly hardcore Nintendo fans.
If families and casual gamers were coming from the Wii and found the Wii U appealing then it should have reflected a lot more sales.
Slightly offtopic
Aren't some of you kind of missing the point regarding each other's argument?
Every time the "Bayo 2 is on Wii U because Nintendo pulled it out of an early grave" topic turns up it's always a debate between one group saying they just won't buy a console just for one game and another saying there are a lot of good games available on the system. In other words, they don't understand this the Wii U has no good games I want apart from Bayo 2. Honestely, some folks just don't like Nintendo games enough to warrant a Wii U purchase. I understand.
On the other hand, some people go on the offensive when some posters honestly think that the Wii U is a better system than PS4 or Xbone. Hmmm.
oh uh carry on
Aren't some of you kind of missing the point regarding each other's argument?
Every time the "Bayo 2 is on Wii U because Nintendo pulled it out of an early grave" topic turns up it's always a debate between one group saying they just won't buy a console just for one game and another saying there are a lot of good games available on the system. In other words, they don't understand this the Wii U has no good games I want apart from Bayo 2. Honestely, some folks just don't like Nintendo games enough to warrant a Wii U purchase. I understand.
On the other hand, some people go on the offensive when some posters honestly think that the Wii U is a better system than PS4 or Xbone. Hmmm.
oh uh carry on
Agree with this. The owners of Wii U also owned NES, SNES, and N64. The casual Wii owners have not purchased Wii U.
I partly agree. I don't know about 'hardcore Nintendo fans', I'd say more like fans of mechanically heavy games and mostly old enough to come from a mechanically heavy background.
I agree that the casuals have mostly abandoned the brand. And that's why Nintendo should throw some weight on these types of gameplay heavy experiences, without losing the colorful and/or lighthearted artistically brand signature. I even think that's what they do for a year or so now.
I'll be honest, it makes me chuckle reading bitter people whining about Bayonetta 2. Guys, exclusives happen, platform jumps happen, it's time you learn to live with it. I want to play Killer Instinct, but not enough to buy a XB1. I haven't whined even once that I supported the series on SNES and N64, and I have never port begged. By going Nintendo + Sony + PC I have way more games than I can possibly play anyway, lol.
As I said most of them left Nintendo and play where the current mainstream is. They play games because all others play them, that's the definition of mainstream. Hardcore Nintendo fans? W101 is a Nintendo game and it bombed. Donkey Kong bombed. The games that sell better are also more mainstream.
If they actually did their jobs marketing the game, they'd probably do better. Let's not get it twisted, Platinum's two last publishers were Sega and Konami, both of which are NOTORIOUSLY bad at marketing their games outside of japan, and in Japan, Sega basically relied on softcore nudity for their non-digital push of Bayonetta 2.
I hate to say it, but if they teamed with EA or Activision, or even Ubisoft, they'd have a much better chance over here. But Japanese publishers these days don't give a fuck as long as the game does well domestically, so Bayo's first week sales are probably going to be a pretty good indicator on what Nintendo uses to push the game over here.
I mean, by this logic, the only mainstream game that's come out this console generation is Destiny.
I'd fall into that category. Not particularly fond of most major Nintendo games, but I am fond of certain game play mechanics that I find lacking in the other consoles' offerings.
My Bayonetta's preordered and I swear I'll only play Fantasy Life when I'm not home.
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
So he can keep it to his/herself then. You tell me what it adds to a discussion about Bayonetta since you rushed to defend it.
I agree that Sega is completelly useless and Nintendo should change their marketing department from the ground up.
But tbh, i don't believe PG are marketed better by others either. Activision does a lousy job as well, and Korra is out in 20 days with very little hype. Not to mention that we are talking about a popular animation series.
Me too, i'm over 30 and i prefer more complex games now than ever. The Wii era was the worst Nintendo period for me.
And from Nintendo, i prefer the Smash, and the Pikmin, and the Sin and Punishment, and Kid Icarus than the superhits. I like those too, and i consider myself a Zelda fan tbf, but i want Nintendo to be wealthy so they can release more of the less known games.
Maybe that was a bit too simple. But you know that people by nature follow existing paths and where other people are. This even happens when they've already specialized in their own interests.
W101 was a niche game so that isn't surprising but Tropical Freeze bombed as well?...
Nintendo's in a tough spot then since I don't see any Wii U game in 2015 other than Zelda U having the same pull as Mario Kart and Smash Bros.
If they really push, maybe Splatoon will have a chance?
I sort of understand Korra as that entire property is about to shut down. I know that the word inside is that they're right where they want to be and they're perfectly happy to have been delgated to online only status, but seriously, Korra is dead, Avatar is probably dead, so marketing things related to it that were clearly penned years ago is probably the last thing on activision's mind. And this thing is supposed to be episodic?
::Shakes head:: I will buy this shit out of it, I have no hope for it. The red tape surrounding the Avatar property is going to sink that game.
If they don't push Splatoon, they should just shut it all down until their next console. That game NEEDS to be successful.
Yeah, I think so, at least it didn't do very well. W101 on the other hand is an interesting case since it would be what I'd imagine a Nintendo advocate to be proud of since it's exclusive and as hardcore as it gets.
W101 is hardcore in a way that most gamers don't want, though.
It has deep gameplay mechanics thay reward skill and cunning.
Unlike most "hardcore" games that just slap rewards on to pressing random buttons to kill people that most gamers seem to like.
ArtHands
Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
It certainly sucks that quality isn't rewarded, and its all about who has the best marketing presence and exposure.
Yeah these things happen, no use getting worked up about it. The worst example of that was if like me you were a Sega fan in the transition from Dreamcast to multi-platform. If you liked their games you would had to have bought FOUR different consoles in a short space of time and I actually did so as well(heck its 6 if you count handhelds). Though it did help that it was by far the cheapest generation to do that, in the UK at least. Gamecube launched at a puny £130 and Xbox had a sizable price cut early on.
I'm a bit more careful with my spending these days though..
In fact, if you look at Nintendo's yearly financial breakdowns, they have a large mass of late 20s to early 40s system owners. This correlates to their NES/SNES heydey, and it implies that they do have a "hardcore" fanbase.
I'm not going to go dig up the documentation, as I'm busy studying at the moment, but they are out there.
I can ubisoft funding them to make a AssCreed cuhrayzee
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
Oddly enough, in my personal experience there often seems to be something to "Nintendo fans only buy Nintendo games". I've dealt with a number of adult Nintendo fans during the Wii era - and now 3 or 4 with the Wii U - who pretty much would not touch anything that wasn't Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Smash Bros., and Pokemon.
To me it seems there are two kinds of people at work here. Those who own Nintendo consoles because they are enthusiasts of traditional and especially Japanese games. And Nintendo happens to still make those games at a high level of quality. Then there are those who are "hardcore" strictly for a handful of Nintendo IP and play nothing but Mario, etc.
Stuff like The Wonderful 101 and Bayonetta are key titles to get the former sort of game player to pick up a Nintendo console. But the latter sort of Nintendo owner may not do such titles any favors even if in theory they are in the right demographic and age range. (30-40, plays action games, likes retro stuff, etc)
To me it seems there are two kinds of people at work here. Those who own Nintendo consoles because they are enthusiasts of traditional and especially Japanese games. And Nintendo happens to still make those games at a high level of quality. Then there are those who are "hardcore" strictly for a handful of Nintendo IP and play nothing but Mario, etc.
Stuff like The Wonderful 101 and Bayonetta are key titles to get the former sort of game player to pick up a Nintendo console. But the latter sort of Nintendo owner may not do such titles any favors even if in theory they are in the right demographic and age range. (30-40, plays action games, likes retro stuff, etc)
friskykillface
Banned
It does.
I own every system and if you look at exclusives (don't count titles that are on PC like a lot of indie/downloadable games ) it's better , but that's cause both those systems are still starting out
It'll change next year though but wii u has had a ton of great games that have made the system worth owning
This is all imo of course so you might not agree and that's fine
If you don't believe me I'll take a pic of every current gen system I own.
Again, thank you Nintendo
JumpJeff84
Member
How big is Platinum as a developer? In terms of number of employees, etc.
Any idea the budget of Bayonetta? Or the sequel?
Any idea the budget of Bayonetta? Or the sequel?
Ive been hearing this one for the least four years, and people still say this even when they are currently working with Nintendo, Microsoft and Activision.
Back in July they had 171 employees. They're always hiring I hear.
Sega never gave a number.
And Nintendo never gives budget numbers (Mario, Smash, Zelda, both of their Platinum titles, Donkey Kong, no numbers)
NoirVisage
Banned
As I understand it, they never shopped it to either of them. They were shopping it to well known 3rd party publishers as per usual, theu do this to ensure multiplatform release, I'm sure MS would have swooped them up if they'd been contacted directly, same with Sony. Nintendo's situation with Bayonetta 2 is more of an inside deal than anything else, some9ne got on the horn and deals were made, the other 2 didn't even know it existed until it was announced.
timetokill
Banned
That seems unlikely. Source?
NoirVisage
Banned
Why does it seem unlikely? They've never been a console specific outfit, not being exclusive made things easier yet quality suffered a bit..that all changed with bayonetta 2 (and wonderful 101 once B2 was secured) it opened up a new world to them ,even if Bayonetta 2 bombs they're straight and now they've got deals with MS first with scalebound. Even if that bombs they'll be straight.