Bobby Roberts
Banned
Speaking of Daisy's performance, I swear to you that right after Finn is all "I'm with the resistance" her next line is her trying (and almost failing) to not blow the take.
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Honest Trailer: The Force Awakens
- Thread starter Vault Dweller 111
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Revenge of the Sith confirmed better than A Fistful of Dollars.
PeskyToaster
Member
Shit, they didn't even wait to get their talking points from lame ass YouTube videos. We've crossed a line folks. And there's no going back.
QuantumZebra
Member
Sergio Leone's pale plagiarism of Kurosawa's Yojimbo can't hold a candle to George Lucas's creative masterpiece.
I'm okay with it being in the top 3 Star Wars films next to RoTS
killertofu
Member
They make good points
Vault Dweller 111
Member
I think we should just be grateful that the internet wasn't around when the OT came out.
Preach
Trickster
Member
Was he meant to make the movie less enjoyable then? Because that's the effect his character has for me. I might enjoy his character more in the sequels if he turns proper badass Sith Lord, but in the TFA, out side of a couple of scenes ( like stopping blaster shots mid air ), dude is lame and dumb.
And saying he's better than another shit character is not really much of an accomplishment.
Edit - I didn't mean I wanted Kylo Ren to be a likabe character. However I want him to be a character I like to see. You know, like Joffrey from GoT, that kind of "like".
QuantumZebra
Member
If I wasn't at work I'd probably be vomiting everywhere at this point. I should bail on this thread before I end up in the hospital.
It sounds like you want a brooding bad ass Sith Lord as the main villain...
... I wonder where one could find one of those...
...hmmm
then TFA really would be ANH remade
Kylo Ren > Episode 4 Vader
brandonh83
Banned
I also don't think it's fair to judge a character arc in the first part, but heyyyy
Pretty sure in VIII and IX she'll be made more vulnerable with more flaws unearthed. The movie is called The Force Awakens and refers to her finding the Force within her as all of these events transpire, so it is about her being "awesome." Abrams also said that the title refers to the dark side awakening in Kylo, which is interesting. So now you have a hero and a villain both discovering something in relative ways which I think is a fantastic juxtaposition for this type of story. Seeing them grow together as hero and villain is unique to the series.
Rey was total boss in this movie, and I think it's to provide some contrast to the conflicts and trials the story will put in front of her going on. Like you said, Luke was the same way in ANH, but in ESB that Skywalker recklessness came into play full-force and it was all about Luke having to make decisions that can alter fates and Yoda trying to temper him knowing full well the blood in him and not wanting to repeat mistakes.
I'm just saying in a multi-part series you have to see the big picture. Calling Rey a Mary Sue from one part and not knowing the rest makes all of no fucking sense to me.
Vault Dweller 111
Member
Easily.
Let's not get carried away (it being next to RotS) but people are acting like they don't realize this is the best Star Wars movie that's been made since 1980.
I will say RotS > RotJ as well, I'm not sure why that's controversial though. TPM/AOTC are hot garbage though.
QuantumZebra
Member
Undoubtedly.
For me it is:
1. Empire
2. TFA
3. ANH
4. RotJ
5. Guardians of the Galaxy
Preach
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Because the original Trilogy has the benefit of nostalgia behind it. Actual answer.
Pop-O-Matic
Banned
Luke had a penis, so it made it all OK.
RoTJ is Episode 1 quality of a movie. Come at me hatets
Even joking about that physically hurt me.
WadiumArcadium
Member
Yeah, I'd put it in third.
Because it's wrong.
ROTS has nothing that even remotely hits the level of this scene.
All of the Vader/Luke/Palpatine segments in Jedi are some of the best moments in the entire franchise.
Vault Dweller 111
Member
You may have an argument. But the third act of ROTJ is just too good.
Edit: Dude above me nailed it
BigBossVanzetti
Member
Not very funny. The movie wasn't that great either.
CapitalismSucks DonkeyBalls
Banned
QuantumZebra
Member
Because it's wrong.
ROTS has nothing that even remotely hits the level of this scene.
All of the Vader/Luke/Palpatine segments in Jedi are some of the best moments in the entire franchise.
Yup. Third act of ROTJ is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The PT
Reference my post on page 1 about this thread becoming a garbage fire by the end of page 2.
The stuff I'm reading here is actually hurting me mentally (and possibly physically).
brandonh83
Banned
This, and they've been out for so long that so many people were able to see Luke's growth without having to wait years between installments. If you'd just seen ANH in '77 and if the internet as well as Max Landis existed along with all the other Max Landii, the same shit would be said about Luke-- a farmboy that discovers the Force and blows up the Empire's moon-sized superweapon in the span of 2 hours.
NHarmonic.
Member
Great, specially agree about Oscar Isaac.
Say: "Hello Sweetie"? I dunno.
I'm not sure I've ever seen a Mary Sue, I don't read fan-fiction ;P
super-heated plasma
Member
"Diet Spielberg." lol
I basically agree with this. Those movies represent the peak of Star Wars' popularity, but also led to enabling the outlandish and puzzling choices that plagued the PT overall.
RoTJ got a free pass because the first 2 movies were so good. Likewise, TPM and AOTC were so poor that RotS never had a chance. It's not Shakespeare, but it's a better conclusion to a trilogy than RotJ was.
TFA is a deliberate pastiche of the entire OT, if you think its just a "ANH ripoff" you weren't paying attention. The first line in the movie is "this will begin to make things right" said by a guy who's name is basically "Movie Without CGI" in Star Wars-ese.
An OT pastiche is what was needed to get the faithful back under the tent, they can break some new ground next time.
It was indeed, and one of the reasons the original film is so mediocre. And I suspect that Abrams cast Ridley to have just that same kind of wide-eyed newcomer effect that Hamill had. But I found Ridley far worse than Hamill.
I thought she gave the worst performance I've seen in a movie for years. Her reactions were ludicrously over-exaggerated, her mouth seemed to be constantly hanging open, she had no chemistry with the two people who mattered (Finn and Han) and I thought both those guys were trying their arses off, to be honest.
I mean, I was watching this thing and thinking 'this is setting everything up for a Finn-Rey romance but I can't tell because I can't read Ridley at all'. I had no idea what she was trying to portray half the time. She was diabolical. Granted, Rey herself is just an atrocious character, but still.
Kill her off at the start of the second one and let Poe take her place as Finn's partner.
Can we not do this? Please?
Luke really taps into the Force, like, once to concentrate and blow up the Death Star in ANH? And I guess to block the probe attacks blindfolded?
Meanwhile Rey demonstrates instant mastery of persuasion, mind-reading prowess against a Force user, Force "pulling," and swordfighting against a dark-sider?
Their gun-fighting skills are so-so and they're both pretty good pilots, so that's a wash. So how is Luke "more of a Mary Sue" than Rey?
EDIT: I should note that I don't really care for the term Mary Sue or find it all that applicable to either character in the first place, but casually bringing sexism or nostalgia into nonsensical arguments isn't all that smart.
QuantumZebra
Member
Luke had a penis tho so its totally cool and logical
the mary sue shit is so awfully misplaced and nonsensical, but I should expect nothing less from internet denizens complaining about Star Wars, I guess
Really?
A few hours into TFA and Rey almost crashes the Falcon running from TIE fighters, and shortly thereafter is running away from her destiny as fast as possible
A few hours into ANH and Luke has learned to block lasers while blindfolded, and shortly thereafter blows up a space station without a targeting computer
Unspeakable Evil
Member
MaRey Sue....
Episode 8 can't come soon enough
Episode 8 can't come soon enough
Revenge might be the worst pos movie I have ever seen. Like a C movie with a ridiculous budget.
Force awakens is miles better than that shit film.
Trickster
Member
I mean, I just mentioned Kylo Ren. Do you really wanna get into the debate about how TFA is just a carbon copy of ANH that panders to the fanbase by filling the movie with a ridiculous and pointless amount of nostalgia?
I don't, to lazy, but I'm right so let's just say I win that debate
Davey Cakes
Member
I disagree about it being forgettable. Then again, I saw it twice and actually appreciated certain things more the second time.
In today's movie climate, it's really hard for anything to resonate as much as it would have back when I was a kid. Nothing will match growing up with Star Wars VHS box set. I loved those movies. I loved The Force Awakens, but with the internet, social media, and access to so many opinions, it's hard for the movie to have the same sort of impact.
Still, I will NOT let the internet try to turn me against TFA. I legitimately had an awesome time sitting through it twice in the theaters, both 3D and not, and I was so happy that it lived up to my expectations, which were pretty high in the first place. It's not perfect but Star Wars never was.
breadtruck
Member
Not their best, but some of that was pretty funny. I got a kick out of the Plinkett cameo.
QuantumZebra
Member
That's what blows my mind about all this.
We finally get a worthy Star Wars film, one that clearly hit all the right notes (3rd highest film ever WW, #1 domestically, and 90+ RT score); and we have people saying its worse than The Phantom Menace.
itslikeimtakingcrazypills.gif
I can do this too.
Luke had to have his ass bailed out by Han in the Death Star's trench at the end; otherwise, he was toast. That is a little different than Rey being slightly incompetent 1/3 of the way through the film.
Kylo Ren is the best part of TFA, whether you consider him a 'little Bitch' or not he was at least incredibly engaging as a character. I'm hoping Rey gets fucked up or something in the 2nd movie as she's dull as dishwater at the moment. A second viewing of the movie cemented that for me.
TAJ
Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
He was pretty good in the OT. A lot of the minor characters, though... woof.
QuantumZebra
Member
And Rey had to have her ass bailed out by fighting a grievously wounded Kylo Ren that had already fought Finn to boot. See where this is going?
neither of them are Mary Sues... and the term itself is fucking terrible to begin with... but Anakin in the PT was definitely a Mary Sue... lol
They practically had an airplane flying a banner that says "The bowcaster just fucks shit up all day" through the movie, and people still completely discount its effect on Kylo at the end
Didn't the movie give you all the information you needed to understand why these things happened? Rey was being trained by Luke early in life, had her memories suppressed and Kylo Ren took a shot from Chewie's bowcaster.
This actually leads to my only actual complaint about the movie - it spends too much time talking up how awesome the bowcaster is. Maybe I'm wrong about it being too much because the 3 references to it being OP still goes over other peoples heads with regard to it weakening Kylo Ren.
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