Support NeoGAF

[Kevtones]

Beautifully boring.



The recent Zelda vs. HZD thread caught my eye because it revealed the difference in playability between the two. HZD felt so stratified and iterative compared to Zelda which was way uglier and also way more interesting.


If Zelda felt like a game, HZD felt like a procedure.

 

[ultratruman]

Animal hunting in Shadow? You mean shooting the birds and spiders?

There are huge, rideable bull things on the second map.

 

[DangerMouse]

It's real easy to tell who has been following the game and who hasn't.

Yup.

 

[cheesekao]

I think that the parallels are obvious. Both games feature these wide open landscapes, both have stealthbushes, both have animal hunting/riding, both have a huge emphasis on bow combat, both at least so far seem to be rather light on story /quality sidestuff (given that they didn't show anything in that regard other than climbing walking towers and talking about creating your own generic resourcequests, it doesnt fill me with confidence).

First of all, you use the sword a lot in Mordor.

Secondly, sure, you can say that but all you're doing is being reductive. I can boil God of War down to it's basics. Linear levels, combo centric melee combat and puzzles. I can also say the same for Devil May Cry. Does that mean both games are similar beyond their surface? If you say yes then I have nothing more to say to you.

 

[xxracerxx]

There are huge, rideable bull things on the second map.

I know about riding the animals, but hunting? I wouldn't compare the two games with hunting.

 

[Vanadium]

I know so little of the game other than to be intrigued. Hard to be disappointed when I have no real expectation at all.

 

[Floody]

I'm surprised at the Shadow of Mordor compassions, I got far more Far Cry 3 vibes than that, and that mostly just comes from the animals. I remember SoM just being a good AssCreed game with the Nemesis System and far better combat.

 

[SolidSnakex]

It's real easy to tell who has been following the game and who hasn't.

The same thing regularly happens with Days Gone. You know they haven't bothered to do any research on it the moment that they mention TLoU.

 

[Guymelef]

I remember another thread like this some time ago, right?

 

[Dalibor68]

I remember another thread like this some time ago, right?

People have become more skeptical since the ubi-tower-dino at E3 I think, at least thats my observation.

 

[kobu]

it's almost like some people want this game to be bad and fail.

 

[kyser73]

Speak for yourself.

Hold on, are you the forestgate guy?

From an earlier H:ZD thread where someone went off on one about arboreal density?

That was some top concern.

 

[Triggerhappytel]

No, there has been tons more gameplay for Horizon than Mass Effect Andromeda. That's a really odd thing to say because it's objectively false.

Hold on, are you the forestgate guy?

From an earlier H:ZD thread where someone went off on one about arboreal density?

That was some top concern.

Yo, the #concern is real. #notallforests

 

[Dalibor68]

Hold on, are you the forestgate guy?

From an earlier H:ZD thread where someone went off on one about arboreal density?

That was some top concern.

Forestgate is not my word, but yes, I'm still waiting for actual gameplay showing off venturing through those dense forests / jungles.

 

[Neoleo2143]

Combat looks great in this game. The options the player has look substantial enough to be interesting throughout (I'm still not sure about on the fly crafting, I feel it can take away from scrappy feeling that these fights should have, lands a bit too close to far cry for my tastes) I'm not sure about the rest though. Stealth looks really simple that it looks a tad overpowered in most generic encounters (especially since the sneak attack both consumes no resources and deals major damage), they even give the patrol paths, enemy weakpoints and elemental weaknesses away with how quick and simple scanning is (which is my main issue with the enemy design in this game which is otherwise interesting, there's a lack of encouraging experimentation, you'll know what works and what doesn't because the game outright tells you and there's likely no way to infer otherwise). Climbing or "platforming" is like Uncharted or recent AC which means it's below mediocre at best. There's not enough to say about exploration.

Combat has to be nailed because I don't think much of the other mechanics have that much depth or challenge to them.

 

[xxracerxx]

Forestgate is not my word, but yes, I'm still waiting for actual gameplay showing off venturing through those dense forests / jungles.

What if there is none of that?

 

[Floody]

Forestgate is not my word, but yes, I'm still waiting for actual gameplay showing off venturing through those dense forests / jungles.

There's some in the PSX trailer.
Edit : this one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMKAdNWv9xA not a lot though, but it looks pretty dense.

 

[kyser73]

From the little I've played and the plenty I've seen I have no worries about the gameplay being good and trust GG to release it mostly bug free. My only worry is the story, it was Killzones biggest weakness (made even worse by that series having really good lore that GG was never able to use well in game) and I can see Horizon going either way.
Also, if anything they've shown too much, you've definitely been out the loop, what they showed at PSX even annoyed me as it was completely unnecessary and possibly a big spoiler. For those unsure what I'm referring too

Spoiler

they quickly teased the inside of the planet and it was all machine

Spoiler

It could be considered a spoiler if a hadn't already seen it hinted at in the first trailer when Aloy opens up the hatch. Personally it's made me more interested because that *could* be a dungeon entrance or something similar. Definitely points to how the Machines remake themselves though - the crabbots collect old bits of downed robot, carry them into the caves/underground factories where the parts are reused in the next generation of bots.

In addition, the Thai subbed tutorial ViveksTo linked to upthread shows done pretty good examples of melee combat, with a particularly goof stealth takedown of a Watcher.

 

[GravityInsanity]

Beautifully boring.



The recent Zelda vs. HZD thread caught my eye because it revealed the difference in playability between the two. HZD felt so stratified and iterative compared to Zelda which was way uglier and also way more interesting.


If Zelda felt like a game, HZD felt like a procedure.

Not comparable. Nice try though.

 

[Inuhanyou]

If Zelda felt like a game, HZD felt like a procedure.

You can't make this stuff up folks.

People have become more skeptical since the ubi-tower-dino at E3 I think, at least thats my observation.

If the worst people can concern about this game is that it may have some elements carried over from other popular games, they might as well not play any game again.

 

[LiquidSolid]

It's real easy to tell who has been following the game and who hasn't.

Forget "following", try "remotely paid attention to."

 

[xxracerxx]

You can't make this stuff up folks.

I am excited for both games, but my god am I not ready for the Zelda comparisons for all open world games from here on out.

 

[farmerboy]

Hold on, are you the forestgate guy?

From an earlier H:ZD thread where someone went off on one about arboreal density?

That was some top concern.

**hearty chuckle**

The concern for this game coming from some quarters is seriously disconcerting. So thanks for the laugh!

 

[CrispyBoar]

I hope it's not a big disappointment like with some of the other hyped games from the past such as Watch Dogs, The Order:1886, Street Fighter V, No Man's Sky & Final Fantasy XV.

 

[sems4arsenal]

Horizon I feel will be ok, nothing too special but hopefully I'm wrong.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Beautifully boring.



The recent Zelda vs. HZD thread caught my eye because it revealed the difference in playability between the two. HZD felt so stratified and iterative compared to Zelda which was way uglier and also way more interesting.


If Zelda felt like a game, HZD felt like a procedure.

Interesting, this is the exact opposite conclusion I have.

Zelda's inventory management systems look unbelievably boring to me, and the combat completely lacking.

HZD's core gameplay looks far better from a fun and engagement POV.

 

[Neoleo2143]

You can't make this stuff up folks.

I do think some of the design seems quite thoughtless like how scanning seems to be implemented. I feel like the game should have not bothered with that feature because it only seems to serve to trivialize learning.

 

[vivekTO]

Wrong because I'm not co-opting others as agreeing with me as he did.

Pull out a Quote from previous thread where looking forward to a game or showing positive response equates to "second coming of christ".

I am not saying you should be not skeptical of the new IP that too from GG , but saying that hoping it to deliver is "Second coming of christ" and is such a Hyperbole!

Check back the last 20 thread on Horizon dawn on Gaf , not more than 500 comments averaged on each topic Except for the launched trailer thread & E3 one. I mean where are all the people hyping this to no end. There is a full trailer on machines with only 2 & 47 post.Some threads are not more than 200 Post. if people completely blind themselves from these topics, like Op, and then reiterate the same points again and again.Then whats the point to be discussed. we should just wait for the launch than and keep our opinion to our

Check back the last 20 thread on Horizon dawn on Gaf , not more than 500 comments averaged on each topic Except for the launched trailer thread & E3 one. I mean where are all the people hyping this to no end? There is a full trailer on machines with only 2 & 47 post.Some threads are not more than 200 Post. if people completely blind themselves from these topics, like Op, and then reiterate the same points again and again,Then we should stop the discussions here and should just wait for the launch than and keep our opinion to ourselves.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I am excited for both games, but my god am I not ready for the Zelda comparisons for all open world games from here on out.

The real controversy will be when Zelda actually has some of those popular open world gameplay elements from other games as well.

 

[renzolama]

I don't personally think so, no. Shadow Fall was disappointing, I think everyone can agree on that, but the larger Killzone history across PSP / PS3 still ranks Guerilla Games just behind Naughty Dog as the second most technically impressive Sony exclusive studio. The Killzone games on both PS3 and PS4 are technical showpieces; Shadow Fall is a boring game with no heart, but it's still a graphical powerhouse. Beyond that, the Killzone games on PS3 had a look/feel that was completely unique. Sony unfortunately abused/maligned that uniqueness with their silly "Halo Killer" marketing attempts, but it doesn't change the fact that Killzone did it's own thing in the COD/Halo market and still managed to do it very well.

Shadow Fall, on the other hand, seems like a pretty obvious case of Sony pushing too hard for a launch title and Guerilla being unable to complete much more than the engine/shell of a game with a thin/disconnected layer of story around it. The fact that Guerilla pushed directly into Horizon after SF tells me that it's very likely they had little interest in making another Killzone game and probably only did so under pressure from Sony. My personal read on it is that Horizon is the real PS4 passion project for the studio, and based on what they did with Killzone 2 in a similar situation (for PS3) along with the reported enthusiasm of almost all of the games critics/journalists I've read/heard I'm still very excited and optimistic about it.

 

[Jawbreaker]

I am excited for both games, but my god am I not ready for the Zelda comparisons for all open world games from here on out.

"But can you literally scale mountains? Can you shieldboard? Case closed."

 

[LotusHD]

The real controversy will be when Zelda actually has some of those popular open world gameplay elements from other games as well.

Ahem, it's an open air game, thank you very much. It will be the birth of open air elements.

"But can you literally scale mountains? Can you shieldboard? Case closed."

Lmao, I can't wait for that.

Spoiler

Those are pretty cool things though ;D

 

[schlynch]

Well... gameplay looks kinda dull. Climbing a Ubi radio-tower in form of some kind of robot-dinosaur. eww.

But art, world and the main character really have me interested.

I will probably wait for cheap deal down the line. Doesn't look like something you have to play at release.

 

[DangerMouse]

Spoiler

It could be considered a spoiler if a hadn't already seen it hinted at in the first trailer when Aloy opens up the hatch. Personally it's made me more interested because that *could* be a dungeon entrance or something similar. Definitely points to how the Machines remake themselves though - the crabbots collect old bits of downed robot, carry them into the caves/underground factories where the parts are reused in the next generation of bots.

Yeah. I agree, and I like it.

Spoiler

I agree, it's what I really wanted to see them do with this part, tease/hint at the possibility of going into those advanced high-tech areas. I too think it's some kind of underground factory installation (maybe even find a number of them in the game) that can serve as a dungeon(s). I think we'll get closer to further into the planet later.

 

[SolidSnakex]

The real controversy will be when Zelda actually has some of those popular open world gameplay elements from other games as well.

It's not when, it already does as it has UBI Towers as well.

 

[Floody]

Spoiler

It could be considered a spoiler if a hadn't already seen it hinted at in the first trailer when Aloy opens up the hatch. Personally it's made me more interested because that *could* be a dungeon entrance or something similar. Definitely points to how the Machines remake themselves though - the crabbots collect old bits of downed robot, carry them into the caves/underground factories where the parts are reused in the next generation of bots.

Spoiler

I just assume it was a base, not actually a entrance to the inside of the planet and would have preferred not to know that yet, not a deal breaker or anything, just didn't think it was a necessary addition to a pretty great trailer. Though them actually being dungeons could be really cool and I never looked at it like that. Also, the machine are cool as fuck, and the more we learn the cooler they get.

 

[Neoleo2143]

The real controversy will be when Zelda actually has some of those popular open world gameplay elements from other games as well.

And it does. It has Ubisoft Towers which unlock parts of the map (which if you ask me aren't actually bad design but I digress). That seems to be the only "major" open world trope that BoTW outright takes though (and even then getting off the tower isn't a scripted sequence and you need the height to mark points of interest so there's a point to it so even that isn't arbitrary). Pretty much everything else has a permutation to it to differentiate itself.

 

[DarkTom]

Honestly just don't preorder and your problem is solved OP.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

It's fair to be skeptical.

If you remember the run up to The Order, then it makes complete sense why a quieter than usual marketing run up would make you cautious. Out of those three new IP, The Order had -- by far -- the most muted and trickle-down info to release. That's why I used it as an example.

No it isn't fair. Horizon Zero Dawn has over an hour of footage out there. The Order 1886 a bunch of short b-roll clips and maybe 7 minutes of extended gameplay footage.

 

[Jawbreaker]

The real controversy will be when Zelda actually has some of those popular open world gameplay elements from other games as well.

Surprisingly, no one's really making a stink out of Ubisoft towers being in Zelda.

Ahem, it's an open air game, thank you very much. It will be the birth of open air elements.



Lmao, I can't wait for that.

Spoiler

Those are pretty cool things though ;D

Hah, agreed. They're neat additions.

 

[kyser73]

Spoiler

I just assume it was a base, not actually a entrance to the inside of the planet and would have preferred not to know that yet, not a deal breaker or anything, just didn't think it was a necessary addition to a pretty great trailer. Though them actually being dungeons could be really cool and I never looked at it like that. Also, the machine are cool as fuck, and the more we learn the cooler they get.

Did you also see there's a snapshot of Aloy jumping down onto a Thunderjaw? It was either a T-Jaw or one of the sabretooths as it had those big vanes (which I assume are for heat dissipation) on its back.

 

[Inuhanyou]

It's not when, it already does as it has UBI Towers as well.

And it does. It has Ubisoft Towers which unlock parts of the map (which if you ask me aren't actually bad design but I digress). That seems to be the only "major" open world trope that BoTW outright takes though (and even then getting off the tower isn't a scripted sequence and you need the height to mark points of interest so there's a point to it that isn't arbitrary) Pretty much everything else has a permutation to it to differentiate itself.

Well then, since that is probably the only major complaint i have heard about Horizon so far, Zelda should be equally crucified, no?

But then again, there are those of us who feel like taking elements from other popular titles isn't necessarily a bad thing, so i guess it doesnt really matter in the end. I think Horizon and Zelda will both be great games regardless of that

 

[silva1991]

however I feel like we've seen more from Mass Effect Andromeda, a game that may not release until Q3 or Q4 2017, than we have out of Horizon Zero Dawn.

You could have at least visit uncle Youtube before posting this objectively false info. It's not rocket science -__-


Anyways, I can easily see this disappoint people expecting TES/Witcher writing and side quests.

As for me at the very worst, it will be Dragon's Dogma good for me, because I'm already sold on the gameplay and enemy encounters/battles.

 

[RibMan]

No it isn't fair. Horizon Zero Dawn has over an hour of footage out there. The Order 1886 had but bunch short b-roll clips and maybe 7 minutes of extended gameplay footage.

I disagree. I don't think there's anything wrong in keeping your expectations in check for a new IP.

 

[DangerMouse]

Surprisingly, no one's really making a stink out of Ubisoft towers being in Zelda.

LOL yeah.

My opinion would probably instantly change if you hack a machine that flies and well... fly yourself. Been a sucker for stuff like that as of late.

Ever since E3 where she first hacked the ground dino, I think this is going to happen. It would be damned cool.

 

[Neoleo2143]

Surprisingly, no one's really making a stink out of Ubisoft towers being in Zelda.
.

Probably because they don't plaster markers on your map like Ubisoft games do and also they're useful because setting waypoints depends explicitly on line of sight. So they fulfill multiple purposes while traditional towers fulfill only one which indicates that they actually thought about how the trope should work.

 

[Brix]

It's that same guy complaining in Horizon threads lol. Just wait for the game to come out man.

 

[Kevtones]

You can't make this stuff up folks.

Who are you talking to and who are you defending? HZD has a wonderful art style but it's looked very boring and iterative to most open-world games. I'd love for its aesthetic qualities to find synergy with a wonderful and enticing open-world but Guerilla's shit track record leaves me hopeful at best. Hell, I even enjoyed Killzone 2 so that makes me one of their bigger (or more apologetic) fans.


Wait and see. Right now HZD looks like it might be its genre's Starfox Adventureish.

 

[Supermanisdead]

The problem isn't that it has very common open world elements. The problem is that it doesn't have anything more than those very common open world elements. They haven't shown anything that makes Horizon "that game that you can do x" which for me is a deal breaker. If they put out a new gameplay trailer that shows off Horizon's new unique hook, then I'll be interested.

 

[JJD]

We had the very same thread a few weeks ago.

It seems that a lot of people want this game to fail.