Flapples
Member
I think the last was maybe Thief 2014? Which had a little nudity.
lol remember when ubisoft was getting a bit gutsy and showed 1 single nipple in watchdogs 1?
I think the last was maybe Thief 2014? Which had a little nudity.
Ah yes, the poor straight male, the real victim in this world.
Give me a break
...majority of women enjoy being looked at when they've put the effort in...
Yeah... women "put the effort" for men's sake, that's how it is.
Yeah... women "put the effort" for men's sake, that's how it is.
I'll say it again, the anti-sex tirade the left wing and feminists are on is just downright creepy to me.
Sex is just a natural part of life, there's nothing "offensive" about it in of itself, people by and large have literally lost their minds these days.
Why wouldn't somebody want to look at something that is good looking rather than a purposely made mediocre character (appearance wise) to pass off as politically correct? How is that in 2018 western female characters have become uglier purposely? Or realistic? Do these people even go out? Women have a wide range and can be beautiful it's not something rare. I never understood this whole "wow get a gf you nerd" approach dismissive people take when somebody dares question why devs these days started making humble ass looking fictional characters.
What is the moral imperative for this to be followed?
This line of thinking is ripped straight out of the Puritant playbook.
I'm sure you can present some examples of your own to debunk his argument then, right?
Um, more often than not it's to feel good about themselves - because looking good and putting the effort in often means compliments (from men/women/toasters/etc), which boosts self esteem when received. People ALWAYS judge others against others/themselves (not necessarily "bad", just how it is) - whether they admit to it or not.
People are so caught up in presenting an ideal version of what life is like to others, it gets in the way of thinking like normal fucking person.
Unless im confused, im not sure whats sarcasm or not anymore.
Puritan? Really? I just cited Bayonetta as a good example of how to do sexiness well, and you're calling me puritanical. Uh huh.
There's a difference between celebrating sexuality and a gross, leering "show me more boobs" sort of request. And I don't think the OP is all that interested in the former.
Most things we do are to feel better about ourselves, the point is that the notion of women getting that satisfaction from the approval of men is troublesome.
Okay, what's the difference? What's the moral imperative for one and not the other?Puritan? Really? I just cited Bayonetta as a good example of how to do sexiness well, and you're calling me puritanical. Uh huh.
There's a difference between celebrating sexuality and a gross, leering "show me more boobs" sort of request. And I don't think the OP is all that interested in the former.
how is "show me more boobs" gross? That's the opposite of gross.
There's that word, "troublesome", which means absolutely nothing. Eating donuts is troublesome, trying to look better for other people is not troublesome. If you see that as troubling, that's on you.
I think the OP was pretty easy to understand. He noticed a lack of fan service in western games and posted some examples where he thought it'd be fitting. Then you waltz in here like it's an absurd thing he posted, which is why I asked you to provide some examples that prove him wrong.I can't even wrap my head around the argument. The mental gymnastics going on here is perplexing. Would be very difficult to even attempt to argue against it when the topic is not clear and broad in the first place.
You even quoted me where I asked if someone could make sense of it. Care to elaborate?
Okay, what's the difference? What's the moral imperative for one and not the other?
Nothing in your reply answered that question. Like the Puritans who tolerated nudity in Classical art yet despised it in popular culture, you seem to be arbitrarily drawing your own lines based on...what?
It's really easy to talk out of your ass and act like personal taste is some moral barometer."There' isn't a difference between celebrating sexuality and celebrating a "show me more boobs" sort of request."
But 90% jRPG designs are hideous and unappealing (my opinion, I know many dont share it) these days.
THANK YOU NINTENDO for not only RESPECTING WOMEN but getting my gears really going with those watermelon airbags
(pretty sure its SFW because its a nintendo game, RIGHT (or is this fan art, i cant tell?)))
Help me understand the OP?! A couple of examples not oversexualizing female characters means no fanservice in Western games for straight men? Please tell me people don't buy into this self victimization.
Like, would anyone in modern history have objected to a little damn cleavage or a pair of shorts? It's just fucking absurd.
Ah yes, the poor straight male, the real victim in this world.
Give me a break
Come on man.
I can post "examples" all night if you want, now your turn.
Are you a straight male?You are a part of the problem.
Are you a straight male?
This point of view never really made much sense to me either.
Sure, there is an untapped user base out there that the general, generic, video games is not necessarily appealing to.
The way it's presented though is as if McDonald's should change the Big Mac because they have a potential untapped vegan and vegetarian customer base out there.
Surely, the correct solution is to offer alternative products for these under served populations?
The main arguments I see are that games need to "grow up" and the like but this doesn't seem like a solution.
I think you would cater to a new audience by offering new products to that audience?
No by adjusting the product and hoping that the lost customers are outweighed by the customers gained?
I'm not sure, for example, to what extent a redesign of Lara Croft's character encourages more sales or even encourages more ladies to pick up a Tomb Raider game?
Such concern?Well, no. Most average gamers wouldn't. But then they also wouldn't show such concern when there's a lack of cleavage and the addition of pants.
Yes. Your point? Should I get executed for being a straight male?
I can make you hate me even further without even knowing me. I’m also white.
In witch quite a donwgrade (for me) from the real actress that the character's based uponWhat does fanservice mean here? If I google images of Aloy in Horizon, she looks pretty attractive and not exactly high-necked:
Okay, what's the difference? What's the moral imperative for one and not the other?
Nothing in your reply answered that question. Like the Puritans who tolerated nudity in Classical art yet despised it in popular culture, you seem to be arbitrarily drawing your own lines based on...what?
I explained it earlier to some extent. Bayonetta, as an example, is a character who very consciously chooses her sexuality. She's also there to appeal to guys, don't get me wrong, but nor does she come across as a doll dressed up solely for guys' amusement. Her personality also reflects that. Basically: if you're going to have a sexy character, of any gender, they'd ideally be in control of their sexuality.
If you want the polar opposite of that... well, there's the DOA Xtreme franchise. Women in that series exist solely to be leered at; it's basically five minutes away from turning into one of those grope-and-rape hentai games. Most games don't come anywhere near DOAX's level of creepiness, but it's easy to see some of that mindset seeping into the "why aren't more women in games dressed solely to give men a hard-on?" requests.
She is a fictional character. She didn't choose anything. So ascribing a fake "choice" is no justification for her outfit, if that is your criteria.I explained it earlier to some extent. Bayonetta, as an example, is a character who very consciously chooses her sexuality.
What -- in particular -- differentiates her sexuality as something "solely for guys' amusement" compared to someone like Lara Croft?She's also there to appeal to guys, don't get me wrong, but nor does she come across as a doll dressed up solely for guys' amusement. Her personality also reflects that. Basically: if you're going to have a sexy character, of any gender, they'd ideally be in control of their sexuality.
How do you know they solely exist to be leered at?If you want the polar opposite of that... well, there's the DOA Xtreme franchise. Women in that series exist solely to be leered at; it's basically five minutes away from turning into one of those grope-and-rape hentai games. Most games don't come anywhere near DOAX's level of creepiness, but it's easy to see some of that mindset seeping into the "why aren't more women in games dressed solely to give men a hard-on?" requests.
Sure it's gross. It's asking games to be pandering and crass because you want to stroke yourself while you're playing.
The problem is, the OP and some others don't really seem to care about that. It sounds more like they're just looking for some masturbation material.
We are talking about games though.You guys haven't watched a pop music video lately have you?
She is a fictional character. She didn't choose anything. So ascribing a fake "choice" is no justification for her outfit, if that is your criteria.
What -- in particular -- differentiates her sexuality as something "solely for guys' amusement" compared to someone like Lara Croft?
And why is this morally better than a woman who dresses up solely for guys' amusement? Above you said that her "choice" was important. What if a woman chooses to dance nude "solely for guys' amusement"?
We are also ignoring the fact that lesbians exist. Can you please detail why her sexuality is male-only and excludes lesbians and bi?
Because it was a tired retread? The previous games did well enough. Are you trying to imply the reason it bombed is the lack of sexy costumes and if it at least had a few it'd have sold great or something?
It is the overall atmosphere. They are way more PC, because if they are not they are getting bombed by era like people telling them how sexist they are.Help me understand the OP?! A couple of examples not oversexualizing female characters means no fanservice in Western games for straight men? Please tell me people don't buy into this self victimization.
This again is real bullshit. But it seems this lie is very persistent even today. Just like the wage gap. What modern feminism really can do is keeping lies up because people are not able to think anymore.Pretty much every AAA game is aimed at straight dudes, so yes.
They think (as stated by one in the above you) only women have a right to design attractive women to be not be treated as an object. All men's designed women character must be boring/ugly to be not for pandering lol.There are plenty of western games with attractive females but yeah I'd be nice to see western devs equivalent of A2/2B from nier when it comes to outfits for example. I think devs these days are either: too scared because nowadays thanks to retarded forums like resetera it's pr nightmare, or too "woke" to portrey women like that (because god forbid). I don't know. Most girls I think like to look and dress sexy sometimes..
You guys haven't watched a pop music video lately have you?
Be specific. You keep making definitive statements based on nothing. What parts of her construction make it apparent that her sexuality is "her choice" as compared to someone like Lara Croft, who -- as far as I remember -- was never forced to have large breasts or short shorts in terms of the game lore?It's the way the character is constructed. Yes, of course the designers were the ones who chose how she's portrayed, but the point is she's portrayed as someone who knows exactly what she's doing.
In what way was it "disconnected" from her personality? What should she have said or done instead in order to make it clear that her sexuality was "her choice"?Lara Croft's sexuality (in the original games, not the reboot) was disconnected from her personality and rather obviously there for pandering. Bayonetta... well, her sexuality includes some pandering, but it's obvious that she embraces it. And yes, if a woman chooses to dance nude, that's fine.
You've not answered any of my questions. Just more moralizing.And yes, I should acknowledge that bi/lesbian/pan/trans women are out there and enjoy female sexuality in games, too. It's just that, let's face it, the developers reducing women to eye candy in games are usually men. Come to think of it, there aren't many games (certainly not AAA blockbusters) that portray female sexuality through an LGBT lens.
Come on man.
I can post "examples" all night if you want, now your turn.