Support NeoGAF

[ExFalsoQuodlibet]

I don't know man, it seems hit/miss. I'm playing DK and some of the loading can be pretty annoying, especially when you finish a level and wait for the overworld then a split second later you are waiting for the next level to load.

I checked wikipedia and the reading speed for the WiiU drive should be 22.5 MB/s while the PS3 2x BD drive should have a reading speed of 9 MB/s, so on paper there is a difference, but yeah, loading times from optical are usually bad in general.

 

[Auto-Reply]

With last gen they have already overstepped a line in my eyes. I never felt as justified to play games on a pc as in todays gaming environment.

 

[Rewrite]

I would honestly have a problem with this if the PS4 installs took super long like they did on PS3, but as it stands it only takes like a minute or so from all the games I've purchased. Don't mind deleting the install after I'm done playing the game either.

 

[TheSpoiler]

With last gen they have already overstepped a line in my eyes. I never felt as justified to play games on a pc as in todays gaming environment.

Yeah, installs are such a terrible problem that we should all go buy gaming PCs out of spite.

I'm glad you finally found your justification for enjoying video games on a particular system.

 

[LithiumSpade]

I think mandatory installs are the stupidiest shit ever.

Optional installs though, they are a thing of beauty. I always install my games.

For some reason, I totally get what you mean. On my 360 I love the option to just stick my games in and have them play...but 99% of the time sitting there and manually installing a game, for me, is part of the fun! It's just nice not to have to if for some reason I don't want to.

 

[Shin-Ra]

Loading's going to get even faster, remember.

https://twitter.com/drewthaler/status/407565332023214080

This is the guy that worked on PS4's PlayGo system.

 

[Damigos]

Nope! I want the fastest asset streaming and loading times. Playing off a slow disc should stay in past

That is the right answer

 

[impact]

I too get upset over waiting less than a minute to get better load times and game performance. Why can't every game have Lego City Undercover load times?

 

[Auto-Reply]

The differences are negligible today. I'm not saying there aren't any anymore but it's a far cry from the Xbox/PS2/Gamecube days. I'm not even blaming Sony & co for going with the times, it had to happen.

 

[Goodacre0081]

Looks like the OP stands alone.

that's because his/her thinking is fundamentally flawed. installing these disc based games to the HDD is making the starting/loading process quicker. I would hate to see pure load times from blu-ray discs.

we essentially have one big cartridge with all our games loaded on memory, all the disc does is verify ownership and allow you to play.

 

[MavFan619]

I also own a PS4. I'm not saying mandatory installs are slow or intrusive. I'm saying it's another step consoles are taking toward being PCs. Bad ones, at that. Regardless, because of mandatory installs, you now need free hard drive space to play new games. That's weak. That's not a positive thing.

I guess I can agree that it's space being taken up and the hard drive should have been bigger relative to the bigger game size. But I still contend with how fast it does install I can delete when I'm all done with a certain game and free up space, and if down the line I want to play it again the installs being so quick doesn't hurt in cases like this.

 

[On Demand]

Why exactly do games need full installs now?

 

[Shin-Ra]

Why exactly do games need full installs now?

Higher quality assets, streaming from HDD is much quicker than optical disc. Disc drives are probably one of the most likely parts to break down so reducing overall wear helps there as well as noise, too.

 

[TAJ]

Why exactly do games need full installs now?

So you can do things like run through an environment as densely detailed as a corridor shooter at a sustained 40mph in an open world without the streaming breaking down. (Infamous SS)

 

[HolyCheck]

Why would you want to play everygame from the disc. There is absolutely zero reason to want to do that.

Because I bought a game. I want to put the disc in and play it.

Not install, sign up to some account, fill in some mandatory crap and register then play.

 

[fedexpeon]

No problem on the PS4 side with a hybrid HD installed in it.
I recently uninstalled SS due to the 1.01 patch error that wouldn't let me download any DLC/redeemed codes.
And Second Son installed in LESS than 3mins flat...I have no clue what black magic they used.

 

[RdN]

I don't really care. It improves the end result, so I'm willing to wait a but more.

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

I cannot imagine why anyone would be anti-install. It protects the optical drive from wear, it allows faster loading and better streaming. If the downside is "waiting", then it's really not an issue.

 

[mrklaw]

I don't like it either. I have not really noticed any benefits of faster load speeds (in comparison to the disc only games on the ps3 and 360) but then again, we are now limited by the 6x read speed on both consoles.

The major problem is memory management. The xbox one and it's non upgradeable internal but incoming external hard drive solution, and the ps4 and limited to it's internal with no external as far as I know.

Instead of having redundant game data on the hard drive, i'd rather it be digital games or really anything else.

Not seeing any benefits of load times Vs 360/PS3 *is* a benefit. You have 10x the ram to fill, if games load as fast as previous gen that is great.

 

[Shin-Ra]

Replaying Killzone atm I really appreciate the 10sec load to the main menu.

 

[dazzlerazzle]

.
And Second Son installed in LESS than 3mins flat...I have no clue what black magic they used.

There is no black magic involved, you just installed main menu, and then most likely first chunk of the game, 6x cav blu ray drive is not gonna install 20GB+ game in 3 minutes

 

[ymmv]

I cannot imagine why anyone would be anti-install. It protects the optical drive from wear, it allows faster loading and better streaming. If the downside is "waiting", then it's really not an issue.

Install times are supposedly pretty bad on the Xbone, but on the PS4 it's not an issue. Insert the disc and it immediately starts installing, wait at most two minutes and you're ready to play. The initial install time in minutes is laughably low compared to the loading times we'd suffer if those huge games had to be loaded from disc constantly. Performance would suffer and you'd be waiting far, far, far more..

 

[see5harp]

I'm fine with it. I just wish you could choose not to download the 20 gigs of uncompressed audio.

Same. I don't mind waiting for the install and updates but in this day and age installs should be completely modular.

 

[Timu]

Install times on Xbox One don't bother me, I believe these have been improving with updates though. What bothers me is how much space games take up. 500 GBs is not enough for either console, it won't be long before people need an external harddrive.

If I run out I plan to get an external hard drive.

 

[Abdul Hafeez]

Disc drives simply can't read data fast enough to render the graphics of today.

 

[mrklaw]

Install times are supposedly pretty bad on the Xbone, but on the PS4 it's not an issue. Insert the disc and it immediately starts installing, wait at most two minutes and you're ready to play. The initial install time in minutes is laughably low compared to the loading times we'd suffer if those huge games had to be loaded from disc constantly. Performance would suffer and you'd be waiting far, far, far more..

And you don't even have to press anything, it starts installing as soon as the disc is in. When I get a new game,mi usually put it in the PS4 when I get home, which powers up the PS4 and installs it automatically. So when I sit down to play its all done.

 

[TheLegendOfMart]

I knew I wasn't the last human being on earth who was annoyed with this. I feel strongly:

- that this will lead to an increasingly "digital" future, where game ownership is increasingly lost;
- that this forces me to buy extra memory storage from a console supplier when this was previously provided to me (without a cost difference from a digital product) for the most part;
- and that this will, over time, naturally lead to invasive DRM practices which were already hinted at last E3.


I personally value feeling like a gamer over having less of a load time in between games.

- Nothing wrong with a digital future, see Steam
- Neither Sony nor Microsoft will require you to buy their proprietary memory expansion, run out of space on the 500GB hdd they come with? Buy a regular PC 2.5" SATA HDD for PS4 or any USB3.0 External PC HDD for Xbox
- If by "invasive" DRM you mean the content provider checking you actually have a licence to play the game then yeah...

 

[Renekton]

First world problems.

Anyways, get a 1 TB HDD from Hitachi, problem solved.

 

[Man]

Not a problem on PS4 at all.

 

[elektrixx]

You shouldn't be buying discs anyway.

 

[jimi_dini]

- Nothing wrong with a digital future, see Steam

All sorts of things are wrong with a digital future.

for example:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_PlaysForSure

...Microsoft announced that as of August 31, 2008, PlaysForSure content from their retired MSN Music store would need to be licensed to play before this date...

Fuck digital future. I prefer to actually own my content instead of effectively renting it.

 

[Crimsonclaw111]

The Wii U is sorely missing an install option... I weep every time I hear the drive read.

 

[mrpeabody]

People who hate disc installs "because they're slow" really do not understand the tradeoffs involved.

 

[Jill Sandwich]

Installs I can handle. It's the 7 pages of unskippable company logos that piss me off.

 

[Vashetti]

Complete non-issue on the PS4.

-Installs are blazing quick/deleting is equally quick
-Less wear and tear on the BD Drive as it's not constantly spinning/loading data
-Therefore less heat and electricity being generated/used = more reliable console

Seems like on the XB1 side the install system is very broken though.

 

[fedexpeon]

There is no black magic involved, you just installed main menu, and then most likely first chunk of the game, 6x cav blu ray drive is not gonna install 20GB+ game in 3 minutes

It did.
I had a save over 4hrs in already since I couldn't get any of the DLC to work due to the 1.01 patch updating+downloading the DLC at the same time error.
I really wanted that Cole's jacket, and the Paper dlc when I unlocked the neon power.
But the game kept saying no such DLCs installed in my game when I was wasting time running around for the DLC markers.
I couldn't even download the DLC from the store because it kept saying it was already installed in the HDD, which it did but just didn't register.
I had to uninstall everything, 22g of it, and I was back in the upper district in 3mins after reinstalling and loading up the save.

 

[GameAddict411]

Install times on Xbox One don't bother me, I believe these have been improving with updates though. What bothers me is how much space games take up. 500 GBs is not enough for either console, it won't be long before people need an external harddrive.

Just delete games that you're not playing or replace the HDD with a bigger one if you have a PS4, The former is more convenient.

 

[KORNdoggy]

You shouldn't be buying discs anyway.

lol, why?

they can be bought cheaper, drop in price faster, are recieved earlier, can be borrowed and sold.

i'm yet to see ANY reason to go digital for retail releases. they're more expensive, barely drop in value, cannot be re-sold, cannot be lent out, and they're locked into their release date. maybe i'm missing something?

as for the OP's point. it's really a non-issue, at least on the PS4. the time you wait is less then a minute before you can start playing. and even a full install is only about 5 minutes (but you don't even have to do that)

 

[le.phat]

Am I the only one bummed out over this? I was always a console gamer growing up and I'm use to instant action, you put your game media in and it plays. Now it looks like those days are long gone, and never coming back. I don't know, there's just something incredibly sad about it and it's kinda keeping me from jumping in.

Anyone else feel the same way?

Guess you don't have a ps4 then ?

 

[Mithos]

- Nothing wrong with a digital future, see Steam

And what if tomorrow morning you wake up and Valve have literally shut down steam and its servers forever? All those games you have payed for but not installed, POFF GONE!

First world problems.

Anyways, get a 1 TB HDD from Hitachi, problem solved.

I understand that this would work for someone like me, that only have 30-35 games, but what about people that have thousands of games.

 

[Moosichu]

The startup time for every PS4 game I've played has been faster then most PS2 games. Even retail ones like inFamous Second Son. No start menu, just instant playtime.

 

[Moosichu]

Because I bought a game. I want to put the disc in and play it.

Not install, sign up to some account, fill in some mandatory crap and register then play.

Ps4 lets you do this. You dont even notice the install and WTF is the second bit going on about?

Edit: sorry for the double post!

 

[kyser73]

Playing on my PS4 is as close to cartridges speeds I've had since I parted with my N64.

I grew up playing on 48&64k games that had to load from cassette tapes (some of which had multi-loads, like Epyx' 'WinterGames') so having to wait ~45s at the initial load or ~30s to start once installed really is nothing.

Plus, there're the actual technical reasons about asset streaming & the like.

This is such a non-problem.

 

[Shin-Ra]

It did.
I had a save over 4hrs in already since I couldn't get any of the DLC to work due to the 1.01 patch updating+downloading the DLC at the same time error.
I really wanted that Cole's jacket, and the Paper dlc when I unlocked the neon power.
But the game kept saying no such DLCs installed in my game when I was wasting time running around for the DLC markers.
I couldn't even download the DLC from the store because it kept saying it was already installed in the HDD, which it did but just didn't register.
I had to uninstall everything, 22g of it, and I was back in the upper district in 3mins after reinstalling and loading up the save.

inFAMOUS/PlayGo might smartly install the district your most recent save is in, first.

 

[Mlatador]

Wii U doesn't have mandatory installs.

By the way...

Thread title could have easily been "It bums me out that both PS4 and Xbox One have mandatory installs...".

But no, it seems to become a trend on NeoGAF to passively troll the Wii U by pretending it is not a "next-generation" console, which is really annoying

 

[davepoobond]

Thread of the future: "I miss load screens"

 

[Renekton]

I understand that this would work for someone like me, that only have 30-35 games, but what about people that have thousands of games.

2TB HDD and occasional uninstalls

 

[Jack cw]

But no, it seems to become a trend on NeoGAF to passively troll the Wii U by pretending it is not a "next-generation" console, which is really annoying

I dont think that OP had the intention to either actively or passively "trolling" WiiU. Dont be so insecure and start debating on semantics because for 99,99% of people clicking this thread its clear that "both next gen systems" means PS4 and xbone.

 

[Eusis]

Am I the only one bummed out over this? I was always a console gamer growing up and I'm use to instant action, you put your game media in and it plays. Now it looks like those days are long gone, and never coming back. I don't know, there's just something incredibly sad about it and it's kinda keeping me from jumping in.

Anyone else feel the same way?

Meh, I took the option to fully install if it was there, and the alternative isn't very pleasant.

Honestly the XB1 and especially PS4 did the next best thing: partial install, let you play ASAP, then it'll finish installing while you play. So I didn't have to wait a long time when, say, renting AC4, I could just get going, then quit out when the patch was done, let it install, then get back to it. It's smoother and faster on PS3, so it ends up closer than the PS3 was (and the last major game I played without a real install, TLoU, took so long to load that I kind of hated that Naughty Dog didn't just force a damn install anyway.)

 

[xImmortal007x]

Xbox One install times are pretty ehhh.... but I did notice the first time I put in Infamous Second Son on PS4 it booted right up and I was good to go immediately. I guess it installed as I played the story. I can only imagine the install times for both systems is going to get shorter and shorter over time.