At 5 figures player numbers?
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Its been a year since Xbox Announced Cross-Network Play
- Thread starter Gowans
- Start date
It's not allowed? Link to this? Or is that just speculation? If they're allowed to do crossplay, I seriously doubt MS or Sony will go "Ok you can do crossplay, but not here, not this part of the game, only this part". At the end of the day both PS4 and XB1 players would be playing with each other regardless which is all that really is on a technical level, there's no reason it'd be "not allowed"
I want to say some games already have in game friends list but I can't think of any other than some PC games
it wouldn't be another username (well it could be I guess), just have it automatically assign you an ID that's forever tied to your gamertag or PS ID. Also wouldn't need to use it, you wouldn't need to connect to their servers unless you're in the cross play menu. So any servers or load times would only be an issue if you're specifically wanting to play with someone from another platform, otherwise it wouldn't be. Is a few seconds of "optional" loading screen really that much of an issue that you wouldn't want to party up with your friends on a different platform? Lol
It'd be a do it once, done forever type of thing though. It's not like they're gonna need to redo it all for every single game they make, they'd just copy and paste the code over. And developers do stuff all the time without monetary gain (this in response to both)
Avatars are completely different to what I'm saying and you'd need to connect from XBL>PSN for that or vice verser, but ok. Unless the avatar is in game anyways, like CoD emblem editor.
michaelius
Banned
It's Microsoft after. They like to keep those little ugly details hidden.
When Windows 10 was annouced I was going to upgrade day 1 but as time went on we started to learn ugly truth about ads, enforced upgrades robbing you out of control of your pc and impossible to completly shutdown telemetry.
More speculation, but more evident considering there's not an example of any game (on Xbox) which circumvents the XBL API's for any social interaction.
If developers create their own social platform, you're creating it from scratch and it's more likely for it to fall flat on it's face when released. It then doesn't tie into your platform and creates segregation within games rather than you making a friend in a game and then being able to play another game easily with that person. Just look at what was said before on the last page around Capcom and SFV which clearly has it's own implementation.
Games which have in-game friends lists, like Overwatch, use the XBL API's to pull that friendslist down. On Xbox, any one deemed as a friend, is a friend on your Xbox, not just on that game.
I thought of a benefit it could have for Sony (also MS too depending on the game), I don't think many would like it though. It could be used to directly market console exclusive items, it's scummy as fuck, but I think would be pretty effective. Destiny as an example if you see plenty of users running around with a Hawkmoon (was PS exclusive and 1 of the best weapons in the game) you'd probably want one too, as it stands those users can just ignore them as they never really see them in action unless they go out of their way to find it, but this way it'd be in their face. I'm sure that'd open the floodgates for other games though, so wouldn't be beneficial to consumers.
I disagree as a matter of principal sorry. This is a burden that should be on the platform holders, not developers. These bespoke solutions are almost always worse than the built-in system solutions too which is bad for the end user as well as being an additional hassle (see SFV).
Well to say that's not allowed, you know how ridiculous that's gonna sound? Like Sony or MS would have to go to developers and say "Okay we'll allow crossplay, but you can't do it on these specific screens/frames, everywhere else is fair game".. Like that in itself just sounds ridiculous. On a technical level all that's happening is PS and Xbox gamers are connected to each other, and that would happen regardless of in game friends list or not. Plus.. Do you really think MS or Sony is gonna tell developers how to make their games? Crossplay is one thing cause they're connecting to each others networks, but to dictate what features can go into their games? That's not gonna happen.
Well technically it wouldn't be from scratch as a lot of it is already there and used in other ways (such as team side in game chat). I responded to the SFV thing to the other guy, plus, is one bad implementation really a reason to shut the idea down completely? That's just silly.. I haven't played SFV so I don't really know much about how it works but yeah.
I was talking about specific in game FL, I know there's a few games on PC with that but not sure Xbox. Even if not, that's because it's already done on a system level and there's no reason to put the work in for something that's already done. Crossplay would open up new possibilities and give a reason to do it.
It isn't allowed. Ofc it isn't, or it would of been done by now.
I'm done in here. Simple point is, Sony have no reason to not allow this.
Um, wait a minute. My posts were under the assumption that cross play was allowed & happened and speaking strictly about in game friends list, party and matchmaking not whether or not crossplay will happen.
Right now cross play hasn't happened, so there is literally zero reason to have a separate in game friends list etc when the platforms themselves have it already. If crossplay happened, there would be a reason to do so.
Lion Heart
Banned
Do ps4 players really want to play with the Xbox Live community? I don't.
You're right it's not exactly the same thing but to me having to create a special sort of account with rocket league and then have the game have to go out and work with both other platform API's for invites, chat, etc. is unrealistic. It's entirely possible as companies have made things work with free to play games but from my experiences with those games, the multiplayer components work shitty compared to the standard games and make people manage a completely separate friends list.
FinaruDensetsu
Member
So assuming it's all Sony's fault why are there so few crossplay games between Xbox and PC?
Also I Yoshida has also said that the ball is in MS's court regarding FFXIV.
Also I Yoshida has also said that the ball is in MS's court regarding FFXIV.
Rewatching the podcast I don't see it as necessarily downplaying it more his opinion is the compromise of the "integrated experience for increased playerbase doesn't seem like a worthy tradeoff due to things like needing to make external accounts, not being able to invite specific people. His argument is that if a game has issue with playerbase then there might be another issues to look at such as age of the game, type of game which if we look at some examples is true(Battleborne, Evolve).
I personally don't see it as giving an insight into Sony's current stance mainly because if the argument is about the intergrated experience being compromise it has already happened with PC/PS4 cross play title with their external account and stuff. I feel this just his opinion on things.
Mouse and Keyboard versus Controller is probably one of the bigger factors why more games don't have crossplay.
FinaruDensetsu
Member
Eh I don't think that's a huge issue. Like Rocket League when you do crossplay you are doing it knowingly so you are accepting the possible disadvantage. Also just have it be unranked.
It's not a huge issue but it's probably one of the main reasons more games are not crossplay. Some Devs just don't like mixing things up and unbalancing gameplay.
KB&M. There's quite a few PC games that's cross play though. The play anywhere titles, Gwent, Rocket League and I might be missing some. Most of them are the PA ones though.
Yoshida said "MS doesn't understand how MMO's work" with FFXIV. I'm pretty sure (speculation) that's because MS requires cross play to be optional, but you can't really do that with an MMO and have both crossplay and just Xbox One servers. FFXIV is an MMO issue, not necessarily cross play.
Quadraphonic
Member
That's what I mean. Given the whole fucking Steam/WindowsStore debacle for Call of Duty, I don't want to think Sony has 100% of the blame.
Is there something inherently different about the xbox community? Most of the PS4 multiplayer community used to be the Xbox 360 community, so I don't see a difference really.
Head.spawn
Junior Member
What the hell does this even mean?
Is there some sacred shit I'm missing while I play a game on PS4? Maybe you've heard that when I load up my Xbox One I get all Dr. Jekyll or something?
Don't believe the rumors.
What a monstruous thing to do. xbox scum!
The Futurist
Member
AgentP
Thinks mods influence posters politics. Promoted to QAnon Editor.
Lol, as if MS cares either. The whole affair was a PR stunt.
CountAntonius
Member
It's up to the developers. Most don't care to do it because of the extra work. Psyonix has it figured out cause it built the game for crossplay and circumvents all the things platform holders are weary of. Clearly Sony is the roadblock here for this particular game as has been stated by Psyonix many time.
Sony doesn't want to matchmaking with Microsoft. It's simple as that and within their right. I won't defend it though cause it fucking sucks. Makes it so Xbox players can't join RLCS with the rest of us. makes it so private lobbies need to be segregated for one platform or another. "Why would Sony do this?" Because it's good for gamers and for the Rocket League community as a whole. You're on a gaming forum think as a gamer and not a shill.
This is such a stupid stance. They gave Psyonix the go ahead. How is that a stunt?
Good lord.
Sony doesn't want to matchmaking with Microsoft. It's simple as that and within their right. I won't defend it though cause it fucking sucks. Makes it so Xbox players can't join RLCS with the rest of us. makes it so private lobbies need to be segregated for one platform or another. "Why would Sony do this?" Because it's good for gamers and for the Rocket League community as a whole. You're on a gaming forum think as a gamer and not a shill.
This is such a stupid stance. They gave Psyonix the go ahead. How is that a stunt?
Good lord.
That would still be more of a cross play issue as it's policy/requirement needed to have crossplay between Xbox and other networks it just affects MMO's more than other genres/games.
The requirement for there to be an option to disable crossplay is from MS btw.
Edit -
I see 😘
Well yeah it's still a cross play thing but you know what I mean
What I meant was that the situation with FFXIV is unique to MMO's (maybe some other genres? cant think of any though) and not cross play in general.Yes I know it's MS requirement, I said that
A fair one IMO, but it sucks about FFXIV for sure.Rain City Gamer
Member
This was just another MS PR stunt. They were trying to play the perception game (Which they have been all gen) while the reality was Xbox Live had been the hold up for years on crossplay but now that they were getting their asses kicked they FINALLY got around changing their Xbox Live rules for devs/sharing/crossplay. Then they tried to parlay that into making people look at Sony while they were a generation late on adding that crossplay feature.
This was a pipedream from the start and was played up more by fanboys than anyone else. Sony has zero to gain by allowing people on PSN to play with Xbox Live, and MS has everything to gain by doing it.
This was a pipedream from the start and was played up more by fanboys than anyone else. Sony has zero to gain by allowing people on PSN to play with Xbox Live, and MS has everything to gain by doing it.
The Call of Duty stuff is on Activision. The developer needs to make a game crossplay (maybe the WinStore version shouldn't have been an XBL game to begin with?). MS allowing it, isn't the same as MS writing it into games that aren't theirs.
If the reality was as simple as "MS was the holdup", then the moment they allowed it Rocket League should have been able to play across both. So did Sony change their stance, or was it all just a "PR stunt" from their side too, until they had their bluff called on it? It wouldn't be a pipedream if they were/are as open to it as your post is suggesting.
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
Even then it just seems fishy. Given MS' Window 10 push and their obsession with telemetry, there probably is some kind of Windows 10 requirement baked into their "It's up to Sony now" statements.
SlaughterX
Banned
I just want to play Destiny on PC with my Xbox peeps, I'll even buy it on the Windows Store if I must, though I would rather get the physical LE.
For all we know, MS is demanding an XBL-only option while Sony is demanding only unified queues. This certainly fits the several cross-plat games that exist on Sony platforms, including cross-plat with XBox thanks to one-time exceptions from Microsoft (no exception needed from Sony because, again, we have a decade of crossplat history from Sony but only very specific limited cutouts from MS.)
No.
We know MS demands an XBL only option, because they publically told us.
We also know that Sony doesn't demand unified only, because both Rocket League and Street Fighter V allow for the option to only play against other PSN players.
So no... you're not using facts. Rocket League should qualify for crossplay between both, but it doesn't because as the devs stated, Sony hasn't approved of it. You're trying way too hard to find Sony an out here, where there doesn't really seem to be one.
Moon_frogger
Member
Why are we claiming Microsoft announced cross play to 'differentiate' from Sony? We are aware that Sony has been doing this since the ps2 days and continues to do so today, right? I don't get it.
Shpeshal Nick
aka Collingwood
Cross play with PC is in Killer Instinct, Gears, Rocket League, Gwent and a few others.
PSN Crossplay? That won't happen. Sony aren't playing ball there.
PSN Crossplay? That won't happen. Sony aren't playing ball there.
Sony could well be demanding unified only or no playing with PS players.
You're trying desperately hard to find a way MS could be telling the whole truth when, as has been pointed out repeatedly to you, games are coming out with PS-3DS-Wii-Switch-PC-Android-iOS cross-play, with none of those platform-holders batting an eye.
Again: is literally every other platform-holder secretly conspiring against the company selling around 50 consoles a week in that market? Really?
The word "differentiate" has been used exactly once in this thread prior to your post...
MS wants crossplay because their significantly lower userbase hurts the long term experience for multiplayer games compared to PS4. For Sony, they would lose a competitive advantage for no real gain.
MS announcing this was an attempt to get popular support against Sony, and also earn some PR points.
In addition, technical and other such issues make the whole thing more complicated on the back end.
Basically MS gains from offering this, and they gain from it happening. For Sony, on the other hand, it's lose-lose.
MS announcing this was an attempt to get popular support against Sony, and also earn some PR points.
In addition, technical and other such issues make the whole thing more complicated on the back end.
Basically MS gains from offering this, and they gain from it happening. For Sony, on the other hand, it's lose-lose.
Sorry, but this makes zero sense. Why the hell would "unified only" or "optional, but then no other consoles" make any sense as a restriction?
I don't need to find ways for MS to be telling the truth... other developers are telling you that they are also. MS could have said nothing at all, and the comments from Psyonix and CDPR would have painted the same picture... just like comments from devs last gen did for PS3.
You're quick to talk about MS examples being "exceptions", but don't seem to apply that same logic to Sony with Dragon Quest or Final Fantasy... especially considering that an MMO implementation doesn't need to directly connect players of the two ecosystems p2p. We don't seem to actually have an example of that being allowed, and the Pure Chess situation seems to suggest it isn't, as Ripstone apparently ended up in the same situation as Psyonix and CDPR when they tried.
Lastly... you're continuously trying to paint me as someone that will just argue this in MS' favour... that isn't the case, and when the shoe was on the other foot, my stance was almost exactly opposite.
Turns out that when MS did allow it, Sony were quick to prove me wrong.
You're treating actually shipping games as equal to statements to IGN. Until you focus on a strong history of actual shipping games as opposed to a strong history of bullshitting and occasional oneoff exceptions, you're either extremely disingenuous or shilling.
P2P is a possible exception, but again, this points to MS as the issue; the other half of their "let Japanese publishers have their MMOs" binge was PSU, which WAS P2P and featured PS2/PC and X360 matchmaking.
And "unified or we're out" makes plenty of sense for Sony - again, they don't profit by forcing Xbone players to sit in queue for 30 seconds instead of 20 because honestly who cares anywhere NEAR as much as they profit from taking away that "my friends are all on Live" argument that's sold so many Xboxes. MS benefit more by far from locked-down userbases, because the only userbase they have right now is the locked-down one.
Banjo-Kazooie
Member
I mean there's also Gwent
https://www.vg247.com/2016/07/23/cd...-paves-the-way-for-gwent-cross-platform-play/
And Mantis Burn Racing
http://www.icxm.net/x/burn-mantis-racing-voo-foo-studios-sep-23-16-comment.html
But I'm sure 3 devs still aren't enough proof for some people lol
Banjo-Kazooie
Member
Boyes is BSing then. Psyonix, CDPR and VooDoo all basicaly have to just push a button. They have MS approval and need Sony approval. Not sure what's complicated if those devs are ready to go.
Are you taking the piss? How is something like Rocket League not actually shipping games? Obviously there won't be examples of shipping an XBL/PSN crossplay game unless it's actually allowed by both MS and Sony. This is such a stupid statement to make.
How in the hell would Sony not allowing p2p crossplay (aka the vast majority of all online gaming) point to MS as the issue? Phantasy Star Universe was server-based btw...
"History" means little in the face of new evidence. Once PSN multiplayer was free, now it isn't. Once XBL was required for Netflix, now it isn't. Etc. If you want to talk about history, then there's been far more this generation to suggest that Sony are being restrictive than there is with MS (EA Access, Early Access games, Bethesda mods, etc).
Why would "unified or we're out" make sense, rather than just a blanket "no XBL"? All the reasoning you give applies even more to simply not letting XBL in either way. Having players be allowed to opt out actually makes sense as a clause, because crossplay itself actually affects user experience (potential cheaters, OS-level social interactions don't work, etc).