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[Gonff]

Yep, it's not a tablet. A tablet is a much better idea than the gamepad. It offers more functionality and flexibility while at the same time costing far less than the Gamepad + Wii U combo.

Makes you wonder why Nintendo wasted so much R&D on the gamepad when they could have taken that idea just a few steps further and made a tablet.

The other approach would be to utilize the millions of tablets already on the market for the system and not bogged down R&D with the gamepad. Sony and MS made the better decision in this regard by far.

Not from a developer's perspective. Or even a user's perspective honestly.

Just like Kinect - if I am Nintendo or MS and I want something supported full-stop, I am building my console around it. The Gamepad is not a tacked on piece of the Wii U, it is its central component.

Sony and MS will suffer from developers tacking on second-screen support as an after-thought. The Wii U can have games built entirely around utilizing the WiiPad.

 

[goomba]

Thats bullshit.

The NES was similar to every other console.

So was the SNES.

So was the N64 bar carts

So was the GC bar the shit control pad.

This loser attitude only came about with the Wii and Iwata's rise.

Nintendo need to lose him quick time! He's sending Nintendo to their doom starting with the WiiU...probably the most pathetic console they've released since the Virtual Boy!

NES - first console to have a dpad
SNES - first console to have shoulder buttons and the still standard diamond face button layout
N64 - Introduced console analog sticks control
as we know it also the first controller with rumble

 

[Brera]

Notice the sales trend, especially on those last two

Nintendo being different is what fucked them up.

If they had stuck to CD like everyone else, PSX would have been defeated, or at the very least it would have been a 50/50 draw.

As soon as they started being "different", they lost!

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Nope.

PS3 isn't a dud simply because it left Sony in a position to continue being competitive in the hardware industry. People have got to stop looking at console generations as islands in themselves, when really they but plays in a much larger game.

Everything Sony did with PS3 has left them in a position to rake in the dough with the PS4, and not just in hardware, but in massive software sales. Sony set themselves up to dominate this gen, and it's thanks to the PS3. Nintendo's thinking how you're thinking, and it is what has lead to this massive fumble in passing the baton.

So that momentum that was completely lost between the PS2 and PS3 is totally not the same thing at all as Wii to Wii U. No way

 

[Schnozberry]

That's BS. Nintendo has more cash reserves than Sony. They can take a loss. Nintendo is in the black. Sony is in the red

It's about more than just cash on hand. Sony as a company had 13.2 billion dolllars in revenue in the last reported financial quarter. Nintendo had 1.5 billion.

 

[qizah]

Then stop competing and become a software company!

Considering that would likely make the quality of their software go down, I'd rather they not.

Iwata is correct in that Nintendo cannot simply just compete based on raw power and matching system capabilities to Sony and Microsoft. They need something different.

They refuse to do both - high specifications and something unique/new - likely because the financial risk to do so is too great. Sony and Microsoft benefit from having multiple business sectors to recoup costs, Nintendo's only back ups are their handheld division and maybe merchandise.

 

[Brera]

NES - first console to have a dpad
SNES - first console to have shoulder buttons and the still standard diamond face button layout
N64 - Introduced console analog sticks control
as we know it also the first controller with rumble

Those were innovations. Not the same as being different.

Wii was a disaster. It made them money in the short term but long term,...look where they are now? Their own fans have abandoned them with the WiiU.

 

[The_Lump]

GC was held back by a crap control pad that made ports hard.

Also...WiiU can only dream of GC style success!

The controller had exactly 1x less button than the competition. How exactly did it stop ports?

And re your 2nd point: That has nothing to do with what I said in my post

Those were innovations. Not the same as being different.

Wii was a disaster. It made them money in the short term but long term,...look where they are now? Their own fans have abandoned them with the WiiU.

Sitting on a tonne of cash? A household name? Honestly, 1x poor product doesn't suddenly negate Wii's success. You can't rewrite history dude.

 

[ASIS]

GC was held back by a crap control pad that made ports hard.

Also...WiiU can only dream of GC style success!

The pad was only missing one button man. It was certainly not the main drawback.

 

[The Technomancer]

Nintendo being different is what fucked them up.

If they had stuck to CD like everyone else, PSX would have been defeated, or at the very least it would have been a 50/50 draw.

As soon as they started being "different", they lost!

Until the Wii, the DS and increasingly the 3DS, at which point them being "different" turned into a big win. The WiiU is a failure in many aspects of its implantation. I don't buy that it was a failure in its conception (and I mean broad conception, above even the controller idea)

 

[royalan]

That's only one approach to competition. You're describing a market research-driven strategy that looks exclusively at existing products and sales and then tries to position and aggressively market a new product with features that fit perfectly within that existing space. Microsoft is very much like this: see what's successful and incorporate it, market it like mad. The alternative is to try and create a new space, or influence the way people purchase and play rather than fitting to their current and known desires. Every company incorporates a bit of each style, but Nintendo--as a smaller company relative to its competitors, and as a toy company by nature--focuses more on trying to shift the market than on trying to pinpoint and match its existing needs.

What you just described is the exact mindset of most toy companies. That "revolutionary toy" that changes the market only comes around once every blue moon. In the meantime, most toy companies make money exactly by positioning themselves firmly within existing spaces. So, I'm not seeing how your stance bodes well for Nintendo in the long run.

 

[SolidSnakex]

GC was held back by a crap control pad that made ports hard.

Also...WiiU can only dream of GC style success!

The GC was hampered because Nintendo's idea of being different that time was releasing a console with discs that only supported 1.5gb of data instead of the 8.5gb that the competing systems supported.

 

[mantidor]

MS and Sony are who you look to for what you'll play.

Nintendo is who you look to for how you'll play.

Their culture and setup is still very much "toy company". People wanting them to stop being Nintendo would be a loss for this industry.

They are all toy companies, Nintendo is the only one that embraces it.

I see it like this, most devs are the kind of toy company that makes action figures, some are cool, like a transformers for instance, others are Max Steel dolls producers, however they all focus on that most of the time, some go to "figurine" status where they think their product is comparable to the David or something, when it's just a very detailed sculpture with little room to play with it. The big publishers are like Hasbro, they have all these licences and have all these action toys companies doing toys for them, toys for that specific demographic.

Nintendo on the other hand makes stuff like rubik cubes.

Gamecube had pretty decent 3rd party support.

I dont think they missed out on any big multiplatform games other then GTA that generation.

And now we live in the parallel reality where the freaking GC had "decent" third party support? lol I don't even...

 

[MagiusNecros]

Those were innovations. Not the same as being different.

Innovation

1. The act of introducing something new.
2. Something newly introduced.


Different

1. Not the same as another or each other; unlike in nature, form, or quality.
2. distinct; separate.


-------------

Well look at that.

 

[Javier]

Those were innovations. Not the same as being different.

An innovation is by default something different.

 

[Tobor]

No they didn't because they cant guarantee every console user also has the 'tablet' controller to take advantage of it's functions. Therefore developers are less likely to waste resources catering to it.

By R&D costs, I'm talking about the streaming tech, which they spent a lot if time/money perfecting by all accounts; not just the screen itself.

It's ironic you wrote "waste resources", as that's exactly what spending time working on Wii U tablet features is. Design anything too involved and the game won't work in off TV play mode anymore. Why would any dev bother trying to come up with something unique?

On the other hand, we're already seeing interesting modes and options through the other consoles tablet apps. Those tablet/phone functions can even work when out of the house, unlike the very limited Wii U pad.

 

[antonz]

What you just described is the exact mindset of most toy companies. That "revolutionary toy" that changes the market only comes around once every blue moon. In the meantime, most toy companies make money exactly by positioning themselves firmly within existing spaces. So, I'm not seeing how your stance bodes well for Nintendo in the long run.

Because they can still make lots of money off software. 3 Games in the Wii Generation alone generated more money than the entire PS1/PS2 generations of Sony.

Nintendo may not hit 5 or 6 billion dollar profit years this time around but if they can still make money. Even the Gamecube era was extremely profitable

 

[JayFalcon]

The gamepad is not a tablet FFS

When I first turned the WiiMote on its side and realized that it was a advanced NES controller I wept with joy

Nintendo are cool ,sure they are taking our money like everyone else but they smile and have manners while doing so.
They also try to entertain the worlds children in good wholesome way with beautiful games like Pikmin , fun games like Mario and the massive nerd fest that is Pokemon.

 

[Mileena]

Then stop competing and become a software company!

This is best case scenario. Be able to play the 2-3 good Nintendo games per year without having to buy abysmal hardware.

 

[NeonZ]

Until the Wii, the DS and increasingly the 3DS, at which point them being "different" turned into a big win. The WiiU is a failure in many aspects of its implantation. I don't buy that it was a failure in its conception (and I mean broad conception, above even the controller idea)

The 3ds didn't succeed by being different though. 3d, its main feature, didn't help it, and Nintendo had to basically eat costs for that, and now is even releasing a model without 3d to lower its price even more. The 3ds was pretty much a failure in its conception, saved by a quick and drastic reaction that cost Nintendo quite a bit.

 

[Brera]

Nintendo used to innovated.

Now they think they need to reinvent the wheel when we just need evolution not revolution. No one wants touch controls No one wants Motion controls.

Nintendo need to get with the program. Just like MS need to lose Kinect, Nintendo need to lose the gamepad...and Iwata.

Nintendo basically have a confidence problem. They need to make a game system. Fuck the competition and their media services.

 

[RobFox64tm]

Yes! Because we should all just be the same, and never try anything new.

 

[Schnozberry]

The GC was hampered because Nintendo's idea of being different that time was releasing a console with discs that only supported 1.5gb of data instead of the 8.5gb that the competing systems supported.

Did the PS2 and OG Xbox support dual layer DVD's? Also, most games of the period were not difficult to fit on GC discs, unless you had seriously long FMV sequences.

 

[DragonSworne]

Not from a developer's perspective. Or even a user's perspective honestly.

Just like Kinect - if I am Nintendo or MS and I want something supported full-stop, I am building my console around it. The Gamepad is not a tacked on piece of the Wii U, it is its central component.

Sony and MS will suffer from developers tacking on second-screen support as an after-thought. The Wii U can have games built entirely around utilizing the WiiPad.

Nintendo is having trouble finding developers to tack on Wii U projects. The idea of whether or not developers will support something like the Gamepad should have been the first question asked and answered when designing the Wii U.

 

[Anth0ny]

That's a really awful excuse.

 

[MagiusNecros]

No one wants touch controls

Tell that to the mobile markets.

 

[methodman]

This is best case scenario. Be able to play the 2-3 good Nintendo games per year without having to buy abysmal hardware.

2 to 3? Word? OK.

Guess all those amazing 3ds and wii u games I've played this year don't count.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

No one wants touch controls.

The hell?

Strong sales of DS, 3DS and Phone games mean nothing?

I'm not convinced the controller is the issue with the WiiU. I think it's more a lack of software and a sophisticated online multiplayer network that hurt it more than a controller (that's actually really cool!)

 

[LiquidMetal14]

Until the Wii, the DS and increasingly the 3DS, at which point them being "different" turned into a big win. The WiiU is a failure in many aspects of its implantation. I don't buy that it was a failure in its conception (and I mean broad conception, above even the controller idea)

Nintendo has a stronghold in the handheld sector. Can't really fault them like their console's in that regard. When it comes to their last 4 console platforms, the situation has gradually worsened in terms of their game output and 3rd party relations. They have only to blame themselves for that so this type of talk by Iwata shows a lack of understanding the current landscape. I'm starting to think that they need someone else to lead the charge because Nintendo can't just get by with just existing and servicing their loyal fans. They need to expand their user base and ultimately make money in the end while making great games with excellent 3rd party support. The latter of which is impossible right now since 3rd parties are not making as many games nor selling as well on WiiU.

You would be foolish to not buy a next gen version of something like AC Black Flag on PS4/Xbone compared to WiiU. This is without comparing the off screen play possible on the next gen PS4 version via Vita. That is now a direct comparison to a feature that WiiU has but is not supported by all the games which is something Sony is pushing for with PS4. This is just one small example of how Nintendo has lost its way but in reality we can all see that just in sales and the general excitement for almost any Nintendo related news. If it was a console with specs and features on part with PS4/Xbone then I would at least give them some leeway but right now it's in the rear view when it comes to that small comparison.

 

[Naminator]

The problem is even if they offered the wiiu that was as powerful as the ps4 with their unique controller for $400 and took a loss on it tons of 3rd party developers would still skip them over out of principal that's it's "Nintendo and only Nintendo games sell"

Dat Nintendo persecution complex, always gets me.

 

[HolyBaikal]

America definitely will and definitely did accept cute monsters.

tumblr is apparently dominated by a few things. Feminism, social justice, gifs, My Little Pony, and cute things. Or so some people have told me. As one of the most popular sites on the internet, that's a pretty big, English speaking, at least, success for cuteness. And I would assume a lot of those English speaking fans

I honestly hate being stereotyped as not being into cute stuff. Plenty of Americans love cute things, and there's plenty of macho media that has come out of Japan. Kyary Jesus, save us, and spread cute throughout the world.

 

[Giant Panda]

Maybe they should try to get better at competing instead of just giving up entirely then. Their hardware isn't even a good bang for its buck (a.k.a. it's not efficient), and their online is horrid. They're going to continue to lose relevance if they have such obvious weaknesses compared to their competitors.

 

[shinra-bansho]

The PS3 was a financial dud; it lost billions upon billions. It was also overengineered and a hassle for developers. Through concerted effort and sinking a crapload of money into it, Sony managed to turn that dud into a success relative to what could have been.

The Vita is also a massive dud. It will be Sony's last effort in the dedicated handheld arena. And they're basically repurposing it as a PS4 accessory; which to their credit is at least some good use of the core technology and R&D.

Why are people talking about the PS3 and/or Vita being a dud though?

 

[evilromero]

GC was held back by a crap control pad that made ports hard.

Also...WiiU can only dream of GC style success!

Who said it was crappy? The GCN pad was my favorite of that gen. The best analog controls by far.

 

[Brera]

The shape and design of the pad was great.

The button layout was disgusting.

 

[Schnozberry]

It's ironic you wrote "waste resources", as that's exactly what spending time working on Wii U tablet features is. Design anything too involved and the game won't work in off TV play mode anymore. Why would any dev bother trying to come up with something unique?

On the other hand, we're already seeing interesting modes and options through the other consoles tablet apps. Those tablet/phone functions can even work when out of the house, unlike the very limited Wii U pad.

The Gamepad is far more likely to create more interesting gameplay experiences if leveraged properly. Tablet apps are far more likely to generate additional revenue. That's the primary difference, and we shouldn't pretend it's anything else.

 

[Mistouze]

Want to put out "new"stuff Nintendo? Keep hiring PlatinumGames.

 

[family_guy]

It's about more than just cash on hand. Sony as a company had 13.2 billion dolllars in revenue in the last reported financial quarter. Nintendo had 1.5 billion.

Revenue and profit are two different things though.

 

[E92 M3]

Yes! Because we should all just be the same, and never try anything new.

I believe that picture is demonstrating that being unique just to be different isn't very efficient.

 

[Majine]

Yes! Because we should all just be the same, and never try anything new.

That's not that what's saying.

 

[JCX]

Nintendo has pretty much never had a technologically bleeding edge console since it started making consoles. NES, SNES, N64, GCN, al of the handhelds, and Wii were all underpowered relative to current tech (SNES/64 were probably closest in their generations, but 64 was limited by cartridges).

 

[hachi]

What you just described is the exact mindset of most toy companies. That "revolutionary toy" that changes the market only comes around once every blue moon. In the meantime, most toy companies make money exactly by positioning themselves firmly within existing spaces. So, I'm not seeing how your stance bodes well for Nintendo in the long run.

True, you have to bring in safe money in order to fund the more adventurous products, but Nintendo does that: Mario platformers, Pokemon, Animal Crossing, and the rest of their standard entries still bring in the revenue right now. But I think they stick to their own safe niches and genres where they still have the advantage, rather than trying to cater to gaming habits and tastes that are outside Nintendo's traditional strengths.

 

[The_Lump]

The shape and design of the pad was great.

The button layout was disgusting.

That didn't prevent any ports though, as you were asserting

 

[prwxv3]

The PS3 was a financial dud; it lost billions upon billions. It was also overengineered and a hassle for developers. Through concerted effort and sinking a crapload of money into it, Sony managed to turn that dud into a success relative to what could have been.

The Vita is also a massive dud. It will be Sony's last effort in the dedicated handheld arena. And they're basically repurposing it as a PS4 accessory; which to their credit is at least some good use of the core technology and R&D.

Why are people talking about the PS3 and/or Vita being a dud though?

The ps3 was a failure in making any money but it's a huge success in building momentum and audience for the ps4. Pretty much the exact oppisite of the Wii which made a shit tone of money but was a failure in building any momentum for the WiiU.

 

[Killing_Joke]

My only gripe with the Wii/Wii U were the last gen specs.

 

[Chû Totoro]

I love gaffers. So many experts I just can't read everything

Thanks for what you do every day for the world and for every gaming company giving your wise advice so they can make the best choices.

I now declare that I won't give my opinion here about something else than what really concerns us : games, systems, accessories.

Everything else is business and it's just shittier discussions every day so I won't participate and I'll just read and laugh. So much fun for free !

 

[God Dayumm]

Tell that to the mobile markets.

That's the issue. Nintendo steered away from competing against MS and Sony and now has to compete against the mobile market

 

[fabprems]

Wii was a disaster

Successful console is a disaster. In what world are you living, again ???

 

[Vinci]

I think you are the only person I've ever heard describe playing the wii as magic. How does that even happen?

I know of at least six people - mostly relatives - who described the Wii using that exact word. You think it got popular because it was dull?

 

[Fabrik]

If Yamauchi will be remembered for playing it loud, Iwata will be remembered for playing it safe. Tired of all the mascot games, give me some of the good old Nintendo arcade racers.

Playing it safe with DS and Wii. Right.