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[Wickerbasket]

It's a disgrace that other outlets don't hold their peers to certain standards. Doing so is throwing others under the bus. If that's the only response you can come up with to that article, it's sad. It means yo believe that writers are complacent, but that you shouldn't criticize peers for being unprofessional, because it may hurt feelings.

I think the majority of the butthurt comes from the us vs them attitude most games "journalists" have; that being the journalists vs the consumers. It confuses them when one of their own stands up for consumers.

You see the same reaction when police officers whistle blow on fellow officers in the US. You're expected to look the other way when your fellow "journalists" shill for companies.

 

[Sir_Crocodile]

Another great article.

Also Tom Hatfield is apparently a moron. Why do people feel the urgent need to make absolute fools of themselves on twitter.

 

[Revven]

That article, IMO, deserves a new thread. It's a great read, too.

 

[antitrop]

I was surprised this thread already did not exist. I read that article linked from Reddit this morning and fully expected a 10 page thread about it already in progress here.

 

[jWILL253]

If only these journalists knew how to be journalists first, gamers second. That's the issue here. It seems all these people see are free trips to E3, free pre-release review copies of games, and a bunch of swag. They think the only way for them to keep all of that going is to thoroughly lick corporate boots.

As far as the article goes, it's a great read. One of the comments below the article stood out to me. It basically said that even with all the BS, SimCity still sold a million copies in two weeks. And that's the bottom line: even with all the negative press, EA stood silent, and people bought the shit anyway. This might have more of an impact on the next SimCity, but as for now, this shit is just idiotically redundant of all EA games...

 

[Sir_Crocodile]

That article, IMO, deserves a new thread. It's a great read, too.

Yeah, or at the least an OP update

 

[Harlock]

Good article. About Sim City selling over a million of copies, I think was low. It was the first month sales, when they sell the highest number. And even with all PC base, years of hype, fans from casual to hardcore gamer, don´t sell that much.

What people need to do now is not buying the next Assassin Creed or Watch Dogs, if these games are online only.

 

[gabbo]

Good to see John keeping the story as alive as he can

 

[Lactose_Intolerant]

Tom needs to step away from the twitter. Please people, stop having debates on twitter.

 

[Jim Sterling]

Always had an admiration for RPS, and Walker's SimCity coverage has totally knocked it out of the park. Good on him for finding ways to keep it alive. I've been mulling over ways to do that for Aliens, myself, and sadly he's right -- publishers and developers can eventually stone-wall the discussion to the point where you need to start inventing reasons to bring it up again, and sadly even one's own readers will get tired of it and start a backlash.

It's hard to be indignant in this business!

 

[chickdigger802]

That article, IMO, deserves a new thread. It's a great read, too.

Then make it!

I would if I still could

 

[SMD]

Always had an admiration for RPS, and Walker's SimCity coverage has totally knocked it out of the park. Good on him for finding ways to keep it alive. I've been mulling over ways to do that for Aliens, myself, and sadly he's right -- publishers and developers can eventually stone-wall the discussion to the point where you need to start inventing reasons to bring it up again, and sadly even one's own readers will get tired of it and start a backlash.

It's hard to be indignant in this business!

I just don't understand the mentality of readers telling journalists to stop chasing something up that's for their own good. In an ideal world, the front page of every professional game site would have a timer showing how long since EA have been asked about why Sim City is such a disgusting piece of shit and why EA treat their consumers so badly until they actually give a satisfactory answer.

Instead it's "SIX REASONS WHY MASS EFFECT 4 WILL REDEFINE THE RPG GENRE AND HOW EA ARE SAVING GAMES" and shite like that.

 

[Moobabe]

I just don't understand the mentality of readers telling journalists to stop chasing something up that's for their own good. In an ideal world, the front page of every professional game site would have a timer showing how long since EA have been asked about why Sim City is such a disgusting piece of shit and why EA treat their consumers so badly until they actually give a satisfactory answer.

Instead it's "SIX REASONS WHY MASS EFFECT 4 WILL REDEFINE THE RPG GENRE AND HOW EA ARE SAVING GAMES" and shite like that.

We just need to hold websites accountable - RPS is the only place I read "news" other than GAF simply because I know 9/10 other publications will have headlines exactly like your final line. Aliens was a disaster: who made it? why did it turn out so badly? Who's to blame? Why are we no closer to knowing any of these answers? Will we ever know?

Sim City is another prime example - people are so afraid to ask questions in case they get blacklisted by publishers and lose income as a result.

 

[Lactose_Intolerant]

Because EA will cut them off

moobabe beat me too it

 

[Sulik2]

That was another fantastic article on RPS. Great insight into how PR works. This needs to get more publicity.

 

[Green Wiggly]

Damn, quickly becoming a John Walker fan here. I'm glad that somebody is calling these journos on their shit.

 

[Moobabe]

Wow, that dude really played the "fellow journalists" card on Walker? As though treating reporting like a good old boys club is in any way good for anyone except the guys sitting right next to each other in some bar buying each other drinks and making sure people keep their jobs regardless of their talent or integrity?

And Walker linking to a Kotaku piece as the best summation of the whole disaster... That tells you something. It's not the name, it's the horrible editors who once worked there and now work at Polygon. They took their total lack of integrity right along with them to the next job.

The only good thing to come out of this whole shambles is now we know which "Journalists" are total hacks, and who, perhaps, have our best interests at heart. I might even buy tickets to Rezzed now just to support RPS (if they get any of the revenue from it?)

 

[SMD]

We just need to hold websites accountable - RPS is the only place I read "news" other than GAF simply because I know 9/10 other publications will have headlines exactly like your final line. Aliens was a disaster: who made it? why did it turn out so badly? Who's to blame? Why are we no closer to knowing any of these answers? Will we ever know?

Sim City is another prime example - people are so afraid to ask questions in case they get blacklisted by publishers and lose income as a result.

If game journos and gamers alike stood firm, dickhead publishers would be the ones losing income.

 

[Sethos]

Who is this Walker guy and why is he so awesome?

 

[Lunar15]

Has anyone ever considered that the reason publishers hold sway over journalists is that there are too many journalists?

It's impossible for one site to gain real leverage when a publisher can just go elsewhere. It's like the industry needs a gatekeeper, but there's a million gates.

 

[Aaron]

As far as the article goes, it's a great read. One of the comments below the article stood out to me. It basically said that even with all the BS, SimCity still sold a million copies in two weeks. And that's the bottom line: even with all the negative press, EA stood silent, and people bought the shit anyway. This might have more of an impact on the next SimCity, but as for now, this shit is just idiotically redundant of all EA games...

SimCity got overwhelmingly positive press and high scoring reviews. The complaints were the minority. Most people either bought it before the bad news surfaced, or are more casual players that never saw the bad news at all. The lesson here is use the press's need to be first with the story and need to have reviews on day one to your advantage, while the negativity that might follow will work itself out.

 

[Moobabe]

If game journos and gamers alike stood firm, dickhead publishers would be the ones losing income.

Most have no interest in asking the questions we, as consumers, want answered though. They're interested in swag, in ad revenue, in paid review trips - and interested in sensationalist headlines and "scoops" about exclusives and Call of Duty DLC.

Who is this Walker guy and why is he so awesome?

"The most hated man in the industry" according to MCV's wonderful editor (if that Parfitt clown is the Editor still.)

 

[pelican]

If only these journalists knew how to be journalists first, gamers second.

I think one hand is sufficient to list gaming "journalists" who actually have the ability to do what it says on the tin. The vast majority, as you say, see free trips, E3 and blag as some form of credibility check.

Perhaps I am biased, but the strongest examples of questioning, interesting and non conforming articles come from the British press. RPS, Eurogamer (e.g. dorito), dtoid (Jim Sterling), and Edge all are responsible for publishing quality articles questioning and informing us on the various unattractive aspects of the industry.

Note, I'm not saying UK sites are perfect because they aren't. Neither am I saying all US sites are awful. However I think we all agree that the biggest culprits in dragging down this side of the industry are from such sites as Kotaku, IGN, and Polygon.

 

[Sethos]

"The most hated man in the industry" according to MCV's wonderful editor (if that Parfitt clown is the Editor still.)

I'm guessing it's because he calls it as he sees it?

 

[Jim Sterling]

I'm guessing it's because he calls it as he sees it?

It's not true, anyway. Walker has a lot of respect from a lot of media folks. He may be hated by some, but definitely not a majority.

 

[CheesecakeRecipe]

I'm guessing it's because he calls it as he sees it?

Pretty much that, it's a bullshit claim against Walker who is doing is goddamn job.

EDIT: Beaten by Jim, another man who catches flack for bringing the heat but again, is not the most hated man in the industry by a longshot.

 

[jschreier]

RPS isn't perfect, but considering the breadth of PC games it does cover, it is one of the few of its kind. Otherwise, you'll only really find loud criticism of something like Mass Effect on an RPG focused site. It's very hard to get a balance between wide coverage and integrity.

Dunno what you're talking about.
http://kotaku.com/5892676/why-mass-effect-3s-ending-was-so-terrible
http://kotaku.com/5898743/mass-effect-3s-ending-disrespects-its-most-invested-players

 

[Moobabe]

I'm guessing it's because he calls it as he sees it?

That exact reason - he's hated for doing journalism and not copy-pasting PR emails.

 

[Moobabe]

It's interesting to think about what guys like Jim and Jason think of this issue:

If sites like Dtoid, Kotaku, RPS etc were to put pressure on EA for answers could they realistically remain silent? How much sway do you guys have with big publishers, if any?

Is IGN still the biggest site in terms of traffic?

It'd be interesting to hear from a bunch of other sites on this "silence" issue.

 

[JDSN]

Hey, I already praised the turnaround in reputation of your site a few posts up, what more do you want from me?

He just want to link his stuff, as usual.

 

[Moobabe]

He just want to link his stuff, as usual.

It worked; I clicked on both!

 

[antitrop]

Aren't those always the guys who get the shit end? When he finally gets fed up and moves on to writing comics for Marvel or dialogue for Valve or whatever, you'll hear endlessly about how great he was. Including from the people who didn't "get" him or hated him.

You have to understand who the person was that attributed the "most hated person in the industry" title to Walker, because that person himself could actually take that title. Easily one of the scummiest human beings in all of games journalism.

 

[StevePharma]

Dunno what you're talking about.
Clickbait
Clickbait 2

You balanced that with Mass Effect week.

When is Elder Scrolls week? Or Call of Duty week?

Spoiler

I kid I kid

 

[Moobabe]

You have to understand who the person was that attributed the "most hated person in the industry" title to Walker, because that person himself could actually take that title. Easily one of the scummiest human beings in all of games journalism.

Yep - MCV isn't worth the paper it's printed on.

 

[jWILL253]

I think one hand is sufficient to list gaming "journalists" who actually have the ability to do what it says on the tin. The vast majority, as you say, see free trips, E3 and blag as some form of credibility check.

Perhaps I am biased, but the strongest examples of questioning, interesting and non conforming articles come from the British press. RPS, Eurogamer (e.g. dorito), dtoid (Jim Sterling), and Edge all are responsible for publishing quality articles questioning and informing us on the various unattractive aspects of the industry.

Note, I'm not saying UK sites are perfect because they aren't. Neither am I saying all US sites are awful. However I think we all agree that the biggest culprits in dragging down this side of the industry are from such sites as Kotaku, IGN, and Polygon.

I think it's safe to say that. I agree that Europe seems to go about things the right way.

I also think Kotaku I'd pretty decent. But, I adjust think they suffer from a case of PatriciaHernandezItis...

 

[xenist]

I think it's safe to say that. I agree that Europe seems to go about things the right way.

It's because in Europe being distrustful of corporations isn't seen as some horrible mental defect. It's actually a pretty big problem for me when it comes to both general public and press opinions that come from the US.

 

[jschreier]

It's interesting to think about what guys like Jim and Jason think of this issue:

If sites like Dtoid, Kotaku, RPS etc were to put pressure on EA for answers could they realistically remain silent? How much sway do you guys have with big publishers, if any?

Is IGN still the biggest site in terms of traffic?

It'd be interesting to hear from a bunch of other sites on this "silence" issue.

For starters, we haven't been silent about SimCity: http://kotaku.com/happy-one-month-anniversary-simcity-hows-it-going-470912279

But, really, the reason you haven't seen many sites continue to cover the game is that there's not a whole lot of news to cover. "EA lied to us and still won't admit it!" is not a very interesting story. When a publisher lies, it's our job to call them out, yes, but that news cycle has ended. We can't just talk about it every week. (Although, on second thought, a weekly post called "EA IS STILL LYING" might be kind of hilarious.)

That's not to say I disagree with John's post. I was just talking to him about it on IM - I agree with everything he wrote, although RPS is just as guilty as anybody when it comes to letting the story disappear. (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/tag/simcity/)

The best move from here isn't to keep pressing EA on SimCity: it's to press publishers even harder on the next game, and the next online-only scheme, and the next incident of someone saying "It's an MMO!" The lesson to learn, IMO, is not that we should all continue to talk about SimCity: it's that we shouldn't let something like SimCity happen again.

 

[antitrop]

It's because in Europe being distrustful of corporations isn't seen as some horrible mental defect. It's actually a pretty big problem for me when it comes to both general public and press opinions that come from the US.

This is borderline trolling.

 

[AcceptableGhost]

man if I was EA I would have hired arthur gies on the spot. a true EA warrior (tears in the eye).

 

[Wickerbasket]

man if I was EA I would have hired arthur gies on the spot. a true EA warrior (tears in the eye).

They're better keeping him at his current position, they should give him a raise though.

 

[SneakyStephan]

This is amazing.

"I didn't want to name anyone specifically to avoid throwing specific outfits under the bus"

"Name five media outfits specifically"

"OK..."

"OMG you're throwing oufits under the bus!"

I would pay money to kick tom hatfield in the crotch.

 

[AcceptableGhost]

They're better keeping him at his current position, they should give him a raise though.

true, like an EA sleeper agent

 

[SMD]

Most have no interest in asking the questions we, as consumers, want answered though. They're interested in swag, in ad revenue, in paid review trips - and interested in sensationalist headlines and "scoops" about exclusives and Call of Duty DLC.

If they had no clicks, no readers and no influence then the swag and ad revenue would dry up.

Ultimately it's down to us and so far it's been a resounding "yes please" to taking EA's shaft fully.

 

[JDSN]

It's because in Europe being distrustful of corporations isn't seen as some horrible mental defect. It's actually a pretty big problem for me when it comes to both general public and press opinions that come from the US.

I dont think that makes them inmune to PR journalists.

How many sites have been reporting the horrid ads-ons that they have included? Or that Polygon quietly upped to the score of the game for a third time last month?

 

[antitrop]

I dont think that makes them inmune to PR journalists.

How many sites have been reporting the horrid ads-ons that they have included? Or that Polygon quietly upped to the score of the game for a third time last month?

9.5 -> 8.0 -> 4.0 -> 6.5

Polygon is such a joke.

 

[eot]

Dunno what you're talking about.
http://kotaku.com/5892676/why-mass-effect-3s-ending-was-so-terrible
http://kotaku.com/5898743/mass-effect-3s-ending-disrespects-its-most-invested-players

Yes I remember that you guys actually discussed the ending instead of starting a war against your own readers like a lot of sites. Ugh, just thinking about how most sites covered that makes me ill.

 

[Flying Toaster]

9.5 -> 8.0 -> 4.0 -> 6.5

Polygon is such a joke.

They are testing their new scoring system that flows up and down depending on critical reception.

 

[RobbieH]

9.5 -> 8.0 -> 4.0 -> 6.5

Polygon is such a joke.

What's worse is they said it'll go back up to 9.5 when the servers are fully fixed.

 

[TalesOfWin]

this walker guy is telling anyone he doesnt agree with to "go away"

real mature.

 

[Kadayi]

What people need to do now is not buying the next Assassin Creed or Watch Dogs, if these games are online only.

Why would they be? Ubisoft dropped the always on DRM about two years ago.