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[Windu]

When done right they are fucking awesome. I hope all the next generation consoles have them.

 

[ksamedi]

The potential of motion sensing is amazing, some games that truly delivered because of them in my opinion are,

WiiSports: the most complex interaction with a sports game, even though many call it shallow because you can't walk, nothing can be further from the truth.

Mario Galaxy: excellent pointer mechanics, just about right for the game. I especially liked the parts where you had to catapult yourself with the pointer.

Pro evo socces 08: The best innovation in the soccer genre. Plays great.

Metroid Prime 3: Proves how good a Wii FPS game can be if the developer spends some time with it.

Bloom Blox: Even though I got bored of the game really quick, Bloom Blox shows the potential for more fleshed out action/advanture games starring telekinetic main characters. The interaction with the game is amazing.

Other noteworthy mentions are Wario Ware, Lost Winds, Excite truck.

 

[stuminus3]

Thread needs more SSX Blur.

Ubermoves might be a little nasty, but carving with the nunchuk is one of the most sublime experiences I've had this generation.

 

[Version 3.0]

I see a lot of "Pointer good, motion control bad" responses here. You're all forgetting the third part: tilt.

The pointer is absolutely great, the best part of the combo.

Tilt is also nice, but as a substitution for an analog stick, it's hit-and-miss. Monkey Ball was ruined by it, but Kororinpa couldn't be done without it. Excite Truck was also awesome. It's especially good in conjuction with the pointer, (see: leaning out from cover or zooming with the sniper rifle--or both at the same time--in Medal of Honor Heroes 2).

The actual "motion sensing" part of "motion controls" is mostly broken. It only functions really well as the hated "shake for button press". You're lucky if it even senses the direction you moved, much less how far or how fast. The tech seems to be there...I think, but the programming isn't. Obviously this is the hard part of the whole package. Right now, I actually prefer that developers don't try anything too ambitious, because it isn't working very well. Metroid Prime's grapple beam, or Boom Blox's different strength throws, is about as complicated as I've seen that still works. Real golf swings = yeah, right.

 

[jjasper]

Thread needs more SSX Blur.

Ubermoves might be a little nasty, but carving with the nunchuk is one of the most sublime experiences I've had this generation.

Yeah everything about SSX was great except the ubertricks. Unfortunately not being able to pull them off consistently ruined the game for me.

 

[davepoobond]

I like playing while laying on the couch. Waggle controls demand I sit or even stand.

sorry, no lazy gamers are allowed to play games anymore.

its like playing a sport -- you cant sit down while playing basketball! you're on the bench, and no one's going to be paying attention to you.

 

[CTLance]

sorry, no lazy gamers are allowed to play games anymore.

I know you're being facetious, but I can honestly say that the two-piece controller of the Wii is one of the most comfortable setups I've ever encountered. Being free to position your left hand and to a certain degree even the right hand is certainly nothing to scoff at.

Sure, there are some games (Pangya etc) where you just have to get up and be active, but many games can be played while lazing around most comfortably. Motion controls do not necessitate an active playstyle.

 

[LunaticPuma]

Why did Nintendo decide to have the nunchuck wired to the wiimote? Stupidest choice they made for their controller design.

 

[agrajag]

I thought the motion controls in Metroid Prime 3 were pretty broken. The pointer worked great, and the parts inside the ship were cool as well, if unnecessary. However, the gesture based actions in the game were poor I thought. Many times the game wouldn't recognize my movements, other times Samus's arm would turn in the opposite direction of what I was intending to do. Motion controls can be very frustrating that way. I'm not sure if this can really be remedied next generation either. What would it take, better hardware? Or better programming? I don't know. What's bothersome is every time I read a glowing preview on IGN with Matt Cassamassina going "the controls are great, the game recognizes my movements 99% of the time." Well, the 1% failure rate is 1% too much.

I also hate the delay between your motion and the character's motion in most 3rd party games. Wii Sports didn't have that thanks to its pseudo 1:1 presentation, but for some reason no 3rd party games have been able to repeat that. Nor even other Nintendo teams. I would love to have a Zelda game which had pseudo 1:1 controls rather than the random button-press-mapped-to-waggle in TP which kills all immersion.

The Wiimote can detect speed, right? So have Link's sword track your motions 1:1 when you move it slowly and have a set of canned animations for when you make a real slash. Ala Wii Baseball. At least recognize if you're swinging from right-to-left, left-to-right, down-up, and up-down and have canned annimations for each.That would be infinitely superior and more immersive to what they did in TP, which was just lazy.

 

[El-Suave]

I would very probably buy Resident Evil 5 for 360 if it featured Wii like motion controls even though I usually buy multiplatform games on PS3 by now.
That alone would probably justify the controller for me.
It would also be interesting to see what FPS developers might do with it. Since it wouldn't be the B-teams that usually worked on the Wii ports, results might be quite cool.

 

[Windu]

I thought the motion controls in Metroid Prime 3 were pretty broken. The pointer worked great, and the parts inside the ship were cool as well, if unnecessary. However, the gesture based actions in the game were poor I thought. Many times the game wouldn't recognize my movements, other times Samus's arm would turn in the opposite direction of what I was intending to do. Motion controls can be very frustrating that way. I'm not sure if this can really be remedied next generation either. What would it take, better hardware? Or better programming? I don't know. What's bothersome is every time I read a glowing preview on IGN with Matt Cassamassina going "the controls are great, the game recognizes my movements 99% of the time." Well, the 1% failure rate is 1% too much.

I also hate the delay between your motion and the character's motion in most 3rd party games. Wii Sports didn't have that thanks to its pseudo 1:1 presentation, but for some reason no 3rd party games have been able to repeat that. Nor even other Nintendo teams. I would love to have a Zelda game which had pseudo 1:1 controls rather than the random button-press-mapped-to-waggle in TP which kills all immersion.

The Wiimote can detect speed, right? So have Link's sword track your motions 1:1 when you move it slowly and have a set of canned animations for when you make a real slash. Ala Wii Baseball. At least recognize if you're swinging from right-to-left, left-to-right, down-up, and up-down and have canned annimations for each.That would be infinitely superior and more immersive to what they did in TP, which was just lazy.

All of the motion aspects of MP3 worked great for me. I think you just suck..

 

[Christine]

I am going to seperate waggle and IR, because i have different opinions on both.

You can separate pointing from gestural input, but keep in mind that they both rely on the accelerometers.

 

[agrajag]

All of the motion aspects of MP3 worked great for me. I think you just suck..

Wow, you quoted my entire post just to troll me? You're a bright one.

 

[agrajag]

You can separate pointing from gestural input, but keep in mind that they both rely on the accelerometers.

No, the pointer relies on the sensor bar, it's all IR.

 

[jjasper]

I thought the motion controls in Metroid Prime 3 were pretty broken. The pointer worked great, and the parts inside the ship were cool as well, if unnecessary. However, the gesture based actions in the game were poor I thought. Many times the game wouldn't recognize my movements, other times Samus's arm would turn in the opposite direction of what I was intending to do. Motion controls can be very frustrating that way.

I had problems with it too as well as sometimes the grappling hook not throwing when I would make the motion.

 

[agrajag]

I had problems with it too as well as sometimes the grappling hook not throwing when I would make the motion.

Shit, well it worked great for Windu, you must just SUCK!

 

[Schwowsers]

I would have loved the stuff like rotating locks in Metroid Prime 3 if they didn't explicity tell you exactly what to do everytime you came upon a lock. Motion controls like those could be really immersive, but I feel the flashing directions take away from that.

 

[Christine]

No, the pointer relies on the sensor bar, it's all IR.

No, the IR is the primary data source, but it is continuously calibrated by the accelerometer function. To test this, play a pointer game, then move the remote off-screen, quickly invert it (so that the B trigger is on top) and point at the screen again. The accelerometers aren't nearly as fast as the IR, so you will see the pointer appear in one position briefly and then rotate around the center of the screen to its correct position once the accelerometer data from the new orientation has arrived.

I had problems with it too as well as sometimes the grappling hook not throwing when I would make the motion.

That was - probably - because you weren't in a valid grapple range. It doesn't work if you're too close or too far away from the target. IIRC, there's an icon that shows if the enemy can be grappled and it lights if you're in the proper ranges. They probably should have made a failure animation for this case to let people know that they were triggering the motion properly.

 

[Stink]

Pretty sure the pointing can be useable without the accelerometers if you just want pointing without tilt. Pretty sure this is how it works on the PC.

Seriously, I'd trade the waggle for a couple of extra buttons.

 

[Threi]

You can separate pointing from gestural input, but keep in mind that they both rely on the accelerometers.

?

no they dont.

*edit*

:O i didn't know that.

my stance is still the same though.

 

[rollingstart]

Pointer != Motion controls

Pointer good
Motion control meh

I agree with this.

Pointer has shown to be great in many games while motion is only sometimes fun, but most of the times awkward or can be done better with traditional controls. Biggest problem is how inaccurate they are most of the time.

 

[kame-sennin]

Great post OP. But I'm surprised that Wii Fit isn't on the list. While the balance board doesn't have motion sensors per se, I think it's pretty accurate to say that Wii Fit is controlled by the player's motion. More interestingly, for all the talk of "pointer controls rock, motion controls suck", the sensitivity and accuracy of the balance board is unparalleled. Anyone who's actually played Wii Fit (especially the skiing and marble games) will tell you how accurate and immersive the game can be.

Personally, I'd like to see how the balance board can enhance the pointer and motion controls of the Wii remote for more traditional games. For instance, an FPS that allows you to duck behind - and lean around - cover.

sorry, no lazy gamers are allowed to play games anymore.

its like playing a sport -- you cant sit down while playing basketball! you're on the bench, and no one's going to be paying attention to you.

I know you're being sarcastic, but I've always dreamed of having a Star Trek holodeck. And in the holodeck, you don't sit. You have to run and jump and fight and shoot, and it's awesome. To me, any console that even takes a tiny step towards that goal is worth owning.

 

[Amir0x]

The inherently unpredictable and finicky nature of the wiimote makes it an flawed control standard for many, many genres and this is where much of the hate comes from.

So far, I have seen it improve only three things (well two, since one is a variation)

1. Extremely niche puzzle games like Zack & Wiki and Boom Blox
2. Pure aiming titles (and not even improve OVER lightgun, for example, just over traditional controllers. And still far inferior to mouse+keyboard)
3. PES 2008 (which really uses a variation of pointer/aiming)

In the genres it does tread into that aren't among the above, it is the ones which seem almost embarrassed to use it in any substantive way that come out on top. Because you're not pandering to the gesture obsessed set who care more about playing pretend and fapping to their imagine land than precision and efficiency.

In Mario Galaxy, you wiggle a bit and scoop up (essentially AIM AT, one of the few wiimote strengths) star bits. And that's it. Everything else is relegated to traditional controls. And it mainly works by magic - were it not for the talented folks behind the game, it probably would have been a disaster without its camera control. Fortunately Nintendo is one of the only developers who can make a camera system that works completely without help.

No More Heroes is the same. Relegate waggle to an extremely specific event - finishing moves or bodyslamming for example - and you'll satisfy the bitter "I'M SO TIRED OF GAMES INNOVATE FOR INNOVATION SAKE PLZ" crowd while still catering to the hardcore market. The thing is, its waggle couldn't help it be anything more than the explicitly buggy repetition fest with awkward geek humour that it ended up being.

I am not against waggle in principle, because it is obvious one day the full evolution is to remove control interface entirely. But this is a helluva stop gap, one that is full of flaws and needs dramatic reimagining to be competent for 90% of genres. At least, compared to traditional controls.

We've gone over my arguments against the tech demo shallow crap that was Wii Sports, so we'll avoid that for this topic.

 

[Christine]

Pretty sure the pointing can be useable without the accelerometers if you just want pointing without tilt. Pretty sure this is how it works on the PC.

I'm pretty sure you're wrong. Every interface script I've looked at for desktop mousing or FPS is polling the accelerometers.

Seriously, I'd trade the waggle for a couple of extra buttons.

This is a different conversation entirely.

 

[RockmanWhore]

I really like motion controls when they are subtly implemented to improve standard controls. I really like what Uncharted and Ratchet & Clank and Resistance have implemented them. Shaking the controller to pull away enemies is more natural than mashing the buttons for example. Modifying the curve of the grenade or behind able do jump back without having to worry about the camera angle also help.

The new Wario game looks very appealing to me either, using it to shake things and tilting stuff seems pretty fun and doesn't sound lame at all, if anything it sound more natural than using a stick.

But my main concern with motion controls is that the neutral position is the hardest to reach, staying steady can be hard if the controls are too sensible (like in Monkey Ball Banana Blitz), and they're not fun when the dead zone is too big.

What I hate is when moves are used to replace buttons, it makes game more complex to play than they would be with buttons, see Call of Duty 3 or Red Steel.

I think that motion controls still have a long way to go to be truly efficient. I can never make forward/backward movement efficiently with the Wii Wiimote, and the sensor bar is very annoying. I seem to praise the Sixaxis in my post here, but the shape of the controller isn't adapted to motion controls at all. I hope that MS or Sony have something to show in E3 that will blow away the competition. They can't add any more buttons, so motion controls is the only way to go. Pads haven't evolved much since the PS2, it's getting old.

 

[Staccat0]

I like motion controls when they are done correctly, but thats a rather stupid statement.
Honestly does anyone here like 3d cameras when poorly implemented? What about button presses?
"tap a rapidly to make your character run" is just as obnoxious as "waggle to run"
Motion controls are new and devs are taking a long time to get used to them. So are gamers.
For example, when TP was first shown many Nfans were angry that the sword wasnt controlled by waggle. Now they regret the changes made.
Like 3d cameras and thumbsticks everyone involved is gonna need some time to figure it all out.

I like playing while laying on the couch. Waggle controls demand I sit or even stand.

Not as a rule.

P.S. Zach and Wiki was a great game, but the motion controls were ass.

 

[Danthrax]

I'd like to second the motions that 1) light gun games like Ghost Squad are awesome and more accessible price-wise with the Wiimote, and 2) the "center" for the accellerometers is too hard to find. I'm speaking specifically of Mario Kart Wii, which is ridiculously hard to control because it's hard to find that center point.

I'm not sure how to fix the center point issue, though, unless there were a weight inside the controller that gives you tactile feedback where the center point is.

For example, when TP was first shown many Nfans were angry that the sword wasnt controlled by waggle. Now they regret the changes made.

When TP was first shown, it was for GameCube. No one knew of waggle at all. But, you know, technicalities.

 

[Scribble]

Wiimote is extremely fun on Budokai Tenkaichi 3. Can't go back.

 

[kame-sennin]

I like motion controls when they are done correctly, but thats a rather stupid statement.
Honestly does anyone here like 3d cameras when poorly implemented? What about button presses?
"tap a rapidly to make your character run" is just as obnoxious as "waggle to run"
Motion controls are new and devs are taking a long time to get used to them. So are gamers.
For example, when TP was first shown many Nfans were angry that the sword wasnt controlled by waggle. Now they regret the changes made.
Like 3d cameras and thumbsticks everyone involved is gonna need some time to figure it all out.

This is a very sensible post.

 

[Vinci]

Wiimote is extremely fun on Budokai Tenkaichi 3. Can't go back.

I completely forgot about that game, and you're right. It is fun.

 

[Man God]

I can never remember how to throw in BT3 using the Wiimote controls. I can do it just fine in BT2 however.

Another absolutely mindblowingly awesome feature that has been overlooked when talking about the Wii controls: One handed RPG play. I love that control scheme for FE:RD.

Madden '07 is also the most fun I've ever had playing videogame football. It's a shame that '08 didn't live up to it, but they got the same wacky guys doing '09, so all might be well.

 

[Amir0x]

P.S. Zach and Wiki was a great game, but the motion controls were ass.

EXPANSION: Zack & Wiki was a problem with implementation, not conception. Zack & Wiki's ability to use motion controls and think in 3D allowed for lateral puzzles that really challenged the cranium from areas that we as gamers are not used to exploring. And it is made possible only with wiimote. The actual implementation and functionality was weak, but I suspect (judging by how simple most of the motions were) that it is Capcom's fault, not wiimote's.

 

[stewacide]

Corruption is possibly the smoothest controlling game I've ever played, although that's due to the pointer.

In particular the visor-switching 'radial menu' was BRILLIANT. **EVERY** Wii game should use that wherever it can (radial menus are something people have been hyping on the PC for years, but that was the first time I really saw/felt the advantage).

/ot

 

[BlackTyrano]

The actual "motion sensing" part of "motion controls" is mostly broken. It only functions really well as the hated "shake for button press". You're lucky if it even senses the direction you moved, much less how far or how fast. The tech seems to be there...I think, but the programming isn't. Obviously this is the hard part of the whole package. Right now, I actually prefer that developers don't try anything too ambitious, because it isn't working very well. Metroid Prime's grapple beam, or Boom Blox's different strength throws, is about as complicated as I've seen that still works. Real golf swings = yeah, right.

I completely disagree with that. More developers need to implement the motion controls such that learning proper use of it is a proper element of the game's balance. Most games now seem to be too afraid to make using the motion consequential to the gameplay, instead making it require no skill to use(shaking or "waggle") or a reward for otherwise doing well in the game(NMH), rather than a challenge. That's boring and doesn't do much toward fulfilling the potential of motion control as an element of the core gameplay. I'm hoping that we'll see some proper integration of motion control into the game's balance from Treasure's 2 Wii titles or possibly Fragile.

Pointer controls' uses are more obvious and it's been handled great in games like Trauma Center, PES, and Metroid Prime. Still, there's more potential to be mined there, I think.

 

[dork]

I will go back to PC gaming if the next systems are motion controlled.

THey are tacky, stupid, pointless, and will take away from the game I think.

Look at the ps3, half the games that use the motion..people disable it anyway. Warhawk and Nba 2k for example.

 

[Version 3.0]

I completely disagree with that. More developers need to implement the motion controls such that learning proper use of it is a proper element of the game's balance. Most games now seem to be too afraid to make using the motion consequential to the gameplay, instead making it require no skill to use(shaking or "waggle") or a reward for otherwise doing well in the game(NMH), rather than a challenge. That's boring and doesn't do much toward fulfilling the potential of motion control as an element of the core gameplay. I'm hoping that we'll see some proper integration of motion control into the game's balance from Treasure's 2 Wii titles or possibly Fragile.

Pointer controls' uses are more obvious and it's been handled great in games like Trauma Center, PES, and Metroid Prime. Still, there's more potential to be mined there, I think.

Totally not what I meant. I meant I prefer limited motion sensing to more advanced, but broken, motion sensing. In other words, if you can't make it work, then don't try. A good example is SSX. They put in these complicated motions, and they don't work. Ever. For the sake of the game, I'd have preferred to "hold A and shake" for uber trick 1, "hold Z and shake" for uber trick 2, etc.

Of course I'd like to see better controls, and of course we will as the better developers learn how to program it properly. But I don't want to play games with poor controls while they learn.

 

[Vinci]

Look at the ps3, half the games that use the motion..people disable it anyway. Warhawk and Nba 2k for example.

That's because motion was an afterthought for Sony, not one of the core principles their entire system is based upon.

 

[Version 3.0]

I will go back to PC gaming if the next systems are motion controlled.

THey are tacky, stupid, pointless, and will take away from the game I think.

Look at the ps3, half the games that use the motion..people disable it anyway. Warhawk and Nba 2k for example.

1. You may as well pack.
2. Of course tacked-on "me too" motion controls suck. That's no argument.

There's a difference between bad controls and good controls, whether it's motion control or just "normal" controls.

Why is it that bad "normal" controls = bad game

but

bad motion controls = would've been a good game if it had normal controls

 

[Gokurakumaru]

What the heck is it with people who can't distinguish between a gyroscope and an IR camera? The Wii's pointer is hands down its best feature if only because it's good for on-screen keyboard and fantastic for point and shoot games.

I've yet to see more than a handful of waggle games that play well. Pangya was good. Excite Truck was so-so (functional but inferior to analog). Wii Tennis was rubbish because you couldn't even control your player, but bowling was fun. Everything else I've played has been pointless. Waggle quick-time events, waggle sword fighting.

Motion controls can go to hell. MS and Sony should be mounting cameras on the front of their controllers and forgetting the gyros.

 

[Death_Born]

I know you're being sarcastic, but I've always dreamed of having a Star Trek holodeck. And in the holodeck, you don't sit. You have to run and jump and fight and shoot, and it's awesome. To me, any console that even takes a tiny step towards that goal is worth owning.

The holodeck is pretty much impossible, without incredibly sophisticated nanotech which I cannot explain, but suffice it to say that the very ground you walk on would have to be spontaneously created, kind of like a real-life rendering engine.

It would be easier to expect a virtual world in which events take place, rather than a hologram that does essentially the same thing with more effort and ridiculous technology.

Totally not what I meant. I meant I prefer limited motion sensing to more advanced, but broken, motion sensing. In other words, if you can't make it work, then don't try. A good example is SSX. They put in these complicated motions, and they don't work. Ever. For the sake of the game, I'd have preferred to "hold A and shake" for uber trick 1, "hold Z and shake" for uber trick 2, etc.

Of course I'd like to see better controls, and of course we will as the better developers learn how to program it properly. But I don't want to play games with poor controls while they learn.

The future of motion controls is NOT tacked-on motion controls.

Motion control is meant to be an actual motion control. Say you're swinging a sword, the sword is meant to swing EXACTLY like the remote.

Having a remote with an accelerometer is not true motion control, it's just a MOTION-ACTIVATED control. The Wii uses motion-activated controls. The only true motion control is the infrared pointing sensor, therefore it works best for shooting games. Sadly, there is a dearth of good shooting, rail or otherwise, games on the Wii.

A real motion control would have much more advanced sensors. Position tracking in real time.

 

[BlackTyrano]

Totally not what I meant. I meant I prefer limited motion sensing to more advanced, but broken, motion sensing. In other words, if you can't make it work, then don't try. A good example is SSX. They put in these complicated motions, and they don't work. Ever. For the sake of the game, I'd have preferred to "hold A and shake" for uber trick 1, "hold Z and shake" for uber trick 2, etc.

Of course I'd like to see better controls, and of course we will as the better developers learn how to program it properly. But I don't want to play games with poor controls while they learn.

Yeah, I guess I'd be fine with most developers using traditional controls(or traditional controls with a few motion flourishes) or pointer+analog controls, which I still think are great for a lot of games. But I'd like at least a few games to attempt to implement more advanced and rewarding motion controls, even if it's just 5% of the games being made in the short term.

 

[agrajag]

I'm with everyone who is singing praises for the pointer. Waggle is a cool added bonus, if done correctly, but at this point I feel the pointer is an absolute necessity in any next gen control interface. There are so many applications to it. Even a simple thing such as using the pointer to navigate the menus in a JRPG is something that makes things so much more convenient. Not only that, but the Wii pointer facilitated new and creative ways to approach game design. Could PES controls have been done on PCs with mouse control years ago? Sure. But no one thought about this intuitive way to do soccer video games until the Wii came around and forced developers to approach things differently.

Also, something must be said for the split controler. To me, it just feels great and really ergonomic. I never want to go back to a traditional controler after the remote and nunchuck. And you sort of need it to use the pointer functionality effectively. The pointer just wouldn't feel right if you tried to control it with both hands.

 

[Ganondorf>Link]

Great choices on the games. There's others that are good, but they're not done nearly as well as they could have been. DBZ BT3 comes to mind, the motion controls make the game a lot more fun, however, they don't work anywhere near perfectly. Its quite likely that someone who is playing with a classic controller and is decent or ok at the game would beat someone who is pretty good at the game but uses the Wiimote + nunchuck. I think if they made a DBZ game for that was built for the Wii (and motion controls), that is not a port, it could turn out to be really fucking awesome.

SSX Blur was really cool too, but the ubertricks were a bitch. Loved the carving controls though, they nailed em.

 

[Bearillusion]

I know you're being facetious, but I can honestly say that the two-piece controller of the Wii is one of the most comfortable setups I've ever encountered. Being free to position your left hand and to a certain degree even the right hand is certainly nothing to scoff at.

Sure, there are some games (Pangya etc) where you just have to get up and be active, but many games can be played while lazing around most comfortably. Motion controls do not necessitate an active playstyle.

Yes you're right when it's possible. It's not possible with Wii Sports or MP3 though. I much prefer playing Hot Shots Golf PS3 slumped on my counch than standing up playing Wii Sports Golf.

 

[Gwanatu T]

What I find nicest about the addition of motion controls, much like the DS's 2 screens, microphone and touch capabilities, is that developers don't have to use them. There are some genres and specific games in certain genres that just will never work with motion controls. I haven't played DBZ Budokai T3, but I just can't imagine it being any fun at all after playing DBZ Budokai T2. All the games you mentioned are wonderful examples of motion and pointer control done right, and there are even more games on the system where it's just plainly done wrong. Many examples are in this thread, there's no need for me to repeat them, but it's nice to see companies keeping old style gameplay and not trying to tack on motion or pointer control just for the sake of doing it. Nintendo has shown that you don't have to have these to make a great game, and it's done so on both the Wii with stuff like Smash Bros Brawl and on the DS with stuff like NSMB.

 

[vareon]

I'm with the "No More Heroes is brilliant" train. It is satisfying to deal only the finishing blow myself with motion controls. Waggle to swing sword made Soul Calibur Legend a pain in my arm, and it made me worrying about battles in Force Unleashed or The Clone Wars.

 

[Version 3.0]

Motion control is meant to be an actual motion control. Say you're swinging a sword, the sword is meant to swing EXACTLY like the remote.

It's been discussed to death, but here it is again anyway: that would completely ruin a game, because now you've removed the game's ability to do anything other than what you do. Now you have to be an expert fencer to pretend to be a Jedi, you really do have to get up and jump around like all the uninformed people keep saying, etc. Like I said, it's been talked into the ground already. 1:1 is never going to happen, and thank god. There is a happy middle ground.

Having a remote with an accelerometer is not true motion control, it's just a MOTION-ACTIVATED control. The Wii uses motion-activated controls.
A real motion control would have much more advanced sensors. Position tracking in real time.

That's not quite true. Sure, most games have "motion-activated" control, that's the "waggle=button press" that's very common. But there is stuff that tracks beyond "it moved" already, and certainly the remote CAN tell which direction it's moved and how far and how fast, but who knows with what precision. Obviously it's not as precise as having a bunch of sensors set up around your house like they do with professional motion capture, but it seems pretty capable, enough to drive a good game with compelling motion commands. I think it's the programming side that's falling on its face.

 

[Version 3.0]

Yes you're right when it's possible. It's not possible with Wii Sports or MP3 though. I much prefer playing Hot Shots Golf PS3 slumped on my counch than standing up playing Wii Sports Golf.

Wii Sports, yes, you do kind of have to stand up. But Prime 3? No. I've been re-playing it the last few days, and I'm slumped across the couch with one leg up and my nunchuck hand almost upside-down half the time. You just have to be able to point effectively. It's not as if the game is using tilt for anything.

Now, Medal of Honor H2 is a game where you have to sit pretty upright, and keep your hands in position. But it's a small price to pay for the best FPS control scheme I've ever used.

 

[Meesh]

Awesome thread. I'm pro motion controls, if only because we haven't a game that uses them in a significant manner...I still think there's potential there, we just haven't properly utilized it.

Currently, pointing is obviously a big strength, Metroid is so unbelievably amazing with the remote, and as I've mentioned before, RE4 was made more accessable to me with remote control, you really have no idea how happy I was to actually beat RE *sigh* A day to remember. Waggling...is getting a little tired though...It has it's uses, but to me it just feels a little lazy.

Really, motion controls are the next evolutionary step for consoles, it just makes sense...people want to be more interactive with entertainment, that's why the rumble pack was so successful, and later dual shock. And just like rumble, motion controls are bound to be the next standard.

From what I've read, Star Wars the Force Unleashed uses motion in some of the force attacks, and apparently it's freak'n amazing

 

[iosef]

Why did Nintendo decide to have the nunchuck wired to the wiimote? Stupidest choice they made for their controller design.

Oh, and my take on Wii controls:

1) The pointer works GREAT. Every system should have this.

2) The motion controls in the Wiimote are too low-res to be effective outside of tightly constrained situations (like Wii Sports). I think we'll look back on them in future generations like we look back on PS1/N64-era 3D today: Seemed new and fresh at the moment, but too early for prime time in retrospect. WiiHD/Wii2 should be great though.

3) I HATE that Nintendo used two different types of MEMS chips in the Wiimote v. the nunchuck, and that the one in the nunchuck is so much crappier than the Wiimote. I see this everytime my daughter plays rhythm boxing in Wii Fit, and the hits are always much less likely to connect from her nunchuck hand vs. her Wiimote hand.

4) I've said it before and I'll say it again: Why is there not a realistic golf sim with Wii Sports golf controls? Not "similar to," not "kinda like," not "inspired by," but exactly like Wii Sports golf controls? Given the demographics of the Wii userbase I feel like said game would sell a gigaton.