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[metalslimer]

Damn, it sucks that they have to go to iOS but at least some people get to keep their jobs. I wish portables were stronger (sales wise) in the west so iOS wasn't the only cheaper option available to many of these people. This is going to continue to happen though going into next gen. The strong developers who sell millions will survive and everything else will be low budget iOS games.

 

[The Take Out Bandit]

Wait. . . will their first iOS game be. . .

Angry Hawks? :X

 

[Totobeni]

I just hope Sony know what went wrong with Starhawk, and give Warhawk engine to some other studio,I hope they don't kill the IP forever just because of Dylan Jobe's mistakes/ego.

 

[stolin]

It's times like these that I'm glad I still have a functioning NES->SNES->N64/GBA/PSone->GCN/NDS/PS2->Wii/3DS/PS3 physical game collection that I can re-play until the end of time (hopefully !)

I have a feeling I will not be spending much on games going forward... down from a significant yearly spend. Sigh.

 

[Warm Machine]

I'm beginning to wonder if making a sci-fi game is a bad idea. Vanquish, Binary Domain, Starhawk, Syndicate, Hybrid, Space Marine, Red Faction, Singularity, Section 8 Prejudice, etc. Have all done not that well.

It is almost like the only Sci-Fi that matters is Halo, Gears, Borderlands, and Starcraft. It seems more like the market wants historical or contemporary.

 

[Gorillaz]

Man, with this news, is Superbot even safe if PSBR bombs?

They knew the potential backlash for the game before they even put it on paper. I would say if the game bombs then they are pretty much done.

 

[Takao]

Man, with this news, is Superbot even safe if PSBR bombs?

They were a studio created to simply make that game because the project demanded more than what a team within Santa Monica could handle. If it bombs what do you think will happen to a studio designed to make a single game?

 

[Phife Dawg]

That's sad but kind of expected I guess.

I hope iOS works out for them but it will get even more crowded around there when everyone is chasing the golden goose.

The AA game is having it rough out here.

Not really, they just totally failed to capture a meaningful audience for the title. Now that Sony is seemingly getting more strict on spending it was inevitable.

 

[Duffyside]

I guess the Plus offering was the Hail Mary for Lightbox as far as Sony was concerned? SP free, and all the DLC for multi free, just pleeeease buy the $20 multi. Please?

I was impressed by the SP, though it lacked that extra "oomf" -- story, character design, enemy design, enemy types and AI, and cutscenes. But the gameplay was real, real solid. A lot of potential squandered here, and that's too bad.

 

[fixuis]

Nooooooooo warhawk was my most played game and now star hawk…damn there goes my hope of a new gen hawk title

 

[subversus]

It is almost like the only Sci-Fi that matters is Halo, Gears, Borderlands, and Starcraft. It seems more like the market wants historical or contemporary.

you forgot Deus Ex.

 

[jrDev]

I'm beginning to wonder if making a sci-fi game is a bad idea. Vanquish, Binary Domain, Starhawk, Syndicate, Hybrid, Space Marine, Red Faction, Singularity, Section 8 Prejudice, etc. Have all done not that well.

It is almost like the only Sci-Fi that matters is Halo, Gears, Borderlands, and Starcraft. It seems more like the market wants historical or contemporary.

It did?

They knew the potential backlash for the game before they even put it on paper. I would say if the game bombs then they are pretty much done.

I guess...

They were a studio created to simply make that game because the project demanded more than what a team within Santa Monica could handle. If it bombs what do you think will happen to a studio designed to make a single game?

Good to know. I'm guessing Superbot employees have plan B if this bottoms out...

Btw, didn't a guy leave Capcom to join this team? That will hurt if they shutter the studio come next year. I'm guessing Capcom takes him back with open arms?

 

[Triggafinga]

I didn't know starhawk single campaign is free on psn+

 

[Marz]

I'm beginning to wonder if making a sci-fi game is a bad idea. Vanquish, Binary Domain, Starhawk, Syndicate, Hybrid, Space Marine, Red Faction, Singularity, Section 8 Prejudice, etc. Have all done not that well.

It is almost like the only Sci-Fi that matters is Halo, Gears, Borderlands, and Starcraft. It seems more like the market wants historical or contemporary.

Mass Effect. Star Wars. Sure there's plenty of more.



Don't know why everyone is hopping on the iOS train. So much crap on there I could see actual good games getting swamped and lost amidst titles like cut the rope.


Seth Killian is the one who left Capcom to work with that studio but I believe he actually got hired by Sony so he's safe either way.

 

[El-Suave]

Seems like the same mistake as Socom 4, lots of effort wasted on a single player campaign, should have been a $20 PSN title and out faster.

A valid point but I see it the other way around. Not enough effort was put into the single player portion of the game. If the typical Sony customer is anything like me, he/she buys games for the single player experience first and doesn't react well to multiplayer games that are promoted mostly as such and that also have a token single player campaign.

Ratchet & Clank All 4 One, Starhawk and Socom are the games I'm talking about. I'm not saying no effort was put into the campaigns/single player, but to me they still seem as tacked on just as multiplayer is to some single player franchises. There is too much better single player content out there for me to pay full price for games like these. They have made the same mistake with the new God of War at least as far as marketing the game goes. Zero excitement yet from me for exactly the same reasons, and I'll wait for reviews or impressions while I normally should be all over that game and have ordered the limited edition by now.

 

[Takao]

Btw, didn't a guy leave Capcom to join this team? That will hurt if they shutter the studio come next year. I'm guessing Capcom takes him back with open arms?

Seth Killian joined Sony Santa Monica. Superbot is a sister studio to Santa Monica, and because of his experience with fighting games he's helping Superbot with All-Stars. Even if Superbot shuts down he'll still have a job at Santa Monica.

 

[Fabrik]

Starhawk was better suited for PSN or XBLA.

 

[Endo Punk]

Seth Killian joined Sony Santa Monica. Superbot is a sister studio to Santa Monica, and because of his experience with fighting games he's helping Superbot with All-Stars. Even if Superbot shuts down he'll still have a job at Santa Monica.

Good! I really like Seth and don't want him to go because of Superbot's incompetence. Love letter to PS fans my arse. biggest load shit I heard this gen. No sympathy.

 

[Canis lupus]

Damn shame.

 

[waypoetic]

Starhawk was better suited for PSN or XBLA.

Go check PSN. Tell me what you see.

 

[Canis lupus]

We even got the singleplayer for free on PS+

 

[Card Boy]

The game had bomba all over it when i first saw it. The beta was a disaster aswell. Game was such a kick in the balls to fans of Warhawk, no one asked for this basebuilding shit.

 

[Fabrik]

Go check PSN. Tell me what you see.

Ok I should have said PSN AND XBLA. But even then, this kind of game is very niche. I'm not sure if a lot of people are that interested in the genre anymore even if it's an ok game.

 

[PapaJustify]

Starhawk was better suited for PSN or XBLA.

Starhawk was better suited for PC!

Starhawk, although not my cup of tea, is a great game without a doubt. But catering a niche genre game to a platform that is not exactly known for enganging multiplayer communities, plus Sony's lacking marketing and BAD controls (first person controls have never been good on consoles), made this to be a sure fail before it even was released.

In my eyes we need a "State of the industry" |OT|. Those things that happened in the last months I find quite alarming.

 

[waypoetic]

Ok I should have said PSN AND XBLA. But even then, this kind of game is very niche. I'm not sure if a lot of people are that interested in the genre anymore even if it's an ok game.

XBLA? But it's a Sony property. But i get what you're saying.

The game had bomba all over it when i first saw it. The beta was a disaster aswell. Game was such a kick in the balls to fans of Warhawk, no one asked for this basebuilding shit.

I enjoy it. It's all the dumbasses who can't figure out the building aspect of it (how difficult could it be to build a well structured and planned homebase? did none of these guys play command and conquer?!) who makes it less enjoyable. The game has a structure limit and it's pretty upfront with that, yet, people still build shit out in the desert and grabs the vehicle they just spawned and then leaves the structure - making it taking a slot out of 32 structures.

Starhawk was better suited for PC!

Starhawk, although not my cup of tea, is a great game without a doubt. But catering a niche genre game to a platform that is not exactly known for enganging multiplayer communities

You don't own a PS3 do you?

 

[Brad Grenz]

Starhawk was better suited for PC!

Starhawk, although not my cup of tea, is a great game without a doubt. But catering a niche genre game to a platform that is not exactly known for enganging multiplayer communities, plus Sony's lacking marketing and BAD controls (first person controls have never been good on consoles), made this to be a sure fail before it even was released.

Obviously Lightbox ran into the same problem Zipper did. They were catering to a target audience that long ago wrote off the PS3 as a platform that does not cater to them. No matter how many MAGs, Warhawks or SOCOMs they made, the people who'd actually enjoy those games refused to acknowledge the PS3 as a viable home for them.

 

[Vilam]

Well, that's depressing news =/

Brutal generation, although most on here are blinded to the realities of it.

 

[Fabrik]

In my eyes we need a "State of the industry" |OT|. Those things that happened in the last months I find quite alarming.

I agree. I'm creating it.

 

[PapaJustify]

You don't own a PS3 do you?

Believe it or not, I own PS3 (since 2007) and this is my 3rd over the course of this generation.

Obviously Lightbox ran into the same problem Zipper did. They were catering to a target audience that long ago wrote off the PS3 as a platform that does not cater to them. No matter how many MAGs, Warhawks or SOCOMs they made, the people who'd actually enjoy those games refused to acknowledge the PS3 as a viable home for them.

Exactly. This is on point.

 

[Takao]

Obviously Lightbox ran into the same problem Zipper did. They were catering to a target audience that long ago wrote off the PS3 as a platform that does not cater to them. No matter how many MAGs, Warhawks or SOCOMs they made, the people who'd actually enjoy those games refused to acknowledge the PS3 as a viable home for them.

This is joke, yes? Starhawk wouldn't have been made if Warhawk didn't do well enough for SCE. The problem with Zipper was an intense decline in quality, and not focusing on what they once excelled at in an attempt to reach a wider market. Starhawk's problem was the fact that people wanted Warhawk 2, not Warhawk: RTS.

 

[acm2000]

3rd party making console exclusive is always a very risky strategy, and very often it doesnt pay off

 

[waypoetic]

Obviously Lightbox ran into the same problem Zipper did. They were catering to a target audience that long ago wrote off the PS3 as a platform that does not cater to them. No matter how many MAGs, Warhawks or SOCOMs they made, the people who'd actually enjoy those games refused to acknowledge the PS3 as a viable home for them.

What are you talking about? There are plenty of people who soly game on the PS3 when it comes to multiplayer. Warhawk is still being played you know. Everytime i get on the official servers are usually full. All those games are still being played for that matter.

 

[TheOddOne]

Yep, heard the contract got yanked fast after Starhawk bombed (Second game was going to be made regardless of performance of first game). People are pissed and vow never to work with said publisher.

 

[Eccocid]

Sony should have gone freemium style with Starhawk on PSN. No SP content, just multiplayer free version worldwide release and maybe they could sell content for cheap. Costumes and other customization items, maybe maps etc. I bet they still would make more money in that way.

 

[Polk]

And people wonder why MS doesn't have such big library of exclusive boxed titles published by them. That's why.
Sony's stance may look great for PR reasons (well until they close studio or something) but bottom line suffers.
There are very finite games that sale multi million every year.

 

[T-0800]

Warhawk is still one of the greatest online games I've played and Starhawk in comparison is a massive disappointment. I bought it day one depsite not really enjoying the beta. I guess I hoped that things would sort themselves out on release but it never really happened.

Warhawk is fun even if your team is getting beaten badly as you can always get away from base and do some damage but in Starhawk....good luck even survinng 30 seconds with 4 tanks camped in your base. What's that you want to getting in a Hawk and escape. Well I hope you survive long enough to build one of things that spawns them. If you do that it and you will be destroyed in no time. Yeah, fun.

 

[ChryZ]

Bummer, I really love Warhawk and Starhawk

 

[Thrakier]

Starhawk was not a worthy sequel to warhawk.

 

[Haunted]

Oh, that's too bad.

I'm part of the problem, played neither of the Hawk games.

 

[slider]

Shame for the guys who've been let go but at least the company will continue to exist in some form (but I'm not an iOS player).

Loved WH, probably too much, and have only dabbled in Starhawk post PS+ promotion but I did pay for the MP extension as a small gesture towards WH.

 

[Gadirok]

I bought this game day one. Played since the private beta as well in december. No regrets, I loved it and played it to the fullest. I only recently got out of the game right before september since I was piling up a backlog of games.


I still have a huge backlog, and when it comes to playing I usually just end up on the starhawk multiplayer. Game gets intense, and its never repetitive. I guess it didn't live up to warhawk vets expectations and didn't get out through word of mouth. Bombed hard... but the devs weren't just good people, they were great people.


Props to Jobe and the rest of the team for the amazing work and dedication you put into starhawk. I joined since the private beta, had all the costumes before you released them for free on plus too. The game had some massive changes with each patch after releasing, changing alot from the beta. They listened to the communitys problems, fixed base rapes, OP weapons, implemented new modes and maps, and promoted this as much as they possibly could.


Many people will see this as a failure and a letdown to warhawk, but I'm going to look back next gen and will remember this as a gem on the PS3.


I still play a multiplayer match every now and then after work, when I get the time.

I did notice how strange things were getting when LBI recently started pulling the $20 PSN multiplayer portion and free singleplayer mode on plus. Maybe multiplayer should have been $20 since the beginning and included a $30 retail version that included a few bonuses. It would have gotten off its feet pretty easily and would have done something unique. Releasing all the dlc for free was also a surprise, it was like they were trying to get all the money as they can. Maybe as a last ditch effort to prove to Sony about keeping the multi deal contract you guys were talking about, if it sold well enough.

The $60 formula only works for something that guaranteed to do well, and is truly AAA on all fronts. Not to say starhawk isin't, but as a fan, I also found the SP to be very lackluster.


Hopefully the LBI devs land on their feet and come back stronger than ever to produce something unique. Maybe they could join up with Eat Sleep Play and combine their efforts to one final blockbuster for the PS3, like good old times as Incognito. Maybe...

 

[Interfectum]

It's a shame they are jumping from PS3 -> iOS without trying something smaller, tighter on PC/Steam first. :/

 

[Jack_AG]

Oh, that's too bad.

I'm part of the problem, played neither of the Hawk games.

I wouldn't say so. Its not your job to buy every game that exists for the sole purpose of feeding a developer. You play what you want and purchase what you feel is worth your dollar.

I'm making a game. If people don't buy it - is it their fault for letting me sink? Or would it be my fault for creating a work that does not appeal to them?

Just saying - don't be down on yourself for mistakes made by others. Every game released is a risk and developers know that. They do the best they can and await the outcome.

 

[Loudninja]

And people wonder why MS doesn't have such big library of exclusive boxed titles published by them. That's why.
Sony's stance may look great for PR reasons (well until they close studio or something) but bottom line suffers.
There are very finite games that sale multi million every year.

PR reasons really?

 

[Fabrik]

It's a shame they are jumping from PS3 -> iOS without trying something smaller, tighter on PC/Steam first. :/

Yes it is so stupid. Why do they have to go in the opposite direction? Some middle ground is possible. I don't think the majority of their developers will be very happy to develop for iOS.

 

[TheOddOne]

And people wonder why MS doesn't have such big library of exclusive boxed titles published by them. That's why.
Sony's stance may look great for PR reasons (well until they close studio or something) but bottom line suffers.
There are very finite games that sale multi million every year.

Uhm, no. Sony tried something that not a lot of publisher even try these days, publish middle tier games in the retail space. It was really big gamble, respect them for doing it, but it just didn‘t pan out.

Most of these types of games either go the F2P route or on downloadable services.

 

[Interfectum]

Yes it is so stupid. Why do they have to go in the opposite direction? Some middle ground is possible. I don't think the majority of their developers will be very happy to develop for iOS.

Yeah it truly is a fate worse than death.

Look at Mistwalker...

From this:

To this:

Just kill the studio.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

3rd party making console exclusive is always a very risky strategy, and very often it doesnt pay off

It really is. Much risk with little reward.

 

[jcm]

And people wonder why MS doesn't have such big library of exclusive boxed titles published by them. That's why.
Sony's stance may look great for PR reasons (well until they close studio or something) but bottom line suffers.
There are very finite games that sale multi million every year.

Sony doesn't focus on first party development for PR reasons. They do it because first party games return about 5x revenue to them, and differentiate the library by adding exclusives. The fact that they've done a poor job executing the strategy doesn't mean the strategy itself is flawed. It works very well for Nintendo.

 

[The Take Out Bandit]

It's a shame they are jumping from PS3 -> iOS without trying something smaller, tighter on PC/Steam first. :/

From what I've heard the PC/Steam already have games like Warhawk, and PC gamers aren't interested in the severe degree of handholding and participation trophy game design Lightbox engaged in.

They wanted a game that appealed to the aim and shoot / Call of Duty crowd that complained about Warhawk.

They wanted a game where flying had a lower learning curve than Warhawk and ended up with one where you only had two viable weapons - machine gun and flak cannon. Air mines were useless. All missiles A2A were useless.

They thought that getting rid of Warhawks that hovered and replacing them with robots would solve the problem of vehicles menacing ground troops. In Warhawk all they needed to do was reduce the hover speed and aiming angle to prevent the severe A2G abuse we saw. Instead they just create a new mess with Hawks which still present the same problem only now G2G.

They had one of the longest beta periods of any game I can think of this generation and showed little to no improvement to the game week after week, but hey - at least we got to see pictures of folks hanging out in cool Austin clubs on the Twitter feed, right?

Starhawk was a game with a lot of ideas and concepts from other games that never congealed.

You can't come at console game development with today's budgets like that. You need to have a solid frame work and a solid set of ideas which you can execute in game. Starhawk was too much wishy-washy nothing design that didn't appeal to RTS fans, didn't appeal to CoD/Gears players, and sure as hell didn't appeal to Warhawk veterans.

Lightbox had a lot of talented staff working for them, and I'm certain they will find employment elsewhere and hopefully thrive working on projects whose demise isn't telegraphed by a multi-month beta period where you try to sort out how all your abstract ideas could fit together if you weren't afraid of alienating players.