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[Loxley]

Just finished it, really solid piece overall.

She said she had it on good authority that Snyder hates his mother... A week after mothers day. I guess got into am argument after that and posted this https://mobile.twitter.com/DCcomicsfan020/status/866541825103941634/photo/1 (she deleted the tweet I think)

Then said it was just a dude thing: https://twitter.com/thelindsayellis/status/866474872834281472

Basically just talking shit. I enjoy her analysis though.

You know that saying, "even a broken clock is right twice a day"? Lindsay is like the opposite of that. Her analyses are usually spot-on, but once in a blue-moon she says some really dumb shit (it's almost always on Twitter for whatever reason) and she doubles-down on it.

 

[Zeyphersan]

Lindsay putting out quality, long-form content like she’s been doing for like ten years now

 

[ThisGuy]

https://mobile.twitter.com/DCcomicsfan020/status/866541825103941634/photo/1

I'm surprised she would use the term white boy.


Decent piece. She's not funny though, at all. She should drop the comedy and focus on her strengths. The ability to explain these concepts really well.

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

Pocahontas is a frustrating film because, yes, the film just isn't very good...

But good grief are the visuals beyond belief for a hand-drawn film.



Fast-forward past the Gargoyles and, yep, it's a masterpiece.

"Hellfire" alone justifies the whole film.

But that was exactly the problem with Disney back then. They thought they could skirt by with style over substance. All those movies are just VISUAL masterpieces with maybe one good song.

 

[lightskintwin]

I like when she says we can tell we're making progress because "It's no longer a hot mess but a mixed bag"

Also this needs to be stickied somewhere:
The legacy of colonialism is baked into every facet of every culture on the planet

 

[Wafflecakes]

Just finished. So good.

I really should get back on her patreon again.

 

[Xiaoki]

It was easily the worst film of that run of awful disney animated flicks which is really saying something.

Like everyone else in the entire world I think you are forgetting Home on the Range.

You know, the one about the cow voiced by Rosanne Barr.

 

[Linkura]

I really like the movie, but I totally get why it's offensive. Peter Pan is similar with the bullshit Native American depictions.

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

Like everyone else in the entire world I think you are forgetting Home on the Range.

You know, the one about the cow voiced by Rosanne Barr.

I think every hardcore Disney fan forgot about that movies existence.

 

[SchrodingerC]

Like everyone else in the entire world I think you are forgetting Home on the Range.

You know, the one about the cow voiced by Rosanne Barr.

Saw HotR in theaters, was one of my biggest mistakes that year.

 

[lightskintwin]

I really like the movie, but I totally get why it's offensive. Peter Pan is similar with the bullshit Native American depictions.

That Peter Pan scene always reminds me of this scene in the movie musical Annie Get Your Gun. This is the Judy Garland version which got cut after she was fired, I can't find the official movie version.

https://youtu.be/LzrOMXOJwjE?t=7

 

[Shaanyboi]

Another fantastic video from Lindsay

 

[Ogodei]

Yes.

Hunchback, Hercules and Mulan which iirc each performed worse than their predecessor and Tarzan which did significantly better than Pocahontas but still nowhere near the B&TB/Aladdin/Lion King highs.

I will defend Hunchback to the death though. There's a 10/10 movie in there buried beneath the gargoyle schlock.

Also Rescuers Down Under which was released between Little Mermaid and B&TB and got zero attention from the studio.

Between Pocahontas and Tangled, Tarzan and Lilo & Stitch were Disney's only unquestionably successful films.

Mulan is good and holds up well. Has cultural issues but mostly in its one-sided portrayal of the China v Hun/Mongol conflict. Basically they portrayed the culture they were trying to portray very well, with its flaws whitewashed a little but still there for all to see (the issues of rigid deference to parents and sexism) without making them seem backwards, but did so partly by making a different culture into an Orc-like parody of itself (imagine if they had done Pocahontas from the English perspective and portrayed most of the native Americans like Mulan did the Huns...)

Edit: Home on the Range and Brother Bear are off in a tier by themselves.

 

[FalsettoVibe]

Definitely will watch later.

 

[temp]

Ahh cultural appropriation. Always reminds me of travelling through the U.S. and stopping at Paddy O' Donnels Irish Pub.

On the menu was "Potatoes O'Brien"

Also "Juan O'Donnell's quesadillas"

Juan was touted as their Mexican cousin.

Potatoes O'Brien is actually a common dish in the United States, you can get it at most breakfast restaurants or buy it frozen at the grocery store.

Also did you by chance mean Shawn O'Donnell's in the Seattle area? Because they have a "Juan O'Donnell's quesadilla" as well: http://www.shawnodonnells.com/Seattle/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Page-2-Jan17.jpg

Anyway Pocahontas is a pretty rough movie.

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

It gave us this

......
so it was a mistake for that alone.

Yes.

Hunchback, Hercules and Mulan which iirc each performed worse than their predecessor and Tarzan which did significantly better than Pocahontas but still nowhere near the B&TB/Aladdin/Lion King highs.

Mulan made more than Hercules.
20 million more Domestic
30 million more Foreign

Mulan made 20 million more Domestic than Hunchback but 40 million less Foreign.

Even adjusted Mulan and Pocahontas are more successful than Little Mermaid

 

[speak_easy]

Jesus fucking Christ. Can we all get over our selves please.

 

[Wet Bloodfart]

I'm surprised she would use the term white boy.


Decent piece. She's not funny though, at all. She should drop the comedy and focus on her strengths. The ability to explain these concepts really well.

You’re insane. She’s hilarious.

Jesus fucking Christ. Can we all get over our selves please.

????

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

Jesus fucking Christ. Can we all get over our selves please.

What are you angry about?

 

[99Luffy]

Apparently she loved frozen so I cant really take her seriously.

I await her 'Everything wrong with Coco' video. You know its gonna happen.

 

[speak_easy]

What are you angry about?

The bits about the cultural appropriation. Everyone throughout time has appropriated culture from somewhere else. Its just naval gazing.

When i look a a corn on the cob, i don't feel guilty that Hernan Cortez appropriated Maize, sorry.

 

[Misha]

The bits about the cultural appropriation. Everyone throughout time has appropriated culture from somewhere else. Its just naval gazing.

When i look a a corn on the cob, i don't feel guilty that Hernan Cortez appropriated Maize, sorry.

Watch the video. She addresses that

 

[lightskintwin]

The bits about the cultural appropriation. Everyone throughout time has appropriated culture from somewhere else. Its just naval gazing.

When i look a a corn on the cob, i don't feel guilty that Hernan Cortez appropriated Maize, sorry.

So you were triggered and didn't watch the entire video.

 

[Shaanyboi]

The bits about the cultural appropriation. Everyone throughout time has appropriated culture from somewhere else. Its just naval gazing.

When i look a a corn on the cob, i don't feel guilty that Hernan Cortez appropriated Maize, sorry.

 

[Fat4all]

When i look a a corn on the cob, i don't feel guilty that Hernan Cortez appropriated Maize, sorry.

Good for you?

Her point is that cultural appropriation is at a neutral state that can be weighed in either direction due to several factors, the video isn't just pointing at cultural appropriation and saying "boo, bad".

 

[Crossing Eden]

This video is fantastic.

 

[ThisGuy]

You’re insane. She’s hilarious.

What? No way. If you said mildly amusing, or fun, I'd say that's a respectable opinion. But hilarious?

Amy Poehler must give you nose bleeds and leave you gasping for air if you find Ellis hilarious.

 

[Slayven]

The bits about the cultural appropriation. Everyone throughout time has appropriated culture from somewhere else. Its just naval gazing.

When i look a a corn on the cob, i don't feel guilty that Hernan Cortez appropriated Maize, sorry.

She literally addresses the wider point, IN DETAIL with examples to the point it almost becomes a video focused on it.

 

[Kin5290]

What? No way. If you said mildly amusing, or fun, I'd say that's a respectable opinion. But hilarious?

Amy Poehler must give you nose bleeds and leave you gasping for air if you find Ellis hilarious.

She's pretty funny. She's not mad loony "funny" like, say, Doug Walker of Nostalgia critic fame, but she's pretty funny.

 

[Draper]

I love Pocahontas. May be one of my favorite animated films.

 

[kunonabi]

Like everyone else in the entire world I think you are forgetting Home on the Range.

You know, the one about the cow voiced by Rosanne Barr.

Im mostly talking about the 2d stuff at the end of the renaissance ie Hercules, hunchback, pocahontas, and mulan.

 

[Kreed]

I remember the outrage back then. You just didn't have social media so it was an easy issue for Disney to ignore.

Another example of why the "people are more sensitive these days" narrative is bullshit. You just didn't have everyone's voices in your pocket before.

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

Apparently she loved frozen so I cant really take her seriously.

I await her 'Everything wrong with Coco' video. You know its gonna happen.

Wow, she liked a movie you didn't and now you refuse to listen to her.

The bits about the cultural appropriation. Everyone throughout time has appropriated culture from somewhere else. Its just naval gazing.

When i look a a corn on the cob, i don't feel guilty that Hernan Cortez appropriated Maize, sorry.

I dont think you watched the video cuz she addressed the wider spectrum of cultural appropriation and why we can never escape it.

 

[Slayven]

Another example of why the "people are more sensitive these days" narrative is bullshit. You just didn't have everyone's voices in your pocket before.

I don't know about taht, but then again I am a late 90s baby

 

[99Luffy]

Wow, she liked a movie you didn't and now you refuse to listen to her.

No I watched the whole thing. Still not sure what to make of it. It was a whole lotta 'look at this, Im not saying its bad or anything, what am I saying really. Have I provoked your thoughts?'

 

[xKilltheMx]

Another great video from her. I like her a lot.

 

[Fat4all]

No I watched the whole thing. Still not sure what to make of it. It was a whole lotta 'look at this, Im not saying its bad or anything, what am I saying really. Have I provoked your thoughts?'

sounds horrifying for you

 

[Zeyphersan]

No I watched the whole thing. Still not sure what to make of it. It was a whole lotta 'look at this, Im not saying its bad or anything, what am I saying really. Have I provoked your thoughts?'

I mean, she was saying it was bad. She was saying the appropriation in a lot of those examples was bad. Her broader point was that at a base level “cultural appropriation” is a neutral state, and means a lot of different things with a lot of different outcomes. She brought up her ring and that Bollywood movie as differing examples.

She definitely made some judgement calls

 

[metalslimer]

Her take on cultural appropriation needs to be stickered in all these threads. It really is a far more interesting discussion than the people who feels like they are being constantly attacked for using another culture in their art.

 

[oti]

Oh hey it's kinda like what I said about Hercules and y'all told me to shut up.

 

[The Technomancer]

Wait wait I haven't watched this movie since I was like 8 do they seriously "both sides" colonization?

 

[Reptars Revenge]

Oh hey it's kinda like what I said about Hercules and y'all told me to shut up.

Lolll I could totally see that, thread link?

 

[Cheerilee]

It gave us this

......
so it was a mistake for that alone.

Amusing story about that movie which I like to repeat.

Disney asks their direct-to-video team to make Pocahontas 2.
Writer sticks up his hand: "Um, can we have a copy of Pocahontas 1, for reference?"
Disney: "It's not out on video yet, so no. Have the script on my desk by the end of the week."
Writer: "Sigh. Has anyone seen Pocahontas 1? Can you tell me what happened in it?"

The Disney Sequels were terrible, but there are reasons why they were so terrible.

 

[Aaron Strife]

Wait wait I haven't watched this movie since I was like 8 do they seriously "both sides" colonization?

Oh completely. The whole song "Savages" is about this specifically.

Amusing story about that movie which I like to repeat.

Disney asks their direct-to-video team to make Pocahontas 2.
Writer sticks up his hand: "Um, can we have a copy of Pocahontas 1, for reference?"
Disney: "It's not out on video yet, so no. Have the script on my desk by the end of the week."
Writer: "Sigh. Has anyone seen Pocahontas 1? Can you tell me what happened in it?"

The Disney Sequels were terrible, but there are reasons why they were so terrible.

Is that real or just speculative? I wouldn't doubt it for a second.

 

[Jazzem]

Amusing story about that movie which I like to repeat.

Disney asks their direct-to-video team to make Pocahontas 2.
Writer sticks up his hand: "Um, can we have a copy of Pocahontas 1, for reference?"
Disney: "It's not out on video yet, so no. Have the script on my desk by the end of the week."
Writer: "Sigh. Has anyone seen Pocahontas 1? Can you tell me what happened in it?"

The Disney Sequels were terrible, but there are reasons why they were so terrible.

Bahaha oh man, hilarious and unsurprising if true.

To be fair, I was surprised watching Doug Walker's Disneycember to see some of them actually weren't a complete waste, the animation could be remarkably solid at times given the direct to video budget+limitations. Is pretty clear that talented people worked on them, even with how bad the final product could be overall.

 

[Wet Bloodfart]

What? No way. If you said mildly amusing, or fun, I'd say that's a respectable opinion. But hilarious?

Amy Poehler must give you nose bleeds and leave you gasping for air if you find Ellis hilarious.

I get a good laugh from her in every one of her videos. What exactly don't you find funny?

 

[The Technomancer]

The Emperors New Groove is actually a fascinating sort of film to talk about in the context of appropriation, precisely for how infrequently it comes up. I think she's spot on, by essentially taking nothing more than a light aesthetic veneer it avoids upsetting people because there is basically nothing to disrespect that it could disrespect

 

[Seesaw15]

Lolll I could totally see that, thread link?

To be fair we did just have a Lindsay Ellis Hercules thread a week before so mabye Gaf was Herculed out?

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1294825&highlight=

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1288580&highlight=hercules

 

[Draper]

I watched the full thing. She had a very balanced argument vs. just being outraged. Nonetheless, I really enjoyed Pocahontas, but primarily for the music and imagery. I guess I really need to see Moana.

 

[ReiGun]

Wait wait I haven't watched this movie since I was like 8 do they seriously "both sides" colonization?

Enjoy.