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[asagami_]

To be fair Jessica never was a superhero. She fails, a lot, thanks to her lack of experience and her PTSD.

Sadly, even if I like the series, I can't deny that the final episodes have some weird pacing. I still want a Patsy spin-off, though, she can embrace without guilty the silly aspect from superhero costumes ;_;

 

[the black pearl]

I hope they expand more on the super soldier thing.

 

[GraceflAnger]

It's a good show with flaws. Better than Daredevil S1 (although debatable) and much better than the disappointing Daredevil S2. Man, that second season is just bad.

What? Both seasons of Daredevil top JJ any day.

 

[Succinct Verbosity]

I really hated this show. A lot of what the characters said were not natural or believable - it really took me out of it.

 

[Father_Brain]

I liked it, but it's a 6-8 episode storyline, 10 at absolute most, stretched to thirteen episodes.

Both seasons of Daredevil had their flaws, but neither made the mistake of focusing almost exclusively on a single antagonist.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

The show didn't do story as tightly as others, but I felt it handled it's subject matter brilliantly. The way they showed the effects an abusive relationship can have one someone was really solid. Could easily write pages on things like Jessica being shown she has the ability to resist Killgrave, but is still helpless and terrified around him, or how they show the repetition that allows these relationships to continue, or how Jessica and Trish and Malcom and Will are all affected by varying levels of PTSD, and each shows a different (mostly broken) path to dealing with it.

So, yeah, the show truly shines when it comes to theme. Plot, not so much.

This right here. It's brilliance on the theme means I gave it a pass on plot somewhat-- although there's a point around eps 9-11 where it's just not good. I liked the finale a lot.

 

[RiZ III]

Thank you op. You summed up my thoughts on this show much better than I could. I was two episodes from the end but finally just gave up. I frankly didn't care about any of the characters enough to suffer through another two episodes of that ridiculous plotline.

 

[DeathyBoy]

DD S1 is great because of Wilson Fisk. S2 nosedived in quality when they went fora new villain.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

A scathing indictment of the show here, you'll find a lot to agree with, OP.

http://www.legitshook.com/blog/a-shit-show-aka-jessica-jones

While none of the Marvel movies have done much in terms of testing the waters with cinematography, Daredevil got much praise for its shooting style. It used long, one take shots, and careful lighting to provide a distinctive look and feel to the show, making it standout from the movies and TV shows. Along comes Jessica Jones and...everything is flat. It doesn't even resemble Daredevil, even though the shows are set in the same few blocks, during the same time period. You'd have no idea they were even tangentially related except for a few off-hand references to The Battle Of New York and a character from Daredevil making a late season appearance in Jessica Jones. The show looks like any other show shot in New York. It might as well be Blue Bloods.

The first season fails on every possible aspect you can fail at. Poor plotting which should wrap up about 5 episodes before it does and is meaningless by the end of the season anyway, poor acting and delivery from everyone except David Tennant (who is wonderful in the show, the only reason to watch), dull and flat cinematography, completely inappropriate music, terrible looking effects, and a complete lack of fun or enjoyability.

 

[PreFire]

I liked it. But it's nowhere near as good as Daredevil for me. Any season

 

[HvySky]

A scathing indictment of the show here, you'll find a lot to agree with, OP.

http://www.legitshook.com/blog/a-shit-show-aka-jessica-jones

Goddamn, it's like reading my own thoughts. While I don't necessarily agree that more serious issues like PTSD should not be touched on in comic book adaptations ever, the bottom line that simply everything in the show (save David Tennant hamming it up) is just terribly executed is something I can't argue with.

 

[dskillzhtown]

Almost hated this show while almost liking it too, which means I don't know. I know Jessica was an unlikable brat for most of the show and I could not get past that.

That has been stopping me from finishing the series. I need to go ahead and suffer through it.

 

[QuantumZebra]

What? Both seasons of Daredevil top JJ any day.

JJ1>DD1>DD2

DD had better action but JJ had better writing, villain, development, and tension. Both S1's are great. DD2 is meh.

--

That has been stopping me from finishing the series. I need to go ahead and suffer through it.

I never got the "brat" vibe but her feelings/motivations are made explicitly clear by show-end.

Spoiler

the point is driven home she is not a hero and never wanted to be, she is a flawed person with a lot of loss to bear .. ala Joel from The Last of Us, for a videogame reference

--

A scathing indictment of the show here, you'll find a lot to agree with, OP.

http://www.legitshook.com/blog/a-shit-show-aka-jessica-jones

The first season fails on every possible aspect you can fail at.

LOL... article is trash, and critiques were as well.

The hyperbole is amazing there. The author seems like they had an axe to grind.

 

[HStallion]

JJ1>DD1>DD2

DD had better action but JJ had better writing, villain, development, and tension. Both S1's are great. DD2 is meh.

Tension is not a word I would use to describe JJ and almost find that a bit laughable as a way to describe that show. Also better written? the DD seasons are ok in terms of writing but JJ is bottom of the barrel outside of maybe the first 3 episodes. What about the second of that show was well written?

 

[jph139]

It was too long and the plot gets contrived. I can agree 100% with that.

But tons of the criticisms I see, like... "characters act dumb" and "the fight choreography was bad" just make me shake my head. Like, clearly you're missing the point of this show. It's not a superhero show about pushing through your limits to save the day, it's about a woman with PTSD trying to come to terms with her past abuse.

Like, is Jessica an unlikeable, selfish wreck? Yeah. She was held captive by a psychotic, manipulative rapist for months. Her friends are a child star with an abusive mom and a recovering heroin addict. They make poor decisions. They are not people you aspire to be. Do these decisions get a bit contrived? Sure, but it's for the specific purpose of challenging the characters and raising interesting questions. It's not perfect, but it works.

Criticising Jessica Jones for having bad fight scenes is like... I dunno, shitting on Daredevil for having undercooked romance subplots. It's not the point of the show, it's a means to an end. Would the psychological profile of Jessica be improved by watching her mow through a bunch of goons with kung fury?

I suspect the biggest reason GAF hates on it is because they don't find "troubled rape victim" a particularly relatable character, don't connect with the show, and are unwilling to forgive the flaws they find. I mean, it won a Peabody, got tons of critical praise. Just because it's not the show you're looking for doesn't mean it's a bad show.

 

[Anton Sugar]

It was too long and the plot gets contrived. I can agree 100% with that.

But tons of the criticisms I see, like... "characters act dumb" and "the fight choreography was bad" just make me shake my head. Like, clearly you're missing the point of this show. It's not a superhero show about pushing through your limits to save the day, it's about a woman with PTSD trying to come to terms with her past abuse.

Like, is Jessica an unlikeable, selfish wreck? Yeah. She was held captive by a psychotic, manipulative rapist for months. Her friends are a child star with an abusive mom and a recovering heroin addict. They make poor decisions. They are not people you aspire to be. Do these decisions get a bit contrived? Sure, but it's for the specific purpose of challenging the characters and raising interesting questions.

Criticising Jessica Jones for having bad fight scenes is like... I dunno, shitting on Daredevil for having undercooked romance subplots. It's not the point of the show, it's a means to an end. Would the psychological profile of Jessica be improved by watching her mow through a bunch of goons with kung fury?

I suspect the biggest reason GAF hates on it is because they don't find "troubled rape victim" a particularly relatable character, don't connect with the show, and are unwilling to forgive the flaws they find. I mean, it won a Peabody, got tons of critical praise. Just because it's not the show you're looking for doesn't mean it's a bad show.

Eeeeeek, you're making some heavy assumptions.

I'm a card-carrying Bleeding Heart Social Justice Warrior® but still had trouble getting through JJ.

My complaints aren't centered around her being unlikable. That's (mostly) fine. It's illogical decisions and actions made by her, and other characters, that are far more glaring.

As for "you should set your expectations lower for anything other than this show's MO", well, that doesn't make it immune from criticism. Do something half-assed, get called out on it. Plenty of shows extend outside their comfort zone for great sequences.

 

[HStallion]

It was too long and the plot gets contrived. I can agree 100% with that.

But tons of the criticisms I see, like... "characters act dumb" and "the fight choreography was bad" just make me shake my head. Like, clearly you're missing the point of this show. It's not a superhero show about pushing through your limits to save the day, it's about a woman with PTSD trying to come to terms with her past abuse.

Like, is Jessica an unlikeable, selfish wreck? Yeah. She was held captive by a psychotic, manipulative rapist for months. Her friends are a child star with an abusive mom and a recovering heroin addict. They make poor decisions. They are not people you aspire to be. Do these decisions get a bit contrived? Sure, but it's for the specific purpose of challenging the characters and raising interesting questions. It's not perfect, but it works.

Criticising Jessica Jones for having bad fight scenes is like... I dunno, shitting on Daredevil for having undercooked romance subplots. It's not the point of the show, it's a means to an end. Would the psychological profile of Jessica be improved by watching her mow through a bunch of goons with kung fury?

I suspect the biggest reason GAF hates on it is because they don't find "troubled rape victim" a particularly relatable character, don't connect with the show, and are unwilling to forgive the flaws they find. I mean, it won a Peabody, got tons of critical praise. Just because it's not the show you're looking for doesn't mean it's a bad show.

I like how its always some weird woman hating reasoning as to why people like the show. That might be some true in certain circles but I think my biggest issue in the show wasn't Jessica herself or Killgrave, it was everything else.

For example you say the fight scene choreography isn't a big deal but how are most of the situations solved in this show? A fight scene and the fact that most of them blend together in how boring they are visually and stylistically is not something to ignore. Its a pretty blatant flaw and it happens over and over and over again. I'm fine with her not being some trained fighter or amazing bad ass, but sloppy choreography and boring camera work and such shouldn't just be brushed aside from what is a show that features a lot of action.

The show is just very poorly done in all respects from the side characters to the choreography and hell, even the soundtrack and score are pretty mundane and generic.

 

[br3wnor]

Surprised by the responses in here. I thought it was a great show and felt that Kilgrave was one of the best villains I've ever seen on a TV show or movie.

There was some stupidity w/ him getting away numerous times, but I was really pulled into the show and thoroughly entertained. Excited for season 2.

 

[Fuchsdh]

Yup.
Old TV used to dictate 20 episode a year to the detriment of many shows, Netflix's 10 to 15 hurt JJ. It would have made for a great 5 or 6 long arc instead they just did capture and release for ten hours.

Or do something for the first couple of episodes, actually sell Jessica Jones as a competent PI with issues before Kilgrave pops up. They tried to hitch the entire season on Kilgrave and as entertaining as Tennant was it wasn't enough to buttress that many episodes.

 

[jrush64]

I enjoyed it, but found Jessica Jones herself to be an extremely unlikable character. I couldn't stand her at all.

DD1 & 2 >>>>>> JJ

 

[jph139]

Eeeeeek, you're making some heavy assumptions.

I'm a card-carrying Bleeding Heart Social Justice Warrior® but still had trouble getting through JJ.

My complaints aren't centered around her being unlikable. That's (mostly) fine. It's illogical decisions and actions made by her, and other characters, that are far more glaring.

As for "you should set your expectations lower for anything other than this show's MO", well, that doesn't make it immune from criticism. Do something half-assed, get called out on it. Plenty of shows extend outside their comfort zone for great sequences.

I'm not saying JJ is an amazing show - it has its issues - but people are a lot less forgiving with JJ than they are with Daredevil and Flash and all of the other comic book media bouncing around. I'm not saying they're misogynists for not liking the show or anything like that, I'm just saying that they're more comfortable forgiving flaws in shows that are more inline with their expectations.

It's a weird thing to get into when youre used to guys like Matt Murdock and Bruce Wayne and Tony Stark as the main character. It won't necessarily click unless you really shift gears. That's fine.

Is there a problem inherent with characters that wouldn't act logically acting illogically? People aren't always logical. Self hating, stalked, victimized people are irrational. Most (not all, mind you, but most) decisions follow naturally from the flaws and psychological profiles of the characters, even if the thought process to us - impartial observers - seems "dumb."

 

[Shaanyboi]

I liked Jessica just fine. She's harsh in the way Jessica has always read. Luke was fine but not much was done with him, hopefully his show lives up to expectations. Kilgrave was a great villain. I look forward to Trish becoming Hellcat.

The problem is that too many characters are required to be complete idiots at pivotal moments. There's a great core story here, better than Daredevil's, but the writing and direction doesn't live up to that potential.

 

[Pops Maellard]

this makes no sense

Comic books are dumb. If you make a show based on this, it's probably going to retain many if not all of the same problems.

Edit: Daredevil is much, much worse.

 

[Illucio]

It was a rape story via super hero style.

That's literally what's great about it, that they took something off the walls crazy and made it very realistic and down to Earth.

 

[HStallion]

I'm not saying JJ is an amazing show - it has its issues - but people are a lot less forgiving with JJ than they are with Daredevil and Flash and all of the other comic book media bouncing around. I'm not saying they're misogynists for not liking the show or anything like that, I'm just saying that they're more comfortable forgiving flaws in shows that are more inline with their expectations.

It's a weird thing to get into when youre used to guys like Matt Murdock and Bruce Wayne and Tony Stark as the main character. It won't necessarily click unless you really shift gears. That's fine.

Is there a problem inherent with characters that wouldn't act logically acting illogically? People aren't always logical. Self hating, stalked, victimized people are irrational. Most (not all, mind you, but most) decisions follow naturally from the flaws and psychological profiles of the characters, even if the thought process to us - impartial observers - seems "dumb."

Looking back I actually see DD Season 1 in a different light and that has nothing to do with JJ or its quality or lack there of. DD S1 is actually pretty weak as well after some stand out beginning episodes. It actually suffers from a lot of the same issues as JJ in that it relies on one main villain to really support a weak cast of side characters, a plot that meanders and doesn't go any very interesting places, and it never really pulls it off. I think I was so caught up in the show I didn't recognize the flaws until some time had passed and I'd cooled on it.

 

[pokeystaples]

It was a rape story via super hero style.

That's literally what's great about it, that they took something off the walls crazy and made it very realistic and down to Earth.

Bolded is on point.

Plus, I just liked it a whole lot.

 

[Abilidebob]

I'm not saying JJ is an amazing show - it has its issues - but people are a lot less forgiving with JJ than they are with Daredevil and Flash and all of the other comic book media bouncing around. I'm not saying they're misogynists for not liking the show or anything like that, I'm just saying that they're more comfortable forgiving flaws in shows that are more inline with their expectations.

It's a weird thing to get into when youre used to guys like Matt Murdock and Bruce Wayne and Tony Stark as the main character. It won't necessarily click unless you really shift gears. That's fine.

Is there a problem inherent with characters that wouldn't act logically acting illogically? People aren't always logical. Self hating, stalked, victimized people are irrational. Most (not all, mind you, but most) decisions follow naturally from the flaws and psychological profiles of the characters, even if the thought process to us - impartial observers - seems "dumb."

Eh, Feminist Frequency didn't like the show that much, and had a bunch of similar problems with it like other posters here. I don't think Anita Sarkeesian is someone that

don't find "troubled rape victim" a particularly relatable character

.

 

[Falchion]

I wholeheartedly agree OP. When I was watching it really bothered me how dumb half the shit the main characters did was.

 

[Azih]

Aside from all the stupid things Jessica did for plot reasons I thought that the show portrayed her as an incredibly smart and capable private detective. She managed to get in a lot of places and find out a lot of things in the early going and the first few sequences of cat and mouse between Kilgrave and Jones was two intelligent people doing clever things at each other. The first half of JJ is great television.

 

[ProfessorLobo]

Completely agree with OP. I'm glad someone said it because I haven't heard it too much from other people.

 

[TheDanger]

funny how everyone seems to agree with you, I totally loved all of it, wasn't bored for a second. I can't remember how many times I search GAF for x tv show I like and usually the consensus is always season x is good season y is beyond terrible , and I never get it, the shows I really like, I usually like every episode, GAF just loves to nitpick.

 

[Clear]

Completely agree with OP. I'm glad someone said it because I haven't heard it too much from other people.

Same for me to be honest, I thought it had some great moments but the serial stupidity of most of the characters annoyed the hell out of me.

I'll always remember it as the only contemporary US show ever where characters never seem to have a gun.

 

[Calabi]

I didn't make it past the first episode. I didn't see much merit in that so didn't bother watching the rest. Glad I didn't waste my time. The one thing I hate is stupid characters.

 

[QuantumZebra]

Aside from all the stupid things Jessica did for plot reasons I thought that the show portrayed her as an incredibly smart and capable private detective. She managed to get in a lot of places and find out a lot of things in the early going and the first few sequences of cat and mouse between Kilgrave and Jones was two intelligent people doing clever things at each other. The first half of JJ is great television.

Good post. I loved the finale as well.

I was far more compelled by the characters than DD. DD himself is unlikeable as fuck and the only characters I found remotely interesting were Fisk and Karen. Foggy is just annoying as the "goofy sidekick who cares".