Support NeoGAF

[SigmasonicX]

I like how you guys were tricked into thinking the Planeswalker Deck Nissa was her "actual" card.

I'm a bit surprised we're getting Nissa in this set, but that makes more sense than having three blue Planeswalkers. She seems pretty good. I'm surprised she can potentially ultimate the turn after she comes out.

After all the talk of prowess being needed so that the blue part of five-card monocolored cycles can do something besides flying, I'm surprised the blue Gearhulk has flash.

The modules are a neat design.

Madcap Experiment is pretty neat. I was thinking that you couldn't include a one-of artifact in your deck and use this to fetch it, due to the damage, but as mentioned, using it to fetch Platinum Angel should work out, right?

Lathnu Hellion looks pretty good. You can choose not to pay its upkeep end step cost to make it be a plain Ball Lightning-esque and use the energy elsewhere, or keep it around.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

I hate hate hate Flash being blue, the last thing blue needed was flash creatures.Creatures should have a downside for blue decks by being sorcery speed. Flash should be primarily red, it could replace haste for the most part. It also fits in the impulsiveness and chaotic nature of red.

Which card lets you do that? I can't keep track with all these reveals.

I thought they were like eldrazi spawns just counters, apparently not. That makes the mechanic way more boring.

 

[Hero]

So Animation Module is Proliferate?

Also you guys are thinking too small with getting Platinum Angel. Get Platinum Emperion instead if you don't want to die.

 

[A Serious Man]

I thought they were like eldrazi spawns just counters, apparently not. That makes the mechanic way more boring.

That would be crazy busted, considering how easy it is to get energy. It would take no work at all to cast 5-6 mana spells on turn 3.

 

[SigmasonicX]

I thought they were like eldrazi spawns just counters, apparently not. That makes the mechanic way more boring.

Wait, you seriously went through the preview events so far thinking energy gave you mana, and you didn't think it was at all odd that, say, a 1R instant was dealing damage to creatures and giving you three mana?

So Animation Module is Proliferate?

Also you guys are thinking too small with getting Platinum Angel. Get Platinum Emperion instead if you don't want to die.

No, proliferate can affect any number of things and isn't targeted. Animation Module just affects one thing.

And forgot about Platinum Emperion.

It even protects you from the case of the creature being destroyed, leaving you with a low or negative life total from Madcap Experiment's damage.

 

[TheBlackMarvel]

So Animation Module is Proliferate?

Also you guys are thinking too small with getting Platinum Angel. Get Platinum Emperion instead if you don't want to die.

You can still lose with Emperion on the field in ways that the Angel will protect you from.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

You can still lose with Emperion on the field in ways that the Angel will protect you from.

Sure, but Emperion hits the battlefield before you take damage from Madcap Experiment, which means you won't take the damage. It's actually really clever.

 

[Yeef]

I hate hate hate Flash being blue, the last thing blue needed was flash creatures.Creatures should have a downside for blue decks by being sorcery speed. Flash should be primarily red, it could replace haste for the most part. It also fits in the impulsiveness and chaotic nature of red.

Flash is primarily a defensive mechanic. It doesn't fit what red wants to do in most sets at all.

 

[Hero]

Wait, you seriously went through the preview events so far thinking energy gave you mana, and you didn't think it was at all odd that, say, a 1R instant was dealing damage to creatures and giving you three mana?



No, proliferate can affect any number of things and isn't targeted. Animation Module just affects one thing.

And forgot about Platinum Emperion.

It even protects you from the case of the creature being destroyed, leaving you with a low or negative life total from Madcap Experiment's damage.

Ah yes, that is the difference, but mechanically very similar. Interesting..

You can still lose with Emperion on the field in ways that the Angel will protect you from.

Sure, I never said you still wouldn't lose the game, but it makes it so you don't take any damage from Madcap Experiment.

Sure, but Emperion hits the battlefield before you take damage from Madcap Experiment, which means you won't take the damage. It's actually really clever.

 

[red13th]

from shippers @ reddit

This is the third time in a little over a year that Chandra and Nissa have been printed in the same set with new cards.
KLD - [[Chandra, Torch of Defiance]], [[Nissa, Vital Force]]
KLD PWP - [[Chandra, Pyrogenius]], [[Nissa, Nature's Artisan]]
OGW - [[Chandra, Flamecaller]], [[Nissa, Voice of Zendikar]]
ORI - [[Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh]], [[Nissa, Vastwood Seer]]
They were also printed together on Zendikar, Nissa's first printing.
ZEN - [[Chandra Ablaze]], [[Nissa Revane]]
Counting Kaladesh, there have only been six Nissas printed. Chandra was there for each one of them.
M15 - [[Chandra, Pyromaster]], [[Nissa, Worldwaker]]
Like most things I post here, this probably doesn't mean anything except that I have too much free time at work.

Nissandra OTP

 

[TheBlackMarvel]

Sure, but Emperion hits the battlefield before you take damage from Madcap Experiment, which means you won't take the damage. It's actually really clever.

Sure, I never said you still wouldn't lose the game, but it makes it so you don't take any damage from Madcap Experiment.

Ah cool, thanks for clarifying!

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Flash is primarily a defensive mechanic. It doesn't fit what red wants to do in most sets at all.

It's pseudo haste which red wants to do and I wouldn't say reactive is automatically defensive. I'd be fien with flash primarily white too, I just dislike it primarily in blue. Flash isnlt even used particularly defensively in blue but mostly for tempo.

Wait, you seriously went through the preview events so far thinking energy gave you mana, and you didn't think it was at all odd that, say, a 1R instant was dealing damage to creatures and giving you three mana?

It's either or it doesn't do both and I generally kept out of energy discussions since the mechanic so far bores me. I did think a 2B Draw 2 lose 2 life get 2 mana was OP though.

 

[SigmasonicX]

from shippers @ reddit



Nissandra OTP

The Penny Arcade thread already informed me of Channel Fireball and Gruulfriends a long time ago. (the names themselves came from Reddit, IIRC)

 

[siddx]

We ever gonna see garruk again? It seems like they just dropped his storyline.

 

[Ooccoo]

I'm already tired of seeing the same Planewalkers every block. The Jacetice league is slowly ruining it for me. I don't care about a league of super PWs getting together and defeating every vilain with the power of friendship.

 

[TheBlackMarvel]

We ever gonna see garruk again? It seems like they just dropped his storyline.

Didn't he go to be a recluse?

Spoiler

They should have never let him kill Vronos.

I'm already tired of seeing the same Planewalkers every block. The Jacetice league is slowly ruining it for me. I don't care about a league of super PWs getting together and defeating every vilain with the power of friendship.

I get why they want to have a "face" of Magic but it seems counter to what the people who care most about the story would appreciate.

Spoiler

I won't be shocked if they announce a movie/series at some point.

 

[Angry Grimace]

It's still weird the new Kaladesh Chandra and Nissa will be in standard at the same time as the Oath Chandra and Nissa.

It's so you can curve Oath of Nissa into Oath of Chandra into Nissa, Voice of Zendikar into Chandra, Torch of Defiance into Nissa, Vital Force into Chandra, Flamecaller.

 

[Ashodin]

With nissa in this set, it confirms something I'd been suspecting; granted, if tezz shows up, then it's wrong

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

It's so you can curve Oath of Nissa into Oath of Chandra into Nissa, Voice of Zendikar into Chandra, Torch of Defiance into Nissa, Vital Force into Chandra, Flamecaller.

 

["God's Beard!"]

We ever gonna see garruk again? It seems like they just dropped his storyline.

He's just one of the skeletons in Lili's closet. He's a mindless serial killer now so I'm sure he'll pop up again at some point when they need a threat to the superfriends.

 

[Santiako]

With nissa in this set, it confirms something I'd been suspecting; granted, if tezz shows up, then it's wrong

Tezz can't be in the set, we know there are 4 pws and Dovin Baan is in the boosters.

 

[TheBlackMarvel]

With nissa in this set, it confirms something I'd been suspecting; granted, if tezz shows up, then it's wrong

Care to share your suspicions?

 

[Ooccoo]

Didn't he go to be a recluse?

Spoiler

They should have never let him kill Vronos.

I get why they want to have a "face" of Magic but it seems counter to what the people who care most about the story would appreciate.

Spoiler

I won't be shocked if they announce a movie/series at some point.

There's already a movie being produced right as we speak

 

[Hero]

Random sidenote, does anyone have experience with TurboFog in modern? Not for serious competitiveness but moreso for just FNM shenanigans.

Bant seems the obvious color combination but I'm kind of wondering if Jeskai would be better since you get Keranos and Fevered Visions.

 

[TheBlackMarvel]

There's already a movie being produced right as we speak

Spoiler

Clearly, I'm out of the loop.

 

[SigmasonicX]

There was a movie announced to be in production back in 2014. They've also outright said that the Gatewatch is partially an attempt to get movie studios interested with a core cast of characters, and that Gideon in particular was created years ago specifically for a promotional video given to movie studios.

MaRo has said they're still working on it and it hasn't been dropped. This could just be covering up a bad production, but then in a recent Drive to Work podcast about his top 10 non-designer roles at Wizards, he brought it up unprompted, saying that he really enjoyed working as an advisor for the movie.

 

[Ashodin]

Care to share your suspicions?

Set 1: show heroes/what you think are the villains
Set 2: show villains

So far it's been holding true (Nahiri is not a villain!).

 

[Neoweee]

There's already a movie being produced right as we speak

Developed, not produced.

 

[OnPoint]

Set 1: show heroes/what you think are the villains
Set 2: show villains

So far it's been holding true (Nahiri is not a villain!).

She so very clearly is.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Tezzeret better be an antihero not a villain.

 

[Santiako]

Set 1: show heroes/what you think are the villains
Set 2: show villains

So far it's been holding true (Nahiri is not a villain!).

You kiding me? She was the villain of the block, she summoned fucking Emrakul.

 

[TheBlackMarvel]

Set 1: show heroes/what you think are the villains
Set 2: show villains

So far it's been holding true (Nahiri is not a villain!).

She definitely is. I feel like they were going for an "each side has a point" thing but they (as usual) screwed it up.

 

[Hero]

Nahiri needed to get revenge on Sorin for what he did to Zendikar and also trapping her in the Helvault. Totally not evil.

 

[xptoxyz]

For someone who's been out of it a bit, so they're printing 2 of each planeswalker character in the same set now?

 

[Santiako]

For someone who's been out of it a bit, so they're printing 2 of each planeswalker character in the same set now?

One (the good ones) comes in boosters as usual, but the other ones (the bad ones) come in the intro packs.

 

[TheBlackMarvel]

Nahiri needed to get revenge on Sorin for what he did to Zendikar and also trapping her in the Helvault. Totally not evil.

Lol.

Also his options were restrain or kill her after she attacked him unprovoked. Was Sorin a dick? Sure. Does that justify dooming Innistrad? No.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Lol.

Also his options were restrain or kill her after she attacked him unprovoked. Was Sorin a dick? Sure. Does that justify dooming Innistrad? No.

Some place had to be doomed anyway. There needs to be no justification for a the results matter character, or better said the results are the justification.

 

[xptoxyz]

One (the good ones) comes in boosters as usual, but the other ones (the bad ones) come in the intro packs.

Okay. So intro packs ones are almost like duel decks exclusive card (though maybe those were just art reissues at the time) but they're still numbered in the regular set. Actually don't remember if intro pack was already a thing, last time I played.

 

[SigmasonicX]

They replaced the five Intro Packs with two Planeswalker Decks, starting with Kaladesh. They come with:
* One new (bad) Planeswalker.
* Two copies of a new spell that tutors for that specific Planeswalker.
* Three copies of a new card that gets better if you have any version of that Planeswalker on the battlefield.
* Four copies of a new(?) card that has a flavor connection to the Planeswalker.
* Some number of copies of a dual land that always enters the battlefield tapped, which may or may not also be in the set.
* And other cards that are in Standard.

All of those cards will be in Standard, so a new player could take a deck or a slightly modified version straight to Friday Night Magic without any issues. So entrenched players don't buy these up, leaving none for beginners, the new cards are all intended to be too weak for tournament play. It also serves the purpose of making sure there is always a cycle of simple dual lands in Standard.

 

[Hero]

Lol.

Also his options were restrain or kill her after she attacked him unprovoked. Was Sorin a dick? Sure. Does that justify dooming Innistrad? No.

I mean maybe, but even when Emmy was on Innistrad he's like "nah fuck this plane" and didn't want to fight.

 

[aidan]

They replaced the five Intro Packs with two Planeswalker Decks, starting with Kaladesh. They come with:
* One new (bad) Planeswalker.
* Two copies of a new spell that tutors for that specific Planeswalker.
* Three copies of a new card that gets better if you have any version of that Planeswalker on the battlefield.
* Four copies of a new(?) card that has a flavor connection to the Planeswalker.
* Some number of copies of a dual land that always enters the battlefield tapped, which may or may not also be in the set.
* And other cards that are in Standard.

I feel like the bolded have the most potential to actually make an impact in Standard, especially given how strong new Chandra and OGW Nissa are.

 

[TheBlackMarvel]

I mean maybe, but even when Emmy was on Innistrad he's like "nah fuck this plane" and didn't want to fight.

Emrakul was only the most pressing concern. The whole point of creating Avacyn was to prevent the vampires from eating the plane to death. With her gone, that's back on the table. Sure, Nahiri going HAM on Markov Manor might slow it down a bit but there's still at least two uber vampires loose on Innistrad and very little to stand in their way.

 

[Daedardus]

I feel like the bolded have the most potential to actually make an impact in Standard, especially given how strong new Chandra and OGW Nissa are.

It will probably only work the version of the intro deck, referencing the exact name, so seeing these two, they probably won't do much.

 

[aidan]

It will probably only work the version of the intro deck, referencing the exact name, so seeing these two, they probably won't do much.

Ahh, I see that now. I was misreading Sigmasonic's description. I though "any version of that Planeswalker" meant any legal Nissa or Chandra PW—but it probably does work the same way as the tutor spell which is specific to the PW deck version.

 

[A Serious Man]

I'm thinking the precon PW's are designed to play well with their decks and look worse in a vacuum. They seem designed to guide new players into what the decks are trying to do, using a PW to teach basic archetypes and strategy is actually a pretty good idea. This could be a great introduction product.

 

[SigmasonicX]

It will probably only work the version of the intro deck, referencing the exact name, so seeing these two, they probably won't do much.

No, from the original announcement:

* Three copies of an uncommon permanent that is enhanced by having the planeswalker on the battlefield

For the uncommon, we are making a permanent that is upgraded if you have the relevant planeswalker on the battlefield. Note that unlike the rare spell, the uncommon is looking for any version of the planeswalker—not just the one that comes in the Planeswalker Deck. This card will be thematically tied to the Planeswalker of the deck in name and art. There will be three copies of this card in the deck.

 

[DashReindeer]

I feel like the bolded have the most potential to actually make an impact in Standard, especially given how strong new Chandra and OGW Nissa are.

Yeah, it'll be funny if any of those end up being broken for standard as these intro packs will then get bought up by the entrenched players and the secondary market resulting in exactly the situation Wizards wanted to avoid. We'll see, but since Chandra and Nissa have multiple strong iterations in Standard right now, and card that synergizes well with them could certainly find a home.

 

[Simply Sarah]

I wish this didn't seem to be working out to be another case of "The only really exciting PWs are returning ones." New PW characters are rare enough these days and you need to go back to Ugin to find the last time one really made a splash of any sort. So far this time we have Saheeli and she's basically a 1UR sorcery that creates a Haste copy of a creature or artifact that exiles at the end of turn and maybe you might be able to reuse the effect in a couple turns.

And yes, I'm counting Nahiri and Ob Nixilis as returning even though their original cards were in a Commander set.

They replaced the five Intro Packs with two Planeswalker Decks, starting with Kaladesh. They come with:
* One new (bad) Planeswalker.
* Two copies of a new spell that tutors for that specific Planeswalker.
* Three copies of a new card that gets better if you have any version of that Planeswalker on the battlefield.
* Four copies of a new(?) card that has a flavor connection to the Planeswalker.
* Some number of copies of a dual land that always enters the battlefield tapped, which may or may not also be in the set.
* And other cards that are in Standard.

All of those cards will be in Standard, so a new player could take a deck or a slightly modified version straight to Friday Night Magic without any issues. So entrenched players don't buy these up, leaving none for beginners, the new cards are all intended to be too weak for tournament play.

As others have stated, this really feels like it could backfire when the new players realize they've gotten a product with intentionally underpowered cards. The old pre-con decks usually weren't great, but at least they had real cards in them and normally played like a real deck.

 

[Xis]

It's so you can curve Oath of Nissa into Oath of Chandra into Nissa, Voice of Zendikar into Chandra, Torch of Defiance into Nissa, Vital Force into Chandra, Flamecaller.

I know this is a joke, but your second Chandra / Nissa would kill your first one of each because of the Planeswalker Uniqueness rule, which is another reason having both standard legal is weird!

 

[charlequin]

It's still weird the new Kaladesh Chandra and Nissa will be in standard at the same time as the Oath Chandra and Nissa.

I mean, back in the day we used to have expansion PWs in Standard with the Core Set versions of the same characters, so this isn't really that different.

We ever gonna see garruk again? It seems like they just dropped his storyline.

We saw him a lot more recently than we did the Phyrexians.