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Microsoft Flight Simulator 2020 | We Don't Need Roads

Lux77

Lux77

Member
After some research I managed to find free solution

Here is a quick guide if someone interested:

Downloadate Airmate
https://apps.apple.com/us/app/airmate/id998181102
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.aero.airmate.airmate&hl=en&gl=US

DownloadFS2FF
https://github.com/astenlund/fs2ff

Run FS2020, when you are in menus, run FS2FF. Then press big "Connect" button, if connection to FS2020 is ok, green light will show in bottom left corner.
In Airmate, you need to set up an account, but after that its totally free.
Go to Settings -> Advanced and under GPS Source enable "Simulator".
That's it, now go to map and press Start flight - app will now follow your plane in realtime.
 
prag16

prag16

Banned
In 23 pages I'm sure this has been covered, but I've been wanting this for a while and bought it today to celebrate my Biden Bucks hitting my bank account....

This has got to have the absolute worst install process I've ever seen. Instead of downloading everything all at once, it seems to download each bite sized snippet and then WAIT while that piece installs before moving on to download the next one. Nobody every heard of background downloading? Or downloading the complete game instead of waiting to install bits and pieces without proceeding? On my connection this should take about an hour and a half, but it's been for 1/2 hour and is only at the 3.5GB mark out of 151GB. Lunacy. This is being installed on a SATA SSD (but a relatively fast one, not an early piece of shit model).

Fuck off Microsoft, holy hell.... What were they thinking...
 
Nitty_Grimes

Nitty_Grimes

Made a crappy phPBB forum once ... once.
Are you downloading the free but not free because you pay for game pass version?

Does the Steam version have the same downloading process I wonder?
 
RPS37

RPS37

Member
prag16 said:
In 23 pages I'm sure this has been covered, but I've been wanting this for a while and bought it today to celebrate my Biden Bucks hitting my bank account....

This has got to have the absolute worst install process I've ever seen. Instead of downloading everything all at once, it seems to download each bite sized snippet and then WAIT while that piece installs before moving on to download the next one. Nobody every heard of background downloading? Or downloading the complete game instead of waiting to install bits and pieces without proceeding? On my connection this should take about an hour and a half, but it's been for 1/2 hour and is only at the 3.5GB mark out of 151GB. Lunacy. This is being installed on a SATA SSD (but a relatively fast one, not an early piece of shit model).

Fuck off Microsoft, holy hell.... What were they thinking...
Click to expand...
You’re right.
Th install process was horrible and took me days.
Have since uninstalled and am waiting to try it on Series X.
Theoretically, there the install will be painless.
 
GHG

GHG

Member
Nitty_Grimes said:
Are you downloading the free but not free because you pay for game pass version?

Does the Steam version have the same downloading process I wonder?
Click to expand...

Yes it does.

It's pretty fucked up as well because the download process counts as "play time" due to the application needing to be open so you can't even check the game works before your no questions asked refund period is up.
 
nemiroff

nemiroff

Gold Member
IbizaPocholo said:
Click to expand...

ANOTHER laggy video from these guys.. The person responsible for the video capturing must be cancelled at once.

Nitty_Grimes said:
Are you downloading the free but not free because you pay for game pass version?

Does the Steam version have the same downloading process I wonder?
Click to expand...

There's no difference between the MS store version and the Steam version AFAIK. The install and the updates are done in-game.
 
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Andodalf

Andodalf

Banned
VFXVeteran said:
It is. And I don't see any game coming out this generation that will have these kind of visuals. There is some magic in this simulator that I can't even figure out how they did it. It's on another level.
Click to expand...

It's use of the cloud to stream insane amounts of data is a big deal. filesize is a limiting factor on fidelity when working with photogrammetry, and this game has access to petabytes of data.
 
VFXVeteran

VFXVeteran

Banned
Andodalf said:
It's use of the cloud to stream insane amounts of data is a big deal. filesize is a limiting factor on fidelity when working with photogrammetry, and this game has access to petabytes of data.
Click to expand...
Yea, but that's easy to explain. Try explaining how the game has a lighting system that rivals film done in realtime without using ray-tracing? This the only game ever that has realistic lighting where it could be clear and sun shinning over here but if you look 2 blocks away it looks dark because there is a cloud blocking the sun in that particular area. If they are using GI probes for illumination, they must have a MASSIVE amount of them and they are all updating in realtime based not on a harmonic equations but the actual sky itself with the clouds illumination.

Then the clouds...how the hell did they use full 3D textures with light propagation with self-shadowing (i.e. full subsurface scattering done properly). I've only seen this in film. Granted they are using a sparse 3D resolution for their texture but they are using texture synthesis to evaluate a procedural noise in realtime and then converting it to a 3D texture with MIPmapping to remove aliasing all in realtime and at a fairly low cost.

I tried reaching out to a graphics programmer at Asobo on LinkedIn. No joy, he didn't respond.
 
S

Sealord of Braavos

Member
VFXVeteran said:
It is. And I don't see any game coming out this generation that will have these kind of visuals. There is some magic in this simulator that I can't even figure out how they did it. It's on another level.
Click to expand...

I’m extremely interested at what kind of resolution and frame rate this will run at on Series X. I do wonder if I’m setting myself up for a letdown after watching all of the Flight Sim youtube videos using premium gaming PC’s.
 
VFXVeteran

VFXVeteran

Banned
Sealord of Braavos said:
I’m extremely interested at what kind of resolution and frame rate this will run at on Series X. I do wonder if I’m setting myself up for a letdown after watching all of the Flight Sim youtube videos using premium gaming PC’s.
Click to expand...
Yea, I have a 3090 and I can't enable all the graphics settings to max. I'm also using dynamic resolution.. something I hate because it's not the true resolution. I also fly with camera looking behind the plane because the framerate tanks when I'm in the cockpit by 6-15FPS depending on the plane. It's a real performance hog. Hopefully they will transition the engine to DX12 to get more resources because my GPU isn't maxed out doing work.
 
CatLady

CatLady

Selfishly plays on Xbox Purr-ies X
VFXVeteran said:
It is. And I don't see any game coming out this generation that will have these kind of visuals. There is some magic in this simulator that I can't even figure out how they did it. It's on another level.
Click to expand...
I don't expect this game to look the same on Series X as is does on a high end PC, but in your opinion do you feel they will be able to still make it more or less acceptably attractive? And more importantly will we be able to see fresh new killer screenshots/videos when hype is renewed for this on the XsX. I LOVE looking at the visuals in this thread. :messenger_beaming:
 
VFXVeteran

VFXVeteran

Banned
CatLady said:
I don't expect this game to look the same on Series X as is does on a high end PC, but in your opinion do you feel they will be able to still make it more or less acceptably attractive? And more importantly will we be able to see fresh new killer screenshots/videos when hype is renewed for this on the XsX. I LOVE looking at the visuals in this thread. :messenger_beaming:
Click to expand...
It's going to look very similar because the textures are photogrammetry and you'll still get that photoreal look. That's the main draw to the sim. They will scale down the cloud rendering. Also, their use of ambient occlusion is the main draw on the terrain and why it looks so realistic (on top of the photogrammetry). They use it liberally and everywhere. Even the people on the ground have a large shadow behind them so that they just appear "planted" to the ground. The real performance hog for the XSX will be the resolution. I'm guessing probably 1440p dynamic scale running at a locked 30FPS. 30FPS is plenty for realism in this sim. I'm usually around 33FPS in cities. They'll scale back the number of items seen on the roads like cars, trucks, people, etc..

Overall presentation will be there for sure. It will still look amazing!
 
M1chl

M1chl

Currently Gif and Meme Champion
VFXVeteran said:
I can NOT control that plane on the ground when it's rolling. It's so hard for me.. lol
Click to expand...
Understandable, rudder control is fairly hard thing to pull off. Especially with how sensitive controls with most of peripherials. In realy world it's much easier and you most often have to fight with it.
 
CatLady

CatLady

Selfishly plays on Xbox Purr-ies X
VFXVeteran said:
It's going to look very similar because the textures are photogrammetry and you'll still get that photoreal look. That's the main draw to the sim. They will scale down the cloud rendering. Also, their use of ambient occlusion is the main draw on the terrain and why it looks so realistic (on top of the photogrammetry). They use it liberally and everywhere. Even the people on the ground have a large shadow behind them so that they just appear "planted" to the ground. The real performance hog for the XSX will be the resolution. I'm guessing probably 1440p dynamic scale running at a locked 30FPS. 30FPS is plenty for realism in this sim. I'm usually around 33FPS in cities. They'll scale back the number of items seen on the roads like cars, trucks, people, etc..

Overall presentation will be there for sure. It will still look amazing!
Click to expand...

Thank you, that's great news! I'll be looking forward to all the visual media from lot of new pilots when it releases on console. I do hope they aren't going to try to put this on last gen though.
 
VFXVeteran

VFXVeteran

Banned
M1chl said:
Understandable, rudder control is fairly hard thing to pull off. Especially with how sensitive controls with most of peripherials. In realy world it's much easier and you most often have to fight with it.
Click to expand...
Exactly. The rudder pedals I have are way too damn sensitive and the crosswind was crazy. It just made the jet do a hard turn when I didn't even touch the controls. LOL then it was about to turn over on it's head!

This is the most costly piece of software I've ever had. I got the Thrustmaster Warthog, the pedals, an RTX 3090, a new AMD 3950X Ryzen with Pci-e 4.0 mb, and TrackIR all for this sim. Of course, I am studying to be a real pilot so it was warranted.
 
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VFXVeteran

VFXVeteran

Banned
CatLady said:
Thank you, that's great news! I'll be looking forward to all the visual media from lot of new pilots when it releases on console. I do hope they aren't going to try to put this on last gen though.
Click to expand...
Just like Cyberpunk, it simply can't run on them with out destroying everything about the sim. I can't see it.
 
M1chl

M1chl

Currently Gif and Meme Champion
VFXVeteran said:
Exactly. The rudder pedals I have are way too damn sensitive and the crosswind was crazy. It just made the jet do a hard turn when I didn't even touch the controls. LOL then it was about to turn over on it's head!

This is the most costly piece of software I've ever had. I got the Thrustmaster Warthog, the pedals, an RTX 3090, a new AMD 3950X Ryzen with Pci-e 4.0 mb, and TrackIR all for this sim. Of course, I am studying to be a real pilot so it was warranted.
Click to expand...
I am not sure if you are doing a standard PPC for that glider, but let me tell you that this is peanuts in comparison : D
 
VFXVeteran

VFXVeteran

Banned
M1chl said:
I am not sure if you are doing a standard PPC for that glider, but let me tell you that this is peanuts in comparison : D
Click to expand...
I'm doing the standard PPC. Wish me luck man! I'm about to take the written test here in a few weeks. I just finished all the studying yesterday and will go back and do several practice exams. The information to be a real pilot is akin to getting a degree in college. It's unreal how much they cram into your mind for this. And I forget things a LOT! I need this year to save up the thousands of dollars for the actual flight training (in AZ Soaring Association). I should have enough vacation built up next year. It will be nice already having the written test done and out of the way so I learn all practical.

The simulator helps me tremendously because I literally make myself go through ALL the steps. I even answer tower before I hit my response on the keyboard. I still don't have that nailed down talking to tower. Ugghhh.
 
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Stuart360

Stuart360

Member
Yeah i wouldnt expect the XSX version to be 60fps, unless they target like 1080p. I do expect the graphics to look very similar to a high end PC though, XSX does have the power.
 
M1chl

M1chl

Currently Gif and Meme Champion
VFXVeteran said:
I'm doing the standard PPC. Wish me luck man! I'm about to take the written test here in a few weeks. I just finished all the studying yesterday and will go back and do several practice exams. The information to be a real pilot is akin to getting a degree in college. It's unreal how much they cram into your mind for this. And I forget things a LOT! I need this year to save up the thousands of dollars for the actual flight training (in AZ Soaring Association). I should have enough vacation built up next year. It will be nice already having the written test done and out of the way so I learn all practical.

The simulator helps me tremendously because I literally make myself go through ALL the steps. I even answer tower before I hit my response on the keyboard. I still don't have that nailed down talking to tower. Ugghhh.
Click to expand...
It's challenging, but manageable, I went through it almost 12 years ago and I am glad that I did : ) So good luck out there!
 
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VFXVeteran

VFXVeteran

Banned
Stuart360 said:
Yeah i wouldnt expect the XSX version to be 60fps, unless they target like 1080p. I do expect the graphics to look very similar to a high end PC though, XSX does have the power.
Click to expand...
Not THAT much power bro. I don't even have all the options turned up and I'm using upscaling myself. There isn't a piece of hardware out now that can run FS2020 with full options at MAX at 60FPS. None. It doesn't exist yet.
 
Stuart360

Stuart360

Member
VFXVeteran said:
Not THAT much power bro. I don't even have all the options turned up and I'm using upscaling myself. There isn't a piece of hardware out now that can run FS2020 with full options at MAX at 60FPS. None. It doesn't exist yet.
Click to expand...
I mean at 30fps. I could hit 30fps with the graphics almost maxed on my 980ti (with heavy overclock).
I just dont think they will target 60fps on XSX. The games is a very slow moving game 90% of the time.
 
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VFXVeteran

VFXVeteran

Banned
Stuart360 said:
I'm only saying me experience VFX. I could see them going for something like 1440p/30 on XSX.
Click to expand...
Yea, I agree but I have no idea how much they are going to pull back on the graphics. It most certainly won't be settings on the "High" category. The big big performance hog in this sim is all the distinct objects overlapping each other and the liquid crystal displays in cockpit mode. If you are out in the middle of nowhere and flying in 3rd person, yea, it is smooth as silk. Going to a city where it has to model every individual building (no instances) tanks every GPU. That's why when people try to show UE5 demo as a true next-gen title, I laugh to myself because nearly everyone of those objects are instances of each other - rocks included. When you start looking at trying to push unique geometry to the graphics card, it will tank because of lack of bandwidth. FS2020 requires an enormous amount of bandwidth in the graphics subsystem that's just not there yet with the hardware we have out today.
 
Stuart360

Stuart360

Member
VFXVeteran said:
Yea, I agree but I have no idea how much they are going to pull back on the graphics. It most certainly won't be settings on the "High" category. The big big performance hog in this sim is all the distinct objects overlapping each other and the liquid crystal displays in cockpit mode. If you are out in the middle of nowhere and flying in 3rd person, yea, it is smooth as silk. Going to a city where it has to model every individual building (no instances) tanks every GPU. That's why when people try to show UE5 demo as a true next-gen title, I laugh to myself because nearly everyone of those objects are instances of each other - rocks included. When you start looking at trying to push unique geometry to the graphics card, it will tank because of lack of bandwidth. FS2020 requires an enormous amount of bandwidth in the graphics subsystem that's just not there yet with the hardware we have out today.
Click to expand...
Yeah not denying what you are saying at all, i'm just saying i could see the XSX running the game at the settings i use, but at 1440p instead of my 1080p.
I get you about the cockpit being more demanding, i did notice that. I played 50 hours in the game and all i did in those 50 hours was pick a medium power plane, and explored the world. Loved it.
Also when i said i could see it looking like a high end PC, i meant more like High or decnt settings, not Ultra. It should still look very good on XSX imo, but not as good as you can get the game looking on your powerhouse!.
 
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VFXVeteran

VFXVeteran

Banned
Stuart360 said:
Yeah not denying what you are saying at all, i'm just saying i could see the XSX running the game at the settings i use, but at 1440p instead of my 1080p.
I get you about the cockpit being more demanding, i did notice that. I played 50 hours in the game and all i did in those 50 hours was pick a medium power plane, and explored the world. Loved it.
Also when i aid i could see it looking like a high end PC, i meant more like High or decnt settings, not Ultra. It should still look very good on XSX imo, but not as good as you can get the game looking on your powerhouse!.
Click to expand...
Even with my powerhouse, the sim shits on it. :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 
VFXVeteran

VFXVeteran

Banned
Stuart360 said:
What kind of frames are you getting in the cities?
Click to expand...
Around 15FPS or so in cockpit mode. If I fly the Pitts SR2, I can get manageable 25-30FPS. What's weird though is that if I take all the graphics settings to Low.. it won't change much. Their engine is a complete brute-force solution. When I upgraded to a Ryzen 3950X 2 weeks ago, it helped but not significantly. Sim still has slight pauses when I'm going really fast 50ft off the ground.

This is my best video I made of myself:



What a freakin rush it was flying that fast and it was only at 375knots!!
 
nemiroff

nemiroff

Gold Member
VFXVeteran said:
Even with my powerhouse, the sim shits on it. :messenger_tears_of_joy:
Click to expand...

Because my 3080 is still delayed and my Reverb G2 (4K native) is getting dusty, I've tried to run it with MSFS through my 1080 - Several times - in case some magic had happened since last time I tried.. :( With that said, with heavy tweaking via OpenXR (downscaling) and turning off reprojection (oddly enough..) I actually managed to get a somewhat good and pretty damn clear VR experience out of it, albeit it's like balancing on an uncomfortably thin line..
 
Stuart360

Stuart360

Member
VFXVeteran said:
Around 15FPS or so in cockpit mode. If I fly the Pitts SR2, I can get manageable 25-30FPS. What's weird though is that if I take all the graphics settings to Low.. it won't change much. Their engine is a complete brute-force solution. When I upgraded to a Ryzen 3950X 2 weeks ago, it helped but not significantly. Sim still has slight pauses when I'm going really fast 50ft off the ground.

This is my best video I made of myself:



What a freakin rush it was flying that fast and it was only at 375knots!!
Click to expand...

What a fantastic video VFX, god this game looks gorgeous.
Yeah i think everyone gets those little pauses and skips. I remember when i was messing around with the settings, one of the graphics settings had a HUGE effect on framerate, cant remember which setting.
Probably going to download the game again later and see the new models added.
 
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VFXVeteran

VFXVeteran

Banned
To the Xbox gamers.. be PROUD of this achievement in visual fidelity. There is nothing else out that like it at the moment and probably won't be for this entire generation. I'm putting that claim out there. You will always be able to revert to this sim as a showcase for the best graphics ever.
 
Stuart360

Stuart360

Member
VFXVeteran said:
To the Xbox gamers.. be PROUD of this achievement in visual fidelity. There is nothing else out that like it at the moment and probably won't be for this entire generation. I'm putting that claim out there. You will always be able to revert to this sim as a showcase for the best graphics ever.
Click to expand...
You have some interesting vids on your Youtube VFX. I'll check some out later.
 
prag16

prag16

Banned
VFXVeteran said:
Around 15FPS or so in cockpit mode. If I fly the Pitts SR2, I can get manageable 25-30FPS. What's weird though is that if I take all the graphics settings to Low.. it won't change much. Their engine is a complete brute-force solution. When I upgraded to a Ryzen 3950X 2 weeks ago, it helped but not significantly. Sim still has slight pauses when I'm going really fast 50ft off the ground.

This is my best video I made of myself:



What a freakin rush it was flying that fast and it was only at 375knots!!
Click to expand...

Man, I really want to fly that F-15. But having just paid $53 for the full game, I can't possibly justify $42 for just that F-15 pack. Or even $20 for that European fighter jet. Oh well. I successfully crashed a Cessna jet into my house at 350 knots (at least I think I did, early fade to black..) so that's the next best thing.
 
O

OceanicWaterHorse

Member
I'm getting about 36fps in the cockpit with the simple aircraft like the 152/172/xCub, but that drops to 10-15 with airliners etc. The multithreading is poor, looking at the Developer mode FPS (core 1 always maxxed out whilst the other three are watching the flowers grow), so I am wondering if a high GhZ CPU is the best upgrade for now to get the more complex planes working smoothly - to be honest I'm impressed how well it works on my I5-4460, 16GB RAM, AMD RX 580 (8GB).

Does it make much difference going i7/i9 rather than a 10th gen i5?
 
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