Microsoft Studios' creative director has some choice words about always-online

DJ Lushious

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Dec 3, 2007
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Agreed and I hope MS officially comments or unveils their new system soon.
As do I, so I can make a sound decision on which console to purchase. However, I don't believe this news article will force MicroSoft's hand. At most, we'd be lucky to get a coyly worded response that can generate its own thread where it is picked apart and dissected to death (IE not the usual "rumors and speculation" response).
 

kamakazi5

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Aug 17, 2012
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It's crazy to have followed this thread since last night. Microsoft's official announcement can't come soon enough because I just don't know what to think at this point.
 

saunderez

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But surely they care about the video game enthusiasts (i.e. us) who buy more games than just COD every year.
If they don't now they will when it doesn't fly off the shelf. We are the early adopters. We will make or break their console in the early days. I was there day 1 for the 360, have bought multiple consoles and over 100 retail games, $1000s worth of DLC and XBLA games, if they don't want my business fine.
 

Felix Lighter

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Why does Arthur Gies seemingly always align himself with the stance that is likely to be wrong in these things?

Does he like yelling at people and think that yelling at people is easier when people are calling you dumb or something?
He consistently backs corporate interests regardless of the effect on consumers. I'm convinced that he's willing to say anything that he thinks may help him get a job in the industry.
 

Einbroch

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Most likely the backlash will cause MS to back down. Or they think it will make them so much money forcing everyone to be connected to shove ads at them they will continue on with it like they did with the negative reaction to Metro on Windows 8 desktops, just because they have money signs in their eyes.
The question is: can they?

I'm sure their economic infrastructure with the 720 was designed around this always online thing. If you're always online, they can push certain things in their first party games and it enables developers (the big ones who already have their hands on the 720) to do some cool things. Their dashboard, DRM, and even hardware would be all based on the fact that the user is always online. Do they have the time to change all this? It's a HUGE undertaking to completely flip-flop on a console's core features beyond just saying "well, no more forced online!"

If this is the course they've chosen, it's likely too late to change, unless they delay.
 

WhiskeyKnight

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Aug 18, 2009
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Holy shit. I've never seen such a tone deaf executive before. How can he behave like this and still have a job a Microsoft? I really hope he got a ear full from the PR folks.
 

BloodMoney

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i feel the need to say it again. Blacksburg, VA (Virginia Tech) is connected. I don't know why this Orth dude needs to hate on Blacksburg.
 

DouglasteR

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Oct 8, 2012
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LOL, M$ is really rolling the anti-hate machine.

M$ boss : Always online is a must
M$ slave: Ppl will not like this boss, even more after Failablo 3 and DisconnectCity 5
M$ boss : then we will CHANGE THEIR MINDS.

Brace yourselves.
 

iMax

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You're very wrong on this and if you have any stature in the company you work for then you should damn well know the implications of tweeting or even posting something on your Facebook wall that can go against the company rhetoric.
It would be barely acceptable if he didn't identify himself, however his profile was plastered with his job title. That's when it gets inappropriate.
 

Sunnybuns

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i feel the need to say it again. Blacksburg, VA (Virginia Tech) is connected. I don't know why this Orth dude needs to hate on Blacksburg.
You seriously haven't been able to understand the context, even with a ton of people explaining it?
 

ekim

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LOL, M$ is really rolling the anti-hate machine.

M$ boss : Always online is a must
M$ slave: Ppl will not like this boss, even more after Failablo 3 and DisconnectCity 5
M$ boss : then we will CHANGE THEIR MINDS.

Brace yourselves.
I wouldn't do that :eek:
 

Jhriad

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Mar 20, 2011
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Penguins&PolarBears = Adam Orth?

was this ever sussed out by DetectiveGAF? either way his full post history is a shill-parade laugh riot.
I wasn't sure how safe it was to start witch-hunting viral marketers around here but he certainly has an eerie history.
Reading through his post history certainly feels like reading the dialogue of a Microsoft shill. Adam Orth starts at Microsoft Feb 2012 and three months later Penguins&PolarBears is on GAF and posting almost exclusively in topics related to Microsoft products. Windows 8, Windows Phone, Nokia Lumia, Surface, Xbox Live, Durango, etc. Even if they're not the same individual the person behind the account obviously has an agenda they're looking to press (and/or defend). Even some of his lone forays into topics related to competing products recently have only been to point out how the fashion in which they do X is inferior to the Microsoft approach.

I think you overestimate the importance of your video game forum.
Most ironic quote in his post history if he is Orth.
 

LiquidMetal14

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Jan 18, 2007
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If Microsofts showing is that poor that they are relying on such tactics then that's just as damning.
Exactly. They better have some decent games to show to offset some of these "tactics".

At least Sony has been about as up front as you can be. Especially on the HW front in which we have tons of detail on their HW and know they have heavy developer support.
 

Sunnybuns

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Okay. Shinobi hears that a dev at MS doesn't have a problem with an always online device. He goes "oh shit". And then the dev says something that might or might not be stupid on his Twitter account, followed by a clarification that it was not meant to be a negative comment. I reckon lots of people on GAF have a Twitter account. Lots of casual stupid things are said on Twitter every single day. Some are said by people who are more well known, some are said by people who are less well known but have many detractors, some are said by absolute nobodies.

At some point we have to ask ourselves why this matters so much, and why we want to give importance to it. If someone says something on this forum which is frowned upon, we can deal with it on this forum. If someone says something which is actually newsworthy, there could be something to discuss. But there has to be a line somewhere right? Let's be rational and sane people here. There's no story here, there's no scandal here, and there is nothing to discuss here really.
 

maltrain

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Jul 1, 2012
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Thing is simple. If this is not true an executive or speaker from Microsoft should say it NOW. They don't need to say anything about Durango, only that this is not true. Period.

The really bad publicity they have with this is very harmful for the company if it's not true.

At less they are so STUPID than thinking bad publicity is better than none publicity.
 

ascii42

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Mar 27, 2007
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Well then let me pose this question to you...

Have you heard of him before this incident?

...exactly.

I'm done here.
That doesn't mean anything. I hadn't heard of Cerny (at least not that I remember) before the PS4 unveil, but he's obviously not a nobody.
 

Fivefold

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Jul 29, 2011
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ironcreed said:
irrelevant links
Gaming "press" echo chamber.

No news so they're running this shit to the ground. I don't think real media outlets run stories based on twitter drama.
 

BolognaSoup

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Dec 12, 2008
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It's almost like Microsoft is setting us all up for a massive troll if they were to come out in a month at their event and say "LOLZ j/k! Everything works offline and used games for everyone!" Then everyone gets all excited and jumps in line.
 

Kerub

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Feb 27, 2011
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This is getting out of hand. If Microsoft actually isn't planning on using always-online, they need to step up and deny it.
 

bj00rn_

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Aug 17, 2007
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Then deal with it?

The guy was stupid enough to put this out on a public medium like twitter, I feel no sympathy for him to be honest.
We all say that - Until the day we suddenly sit there with a surprised"wtf just happened"-face in a similar situation and think "it wasn't really meant like that!" when other people think otherwise. I don't know what is what in this case, I'm just saying.

BTW, I saw the story hit mainstream in Norway as well today, heh.
 

Htown

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Feb 19, 2008
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Haha, I don't know anything about this, but "delusional feminist extremist crusader" and "agenda-driven" are super sus. Is this enough to give me a perm?
In the case he's talking about, the person in question was actually being those things. It wasn't a general anti-feminist statement, it was a response to a person on twitter being an actual dumbass.
 

FieryBalrog

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Oct 6, 2006
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LOL, M$ is really rolling the anti-hate machine.

M$ boss : Always online is a must
M$ slave: Ppl will not like this boss, even more after Failablo 3 and DisconnectCity 5
M$ boss : then we will CHANGE THEIR MINDS.

Brace yourselves.
Brace yourselves for shitty po$t$.
 

sneaky77

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Jan 15, 2008
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Thing is simple. If this is not true an executive or speaker from Microsoft should say it NOW. They don't need to say anything about Durango, only that this is not true. Period.

The really bad publicity they have with this is very harmful for the company if it's not true.

At least they are so STUPID than thinking bad publicity is better than none publicity.
The official announcement will drown any kind of rumor and "outraged" people in this forum. So no I don't think Microsoft needs to do shit right now.
 

Shahed

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Feb 14, 2012
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Damn i stayed up till 4 AM reading this thread. Waking up I see there's 20 new pages. Crazy as hell reading in real time when it initially broke.
 

Omegasquash

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Apr 13, 2007
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It would be more palatable with an heavy subsidized console. 50$ upfront with a monthly fee of $15-$20 that includes 4G fees/Live/and a subscription model of renting content. The values could be way off but they're just to illustrate the point.
If I could rent content (so to speak), then at least there would be something there that I'm getting. If the expectation is that I pay more, then it's fair for my expectation to be that I get more. At that point, they'd be offering something more, and the price debate is an aside...it's about value and value is subjective from person to person.

I don't know if I'm speaking for lots of people when I say this specifically, but here goes....I feel like an always online requirement would cause hiccups, annoyances and accessibility issues more than I do now. None of these issues measure on the Richter scale, but they do measure. If given the choice between a platform that doesn't have these hiccups and one that does, I will choose the one that doesn't have the hiccups. These hiccups become more than that for lots of non-metropolitan areas, and residents of those areas have WAY more reason to speak up than I do, and we're seeing lots of that, as well as support/advocacy for those people.
 

Fivefold

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Jul 29, 2011
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LOL, M$ is really rolling the anti-hate machine.

M$ boss : Always online is a must
M$ slave: Ppl will not like this boss, even more after Failablo 3 and DisconnectCity 5
M$ boss : then we will CHANGE THEIR MINDS.

Brace yourselves.
Great post, Failablo really pushes this into top tier.
 

Hix

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Jul 24, 2011
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The question is: can they?

I'm sure their economic infrastructure with the 720 was designed around this always online thing. If you're always online, they can push certain things in their first party games and it enables developers (the big ones who already have their hands on the 720) to do some cool things. Their dashboard, DRM, and even hardware would be all based on the fact that the user is always online. Do they have the time to change all this? It's a HUGE undertaking to completely flip-flop on a console's core features beyond just saying "well, no more forced online!"

If this is the course they've chosen, it's likely too late to change, unless they delay.
All of the rumors, including Kotaku's, have come with the proviso that Microsoft can change it at any minute with minimal effort and impact. A simple firmware update presumably.
 

LiquidMetal14

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Jan 18, 2007
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Okay. Shinobi hears that a dev at MS doesn't have a problem with an always online device. He goes "oh shit". And then the dev says something that might or might not be stupid on his Twitter account, followed by a clarification that it was not meant to be a negative comment. I reckon lots of people on GAF have a Twitter account. Lots of casual stupid things are said on Twitter every single day. Some are said by people who are more well known, some are said by people who are less well known but have many detractors, some are said by absolute nobodies.

At some point we have to ask ourselves why this matters so much, and why we want to give importance to it. If someone says something on this forum which is frowned upon, we can deal with it on this forum. If someone says something which is actually newsworthy, there could be something to discuss. But there has to be a line somewhere right? Let's be rational and sane people here. There's no story here, there's no scandal here, and there is nothing to discuss here really.
Shut it down. The voice of reason is here.

I'm giving you hell but damn, there is definitely discussion material here.
 

Takuya

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May 24, 2011
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Okay. Shinobi hears that a dev at MS doesn't have a problem with an always online device. He goes "oh shit". And then the dev says something that might or might not be stupid on his Twitter account, followed by a clarification that it was not meant to be a negative comment. I reckon lots of people on GAF have a Twitter account. Lots of casual stupid things are said on Twitter every single day. Some are said by people who are more well known, some are said by people who are less well known but have many detractors, some are said by absolute nobodies.

At some point we have to ask ourselves why this matters so much, and why we want to give importance to it. If someone says something on this forum which is frowned upon, we can deal with it on this forum. If someone says something which is actually newsworthy, there could be something to discuss. But there has to be a line somewhere right? Let's be rational and sane people here. There's no story here, there's no scandal here, and there is nothing to discuss here really.
Implicitely confirming an anti-consumer feature is pretty newsworthy, especially from an employee from a company who has remained completely silent. And then proceeded to ("jokingly") mock their consumers.
 

freddy

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Jun 7, 2007
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Okay. Shinobi hears that a dev at MS doesn't have a problem with an always online device. He goes "oh shit". And then the dev says something that might or might not be stupid on his Twitter account, followed by a clarification that it was not meant to be a negative comment. I reckon lots of people on GAF have a Twitter account. Lots of casual stupid things are said on Twitter every single day. Some are said by people who are more well known, some are said by people who are less well known but have many detractors, some are said by absolute nobodies.

At some point we have to ask ourselves why this matters so much, and why we want to give importance to it. If someone says something on this forum which is frowned upon, we can deal with it on this forum. If someone says something which is actually newsworthy, there could be something to discuss. But there has to be a line somewhere right? Let's be rational and sane people here. There's no story here, there's no scandal here, and there is nothing to discuss here really.
Almost 5k replies in this topic, many more on redditt and a bunch of news stories growing all the time. People care.
 
May 11, 2009
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Okay. Shinobi hears that a dev at MS doesn't have a problem with an always online device. He goes "oh shit". And then the dev says something that might or might not be stupid on his Twitter account, followed by a clarification that it was not meant to be a negative comment. I reckon lots of people on GAF have a Twitter account. Lots of casual stupid things are said on Twitter every single day. Some are said by people who are more well known, some are said by people who are less well known but have many detractors, some are said by absolute nobodies.

At some point we have to ask ourselves why this matters so much, and why we want to give importance to it. If someone says something on this forum which is frowned upon, we can deal with it on this forum. If someone says something which is actually newsworthy, there could be something to discuss. But there has to be a line somewhere right? Let's be rational and sane people here. There's no story here, there's no scandal here, and there is nothing to discuss here really.
In a simple world without inference or context you might be right. But we don't live in that world so you're wrong.
 

Corto

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Dec 5, 2008
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Okay. Shinobi hears that a dev at MS doesn't have a problem with an always online device. He goes "oh shit". And then the dev says something that might or might not be stupid on his Twitter account, followed by a clarification that it was not meant to be a negative comment. I reckon lots of people on GAF have a Twitter account. Lots of casual stupid things are said on Twitter every single day. Some are said by people who are more well known, some are said by people who are less well known but have many detractors, some are said by absolute nobodies.

At some point we have to ask ourselves why this matters so much, and why we want to give importance to it. If someone says something on this forum which is frowned upon, we can deal with it on this forum. If someone says something which is actually newsworthy, there could be something to discuss. But there has to be a line somewhere right? Let's be rational and sane people here. There's no story here, there's no scandal here, and there is nothing to discuss here really.
You are not Duckroll. And this has no parallel with the CliffyB/Roger Ebert tweet. This is newsworthy (just take a look at how many outlets are already running the story, and there's much to discuss about the implications of this.
 

Azull

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Feb 13, 2013
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If someone says something which is actually newsworthy, there could be something to discuss. But there has to be a line somewhere right? Let's be rational and sane people here. There's no story here, there's no scandal here, and there is nothing to discuss here really.
I am sorry you were saying?
 

jorma

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Jun 4, 2007
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And he's right, Orth might have handled the situation stupidly but this out of context "deal with it" bullshit sites are accusing him of is ridiculous. He was just joking with his friend for god's sake, I dislike anti-consumer policies and the douchebags who defend them as much as any other gamer but I feel sorry for this guy for getting all this heat, it's simply unfair.
I kind of agree, even though he should probably have known better since he is a suave internet user that is always online, and all that jazz. :)

my own beef with this is solely the message, not the messenger or the style in which it was provided.
 

Sunnybuns

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Dec 5, 2008
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You are not Duckroll. And this has no parallel with the CliffyB/Roger Ebert tweet. This is newsworthy (just take a look at how many outlets are already running the story, and there's much to discuss about the implications of this.
That's the idea!
 

blackflag

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Jan 17, 2009
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Okay. Shinobi hears that a dev at MS doesn't have a problem with an always online device. He goes "oh shit". And then the dev says something that might or might not be stupid on his Twitter account, followed by a clarification that it was not meant to be a negative comment. I reckon lots of people on GAF have a Twitter account. Lots of casual stupid things are said on Twitter every single day. Some are said by people who are more well known, some are said by people who are less well known but have many detractors, some are said by absolute nobodies.

At some point we have to ask ourselves why this matters so much, and why we want to give importance to it. If someone says something on this forum which is frowned upon, we can deal with it on this forum. If someone says something which is actually newsworthy, there could be something to discuss. But there has to be a line somewhere right? Let's be rational and sane people here. There's no story here, there's no scandal here, and there is nothing to discuss here really.
Lol really? It doesn't matter? He's literally caused Microsoft millions of dollars in damages overnight.
 

Replicant

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Mar 20, 2007
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Mermandala said:
Penguins&PolarBears = Adam Orth?

was this ever sussed out by DetectiveGAF? either way his full post history is a shill-parade laugh riot.
I'm curious about this and that guy who made the "always on is GOOD for the industry" thread. The later apparently has an account since 2005 but rarely posted until now.
 

BoboBrazil

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Jun 6, 2004
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The question is: can they?

I'm sure their economic infrastructure with the 720 was designed around this always online thing. If you're always online, they can push certain things in their first party games and it enables developers (the big ones who already have their hands on the 720) to do some cool things. Their dashboard, DRM, and even hardware would be all based on the fact that the user is always online. Do they have the time to change all this? It's a HUGE undertaking to completely flip-flop on a console's core features beyond just saying "well, no more forced online!"

If this is the course they've chosen, it's likely too late to change, unless they delay.
They could probably pretty easily remove the requirement that games will shut off after 3 minutes without a connection atleast. This is Microsoft though, so most likely they will push ahead because they think the additional money they make with make up for whoever they lose due to this. I'll just stick with Sony as they are the most gamer friendly, which is the reason I actually buy a GAME CONSOLE.