die. The company (Lunar Industries) simply felt it was too expensive to continually send him back and forth from Earth to the Moon, so they created countless clones of him that are put on a 3-year cycle. Eventually workers arrive to the Moon and take back the helium that Sam has extracted, while the clone incinerates himself. When clone Sam communicates back home, he's talking to his daughter, and at one point you hear a male's voice - that's the original Sam.
die. The company (Lunar Industries) simply felt it was too expensive to continually send him back and forth from Earth to the Moon, so they created countless clones of him that are put on a 3-year cycle. Eventually workers arrive to the Moon and take back the helium that Sam has extracted, while the clone incinerates himself. When clone Sam communicates back home, he's talking to his daughter, and at one point you hear a male's voice - that's the original Sam.
Saw this movie on friday with my friends. Loved every second of it. Felt like the film was going to become another story with an evil AI running rampant but it ended up surprising me with great twists.
Yeah, the Helium 3 is shipped to earth using the same pod
that Sam 2 uses to escape at the end. The rescue team that arrives on the Moon is there to fix the harvester, and kill Sam 1 if he is found alive.
But my question is, do memories carry over from previous clone to the next? Why does GERTY ask Sam 2 if he remembers the crash, when he should be making sure that Sam 2 lives on the moon for the next 3 years?
Yeah, the Helium 3 is shipped to earth using the same pod
that Sam 2 uses to escape at the end. The rescue team that arrives on the Moon is there to fix the harvester, and kill Sam 1 if he is found alive.
But my question is, do memories carry over from previous clone to the next? Why does GERTY ask Sam 2 if he remembers the crash, when he should be making sure that Sam 2 lives on the moon for the next 3 years?
They use the crash as a means of providing a story for the new clone. They go from their pod to the med bay where they "wake up" from a "crash" which happened shortly after they first arrived. I thought that was explained in the movie.
Actually, the next movie by Duncan Jones is a kinda-prequel to Moon called Mute. Its a completely different story that takes place on earth, yet it takes place in the same time frame as the events of the first movie and stars Sam Bell in a short role.
In future Berlin, a woman's disappearance causes a mystery for her partner, a mute bartender. He must to go up against the citys gangsters to solve the mystery.[3] The film takes place in the same timeline as Jones' Moon, and will feature Sam Rockwell in a cameo as his character Sam Bell.
They use the crash as a means of providing a story for the new clone. They go from their pod to the med bay where they "wake up" from a "crash" which happened shortly after they first arrived. I thought that was explained in the movie.
crash that Gerty is referring to is a different crash from Sam 1's rover crash; it's a crash that they tell all of the clones about to explain why they wake up in a stupor.
Basically:
Sam 1 is woken up and told about lander crash.
Sam 1 nears end of contract.
Sam 1 crashes his rover.
Sam 2 is woken up and told about lander crash.
Sam 2 discovers the missing rover, sneaks out and finds Sam 1
Every Sam is told there was a crash when they are woken up. They then have memories of "arriving" but not much after since they are just clones. The crash supposedly happens early in their three year stay so the clone believes everything is fine after their crash and continues with their work.
Every Sam is told there was a crash when they are woken up. They then have memories of "arriving" but not much after since they are just clones. The crash supposedly happens early in their three year stay so the clone believes everything is fine after their crash and continues with their work.
So the Harvester is programmed to crash right before their contract expires and a "rescue team" comes in to fix it every 3 years? I didn't really catch that, because I thought Sam 1 gets distracted by an apparition and accidently crashes his vehicle. But it makes sense.
So the Harvester is programmed to crash right before their contract expires and a "rescue team" comes in to fix it every 3 years? I didn't really catch that, because I thought Sam 1 gets distracted by an apparition and accidently crashes his vehicle. But it makes sense.
No, what happened with that was a total coincidence.
Sam A is woken up from his eternal clone slumber and told that there was a crash and that GERTY had to save him. That is why he is in the medical bay and has no concrete memories other than arriving on the moon to work his 3 year stint. Three years later, Sam A hops in the incineration chamber and dies. Sam B is then woken up, put into the medical bay, and told there was a crash and that GERTY had to save him. So on and so forth. Sam B dies after 3 years and is replaced with Sam C, ect ect. Again, the fact that a Sam actually was involved with a harvest crash is totally coincidental.
So the Harvester is programmed to crash right before their contract expires and a "rescue team" comes in to fix it every 3 years? I didn't really catch that, because I thought Sam 1 gets distracted by an apparition and accidently crashes his vehicle. But it makes sense.
The harvester isn't programmed to crash. That was an actual accident. Gerty is programmed to tell each clone that "their space ship crashed when they are first coming aboard the station from earth" In actuality they are being awoken.
Just finished watching this for the first time, and I absolutely loved it. Extremely well-done film, and it was beautiful to look at. Great score as well. I'm really quite glad I went in almost completely blind; I only knew it involved a man working alone on the moon with an AI. Enjoyed it so much I now have the blu-ray ordered on Amazon.
The "twist" of them being clones surprised me a bit at first, especially since early in the film it really hints at him going crazy (seeing his wife, odd dreams). Also glad the film avoided/subverted some of the usual sci-fi film tropes, like the AI being evil or turning into a thriller at the end. Initially I expected there to end up being some kind of fight/battle at the end with the "rescue" team that was coming, so I was glad to be wrong.
Fake edit: I see I wasn't the only one to watch this excellent film for the first time tonight. Huzzah!
But my question is, do memories carry over from previous clone to the next? Why does GERTY ask Sam 2 if he remembers the crash, when he should be making sure that Sam 2 lives on the moon for the next 3 years?
Memories do not carry over between clones. They are all given the same starting memories.
By the way, I just watched this Monday and thought it was great. It went in a much different direction than I expected. At first it threw me off guard and it felt like I missed 30 minutes, but once I figured it out it was great.
EDIT:
trinest said:
Bluray came today, checked out some of the special features to get a feel for the movie, looking good, might watch it tonight
Also keep in mind I only bought the movie because of this thread.
Wait, so did you already know the plot of the movie? The special features completely give away the main plot element of the movie. I was lucky and had no idea what was going to happen when I first watched it.
Wait, so did you already know the plot of the movie? The special features completely give away the main plot element of the movie. I was lucky and had no idea what was going to happen when I first watched it.
Well I kinda did that only because I didn't even know WTF the movie was about/was. All I knew was GAF = WUBS THE MOVIE so I thought "okay I'll get it".
Even more blown away by the fact that my old friend and fellow Brummie Clint Poppie did the soundtrack, man I knew he was doing well for himself after The Fountain & RFAD, but it still seems very odd to see him doing stuff like this, so far removed from PWEI.
If you had the opportunity to go work on the moon by yourself for 3 years, and presumably become filthy rich and never have to work a day in your life after that, would you go?
For the purpose of the question, disregard the major plot twist of the movie if you know what I mean.
If you had the opportunity to go work on the moon by yourself for 3 years, and presumably become filthy rich and never have to work a day in your life after that, would you go?
For the purpose of the question, disregard the major plot twist of the movie if you know what I mean.
Assuming the work was relatively safe (sub 1% fatalty rate for the trip there, work/stay for the three years, and the return to earth) hell yes I would.
I've seen plenty worse films this year (Knowing, anyone?)
But this is without my personal mega flop of 2009. I was expecting so much from the rave reviews, and it just failed to engage me on so many levels.
It was pretty obvious from
the moment 2nd Sam was awoken what the hell was actually going on, and the plain bizarre nature of Gerty flipping from hinder to help wasn't explained in any way shape or form.
I also felt really let down by the way after
Sam 1 and Sam 2
found the
secret room, it really served no real purpose at all. The clones might as well have been grown from a pill Marvin the Martian style in my eyes.
And whilst on the subject of
clones, or more specifically, getting rid of them, the ash from the clone destrution coffin. If you've gone to the effort of designing something that can nuke an entire human/clone in 1 second flat, why on earth would it have a nozzle to get rid of the ash, on top of that, why would you have designed it so badly to have the nozzle blatently positioned on the outside of the zapper, and then why would it not work properly so it left ash on the floor? AND on top of that, why in fuck would it be placed exactly next to the secret trap door where hundreds upon hundreds of clones are secretly buried?! Surely the clones should be next to the infirmary where they're woken up, not next to the machine that burns them to a cinder
This film just ended up pissing me off and instead of taking me on a journey just ended up making me ask more questions about the reason why things in the journey just seemed a bit stupid at the conclusion.
The twist came so early and was so blatent, and the plot became so predictable, that I actually felt cheated that was it. If you're gonna have a twist, do it properly. If you're gonna hitchcock it so that the twist is that there's no twist then fine. But don't do what Moon did for god's sake.
I will now don flameproof suit number 2, as 1 seems to be missing for some reason, rip away.
Honestly, I was disappointed as well. I liked the overall story, but the execution of it was problematic. I felt like the film didn't want to commit to focusing on any single element. Is it a mystery? An existential nightmare? It sampled many directions at various times and added up to none of them.
A lot of the stuff about the base, the operation and GERTIE bugged the hell out me.
Why does GERTIE flop back and forth between protecting the corporation's interests to helping Sam? That made zero sense but was integral to several moments of plot progression. How do the clones get from that basement to the infirmary? Seems ridiculous that in the future we'd have a robot who isn't really connected to the happenings of the base. Its senses didn't appear to reach beyond its physical self and its justified because the characters need a way to run around the base doing stuff without supervision.
And regarding the ending:
I was disappointed that the cloning thing was a controversy on Earth. It was such a tacked on happy blurb when it seemed infinitely more appropriate for Sam to return to a world that fully accepts clones being disposable tools for long duration work in space.
It's not a trilogy, just three films in the same universe.
I agree with these two posts. I wasn't as disappointed but after watching it I felt like there was something missing, or something wrong with it. I also felt like I've watched this movie before in some shape or form (maybe a book?).
I like the premise, but I think the script could have been tightened up a bit. Things are revealed at an even pace, and as a result the buildup isn't as intense as it could be, and the climax falls flat. At the end,
he knocks down a communications jammer and the camera hangs on a computer screen as it suddenly flashes "Live Feed Available", as if the company wouldn't immediately take care of that
...just seemed kind of silly.
Then there's all the miscellaneous random things that don't make any practical sense like:
- The ash nozzle.
- The secret room.
- Making the clones suffer at the end of their "contract" even though they're going to be incinerated anyway.
- Why Gerty would help Sam1 with the password. I get that Gerty is there to "help" the clones, but that's a pretty vague/convenient mission statement that I don't really buy.
- How the escape plan would work at all...I assume the helium cargo is delivered straight to Sarang...how would he escape the pod once he landed?
- The lengths this company will go through to hide/carry out this clone program (cryo for a hundred clones, constantly lying to the clone, keeping the identity of the only man on the moon a secret from everyone, potentially getting into huge trouble with the govt, etc.), when it would be infinitely easier to just rotate real people every once in a while. They're apparently able to ship over some "rescue teams" pretty fast...
- I found a lot of the character's reactions to be unrealistic. If I were Sam1, I would be screaming in that Mako after the live feed, instead of just crying a little bit.
A LOT of people will disagree with me I'm sure, but I enjoyed Sunshine more. The only flawless part of this film is Rockwell's performance.
Liked it quite a bit. Some things bugged me that weren't explained (or hinted better, maybe I just missed them ).
About 3rd inoperative harvester
The 3rd one, Luke AKA Judas (iirc), was offline all the movie. Why didn't it get fixed or at least visited? Sam #2 went out to check the missing rover and Harvester #1 being stalled, discovering Sam #1 in the process.
GERTY even had one post-it with the message.
About Sam
The original one. Given the wife videos I thought the man their daughter called dad wasn't the original Sam but a new husband the wife eventually got.
I had assumed original Sam died in an accident on Harvester #3, but the company could clone him and wake a new one up every 3 years from that accident point of time to keep him working eternally.
Guess my theory doesn't hold up when
you get to memory discussion, since every new clone thought it was the start of the 3 years contract and wouldn't remember anything not just about the accident but about living there originally until it. Also it seems reading the thread that GERTY mentioned arrival accident specifically but I didn't heard 'arrival' part thus making me question what accident it was. I vaguely remember the part where GERTY reveals Sam he's a clone that his memories were altered though.
And then the LORD David Bowie saith to his Son, Jonny Depp: 'Go, and spread my image amongst the cosmos. For every living thing is in anguish and only the LIGHT shall give them reprieve.'
Even more blown away by the fact that my old friend and fellow Brummie Clint Poppie did the soundtrack, man I knew he was doing well for himself after The Fountain & RFAD, but it still seems very odd to see him doing stuff like this, so far removed from PWEI.
Wow, how'd you meet him? All I knew about him was PWEI (dos dedos mis amigos is one of my favorite albums ever), then he partnered up with aronofsky and completely defied my expectations.
As far as the rescue crew at the end, I'm still confused about what their intentions were. Was it a one-off trip because of the collasal fuckup that is having two clones activated at once and they came to clear it up personally? Or were they actually there to bring someone back... I'm also wondering how the new clones get from the pods to the medical bay. I guess that's a suspension of disbelief thing. .
I'm completely in love with Sam Rockwell, he's an actor's actor. The way he played the frustration/alienation at the beginning was unnervingly good.
His dual acting was better than I couldve hoped for, having two distinct and yet very subtle and believable styles of behavior for the two clones, at different stages of their cabin fever loopiness, he's one of the best. The creeping insanity at the beginning reminded me of what he did so well on Confessions of a Dangerous Mind.
I had assumed original Sam died in an accident on Harvester #3, but the company could clone him and wake a new one up every 3 years from that accident point of time to keep him working eternally.
It really wouldn't affect anything major in the story anyway - 3 years is human-lifespan under radiation exposure in the work they do, so whether one of them was original or not doesn't make the process any more/less gruesome.
But yea, I'm pretty sure original Sam was meant to be alive and on Earth.
Liked the movie but was bugged by something : why would the company need a human on the moon at all? Seemed that all Sam did was drive onto the harvesters and load the helium containers into a launcher. Surely GERTY could have supervised a number of robotic systems to do the same job? It seemed to be a very advanced AI and would have been able to administer such a task. Why would the company risk doing something so illegal with the clones when they didn't need to? Seemed somewhat contrived to me.
Liked the movie but was bugged by something : why would the company need a human on the moon at all? Seemed that all Sam did was drive onto the harvesters and load the helium containers into a launcher. Surely GERTY could have supervised a number of robotic systems to do the same job? It seemed to be a very advanced AI and would have been able to administer such a task. Why would the company risk doing something so illegal with the clones when they didn't need to? Seemed somewhat contrived to me.
Because a human will be able to deal with all the unknowns you can't plan for. If there was a human on Mars with the spirit/opportunity rovers, he/she could just wipe the dust of the solar panels and grease the wheels.
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