LordOfChaos
Member
It's technically more accurate I guess? RNDA is the architecture, Navi is assigned per-card codenames within this generation, and it's not any readymade chip.
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It's technically more accurate I guess? RNDA is the architecture, Navi is assigned per-card codenames within this generation, and it's not any readymade chip.
TeamGhobad
Banned
It's technically more accurate I guess? RNDA is the architecture, Navi is assigned per-card codenames within this generation, and it's not any readymade chip.
Radeon RX 5000 series - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
earliest rumors said navi was sony exclusive cause they help build the tech. i just hope its not some vega + raytracing.
LordOfChaos
Member
RDNA is the name for the whole architecture, so it's definitely not Vega as they've said RDNA outright.
Navi + number is the naming scheme for the GPU family.
TeamGhobad
Banned
phils blog said Next Generation RDNA...does that mean RDNA or Next generation OF RDNA..
I'll take a bet with you that it's 10.something..... less than 11?
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Dory16
Banned
I have and I know all hardware manufacturers are capable of doing it.
Not a betting man but I can tell you that you're wrong ,
People knew Xbox SX was 12TF when they said PS5 is more powerful
McHuj
Member
It's ambiguous so who knows.
Since it supports VRS and RT, it's definitely beyond RDNA of the 5700 series. But is it all the way to RDNA2? I'd like to think so, but I have no supporting evidence.
CameFromNearFuture
Banned
He has a friend in every single game Studio he wants to spread HIS Desires as a support FOR HIS narratives.
I can Tell he already has friend on guerrilla games bc he wants Horizon on PC.
Next time he'll make some frienship at Naughty Dog Studios because he want the Last of us part II on Pc as well.
How about a next gen console(ps5 or x series x) of the winner's choice? If I'm wrong and you're right like you insist, it's a sure thing then right?
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Psyrgery ES
Member
Man I can't wait to see how they are getting >12TF out of these boxes. Can't wait to see the hardware, how many CUs, clock speeds, RAM, etc.
Well, the shape factor of the XSX speaks volumes. That thing is going to run extremely hot and the bigger the box the better the airflow will be. I am confident they will be able to pack it with 12TFlops Navi (even Klee said a bit over 12, so it could be 12.1 as far as I can tell) but I am no engineer so it's all a wild guess.
I am EXTREMELY curious about the Ps5. If the rumours are true and is about 5-10% more powerful than Scarlett AND is also using a more traditional console box... I cannot but bow to Sony engineers and will look forward to how they managed such feat.
Exciting times ahead. No matter which platform you support ❤
I just said I'm not a betting man ,
THE:MILKMAN
Member
I agree the phrasing is weird but I'm not sure it means anything. There was, I'm sure, an AMD press release about Scarlett/Microsoft partnership possibly around Computex that had a very similar sentence in it to the one below from Phil's blog. I can't find it now on AMD's site.
Fake
Member
THE:MILKMAN
Member
I found the AMD press release in their blog! This is far more explicit IMO.
Sign In to AMD Community - AMD Community
Also IMO the RDNA is first generation with the second generation RT feature being added to it. Some believe it will be a RDNA 2 chip.
DJ12
Member
Or maybe nextgen rdna like has been on amds slides since rdna was announced. It's no mystery it's been staring you in the face all this time.I found the AMD press release in their blog! This is far more explicit IMO.
Sign In to AMD Community - AMD Community
community.amd.com
Also IMO the RDNA is first generation with the second generation RT feature being added to it. Some believe it will be a RDNA 2 chip.
Listen less to the people that are convinced they know everything.
Ar¢tos
Member
One thing that hasn't been discussed is themes. I would like ps5 to give more ram/cpu/GPU to allow for more complex dynamic themes, like themes that change night/day, seasons, time of the year, copy weather forecast for region (when connected to internet), etc . with the improvements of zen2 and navi I think it is possible to allow more but at same time it be less hardware reserve when comparing to previous gen in percentage.
OsirisBlack
Banned
Seeing as that bit of information is out and cleared up only need to wait two months for the next pieces to fall into place. Also the design of the SX is actually for function, it does kind of remind me of a bigger external HD. Both machines are very powerful with the PS5 having a slight (not significant at all) advantage. There is no need for a console war as stated before BOTH machines will be amazing.
THE:MILKMAN
Member
We'll see. My thinking from reading the quote I posted is if it was RDNA 2 then why not put "RDNA 2" like they have done with "Zen 2" and not just "Zen"?
ResilientBanana
Member
Didn't you say you could put out pics 4 months early?
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bitbydeath
Member
Ya’ll got anymore of them teasers
Insane Metal
Member
Indeed.
Anyway if we're talking +- 10% difference between these consoles it'll make absolutely no difference. Which is great imo.
pawel86ck
Banned
Ok, lets consider for a second our beloved Phil (never lying, misleading, and one and only) was talking about GCN TFLOPS.
In order to match 8x xbox one performance, you would need 11TF GCN Vega architecture, and probably even less like 10TF because Vega was already way more efficient than GCN found in xbox one s. So in order to match 10-11TF Vega, you would need just 8TF Navi, and maybe even 7TF (and especially if it will be improved or customized RDNA+). The thing is, 7-8TF Navi would be not enough to match 2x Xbox X performance, because you would need at least 10TF navi to match it (remember Xbox x architecture was much more efficient than standard xbox one). Therefore there's simply no way Phil is talking here about GCN TFLOPS.
If however we consider Phil is talking about TFLOPS metric alone (like he always did), then everything adds up:
Xbox one s is 1.4TF, multiply it by x8 times and you get 11.2TF, so 12TF would be exactly a little bit over 8x xbox one s TF power (not performance), and exactly 2x times xbox x power. With leaks on top of that (windows central is very reliable site, and even Klee over resetera has confirmed it) there's no longer a valid reason to consider Phil was talking about performance in general. He was talking only about TFLOPS metric alone.
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TeamGhobad
Banned
What is 2x times 6 vega tflops? surely it isn't 12 Navi/RDNA tflops? The console us most likely in that 9-10 Navi tflop area.
Dabaus
Banned
Any word on Price? For either console? Jim ryan said he wants to sell PS5s at a very fast rate, I cant see that happening at 499 or more. Thanks.
Insane Metal
Member
I said this before. Knowing that the 5700XT is <10TF... I just don't see how this machine is sporting 12TFs. But I'll be happy to be wrong.What is 2x times 6 vega tflops? surely it isn't 12 Navi/RDNA tflops? The console us most likely in that 9-10 Navi tflop area.
VFXVeteran
Banned
I have some questions for the speculators here.
TF(Teraflops) definition.
We are measuring under what constraints? TFLOPS for 32-bit registers, 64-bit registers, 16-bit packed into 64-bit registers (i.e. 4 16-bit FP numbers packed into 1 64-bit register)? Which math ops are we measuring (sin, cos, fabs, remainder, sqrt, multiply, add, division, subtraction, etc..) ?
I don't get the "RDNA/GCN" type of FLOPS? A FLOP is a FLOP.
TF(Teraflops) definition.
We are measuring under what constraints? TFLOPS for 32-bit registers, 64-bit registers, 16-bit packed into 64-bit registers (i.e. 4 16-bit FP numbers packed into 1 64-bit register)? Which math ops are we measuring (sin, cos, fabs, remainder, sqrt, multiply, add, division, subtraction, etc..) ?
I don't get the "RDNA/GCN" type of FLOPS? A FLOP is a FLOP.
TeamGhobad
Banned
apparently not. DF did a whole video about it. from my understanding a Navi Tflop is 30-40% more powerful than a vega tflop. this is why a navi 5700 with only 7 tflops ran games better than a vega card with 10tflops. there is more to it than flops.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Wider CUs and more efficiency. A FLOP is a FLOP, but how efficient they perform and not waiting on draw calls, idle, etc..
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VFXVeteran
Banned
TeamGhobad
Banned
flops are measured in FP32.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
VFXVeteran
Banned
OK. That's what I was looking for. Now the test specifics? I can make a test that pushes 32-bit floating point adds all day long but that's not going to tell me much. I need to know which hardware instructions were done. sqrt is more expensive than an add, etc..etc..
CameFromNearFuture
Banned
Yep
The advantage is not a big Deal.
As an insider, I like to make people not suffering that much for the waiting so I decided to drop bomba already.
But You are right. We're talking about two legit beasts and everyone Will be blown away with First Wave of games specially from Guerri... Sorry.
Insane Metal
Member
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
I can't even imagine what Decima will do next-gen. I am guessing that Unreal sci-fi RT tech demo that looked similar to the Death Stranding landscape.
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CameFromNearFuture
Banned
It is officially above 11tf mark
CameFromNearFuture
Banned
Yep
Cant even understsand How Guerrilla could make Horizon looks that good while being an open world game.
I might get the walking simulator (Death stranding) later on only to approciate this fantastic engine.
Aceofspades
Banned
MS needs the power advantage more than Sony. What kind of wizardry did Sony engineers do to create PS5?! Cerny is DA GOD!
I need to know more about Sony's beast !
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Look at the foliage in Ghost (which is probably not Decima, but the Sony studios do share tech) which leaped over HZD, so I can imagine Decima PS5 foliage.
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XcloudTimdog
Banned
I thought you left , anyway, Xbox Series X will be more powerful. If Sony was as confident as you, they would of responded already. Please stop the bullshit, a week ago you were at 10 tflops.
XcloudTimdog
Banned
Its navi , sony isnt touching this guysI know that, (and there are already other 'gaming' sites claiming that Phil confirmed doble XoneX 12tf) but i was referring to the people in this thread that are doing the same, and doing mental gimnastics to justify why Phil only said doble the power/but is 12tf RDNA, just read back and enjoy
I think you are wrong there _ Phil knows exactly what he can say right now (he doesn't give away CPU or GPU clocks, CU count, Tflops, that's all for later) of course he is inside all that stuff with the engineering team. And what does he specifically mention? Power in general, how much one GPU is more powerful than the other _ how much faster the new X is going to get to 100km/h (by your analogy), no horse power numbers, valves, no engine cylinder capacity,... all the stuff inside the engine that gets you there.
And about Windows Central leak, SX GPU being less than 12tf doesn't make it inaccurate, they specifically said 12tf target specs, and evenXcloudTimdog confirmed it, that it can be a lower number, some time after (don't remember if it was this thread or the other).
Sorry for the long wall of text, but I'm not a native English speaker and it's a bit hard to translate and write my thoughts lol
What are you talking about onQ? Are you teasing or have real Intel?
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Actually, he said it is over 10. And no, that is not how it works. The market leader does not need to react to no specs and a design, they operate at their own accord.
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Insane Metal
Member
One thing I didn't see anybody talking about after the supposed 12TF "confirmation": power consumption. I mean... the 9.5TF 5700XT eats away ~220W average with 240+ peaks. Unless they made a huge fucking different arch for NAVI 2.0 I just don't see how it's possible that a console with a 12TF GPU + Zen 2 CPU will keep power consumption on console levels. It just doesn't seem possible.
TeamGhobad
Banned
so xbox is saying they are more powerful
FranXico
Member
Most powerful Xbox. And that's true. Nothing to do with other consoles that haven't been shown yet.
Insane Metal
Member
Yes they're saying Series X is the most powerful XBox ever.
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