Gamernyc78
Banned
This is huge for psvr immersion. Sony still has alot to show and talk about.
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This is huge for psvr immersion. Sony still has alot to show and talk about.
Reindeer
Member
Variable Frequency (AMD SmartShift) is there because of thermal limitation and that's why both CPU and GPU can't run at those clocks, main reason being if course they're pushing that GPU at crazy clocks.
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Deeper Underground
Member
DRAG HIMMMMM
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Sony has always been like that. People should dig up those old PS2 or PS3 slides where they bragged about thrashing Nintendo and MS (I forget if Sega was in there too), and then during Xbox One that Shu guy (again) and that fat blonde guy with glasses did that YT video about borrowing games when MS was getting flak for used game DRM which wasn't even released in the final version.
Sony will yuk it up when winning, but will zip it when there's nothing good to say.
That's why it took so long for PS5 details to come out.
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Gamernyc78
Banned
Yeah I think ppl are erring on caution because thy Dont comprehend and nobody knows what tht ssd really means in real world performance and application also the high clock speeds. Shit even DF were talking in theoretical and not necessarily facts for alot of ps5 breakdown.
The more I think about it the more I'm excited to find out how this turns out.
I don't fully understand tech specs, but I walked out of that stream thinking that there is something wrong with Sony leadership now, hence the departures and reshuffles.
And that this "audio, audio, ssd, audio, 10tf" seems a lot like xb1's "tv, TV, sports, TV, Kinnect camera" moment.
Hella disappointing from an on paper tech specs standpoint.
As for looking ahead...
Though xb1x is more powerful than my launch PS4 and I literally never turn it on unless something comes on gamepass. And after completing that game, which could be a skant few hours, the xb1x gathers dust again.
Exclusives/Games/OS Menus/Game Services and Controllers are big parts for me. Sony's got a PS5 purchase just on games tbh, but I've also preferred every one of those bullet points more on ps4 rather than xb1x. Only xb's Gamepass and Backwards Compatability shit on PS4's PSNow service.
MS most likely get an XBSX purchase off BC/GamePass alone. Only this gen, based on this initial tech specs and the feeling in my gut right now, should see me fire up the XBSX more reguarly based on GP/BC, and individual next gen games if they're horrendously bad ports on PS5.
In the back of my mind, two potential issues loom which makes the PS5 feel... PS3-ish.
1. multiplatform games won't use any PS5 unique tech, they will target bog baseline and aim for parity and be done with it.
2. The factor of Sony sending their exclusives to PC this gen like MS did last gen. So are games gonna take advantage of SSD benefits.
Now... Somebody come tell me how wrong I am and how I'm wrong, and make me feel better please.
And that this "audio, audio, ssd, audio, 10tf" seems a lot like xb1's "tv, TV, sports, TV, Kinnect camera" moment.
Hella disappointing from an on paper tech specs standpoint.
As for looking ahead...
Though xb1x is more powerful than my launch PS4 and I literally never turn it on unless something comes on gamepass. And after completing that game, which could be a skant few hours, the xb1x gathers dust again.
Exclusives/Games/OS Menus/Game Services and Controllers are big parts for me. Sony's got a PS5 purchase just on games tbh, but I've also preferred every one of those bullet points more on ps4 rather than xb1x. Only xb's Gamepass and Backwards Compatability shit on PS4's PSNow service.
MS most likely get an XBSX purchase off BC/GamePass alone. Only this gen, based on this initial tech specs and the feeling in my gut right now, should see me fire up the XBSX more reguarly based on GP/BC, and individual next gen games if they're horrendously bad ports on PS5.
In the back of my mind, two potential issues loom which makes the PS5 feel... PS3-ish.
1. multiplatform games won't use any PS5 unique tech, they will target bog baseline and aim for parity and be done with it.
2. The factor of Sony sending their exclusives to PC this gen like MS did last gen. So are games gonna take advantage of SSD benefits.
Now... Somebody come tell me how wrong I am and how I'm wrong, and make me feel better please.
Null_Key
Neo Member
This is why Cooling fan is a big part of it.
HawarMiran
Banned
You seem to browse twitter a lot. How about you stop posting the tweets of some nobody from twitter?
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JLMC469
Banned
Kazekage1981
Member
if ps4pro has the same ssd technology as ps5 but with all the current gen specs, how would ps4pro graphics improve if all those I/O bottlenecks have been removed?
How would Gran Turismo Sport look? How would God of War Look? How would Grand Theft Auto 5 look? How would Horizon Dawn look? How would Uncharted look? How would The Last of Us 2 look?
How would Gran Turismo Sport look? How would God of War Look? How would Grand Theft Auto 5 look? How would Horizon Dawn look? How would Uncharted look? How would The Last of Us 2 look?
Reindeer
Member
Even that cooling fan is obviously unable to sustain those clocks so they had to use SmartShift to maintain thermal balance.
Deeper Underground
Member
Let's lay off the blatant, low effort console warring.
lol Oh fuck off. Like shills like Greenberg, Albert Penello, Mike Ybarra, etc. weren’t saying slick shit all through the PS3/360 generation only to get their shit slapped vs. the PS4. It’s going to be hilarious to see all of you Xbox fans yuk it up over this, only to have MS once again fall to Sony and Nintendo the next generation. Oh wait, MS doesn’t want to play that game so now they are going after PC people too with GamePass. Comments like these are embarrassing, cut it out.
xool
Member
No that isn't it - transistors need to switch to draw substantial power - if they're not doing anything the power draw is small
Rusco Da Vino
Member
For me it is over. I know that the PS5 is 10.2tf RDNA2 machine with an amazing SSD. Now I want Sony to show me something other than numbers.
Is the tech amazing? Nice, show me what we the gamers can do with it.
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Zero707
If I carry on trolling, report me.
HawarMiran
Banned
We got it. you like the movie friday. be more creative with your gifs
Gamernyc78
Banned
I'm a big Sony supporter but yeah I'm not feeling Ryan imo way better under Kaz Hirai leadership, now it's a different vibe. Kaz Hirai basically turned the whole Sony around.
Smoke6
Member
Well for what it’s worth, Sony has never really lead the “power” battle and their games do the talking along with the their studios! So no matter what was gonna happen we have seen what Sony is done with far less spec wise than their competitors ever have!
the Xbox library is very full and shallow all’s cross the board and ice we get to see these games and what other features these systems have the I would suggest the dick measuring can really take place at that point
the Xbox library is very full and shallow all’s cross the board and ice we get to see these games and what other features these systems have the I would suggest the dick measuring can really take place at that point
PaintTinJr
Member
He definitely said the power (draw) at the wall will be fixed, the fans will still run louder in a hotter environment in a worst case but the boost clocking is used to use any excess power that isn't being used in workload, because to push a chip at a higher clock you need to supply more power. I'm 99.9% sure that's what he was trying to say
HawarMiran
Banned
Ken Kutaragi bro ;D
Zero707
If I carry on trolling, report me.
saintjules
Member
1500 pages!
kyliethicc
Member
Cerny did say that everything is repeatable and deterministic, so every PS5 will run the same. They can send “any unused power from the CPU to the GPU so it can squeeze out a few more pixels”
i trust the dude Cerny, he made the PS4. I love the PS4. and now he’s basically pitching the PS5 as “yo the PS4 was lame, the PS5 is gonna be way better” and I have no reason to doubt him. He’s been making games since before I was born.
HawarMiran
Banned
are you asking for a ban? you will get there if you keep going with your shit
VanSiriusGabriel
Member
Pretty much.
With SeX I can see why people are going crazy. PS5 is good but some devs are talking about awesome stuff about it (BGs also) but I don't know why, it seems less obvious if even true. I'll just wait for games.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
lol. Tom is going to have a field day for years.
Kazekage1981
Member
can someone answer my question please? 
Zero707
If I carry on trolling, report me.
Gamernyc78
Banned
There were a few players involved kodera as well but I have fond memories of always seeing Kaz Hirai talk when he was Sony ceo up until 2018.
GermanZepp
Member
Guys guys, let's wait to see how the 3rd party games perform against the x before calling it a bad design. I'm surprised about the clocks too. But it looks more like a new strategy/paradigm that "let's just boost at 2.3 cause we are behind competition ".
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zubairali2
Member
i feel mark cerny has really made this developer friendly. he cares about what developers what the most and you can really see it in the presentation.
DaGwaphics
Member
Over half of it is faster too. LOL
Reindeer
Member
My point is about CPU and GPU not running at the same time at those clocks due to thermal limitation and SmartShift is used to make CPU drop it's clockspeed so that GPU can be pushed harder when the game needs it to, and vice versa. This is contrary to some people think, that it can sustain those clocks for both GPU and CPU. AMD already talked about this tech that was designed for laptops because of their thermal limitations. Cerny tried to downplay the thermals being the reason for this, which obviously is the case.
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icerock
Member
People erring caution are right, they spent 50% of their presentation to talk about SSD. Messaging on GPU/CPU clock was bungled which is allowing people to spread whatever info they want. Plus, the whole BC debacle.
Sony need to show some amazing games, and put on a hands-on preview of the hardware for consumers to gauge the thermals and noise range of PS5. Plenty of work to do from here on, they need to sell their pitch better. No question for me.
Amazing how persistent these Xbox centric reporters are to push the "real 9 TF" narrative plucked out of their asses when Sony themselves didn't reveal the base clocks, nor showed any games for one to gauge it.
Because you're deliberately being dense, the RAM in PS5 is unified, there is no fast or slow pool for devs to pick and choose from. For Series X, there's a limited amount see 10GB of fast bandwidth available to them with addition 3.5GB available in slower pool. Difference is, it would be feeding a much more powerful CPU/GPU on Series X. Hence, why people perceive the overall RAM and available bandwidth to be on lower side. It sure isn't rocket science when you take a look at what hardware that memory would be feeding. But you sure made it sound like, sigh!
Deeper Underground
Member
A MS journalist downplaying a competitor’s system. Stop me if you’ve heard that one before.
xool
Member
Well no pop in, no loading screens and no pseudo loading screens for one.
The wouldn't be able to increase gfx overall unless they took special restrictive measures like reducing rotation speed and only loading what is in front at one time - that could give an increase in overall quality, but as usually stuff behind is much the same as stuff infront it wouldn't be a huge gain. They'd also be able to free up memory - so maybe more texture detail overal - but the GPU might be the limit on that ..
Mostly QOL improvements imo
Roronoa Zoro
Gold Member
Is there any truth to what this guy is saying?
CJY
Banned
At the end of the day, 99% of games won't touch the max capability of boosting both CPU and GPU to their max clocks for long sustained amounts of time and performance will need to be monitored to bring it back down to maybe 95%.
XSX has fixed clocks but also no dev will want pin both GPU and CPU at its max clocks for sustained periods of time as a sudden spike in activity in a game will stall the system, so there will always be some performance headroom left over.
In both cases, consideration on the part of the developers will come into the play.
Cerny said PS5 will throttle down in the "worst case" scenario where both CPU and GPU are maxed, but I'm really not sure this has anything to do with thermals like you are suggesting and more to do with the fundamental design of the system itself. I doubt they introduced the whole concept of variable frequencies simply in response to XSX having a beefier GPU. There are other aspects at play here and we don't know how it's going to play out. The narrative that you're projecting just seems like an oversimplification based on old paradigms of how consoles work.
In the end, you might turn out to be right, but it's not absolutely clear yet and just based on a lot of assumptions, such as: "The only reason they can't run at max clocks is because of thermals"
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HawarMiran
Banned
xool
Member
Nah - I think it'll reach 10+TF but it'll be hot.
A lot of those discredited leakers seem to have got a lot right .. everything except the TF number - ie delay on BackCompat, was going to launch 2019, problems with heat - it all matches what we know now, or can read between the lines from the info from the talk ..
Reindeer
Member
SMH. While there's no fast or slow ram pool on PS5, it will still have limit how much GPU and CPU can access. Microsoft obviously gives more bandwidth to GPU because it's common and sense and leaves slower ram for CPU because it doesn't need as fast bandwidth. This is a common sense approach from Microsoft and there shouldn't be much difference between the two consoles ( hence why DF didn't even give this attention), but you making it a big deal, smh.
Zero707
If I carry on trolling, report me.
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HawarMiran
Banned
Microsoft was talking about the power of the cloud and shit that is why people believed it
xool
Member
Looks like astroturf to me .. "as a respected developer I .. " yeah ok
Roronoa Zoro
Gold Member
I think most people accept that. Seems to be down to HOW MUCH and what price will be now
DaGwaphics
Member
People shouldn't get carried away with the TFs (or Mhz) don't matter arguments. While that is true when comparing different architectures, when comparing the the same arch these numbers are very consistent with final performance. The SSD could even things out, but the raw performance differences still matter. Though both are very close too each other when using PS5's boost clocks, it's not a huge difference (Xbone was in way worse position).
I'm surprised that Sony isn't supporting NVMe upgrades via a memorycard-esque option.
I'm surprised that Sony isn't supporting NVMe upgrades via a memorycard-esque option.
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