• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

Status
Not open for further replies.
zaitsu

zaitsu

Banned
TheGreatWhiteShark said:
right now I'm thinking that sony WISH they had a twin solution like microsoft's.
if you can't see it yet, what microsoft did is going to cost sony some money.
imo they will have to model the price of at least one console between the two xboxes.
in that same business article it was described that there are two opposing forces inside sony: those who want to sell many pieces, and those who want to sell for a profit...
Click to expand...
This dude again
 
B

BattleScar

Member
Bo_Hazem said:
Xbox boss says the idea of cross-gen games being held back "a meme".

www.ign.com

Phil Spencer Says Xbox Series X Games Aren't Being Held Back By Xbox One - IGN

The Xbox boss has called the idea that Xbox Series X are held back by needing to be playable on Xbox One "a meme".
www.ign.com www.ign.com

Imagine being this stupid yet be in the leadership.
Click to expand...


I don't necessarily disagree that the Series S will "hold back development", as at the very least the CPU and SSD are the same specs. CPU and storage speeds was really the biggest major bottleneck in the last gen consoles.

HOWEVER.

The Series S will undoubtedly offer its users a massively gimped experience. The idea that the Series S will offer the same visuals as a Series X, but at 1440p or 1080p instead of the XSX's 4K, is pure bullshit. As I've mentioned before, the smaller GPU and the reduced VRAM will massively neuter texture throughput and geometry throughput, not just the render resolution. Environments will be less complex, with reduced poly counts and more obvious LOD. Texture resolutions will be worse and so on. The kind of gameplay on offer will broadly be the same, but the visuals will be massively neutered and there's no two ways about that.

Both the Series X and PS5 are dramatically faster than the Series S. There will be a noticeable uplift in visual fidelity when moving from the S to the X or PS5. No two ways about it. To some, that might not matter. Its just another thing to think about when putting your games on Xbox.

Also, I think removing the blu-ray drive from the Series S was a mistake. Would have been an amazing cheap 4K blu-ray player with what an extra $20 added to the BOM? It would have made for an amazing cheap all-in-one Backwards Compatability machine to play people's old 360 games. Alas.
 
mejin

mejin

Member
jose4gg said:
Microsoft could have been in another position if they would have shown a decent version of Halo Infinte... seriously, No next gen, just a pretty looking game by the standards of this end of generation...

But now it’s time to watch the people that never let you down.

Common SONY !
Click to expand...

If Microsoft was in a better situation Sony would just be more aggressive, but no doubt everyone feels like you. Hope we have a great week of infos.
 
MasterCornholio

MasterCornholio

Member
BattleScar said:
I don't necessarily disagree that the Series S will "hold back development", as at the very least the CPU and SSD are the same specs. CPU and storage speeds was really the biggest major bottleneck in the last gen consoles.

HOWEVER.

The Series S will undoubtedly offer its users a massively gimped experience. The idea that the Series S will offer the same visuals as a Series X, but at 1440p or 1080p instead of the XSX's 4K, is pure bullshit. As I've mentioned before, the smaller GPU and the reduced VRAM will massively neuter texture throughput and geometry throughput, not just the render resolution. Environments will be less complex, with reduced poly counts and more obvious LOD. Texture resolutions will be worse and so on. The kind of gameplay on offer will broadly be the same, but the visuals will be massively neutered and there's no two ways about that.

Both the Series X and PS5 are dramatically faster than the Series S. There will be a noticeable uplift in visual fidelity when moving from the S to the X or PS5. No two ways about it. To some, that might not matter. Its just another thing to think about when putting your games on Xbox.

Also, I think removing the blu-ray drive from the Series S was a mistake. Would have been an amazing cheap 4K blu-ray player with what an extra $20 added to the BOM? It would have made for an amazing cheap all-in-one Backwards Compatability machine to play people's old 360 games. Alas.
Click to expand...

I agree that they should have left the drive in however I think they removed it to push gamepass more than anything.
 
Oddspeak

Oddspeak

Member
Bo_Hazem said:
Xbox boss says the idea of cross-gen games being held back "a meme".

www.ign.com

Phil Spencer Says Xbox Series X Games Aren't Being Held Back By Xbox One - IGN

The Xbox boss has called the idea that Xbox Series X are held back by needing to be playable on Xbox One "a meme".
www.ign.com www.ign.com

Imagine being this stupid yet be in the leadership.
Click to expand...

This article was published only 13 days before the Halo Infinite gameplay premiere, so Phil was already aware of this worry of Xbox One holding back XSX games before the showcase happened.

And yet he saw that gameplay footage, thought "yeah, that looks next gen," and gave the okay to air it?
 
RaySoft

RaySoft

Member
BattleScar said:
I don't necessarily disagree that the Series S will "hold back development", as at the very least the CPU and SSD are the same specs. CPU and storage speeds was really the biggest major bottleneck in the last gen consoles.

HOWEVER.

The Series S will undoubtedly offer its users a massively gimped experience. The idea that the Series S will offer the same visuals as a Series X, but at 1440p or 1080p instead of the XSX's 4K, is pure bullshit. As I've mentioned before, the smaller GPU and the reduced VRAM will massively neuter texture throughput and geometry throughput, not just the render resolution. Environments will be less complex, with reduced poly counts and more obvious LOD. Texture resolutions will be worse and so on. The kind of gameplay on offer will broadly be the same, but the visuals will be massively neutered and there's no two ways about that.

Both the Series X and PS5 are dramatically faster than the Series S. There will be a noticeable uplift in visual fidelity when moving from the S to the X or PS5. No two ways about it. To some, that might not matter. Its just another thing to think about when putting your games on Xbox.

Also, I think removing the blu-ray drive from the Series S was a mistake. Would have been an amazing cheap 4K blu-ray player with what an extra $20 added to the BOM? It would have made for an amazing cheap all-in-one Backwards Compatability machine to play people's old 360 games. Alas.
Click to expand...
What I find "strage" is that last time I checked their storage solution have the same throughput. Giving that the Series S only uses half the texture size (1440p vs 4K) it should operate at almost 2x the speed compared to the Series X. It will actually load everything faster than it's big brother.
 
Last edited:
TheGreatWhiteShark

TheGreatWhiteShark

Member
jimbojim said:
Under Niko partnes you mean Zhuge. He said during March this year that Xbone is 50+ million
Click to expand...

are you guys even for real?
If that played out for real that's quite concerning for MS.
If you take AMD at their word and there are 150m consoles out there and we know from Sony that at that time they'd sold 109m it pegs Xbox One at 41m.
Click to expand...
www.neogaf.com

Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

With Sony officially announcing their last Showcase being game centered and not about the system, we can conclude Sony has conceded the battle over whose system is superior. We had one show from Cerny that basically concentrated on the SSD and that was all. To be honest I am kind of surprised...
www.neogaf.com www.neogaf.com

so one dude throws out "41mil" and I correct him, saying its 50m, and you try to prove that I am wrong? By showing what? over 50milion? FFS get a grip!

And for what little its worth, YOU are wrong also, and for the hundredth time too!
Not only Niko Part. publicly referenced the 50+ million at least a month earlier than what you show here, but I already said there were investor meetings before Christmas 2019 where this number was discussed as achieved.

you guys are something else!!
 
Last edited:
Daniel_Mallorca1985

Daniel_Mallorca1985

Member
D1zqwXS.jpg


449€ disc 4K

399€ digital
 
Last edited:
Q

quest

Not Banned from OT
RaySoft said:
That's like saying Kena, as beautiful as it is, are the pinnacle of next-gen gaming. I think we have more in store for us...
Click to expand...
Sure but I am not the one shitting on cross generation games. Be consistent if you shit on them shit on all of them. If you see value in them like some of us we can enjoy games like kena. Shit on 343 fine but admit it is a developer problem.
 
B

BattleScar

Member
RaySoft said:
What I find "strage" is that last time I checked their storage solution have the same throughput. Giving that the Series S only uses half the texture size (1440p vs 4K) it should operate at almost 2x the speed compared to the Series X. It will actually load everything faster than it's big brother.
Click to expand...
That's not really how it works.
I mean, sure it could theoretically load more lower-resolution textures into memory more quickly than the Series X could load big 4K textures into memory. But then it also has less available VRAM compared to the Series X - a little more than half of the available VRAM. And then the GPU, with only 20CU has less than half the TMU's operating at a lower clock frequency. So the bottleneck gets pushed to somewhere else in the pipeline.

Also, loading _more_ low res textures isn't automatically better. The textures are after all, still lower resolution. So they'll look worse either way.
 
bitbydeath

bitbydeath

Member
Ptarmiganx2 said:
We already know the Sully game is real and God of War is ready for a demo. Bend might have something as well.
Click to expand...

Waiting on:
-Sully/Uncharted game from Sonys unannounced studio
-God of War - SSM
-Silent Hill (pending its real) - Japan
-Unannounced shooter - Guerrilla Games
-Mark Cernys new game - Japan
-Supermassive Games mentioned they had an exclusive in the works a couple years back (could have since been cancelled)
-WiLD still MiA
-Capcoms new Deep Down like title that was shown off last year (forget what it’s called)
-Sony London may also have something
 
Neo Blaster

Neo Blaster

Member
Md Ray said:
The last June PlayStation event was called "The Future of Gaming", this time it's simply called "PlayStation 5 Showcase". Hopefully, we get a nice glimpse of the UI, new OS features, etc.

Likely not gonna happen but I wish there's PS5 teardown or at least shortly after the event. Pretty please Sony!
Click to expand...
I'm beginning to think the teardown will come only after AMD reveal RDNA2 cards.
 
kyliethicc

kyliethicc

Member
BattleScar said:
I don't necessarily disagree that the Series S will "hold back development", as at the very least the CPU and SSD are the same specs. CPU and storage speeds was really the biggest major bottleneck in the last gen consoles.

HOWEVER.

The Series S will undoubtedly offer its users a massively gimped experience. The idea that the Series S will offer the same visuals as a Series X, but at 1440p or 1080p instead of the XSX's 4K, is pure bullshit. As I've mentioned before, the smaller GPU and the reduced VRAM will massively neuter texture throughput and geometry throughput, not just the render resolution. Environments will be less complex, with reduced poly counts and more obvious LOD. Texture resolutions will be worse and so on. The kind of gameplay on offer will broadly be the same, but the visuals will be massively neutered and there's no two ways about that.

Both the Series X and PS5 are dramatically faster than the Series S. There will be a noticeable uplift in visual fidelity when moving from the S to the X or PS5. No two ways about it. To some, that might not matter. Its just another thing to think about when putting your games on Xbox.

Also, I think removing the blu-ray drive from the Series S was a mistake. Would have been an amazing cheap 4K blu-ray player with what an extra $20 added to the BOM? It would have made for an amazing cheap all-in-one Backwards Compatability machine to play people's old 360 games. Alas.
Click to expand...
There will always be a theoretical game that can only be made if the minimum specs for game dev is "X".

If then the minimum is lower to "Y" then that game cannot be made. It was held back by Y.

In the current scenario, X is PS5 and XSX. But Y is XSS.

Also, the reason S is all digital is because Microsoft don't want you to buy physical games. They want you to subscribe to Game Pass. Its digital. They can only offer the console at that price because of its closed nature. The user is locked to the digital store. If it had a disc drive, the console would be pointless from their perspective. It was made to push Game Pass.
 
RaySoft

RaySoft

Member
BattleScar said:
That's not really how it works.
I mean, sure it could theoretically load more lower-resolution textures into memory more quickly than the Series X could load big 4K textures into memory. But then it also has less available VRAM compared to the Series X - a little more than half of the available VRAM. And then the GPU, with only 20CU has less than half the TMU's operating at a lower clock frequency. So the bottleneck gets pushed to somewhere else in the pipeline.

Also, loading _more_ low res textures isn't automatically better. The textures are after all, still lower resolution. So they'll look worse either way.
Click to expand...
Im quite aware of the other bottlenecks, I was just refering to data fetch rate here, wich will be faster if they still have the same 2.4GB/s raw bandwidth as the Series X.
I just find it strange that the weaker console will load games faster than the bigger brother.
 
Last edited:
MasterCornholio

MasterCornholio

Member
Dibils2k said:
that would be perfect price

100 off for digital (if real) is also incredible news
Click to expand...

The best case for Sony would be 399$ DE and 499$ for the disk edition.

The worst that I can see is 499$ for the DE and 599 for the disk edition.

I would be shocked if the prices were higher or lower than that.

Edit: I'm mostly basing my predictions that I think the BOM for both systems are extremely similar. I'm definitely not expecting one to be 100$ more expensive to make than the other. I could be wrong though.
 
Last edited:
kyliethicc

kyliethicc

Member
MasterCornholio said:
The best case for Sony would be 399$ DE and 499$ for the disk edition.

The worst that I can see is 499$ for the DE and 599 for the disk edition.

I would be shocked if the prices were higher or lower than that.
Click to expand...
And companies prefer not to use $50 price points, like $350 450 550 etc. They always prefer ending on 99 than 49.
 
Bo_Hazem

Bo_Hazem

Banned
TheGreatWhiteShark said:
Lets wait and see how it pans out Bo. in what you quoted I say "MAYBE it will go like this"
Click to expand...

Problem is I can't relate to other countries, here I've seen more Ferraris than xboxes, extremely serious. They are available if you wanna buy any, and much cheaper than PS4 as X1X was sold for like $260 at some point, cheaper than PS4 Slim and Switch Lite. My brother bought a PS4 Pro for his sons and like 2-3 games and they don't have PS Plus so they play fortnite online all the time for free. Also the new COD will have free multiplayer on PS4/PS5 up to 20 players mode. This is a VERY major advantage for PS over xbox that has everything locked behind a paywall.
 
Last edited:
S

smallpotatosan

Member
T-Cake said:
Me too but I'm leaning towards the disc one if it's not too expensive. Reason being for this gen, I've spent a lot on digital PS4 games that I ended up rebuying on Steam when I got a PC. I really should just buy the Blu-rays next-gen and sell them on and then pick up the PC versions when they get cheap.
Click to expand...
I will get whatever is available. I don’t think we will have a choice during the launch window. lol
 
Metroiddarks

Metroiddarks

Member
TheGreatWhiteShark said:
right now I'm thinking that sony WISH they had a twin solution like microsoft's.
if you can't see it yet, what microsoft did is going to cost sony some money.
imo they will have to model the price of at least one console between the two xboxes.
in that same business article it was described that there are two opposing forces inside sony: those who want to sell many pieces, and those who want to sell for a profit...
Click to expand...
Probably the only two things PLaystation wants to have from Microsoft (aside the money)
are Azure and the IP of Halo because usually the companies prefer to have IP and
infrastructure more than have a risky business plan.

Xbox is not necessary doing something good with his double console, the only console manufacturer which usually
release week systems as new gen is Nintendo and they are able to do it because it's IPs are most important in the
industry and is usually recognized for its quality so is more probably a user prefer that console than other only for this.

XSS just looks as the perfect excuse to many third party to not make game in Xbox or even been release later if the
plan of Xbox is still without big games the first two year which show why a user should buy a new console of Xbox then
in a couple of years is probably most of the devs doesn't want work more and hold back its game in order of work in
a system with the smaller market.

The consoles involve with the pass of the gen to become from the technical target of the AA and AAA to the minimum
requirement of the same, have a console which in some aspects is worst than its current gen is something than not even
Nintendo does.
 
Last edited:
jimbojim

jimbojim

Banned
TheGreatWhiteShark said:
are you guys even for real?

www.neogaf.com

Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

With Sony officially announcing their last Showcase being game centered and not about the system, we can conclude Sony has conceded the battle over whose system is superior. We had one show from Cerny that basically concentrated on the SSD and that was all. To be honest I am kind of surprised...
www.neogaf.com www.neogaf.com

so one dude throws out "41mil" and I correct him, saying its 50m, and you try to prove that I am wrong? By showing what? over 50milion? FFS get a grip!

And for what little its worth, YOU are wrong also, and for the hundredth time too!
Not only Niko Part. publicly referenced the 50+ million at least a month earlier than what you show here, but I already said there were investor meetings before Christmas 2019 where this number was discussed as achieved.

you guys are something else!!
Click to expand...

Are you for real? Let's the receipts for that meeting. Btw. AMD used VGChartz numbers back then.

bo3jId8.jpg


SdFA4gR.jpg



So, PS4 was around 106 million, Xbone 44 mil. on VGChartz and AMD used that number 6 months ago and rounded it on 150 mil.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Tom Warren - Sony’s PS5 Pro is real and Sony is asking developers to get games ready over the summer, with a push for ray-tracing support
News Hardware Hype 2 3 4
186
12K
DanielG165 replied
Report: Upcoming 'Turin' Zen 5 CPUs will support 4TB of RAM at 6000 MT/s
Rumor Hardware
43
2K
OverHeat replied
Leak - Zen 5 is now in mass production, release in late 2024
Hardware 2
61
5K
CuteFaceJay replied
PS5 Pro Specs Leak are Real, Releasing Holiday 2024(Insider Gaming)
38 39 40 41 42
2K
128K
Fafalada replied
So What is Sony Doing For The PlayStation 6?
2 3 4
171
10K
HighPoly replied
Top Bottom