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Dibils2k
Member
hate to break it to you but you are not really enjoying 4k gaming on a PS4 Pro... its 1440p majority of the time
mancs
Member
Ohhh , I knew that , that isn't in discussion , 1080p is..... Hd .
Darn him breaking info to me I know. *Fist Taps knee* sarcastically.....
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ToadMan
Member
Of course it matters for the UI.
I can watch a movie from 50 years ago on my 4k TV and it’s “fine” in terms of eye strain and clarity for it’s age.
But I don’t want the TV menus at that low res. I need to read and focus on small areas of the screen for that.
There’s clearly a difference between detail for text and menus the user has to read vs full screen moving images.
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kyliethicc
Member
You didn't get his joke. Its ok.
DaGwaphics
Member
ToadMan
Member
Isn't the PS4 Pros UI 4K?
And we are talking about a difference between 1080P and 4K not 1800P and 4K.
Also many people loved Demon Souls and said the game looked next gen. But according to Digital Foundry it was running at 1440P. Even with thatBo_Hazem could only find one jagged line in the image while the rest of it was clean.
What im trying to say is that even though the resolution might be lower it's the final product that matters. It's why many find technologies like DLSS and Insomniacs TI so fascinating.
There’s a difference in usage between the text used for menus and the res used for a full screen game image ...
Readability is important and that is aided by higher res on higher res displays.
Compute capability is not everything (more cores = more system load and complexity to manage tasks; we need balance between complexity and raw power).
If GPU recive data earlier then it can start compute earlier.
Dibils2k
Member
so 4k is important for games too... since you spend alot more time reading text on game UI lol
again, 4k is better for both, the fact anyone argues against that (whichever way) is pure bias and fanboy BS
ToadMan
Member
Sure - depends on the game.
Perhaps you haven’t noticed but game UIs and the underlying 3D render don’t have to be the same res ...
The fact remains, all consumer display tech uses high res for menus and controls and allows lower quality rendering for full screen images.
DaGwaphics
Member
It was a FUD that's been created by fanatics very close to Microsoft, Phil Spencer, and other execs. It was a reflection of what it seems XSX's reality, and now it's backfiring as you can't lie for too long.
So the new FUD is that Arden is RDNA1 on the same process node as the 5700XT. If that's the case, MS deserves a prize in engineering. Getting a wider GPU running at higher clocks + a CPU and at less watts. That's something.
Mr Moose
Member
What if they are playing 4K games and enjoying them?
Stooky
Member
4:4:4 is not a color gradient, its chroma subsampling. That's all i need to know that you have NO clue what your talking about
"Cinema analogue Is equal to 16k digital' Wtf are you talking about!? 16k is what some people believe it takes to digitally resolve a 70mm film frame. Some people think it can be done with 8k. Some people think 35m is equivalent to 5k-4k. More resolution dosen't give extra details that don't exist. If i create art completed at 4k, upresing it to 8k is not going to introduce any new details. Nobody is making any content for 8k. 8k for now is a waste. Resolution vs screen size at certain point becomes null.
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mancs
Member
444 is not a color gradient. it a pixel structure
4:4:4 is not a color gradient, its chroma subsampling. That's all i need to know that you have NO clue what your talking about
"Cinema analogue Is equal to 16k digital' Wtf are you talking about!? 16k is what some people believe it takes to digitally resolve a 70mm film frame. Some people think it can be done with 8k. Some people think 35m is equivalent to 5k-4k. More resolution dosen't give extra details that don't exist. If i create art completed at 4k, upresing it to 8k is not going to introduce any new details. Nobody is making any content for 8k. 8k for now is a waste. Resolution vs screen size at certain point becomes null.
[/QUOTE]
I thought chroma was colour?? Yeah I haven't a clue , 8 k is a waste ?? For the time being?? (Devices already like pcs can use and produce it) gtfo retard.. You haven't a clue idiot ... Nice try
4:4:4 is not a color gradient, its chroma subsampling. That's all i need to know that you have NO clue what your talking about
"Cinema analogue Is equal to 16k digital' Wtf are you talking about!? 16k is what some people believe it takes to digitally resolve a 70mm film frame. Some people think it can be done with 8k. Some people think 35m is equivalent to 5k-4k. More resolution dosen't give extra details that don't exist. If i create art completed at 4k, upresing it to 8k is not going to introduce any new details. Nobody is making any content for 8k. 8k for now is a waste. Resolution vs screen size at certain point becomes null.
[/QUOTE]
I thought chroma was colour?? Yeah I haven't a clue , 8 k is a waste ?? For the time being?? (Devices already like pcs can use and produce it) gtfo retard.. You haven't a clue idiot ... Nice try
mancs
Member
Some more salt on ya fries fucktard??
The darkness of the screen , i.e the grey scale , also effects the chroma and colour rep , obviously , its all fkin connected , gains in one production , helps another.
you're just trying to make me look like a cunt , trying to defend sense.
The darkness of the screen , i.e the grey scale , also effects the chroma and colour rep , obviously , its all fkin connected , gains in one production , helps another.
you're just trying to make me look like a cunt , trying to defend sense.
Stooky
Member
Actually chroma describes the intensity of color. So you thought wrong again, better luck next time!
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mancs
Member
Actually chroma describes the intensity of color. So wrong again, better luck next time!
[/QUOTE]
Still colour related and certainly in relation to what is involved in TV tech. THOUGH FUCK ALL TO DO WITH 1080p........ Ouch.
mejin
Member
I think a little of context is important cause when we talk about resolutions on Pro that's where WWS really shine.
Pro wasn't strong enough to output native 4K for the ambitions games...heck, ps5 won't be either if they continue to push above the limit.
But the quality image is top notch thanks to their tweeks on their engines. Not a single big ps4 game is 4k native as far as I know and the people didn't care cause no one would dismiss the visuals of TLoU 2 or Ghost of Tsushima.
We saw it with Demons Souls. People only started the mimimi after DF talking about 1440p.
So, if MS can't make 4K native UI (I still think they will), they should do something about it...simple 1080p is not enough.
Stooky
Member
Its not the same thing, but ahhhh keep doing you buddy.
mancs
Member
Chroma boy said 8k isn't relevant ... Lmao , go tell that to the techie heads who are using it atm all around the world , I imagine they will Craig ball throw you in a pc build waste bin, if they heard your shite.... Pmfpl.
which came first , the chroma or the colour. Nice try
*slow claps*
which came first , the chroma or the colour. Nice try
*slow claps*
mancs
Member
It's integrally connected to colour , I was correct , you prick.
xHunter
Member
Would be nice to see some actual quotes so we can all laugh together.
SirTerry-T
Member
That's all well and good but speaking as someone who occasionally "pops his head over the parapet" it's clear that fans of both machines (or is it the companies) are both guilty of finger pointing, name calling....and God help me for even typing this.... FUD spreading, that this thread has become an absolute shit hole to wade through when all you want to do is get some more insght on what's happening with these new consoles.
It's basically gang warfare over silicon, plastic and Corporate balance sheets and it's fucking pathetic to be honest.
Epic Sax CEO
Banned
Hotchips is a place were you go to give technical details and be honest!
There are questions that they may not answer because of AMD's NDA, but to think that they would hide and obfuscate this way is a ludicrous idea.
How can anyone insist in this ridiculous theory about "RDNA 1.5"?
AMD redesigned their GPU architecture and created RDNA from which new generations will be iterated. RDNA 1 is the first product, with more changes and additions it becomes RDNA 2. Both consoles are OFFICIALLY based on RNDA 2, it may not be exactly equal to what we are see later this month in the PC Cards but the fact that the GPUs in these consoles use base RDNA 2 doesn't change. Any difference is just due to the "Custom Silicon" business nature from where these APUs come from AMD.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
All will be clear in a few days/2 weeks.
MasterCornholio
Member
Actually what matters the most is the final image that you get. If a game is rendered at 1440P and uses a reconstruction technique to reach an image quality that's almost as good as 4K or maybe even the same or better that's not a bad thing. Because the developers can use the left over lower to push visuals even further and maybe even framerate.
I do agree that a native 1080P image blown up to 4K does look bad.
Dave_at_Home
Member
Where are you getting the PS5 has to downclock?The console with an inferior GPU, a slower CPU, lower memory bandwidth and is larger is now better thought out and developed
Looking at the power supply and the fact the PS5 has to downclock at a certain power threshold, a point a lot of people are conveniently forgetting, I'd be pretty surprised if the XSX isn't also cooler and quieter on top.
Zoro7
Banned
You only ever seem to notice the Sony fanboys and never the Xbox fanboys. Both sides do it constantly. Xbox fans were laughing at dynamic 4K games on PS5 and now the UI on series X isn’t even dynamic 4K. So it’s hilarious in my opinion.
DaGwaphics
Member
Agreed. LOL
AMD is promising a 50% performance per watt improvement in material provided to the press so far. MS has added almost exactly 50% more transistors to the 5700XT with lower power usage. So it looks like they got the efficiency boost as promised. If they've done that on 7nm duv, someone give them an award, they did it better than AMD.
FunkMiller
Gold Member
Console warriors do indeed exist on both sides, but shouldn’t be confused with people who make legitimate comparisons between the games footage that both companies have released, and draw conclusions based on them.
444 is lossless color coding, the other modes are for saving the amount of data to represent the colors [resolution].
Its not pixel structure.
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mancs
Member
Colour gradient , it's all to do with colour on a TV trying to reproduce it.. correct??444 is lossless color coding, the other modes are for saving the amount of data to represent the colors [resolution].
Yeah thought so.
MasterCornholio
Member
I think Cerny said there's enough both to run both at max clocks. I believe he said the variation in clockspeed is dependent on the workload. Plus from what I've read here it appears the PS5 can change it's clocks extremely quickly so it might not even be noticeable to the player.
Dibils2k
Member
while true, reconstruction can be great like in horizon zero dawn but not many game do that on consoles, DLSS nowadays looks superb but again will we see something like that on console?
to me 1440p native is not good enough either, 1440p reconstructed to 4k can be good enough depending on how it is done
if Dark Souls is native 1440p, sure on youtube it wont really matter, but when i am playing it, believe me i will notice the softness if is just native 1440p
Thirty7ven
Banned
Microsoft better at AMD than AMD.
MasterCornholio
Member
Demon Souls is at 1440P yet it doesn't look like it to me. Whatever reconstruction they are doing it's working pretty well for the game.
Credit to
Bo_Hazem
for the capture. 
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Dibils2k
Member
this might be because i usually look in here for next gen stuff and lets be honest its mostly sony people posting here... things from xbox are usually tweets and stuff and those arent forum posts
Dibils2k
Member
but you cant know that until you have it on your TV natively, no matter how good something looks on youtube, if they looked like that when i am playing i would be disappointed since there is clear compression. but while i am watching i can excuse things knowing its not real quality
dead monkey uk
Member
You realize you will see every game in 4K as your output right?
Its use widely in camera video recording to save space on disk (memory). Only top Hi-end Holywood camera use 444. in computer graphics we have a different situation because here we have multi render targets and we do not have such limits, but have bandwidth (and other) limits.
MasterCornholio
Member
Well according to you it will look even better on my monitor. So if a youtube video looks good then the game on my monitor will look even better. Than there's those screenshots captured from a PS5 that I've seen on my screen.
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Bo_Hazem
Banned
Agreed. LOL
AMD is promising a 50% performance per watt improvement in material provided to the press so far. MS has added almost exactly 50% more transistors to the 5700XT with lower power usage. So it looks like they got the efficiency boost as promised. If they've done that on 7nm duv, someone give them an award, they did it better than AMD.
Well, no one said it's totally RDNA1, it's custom, both are. But everyone went with a direction, and PS5 seems inline with RDNA2 with leaks of better custom RT and Geometry Engines, along with the exclusive GPU cash scrubbers. 10 days
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