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[Neo C.]

It's funny because it's a quote that Jobs repeat every now and then

I got this quote from him.
I don't know more whom he quoted though.

It's really ironic that people want Nintendo to leave the hardware part so badly when the hardware is key to Nintendo's quality just like the hardware is key to Apple's success.

 

[Clear]

Bottom line: 3D isn't a strong selling point.

Also failing to recognize the importance of offering dual analog input and hence limiting its application for contemporary game-styles was a major blunder.

The failure of 3DS to explode the way that DS did should have come as no surprise to anyone, especially given its excessive launch price and mediocre line-up of games.

Long-term I think it'll do alright, but Nintendo is learning the hard way that they'll need to work for their success this time around.

 

[UncleSporky]

Doesn't any tech/game company's stock typically drop like 5% following any big showing?

The prevailing thought is that anything new being shown means the company is spending big money on something that is not guaranteed to make a return on investment.

I expect Sony's to drop today as well.

 

[Cygnus X-1]

Rovio: All versions of Angry Birds combined have had 250 million downloads. Made $50 million in revenue.

That wouldn't even cover Mario Kart 7's marketing costs.

Yeah. 50 millions $ is nothing for a company like Nintendo who makes billions of revenues from handheld games. If this number is accurate, the iOS world is something to look after, but sure not to switch entirely on, for now.

Do we have more data?

 

[Para bailar La Bomba]

What's the big deal? The article is NOT from their business/finance dept. Furthermore, this is Isabel Reynolds' third negative article about Nintendo in as many months. She doesn't deserve the attention you're giving her, Gaf!

 

[Commanche Raisin Toast]

Looking at what is coming for the 3DS over the next 12 months, there is just no way it is going to "fail".

it's not about if it "fails". it's about it not suddenly having a massive sales explosion and being sold out all the time like the wii. if they think it's going to do "good" but not "awesome" then they'll be all poopie faces about it.

same as these big corporations get all pissed off if they make less PROFIT than last year. they still made a profit, but they're not making bigger numbers than last time, so obviously they are in big trouble. capitalistic mentality is weird.

3DS isn't going to *fail*. it's just not. nor will the Vita. (nor is the PS3, regardless of it being last place) but investors are looking for signs of either of them becoming this super megahit and selling like crazy so they can cash in. they won't waste their time with something that just hums along. (it's worth noting im talking about software sales too, not just hardware)

 

[jman2050]

I don't think that the iOS scene is as bleak as you paint it. Can we get hold of any actual figures to settle this? Do we know how Capcom, Sega et al feel about the marketplace? Have we had any big pubs / devs talking smack about their iOS profits?

Why would they? Those big companies actually make their money elsewhere while using iOS platforms as a dumping ground for old/cheap games to make some supplemental income on the side. It's a win win for them as it allows them to squeeze profit out of games far past their expiration date with little investment while crowding out the smaller independant competition.

 

[walking fiend]

Yeah, just because Nintendo didn't use its pre TGS conference which is watched almost exclusively by enthusiast gamers, not casual people, it means they don't have any plan to cater that portion of the market.

Nintendo is really always blamed whether they do or don't, now everyone was blaming them for that Wii U teaser focused on casual functions of Wii U controller. And now everyone blames them for not doing so.

 

[The Technomancer]

Bottom line: 3D isn't a strong selling point.

Also failing to recognize the importance of offering dual analog input and hence limiting its application for contemporary game-styles was a major blunder.

The failure of 3DS to explode the way that DS did should have come as no surprise to anyone, especially given its excessive launch price and mediocre line-up of games.

Long-term I think it'll do alright, but Nintendo is learning the hard way that they'll need to work for their success this time around.

I agree with most of what you say, but its worth pointing out that the DS didn't explore until a year or two into its life.

 

[The_Darkest_Red]

Of course i don't believe in that statement, that's plain stupid. I just said i understand where the "mood" of the article comes from as well as the lack of faith from the investors. Taken word for word the article doesn't mean much, but that whats we come to expect from content about video games from similar sources... that is, not much inside knowledge.

The point is, Nintendo didn't played it smart with the 3DS and WiiU, and they will be stuck with them for years. For example, the GC was considered a failure for the company even though it generated revenue when all was said and done.

I think you're getting a little off topic here. My very first comment, the one you responded to, said that a lot of folks would be eating crow after this holiday season. That thought was formed based purely on the statements found in the article, and particularly the belief that the games shown and announced last night wouldn't help the 3DS at all. I think those games will help, and I think a lot of the people predicting otherwise will be eating some crow because of it.

That's really all there is to it. I'm not trying to figure out the "mood" of the article, I'm just reading it and taking the statements directly for what they are. Anything beyond that is pure speculation as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Wazzim]

That's pretty clear, it will take some time to get their shares back on the price they were. Definitely sucks for investors.

 

[Carlisle]

Oh ffs, Reuters too?

I also like how they called 3DS a "glasses-free 3D version of the DS".

I believe this is the main problem in the article "demand for the glasses-free 3D version of the DS"; unfortunatelly with the name 3DS, people sees it as another DS but on 3D. Only hardcore gamers know that this is a more powerful handheld. Only Nintendo is to blame for their poor advertisement and not trying hard enough to separate the platforms.

Glad others caught that too. Clearly the writer isn't very well-educated on the products he's talking about.

 

[Drkirby]

Rovio: All versions of Angry Birds combined have had 250 million downloads. Made $50 million in revenue.

That wouldn't even cover Mario Kart 7's marketing costs.

Marketing isn't that expensive, but I know what you mean, they have one of the most well known games in the past 5 years, and they have the profits that the monthly "AAA" console game selling 2-3 Million.

My bet though, is the real money for Angry bird is in the Merchandising.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjEdWTk1l9o

 

[Josh7289]

Yeah. 50 millions $ is nothing for a company like Nintendo who makes billions of revenues from handheld games. If this number is accurate, the iOS world is something to look after, but sure not to switch entirely on, for now.

Do we have more data?

Furthermore Angry Birds is probably the most successful iOS game to date. It's probably not the best barometer for the average successful iOS game case study.

 

[donny2112]

Are they going to have one?

This was their pre-TGS conference, which I think they've had before. October will be a retailer conference, but there have ocassionally been announcements there (e.g. MH3). Probably not near as many this year with the loaded pre-TGS conference, though.

 

[7Th]

Girl Mode

Girl's Mode was already in DS.

 

[Cipherr]

Rovio: All versions of Angry Birds combined have had 250 million downloads. Made $50 million in revenue.

Im fucking crying, lol.

God I swear. I love the smartphone market, and I dont think smartphone gaming is a fad like some folks do. Smartphones have MASSIVE growth ahead of them, the mobile industry is a drop in the bucket compared to what it will be eventually at its current growth rate. But goddamn if the folks trying to push the gaming side of it aint out of their league. Or at least premature as hell.

I understand when you are a small fish in a big pond, you have to make a lot of ripples/noise to get noticed. Rovio and the like have taken some shots at consoles, and thats to be expected when you are the new kid on the block wanting and needing attention, but for the love of god, temper yourselves...


50 million on one of the largest mobile games in existence....cmon now.

 

[Jedeye Sniv]

Fucking iPhone and mobile gaming.

EDIT: I cannot wait for these tools to be wrong.

You sound very bitter about this, what's the problem?

Mobile gaming is definitely the future. hostile reactions like this are just the old guard getting defensive in the face of new competition.

I'm honestly never paying £30 for a portable game again, it's a ridiculous outdated business model. There is lots of money to be made in the sub £5 market.

 

[hatchx]

Last nights show was really lackluster...Maybe a handful of new games were announced and they didn't look very exciting or new. MH4 was all they had and in the end, I wouldn't be surprised if it appeared elsewhere.

What are you talking about?

Known about:
-Kid Icarus
-Animal Crossing
-Mario
-Mario Kart
-Luigi's Mansion
-Paper Mario
-Sonic Generations
-FF:Therythm
-Four Swords +

.....all look fantastic.


New:
-Mario Tennis
-Bravely Default
-Monster Hunter 3G
-Monster Hunter 4
-Fire Emblem
-Gundam
-Some Japanese games


....all look fantastic.

 

[Fafalada]

Have we had any big pubs / devs talking smack about their iOS profits?

It's simple - if the market showed evidence that it can sustain anything wortwhile(in terms of production value), you would have seen it already.
After 4 years - all you need is look at their investment into the platform - I bet Gameloft games get bigger budgets then what other "big" publishers put into their mobile games.

Of course, the fact that piracy is just as bad as on PC(even with the low pricing) doesn't help build confidence among publishers.

 

[Dedication Through Light]

Rovio: All versions of Angry Birds combined have had 250 million downloads. Made $50 million in revenue.

That wouldn't even cover Mario Kart 7's marketing costs.

Its 350 mln today.

 

[Diffense]

This thing needs a revision, QUICK.

It looks a lot better in that picture.

Anyway, the analysts are thinking in terms of Nintendo's 'casual' market and question whether those will see any need to upgrade.
OTOH Nintendo is showing a willingness to compete that I haven't seen in a while.
So that has to count for something even if they lose some less committed players to more convenient devices.

 

[Commanche Raisin Toast]

Yeah, just because Nintendo didn't use its pre TGS conference which is watched almost exclusively by enthusiast gamers, not casual people, it means they don't have any plan to cater that portion of the market.

Nintendo is really always blamed whether they do or don't, now everyone was blaming them for that Wii U teaser focused on casual functions of Wii U controller. And now everyone blames them for not doing so.

to be fair, when they ARE praised by investors it's usually universal praise regardless of what all is announced. either investors absolutely love nintendo or they hate them. same with sony though, it seems. each time they go out of their way to comment on jumps/drops in stock it's almost always met with "wtf?".

although in this case i kind of agree. not a lot of hype around the holiday releases for 3DS (kid icarus delayed), the slidepad looks terrible, and the 2012-and-beyond titles are good but not the sweeping full house hand that could have been played. but i do feel like the rest of the show needs to be finished up before the stock jockeys start coming out with bold statements. for all we know they show footage of the new titles tomorrow and could turn heads.

 

[The Technomancer]

You sound very bitter about this, what's the problem?

Mobile gaming is definitely the future. hostile reactions like this are just the old guard getting defensive in the face of new competition.

I'm honestly never paying £30 for a portable game again, it's a ridiculous outdated business model. There is lots of money to be made in the sub £5 market.

If you're three guys programming out of a garage maybe. Hell, my brother and I might do just that. But again, Angry Birds has made $50 million.

 

[Jocchan]

This was their pre-TGS conference, which I think they've had before. October will be a retailer conference, but there have ocassionally been announcements there (e.g. MH3). Probably not near as many this year with the loaded pre-TGS conference, though.

Yeah, this is why I asked. They went all out with announcements, so I'm not sure what they would be showing next month.

 

[Cipherr]

Its 350 mln today.

Which would make it what, 70m in revenue? Still a drop in the bucket, and AB is the exception to the rule, not the average. These really are not even comparable.

 

[The Technomancer]

Which would make it what, 70m in revenue? Still a drop in the bucket, and AB is the exception to the rule, not the average. These really are not even comparable.

Seriously. Hell, a DS game that sells 1 million units is probably going to return $8-10 million to its developer after all is said and done.

 

[wsippel]

It's simple - if the market showed evidence that it can sustain anything wortwhile(in terms of production value), you would have seen it already.
After 4 years - all you need is look at their investment into the platform - I bet Gameloft games get bigger budgets then what other "big" publishers put into their mobile games.

Of course, the fact that piracy is just as bad as on PC(even with the low pricing) doesn't help build confidence among publishers.

I'd argue that the low prices actually attribute to the rampant piracy. Stealing $50 is kinda bad, but all that $0.99 is basically worthless to begin with, so one might as well steal it. Who cares, it's not even a dollar. Iwata got a lot of flack for his GDC keynote, but he was absolutely right. Perceived value goes down the shitter, and that's bad for everyone. Probably including Apple.

 

[Jinfash]

This was their pre-TGS conference, which I think they've had before. October will be a retailer conference, but there have ocassionally been announcements there (e.g. MH3). Probably not near as many this year with the loaded pre-TGS conference, though.

I thought this was their October event moved up a couple of months?

 

[Fafalada]

Furthermore Angry Birds is probably the most successful iOS game to date. It's probably not the best barometer for the average successful iOS game case study.

Yea that would be probably more like this: http://asia.gamespot.com/news/6276708.html
160 titles, 20M total sales -> 100k average per title.

 

[REV 09]

regardless of what happens to Nintendo, if you like Nintendo games, then they'll likely be around for a long, long time. Nintendo is both outclassed and unnecessary as a hardware provider, but their games are timeless.

 

[yamaneko]

Analyst thinking "This fucking joystick for 3DS is true?"

Nintendo says - Yes of course

Analyst - O my... m*

 

[Loxley]

I'd love to stay optimistic about Nintendo's share of the handheld market, but with the iPhone 5 and iOS 5 both launching this fall, I can only imagine Apple will take an even bigger slice of the pie by year's end.

When Apple releases a new iPhone, they usually bring an updated line-up of iPods, which any electronic retailer will tell you is the #1 thing on every kid's Christmas list. As for the 3DS, Nintendo doesn't even know what the fuck to do with the device, as evidenced by the hilariously awkward right-analog nub attachment they're releasing with Monster Hunter. If they don't have any confidence in the 3DS, what makes you think consumers will come the holiday season?

Nintendo has never faced such fierce competition on this level in the handheld market up to this point, and even if they did, they were always ahead regardless. I wouldn't even argue it was a "handheld market", it was Gameboy/DS market with a few other handhelds in it, they always had a dominant lead. Here though, they're clearly falling behind and have been too stubborn to adapt to a changing market that they no longer have the iron grip on that they once did. Before-hand they never had to face change becuase they were the ones who were controlling where the handheld market was. Now? They've officially lost that position to Apple and clearly don't want to accept it.

I agree that saying ridiculously hyperbolic things like Nintendo is "doomed" is definitely jumping the gun, but I also agree that they will be in trouble if they continue to put their fingers in their ears going "lalalalalalala" whenever anyone mentions to them the ever-increasing popularity of iOS games.

 

[SatelliteOfLove]

GAF (circa 2005) --> major mainstream media (circa 2011) --> ???

 

[Dynamite Shikoku]

nintendo doesn't know what they're doing anymore

 

[Cow Mengde]

Time to buy Nintendo stock?

 

[LeleSocho]

You sound very bitter about this, what's the problem?

Mobile gaming is definitely the future. hostile reactions like this are just the old guard getting defensive in the face of new competition.

I'm honestly never paying £30 for a portable game again, it's a ridiculous outdated business model. There is lots of money to be made in the sub £5 market.

yeah good luck with your AngryBirds-quality game and good luck finding something like Shenmue/ZeldaOOT/Ico on your phone

 

[cw_sasuke]

They dont know shit - those are the same investors who thought and expected Wii and DS to flop....

3DS flop - after 6 months ? Come on... if the 3DS is a flop, every console besides Wii and Ps2 is a flop with those sales in spring and summer.

 

[Drkirby]

Yea that would be probably more like this: http://asia.gamespot.com/news/6276708.html
160 titles, 20M total sales -> 100k average per title.

Single Game. Say the words out loud.

 

[Kacho]

So, Nintendo is still doomed, eh?

smh @ internet

 

[Gamecocks625]

I don't want (nor think they will) Nintendo to totally abandon hardware, but I would absolutely love some Nintendo content on iOS. They could get away with charging a premium on the App Store.

 

[Cipherr]

Single Game. Say the words out loud.

And honestly Gameloft is another one of the biggest mobile devs out there, still not representative of the average in any way.

 

[Celine]

Why do we need 2 nearly identical threads?

One is for Doom the other is for Gloom.

 

[chubigans]

Which would make it what, 70m in revenue? Still a drop in the bucket, and AB is the exception to the rule, not the average. These really are not even comparable.

Are any of y'all considering the fact that a Nintendo iOS game sold for, say, $10 would do considerably better than Angry Birds? It would rock the charts like crazy.

 

[hwalker84]

They lost me when they came out with the Nintendo 64.

 

[Fafalada]

Single Game. Say the words out loud.

My point was that one of the top publishers on the platform averages only 100k UNIT sales for their releases (which to be honest, is comparable to lots of packaged-goods publishers).

That goes very much against the advertised perception of iStore where people go "oh 1$ dollar games must be selling 10Milion on average easily" (I've had MBA professionals say things like that to me, among others).

 

[Philthy]

I've bought every Nintendo handheld to date with the exception of the 3DS.

1. 3D is tired. I cannot stand it. They broke the barrier of not having to wear stupid glasses that dig into the bridge of your nose. But in the end, 3D is just not doing it for me.

2. Price. I could post that we've been coming out of a recession, but the truth is I simply don't want to spend any more on this device than a normal DS. They dropped the price to a level worth buying. But...

3. Graphical upgrade is negligible. When all is said and done, it still looks like my DS that does 3D. I want something that is by Nintendo that does graphics like the PSP if I want to move on from my DS.

4. I am perfectly happy with the DS. I like the 2D games. It still feels like a great platform. Unlike the Wii, this platform has life left in it. Leave it alone for another 5 years.

 

[beril]

I don't think that the iOS scene is as bleak as you paint it. Can we get hold of any actual figures to settle this? Do we know how Capcom, Sega et al feel about the marketplace? Have we had any big pubs / devs talking smack about their iOS profits?

How many original high quality games have you seen from any of those publishers on the iOS?

I'm sure there are a lot of companies making a decent profit from iOS, but the 1$-game market still has not been proven to be a sustainable business model for making any reasonably sized productions.

 

[MetatronM]

The failure of 3DS to explode the way that DS did should have come as no surprise to anyone, especially given its excessive launch price and mediocre line-up of games.

Long-term I think it'll do alright, but Nintendo is learning the hard way that they'll need to work for their success this time around.

I don't understand this. The DS did not explode onto the market. The DS' first year was TERRIBLE, and it was being beaten soundly by the stronger, prettier, sexier PSP. Then all of a sudden a whole huge wave of games hit about a year into its lifespan, and the machine exploded. And yeah, I've heard the arguments (b-b-but the 3DS is coming off of the DS being the best selling thingamajig ever!), but the DS was coming off of the Game Boy Advance, also just about the best selling thingamajig ever to that point, and everybody was crying doom and gloom about the DS to the point that Nintendo had to keep on reassuring people that the DS was not meant to replace the Game Boy line and that there would be a true successor (rhetoric which promptly disappeared as soon as the DS started to take off).

3DS is going to have a HUGE holiday in Japan. That's what we learned at the conference last night. In the west? Eh, things will probably be a bit dicier, but with evergreen Zelda, Super Mario, and Mario Kart games out before year's end, they'll be in solid shape. Maybe not "dominate the globe" type shape like the DS, but the 3DS will be fine.

Labeling the 3DS an outright failure, especially compared to this stage in the DS' lifespan, is just ludicrous. The 3DS has only been out little over 6 months (and not even 6 months in the west). Has it been slower than Nintendo expected? Yeah. I think they've gotten a little too used to the level of success of the last 5 years and just thought everyone would be there day one rather than seeing how things developed. I think the one thing Nintendo failed to realize coming into this year is that they burned almost as many bridges as they built with the Wii, which was also demonstrated in their awkward Wii U reveal at E3.

The level of support they were expecting at launch, both from third parties and from customers, will probably be there in about a year's time.

 

[King of the Potato People]

Maybe the shareholders are just really big Metroid fans... I laughed.