With the Rayman thing and now this, it has been a great week of gamers begin told by other gamers to quit bitching about anticonsumer moves. Here man, this just opened up two day sago.
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"No more used games" uproar for nothing?
- Thread starter Cru Jones
- Start date
Gamestop ALWAYS has discounts/extra trade credit when trading towards NEW releases. There is no way I would have played both DmC and Dead Space 3 if I didn't get both for $70.
Do you have insider info that this "no more used games" system definitely isn't happening? Or are you just stating your opinion as fact?
kinoki
Illness is the doctor to whom we pay most heed; to kindness, to knowledge, we make promise only; pain we obey.
I feel like I'm the only one who wants a Steam-like service for the next gen. Buy the game once and download it to every console you own. But, unlike Valve, neither Sony or Microsoft seem the least bit interested in offering any kind of value in return.
Vyse The Legend
Member
This is the main issue. If they create a way to lend games to a friend, a la ebook lending, I will be fine with it.
However, for games that go out if print, new copies will be ridiculously expensive on eBay. So there should be a way to deactivate a license or buy a new license for a game. In the latter scenario, the game companies/devs would make money on "used" copies, so it is a win-win for everyone.
The only nice thing about the steam service is their addictive discounts. other than that. it wouldn't sustain.
Alx
Member
We are getting up in arm over a mere rumor, since nothing official has been announced yet.
Depends what you're buying. If you're a generation behind guy like myself, used games are the sheeeeiiiit. Love paying $5 for God of War, or $3 for Jak II for the PS2.
Without used games maybe lots and lots of studios wouldn't have closed this gen.
Knux-Future
Banned
what? That a hell of a leap man.
When I was in college and didn't have a job, I used to trade in a bunch of games (dvds, and books) to Amazon for credit.
Credit that I used for various stuff but main new games. I would use this to pre-order stuff. The only time I bought a used copy of a game is because that's the only copy they had.
But honestly, while the whole selling part of it is big for me the fact that it would effectively gimp or outright stop lending and renting just sucks.
and in the end, I don't see a compelling reason as to why it needs to be "stopped" anyway..so why do it?
Now if it is just a streamlined online pass service, then fine...while that sucks, it doesn't exactly ruin stuff for me since I'm not an online gamer and would in theory still be able to rent and thus try out enough of the games to know if I like it or not.
Basically don't outright ban it
why is everyone ignoring online passes and dlcs?
Haunted
Member
This is correct.
A decade? No. Steam didn't even get useful until maybe 2006. Gamestop never sold used PC games, though, so there's that.
Sure the volume of used PC games was much lower compared to console games and it's practically nonexistent now, but the prices are good enough to accommodate such. There's a market and competition to allow it - it's not a one ruler dynasty like Xbox Live and PSN. This is what I'm so afraid of... There won't be any good deals compared to the PC marketplace. It's exactly like that right now.
PC gamers dealt with it and it turned out to be a good option overall. The used games market as of now would be destroyed and the alternative is up in the air with regards to its quality. Why anyone would put faith in MS or Sony for such a thing, I have no idea.
Vyse The Legend
Member
What about them? Not everyone cares about online or DLC, and even if a person buys a used game from GameStop, they aren't guaranteed to get buy either of them. So, the developers lose out on a fuckton of money anyway.
I H8 Memes
Member
Makes sense for both publishers and MS and Sony to want to block used game sales. It's not just publishers that lose out on money from a used game sale. Console manufacturers sell consoles at a loss and operate under the razor and blade economic model, and they need that $10 royalty that comes from every new game sale.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
I suspect you are correct about what is going to happen, however people are reacting to early reports that don't make the implementation details clear.
I do not think you've quite correctly read the way retail will "pass on the savings". The first few online pass games were discounted significantly (I remember the UFC game that first had an online pass was $15 off used day one for that reason) but most games today just have the standard $5-10 off even without an online pass.
starchild excalibur
Member
The more you reduce the size of the market, the more you need to be prepared to be price gouged.
I don't buy as many used games as I used to because I have a big enough backlog that I can just wait for sales on new games. But the thing that the used market provides is a better reflection of the game's worth. It's a system that upsets what retailers may think the game is actually worth and I appreciate that.
Even that aside, I don't like having to jump through hoops to play games any more than I currently have to. I don't want to have to worry about my internet going down. Or their servers going down. Or a friend having to log in on my account to play a borrowed game (if they even allow multiple log-ins, which they won't). Or having to update my system to even play games offline.
If the rumors prove true, it'll definitely be an interesting test to see how much the used market really does or doesn't matter. In this day of diminishing exclusives I don't know that Halo and Gears will be enough. They're within their right to lock out used games. I'm within my right to not give them my patronage.
I don't buy as many used games as I used to because I have a big enough backlog that I can just wait for sales on new games. But the thing that the used market provides is a better reflection of the game's worth. It's a system that upsets what retailers may think the game is actually worth and I appreciate that.
Even that aside, I don't like having to jump through hoops to play games any more than I currently have to. I don't want to have to worry about my internet going down. Or their servers going down. Or a friend having to log in on my account to play a borrowed game (if they even allow multiple log-ins, which they won't). Or having to update my system to even play games offline.
If the rumors prove true, it'll definitely be an interesting test to see how much the used market really does or doesn't matter. In this day of diminishing exclusives I don't know that Halo and Gears will be enough. They're within their right to lock out used games. I'm within my right to not give them my patronage.
There's a difference between a rumor from EDGE Magazine and some no-name blog. We can be worried now. Just because Microsoft and maybe Sony haven't ordained it to be true does not mean it's not worth outrage or discussion. This philosophical change that appears to be on the verge of being implemented is a dangerous precedent for gaming. I don't think a lot of people realize how many people participate in the used game market.
The used game market are the people who are on the verge of not buying a new console, because there old systems are just as good. They are the people who could get along well with just a cheap iPod Touch and some shitty $.99 licensed application. It seems to be a terrible idea to make the shift right now when futures are unsure in this space, but from what it looks like bravado from the big guys will win out. The studios hanging on by razor thin margins without their own digital store front will lose big.
Good luck getting a retailer like GameStop to stock and move your systems and push your stupid collector's editions. It won't exist any more as a marketing vehicle for games.
Yes but don't you think if we complained enough beforehand it would maybe reach the gaming gods ears and stop this from happening.
Personally I haven't paid more than $15 for a game in probably three years, don't have the money to buy new games. I still buy a good number of games but they are all used. If used games aren't supported next gen then I'll probably be out...might actually be a good thing.
SolidSnakex
Member
That definitely isn't going to happen. If either console manufacturer blocks used games then GameFly isn't going to carry any games for that console.
That can account for a large portion of their sales, though. And the reason they can do it is because DD is much cheaper. We've been over this a gazillion times.
I think if the cost of manufacture and distribution is cheaper, then that should trickle down to consumers somewhat - or you can use it for promotion, or volume-based sales, or whatever. There are different ways of making a profit without all the physical item overhead. On XBL you aren't really seeing this. It's still a big money or nothing game.
DidntKnowJack
Member
For me, it's more about having the situation where a few years have passed and I want to buy a certain game that's out of print. If they're no longer making these games, then buying them pre-owned is the only option.
I imagine there will be a way to re-purchase a disc activation, but all this stuff ends up doing is inconveniencing the consumer. A bigger trend these days, it seems.
If you were buying used,you didn't care about the developer to begin with. If you were in support of the game creators. you would buy new. then if you really liked the game, buy dlcs. ((or if u bought used->buy dlc)
online passes are just a strike against gs for the their used game market. and attempts to make sure their games get somewhere.
plus online passes i would say just help give a idea of how many new players are online so they can budget or estimate when to turn off its server for something better.
im done.
faceless007
Member
Speak for yourself. I buy used games, out-of-print current-generation games, out-of-print previous generation games, and even new and sealed games at retail, all the time.
And even people who never buy used still have every right, if not duty, to defend the first sale doctrine and human right to buy and sell secondhand goods without restriction.
Mystic_Wanderer
Member
No used games are a dealbreaker for me.
I spend a few thousand on gaming a year. If I can't re-sell games I don't like/not buy cheap used games I'm not sure I will like or maybe missed, well I'm 28. Probably about time I got a new hobby anyway.
I spend a few thousand on gaming a year. If I can't re-sell games I don't like/not buy cheap used games I'm not sure I will like or maybe missed, well I'm 28. Probably about time I got a new hobby anyway.
It just seems like, if it's true, that developers/publishers want to grab as much cash as possible without considering how the used game market actually benefits them.
It may seem like someone else is getting their hard earned money, but it actually benefits them to some degree I think.
Used, and rental games probably affected a decent amount of the new game sales. They made some people aware of interesting game series, good developers, interesting genres - and the money people got from selling used games probably indirectly, or directly made people more likely to buy a new title.
I think the majority of used game sales are probably titles that people were somewhat interested in, and wouldn't have purchased otherwise though. That, however, just makes it more likely that used games are good for the game-market-economy, since it might make people buy a new game from a developer, or genre, or series they liked.
I mean, why even consider cutting out the used games market if it's that small?
Chances are higher that they'll lose money by doing this, instead of gaining. The game market itself could crash, cause they probably won't lower the prices to match the new game-market-economy of no used games.
And regular, cliche, mediocre titles like Call of Duty will become even more common.
probably. if any of these ideas are implemented, it will be crazy to watch the effects ripple out to used and rental companies.
it is all very touchy and controversial, so no i think the uproar is not for nothing, even if the simple solution does not appear very intrusive, it's still a controversial issue.
don't forget you have to stop watching movies at 30, too. edit: but more hobbies is always great! lol
Except the PC market isn't a closed platform like consoles. There are dedicated servers to play games on after publisher's take their servers down. Valve is a company that instills more trust in customers than Sony, Microsoft, EA, and Activision who will use their leverage over the market to take more and more away from the games you love. It's not just about how just the "poors" will be hurt by this policy, so why care at all?
It's not just people that buy games. Outside of the occasional b2g1, most of my interactions with gamestop are me trading in used games towards new games that I otherwise wouldn't buy. If I can't even trade in used games then I'll be buying a lot less new games, due to both possibly not liking the game and not having the money.
Get Lovefilm to pay a license fee i.e. Lovefilm pays Capcom and they produce a disk which can be traded between users...?
Mystic_Wanderer
Member
You know who isn't doing it? Nintendo.
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
If they do buy it, that's additional income that the developer NEVER would have seen otherwise.
HolyBaikal
Banned
I've bought over half of my games in the past 2 years or so used on Amazon for around $10.
Ace Harding
Member
Of course it's being blown out of proportion, because we have no idea how this is going to work if it it's even happening at all.
People saying things like "I won't be able to take a game to a friends house" are speculating on zero facts. Everyone is assuming it will be implemented in the worst way possible.
I mean maybe it will, but we just don't know yet.
People saying things like "I won't be able to take a game to a friends house" are speculating on zero facts. Everyone is assuming it will be implemented in the worst way possible.
I mean maybe it will, but we just don't know yet.
lowhighkang_LHK
Member
Each game should come with four activation keys. That way you can register it on multiple devices and lend it out to multiple friends. Gamestop wouldn't deal with used games still because it would be a logistical nightmare to maintain how many of the four activation keys have been used up. They would also have to take the word of the seller in regards to how many keys he used or lent out.