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[Fourth Storm]

Now no one go scream the sky is falling.... but around thanksgiving I was chatting with two friends who work at my old studio (a Sr Designer and a Lead Env Artist, SO seasoned vets but clearly not leadership) about the Nintendo NX... And neither even knew it was a thing

So at the very least Nintendo has not shown it to all that many westen devs at that point. Or my friends are for once in their lives honoring their NDA over their FrienDA

Arkam: Still the bearer of bad news after all these years. We have indeed come full circle.

 

[Vena]

Now no one go scream the sky is falling.... but around thanksgiving I was chatting with two friends who work at my old studio (a Sr Designer and a Lead Env Artist, SO seasoned vets but clearly not leadership) about the Nintendo NX... And neither even knew it was a thing

So at the very least Nintendo has not shown it to all that many westen devs at that point. Or my friends are for once in their lives honoring their NDA over their FrienDA

Well at least from some insider knowledge we know it was shown off, at least in concept, early last year.

 

[The_Lump]

Now no one go scream the sky is falling.... but around thanksgiving I was chatting with two friends who work at my old studio (a Sr Designer and a Lead Env Artist, SO seasoned vets but clearly not leadership) about the Nintendo NX... And neither even knew it was a thing

So at the very least Nintendo has not shown it to all that many westen devs at that point. Or my friends are for once in their lives honoring their NDA over their FrienDA

Interesting. Either it's still v. early and we're still a long way off or they've only shown it to a select few so far (or had done up to thanksgiving, anyway).

Arkam: Still the bearer of bad news after all these years. We have indeed come full circle.

Indeed, we just need Ideaman to pop up with some Tidbits® and it'll be like a class reunion.

 

[Vena]

Indeed, we just need Ideaman to pop up with some Tidbits® and it'll be like a class reunion.

Well this time we have a bit of a conflict of information from one side and another, so its a bit of a messy blur.

We also know that this time around there are NDAs for NDAs.

 

[Arkam]

Yikes. Do they work for a major publisher and did any of them leak you Wii U stuff? If yes to both then I'd be worried. If no to both then I'm not worried. myne they did honour their NDA's this time since many of our Nintendo insiders have been silent compared to the Wii U. Revised NDA's I guess or or serious ramifications.

I'd imagine the Japanese pubs and Ubisoft got a look at it first while the CES back room stuff will be for the western studios.

They work for one of the top two western publishers. And NINTENDO is who gave me/us the info on the WiiU.

Arkam: Still the bearer of bad news after all these years. We have indeed come full circle.

Lol. I just pass on facts, good or bad. I am a huge Nintendo fan so I always root for them. Even when that screw up.

 

[Instro]

Now no one go scream the sky is falling.... but around thanksgiving I was chatting with two friends who work at my old studio (a Sr Designer and a Lead Env Artist, SO seasoned vets but clearly not leadership) about the Nintendo NX... And neither even knew it was a thing

So at the very least Nintendo has not shown it to all that many westen devs at that point. Or my friends are for once in their lives honoring their NDA over their FrienDA

Interesting, it seemed like dev kits were out there from what we had heard(little that it is). Would everyone in a publisher/developer that size be aware of the system/dev kit if their specific team isbnot involved with it right now. Not sure how NDAs work in that sense.

Otherwise it's as you mentioned, poor dev relations or NDAs stopped your friends.

 

[Vena]

They work for one of the top two western publishers. And NINTENDO is who gave me/us the info on the WiiU.
Lol. I just pass on facts, good or bad. I am a huge Nintendo fan so I always root for them. Even when that screw up.

Hmmm....

Interesting, it seemed like dev kits were out there from what we had heard(little that it is). Would everyone in a publisher/developer that size be aware of the system/dev kit if their specific team isbnot involved with it right now. Not sure how NDAs work in that sense.

Otherwise it's as you mentioned, poor dev relations or NDAs stopped your friends.

The WSJ article on that matter could well be Japan-specific, given the writer and his likely source (probably SE). We haven't actually heard anything concrete for the West other than John talking about the NDAs on NDAs and that the console was shown off well before that WSJ article went out.

 

[10k]

They work for one of the top two western publishers. And NINTENDO is who gave me/us the info on the WiiU.




Lol. I just pass on facts, good or bad. I am a huge Nintendo fan so I always root for them. Even when that screw up.

Color me worried. That's pretty much Activision and EA. The ones who drive western audience with CoD and sports titles. Nintendo what are you doing?

 

[maxcriden]

I really appreciate you sharing the info with us, Arkam. I think it's better we set our expectations as realistically low as possible when it comes to third parties. I think it's kind of a damned if you do damned if you don't situation in regards to Western third parties and Nintendo. If they port some games to NX, people will say "eh, those are just launch window ports, they're just throwing Nintendo a bone and their support won't continue," which depending on word of mouth can end up being a self-fulfilling prophecy. If they don't support NX, even if we didn't expect them to, people will point to it as another example of how Nintendo has failed and how the NX will bomb.

However you slice it, Nintendo's system is not going to be the core gamer's home for your GTAs, your CODs, your Maddens. The market has shifted and as much as I think XB is mostly just a me-too PlayStation without a strongly defined POV as a device or brand (and I say this as someone who has owned multiple XB systems), for the core market it is going to be extraordinarily difficult to ever get them strongly interested in a Nintendo console again. Nintendo is still seen as a maker of children's games, no matter how many Bayonettas they publish (not that most core PSX/XB gamers know what Bayonetta even is). Still. My point is that Nintendo will continue to develop good relationships with family-friendly Western game production (see: Skylanders, Rayman, etc.) and with mostly mainstream Japanese titles (maybe I'm naive but I don't think 3DS for example has the market for certain kinds of Japanese games that Vita does).

It will take a seismic market shift for core gamers to not only get an NX in addition to their PS/X, but in addition to that, to pick up their favorite M-rated games for the system rather than for their PS/X where (a) the online player base will be much higher and (b) all their friends are. When you look at the success of the Wii it is not in these core third-party games. It's in new kinds of games and experiences that Nintendo made themselves, the massive blue ocean they made an enormous splash in (that is hard but never impossible to do again--if anyone can succeed at that, it's Nintendo!), and the kinds of quality games that third parties in the east and west made primarily or exclusively for Wii, be they Sega or EA or Capcom or whoever. 3rd Party support has been a dwindling proposition since the N64 days, and I just am not banking on the core market shifting towards Nintendo for the first time in...well, it'd be the first time since Sony came onto the market, really.

 

[Kimawolf]

Color me worried. That's pretty much Activision and EA. The ones who drive western audience with CoD and sports titles. Nintendo what are you doing?

Probably EA as Acti would have some for Skylanders at least I'm sure. But perhaps they keep stuff compartmentalized as we know of others getting kits before E3.

 

[Arkam]

Interesting, it seemed like dev kits were out there from what we had heard(little that it is). Would everyone in a publisher/developer that size be aware of the system/dev kit if their specific team isbnot involved with it right now. Not sure how NDAs work in that sense.

Otherwise it's as you mentioned, poor dev relations or NDAs stopped your friends.

It is entirely possible the company has dev kits at the other studios and maybe even that studio (they have a few game teams). So like I said dont get too worried. But I personally found it a bit odd that they were not aware and planning work for it.

I am still very excited to see what NX is/isnt and what games they have in store. They just sure as hell will not have a certain IP come launch

 

[Vena]

It is entirely possible the company has dev kits at the other studios and maybe even that studio (they have a few game teams). So like I said dont get too worried. But I personally found it a bit odd that they were not aware and planning work for it.

I am still very excited to see what NX is/isnt and what games they have in store. They just sure as hell will not have a certain IP come launch

I'm actually more surprised that they wouldn't have even heard of it. I know random people who barely play games who have heard of the thing through its proliferation all over social media. I can't imagine anyone who even remotely glances at gaming sites wouldn't have even the slightest knowledge of the product.

 

[Arkam]

I'm actually more surprised that they wouldn't have even heard of it. I know random people who barely play games who have heard of the thing through its proliferation all over social media. I can't imagine anyone who even remotely glances at gaming sites wouldn't have even the slightest knowledge of the product.

When you are working 60hours a week to get a title out you tend to stop caring out the outside world. Especially if you are not an avid gamer on your personal time. Not everyone who makes games reads NeoGaf/Kotaku/IGN/Etc.

 

[GDGF]

Edit: Disregard.

 

[Vena]

When you are working 60hours a week to get a title out you tend to stop caring out the outside world. Especially if you are not an avid gamer on your personal time. Not everyone who makes games reads NeoGaf/Kotaku/IGN/Etc.

Fair enough (though the people of whom I speak are also people who work 60+ hours a week and aren't avid gamers, being a grad student is murder ).

But then in this context, the same applies to an SDK of a platform that has nothing to do with their project.

 

[Mpl90]

Mmmh, since the SDK distribution started reportedly at the end of October, and Arkam got in touch with his friends around Thanksgiving, could it be that his friends' studio had yet to receive a dev kit, and that (in pure theory) it's possible they received it now? I'm probably just talking from my ass, but I suppose this is theorically possible? Assuming they're not respecting NDAs, of course.

Also, of course the publisher involved is one between Activision and EA. I'd lean more towards EA, and FIFA being the potential missing franchise (even if, actually, what about a smaller, isolated team put to work on a port of that game?)

 

[10k]

It is entirely possible the company has dev kits at the other studios and maybe even that studio (they have a few game teams). So like I said dont get too worried. But I personally found it a bit odd that they were not aware and planning work for it.

I am still very excited to see what NX is/isnt and what games they have in store. They just sure as hell will not have a certain IP come launch

You're crushing my dreams of the NX getting all the big third party IP's. NX isn't getting FIFA confirmed.

 

[Vena]

You're crushing my dreams of the NX getting all the big third party IP's. NX isn't getting FIFA confirmed.

Why were you entertaining such thoughts? Come now.

 

[DrWong]

You're crushing my dreams of the NX getting all the big third party IP's. NX isn't getting FIFA confirmed.

Hope EA will release a NX remaster of FIFA 12.5 Wii U :]

 

[AerialAir]

You're crushing my dreams of the NX getting all the big third party IP's. NX isn't getting FIFA confirmed.

Lacking FIFA, CoD and Minecraft is like... dead from the start.

Spoiler

/s...?

 

[10k]

Why were you entertaining such thoughts? Come now.

Hope EA will release a NX remaster of FIFA 12.5 Wii U :]

Lacking FIFA, CoD and Minecraft is like... dead from the start.

Spoiler

/s...?

This thing is going to be the Wii U all over again isn't it?

I won't call it a dreamcast because that actually got third party support.

 

[Neoxon]

This thing is going to be the Wii U all over again isn't it?

I won't call it a dreamcast because that actually got third party support.

At least in this case, the NX Handheld will sell decently enough to pull the weight of the platform.

 

[udivision]

This thing is going to be the Wii U all over again isn't it?

I won't call it a dreamcast because that actually got third party support.

Until Nintendo gives us reason to believe else wise, assuming the NX will be something akin to the Wii U with Wii U like success is probably the safest best. Assuming a Nintendo home console will sell better than the the previous Nintendo console is quite a big risk.

 

[Neoxon]

Until Nintendo gives us reason to believe else wise, assuming the NX will be something akin to the Wii U with Wii U like success is probably the safest best. Assuming a Nintendo home console will sell better than the the previous Nintendo console is quite a big risk.

This is part of the reason why I believe the NX Handheld will exist, to pick up the NX Console's slack (on top of cutting down on software droughts).

 

[Arkam]

At least in this case, the NX Handheld will sell decently enough to pull the weight of the platform.

hey If it sells and people buy games for it the developers will come. It is as simple as that. If Nintendo releases an e-reader but 20m people buy it and the attache rate is high you better believe the games would come in like a tidal wave.

It is not about specs so much as it is about consumer appeal.

 

[TheOnlyOneHeEverFeared]

I like the presumptions people are making off such bare bones rumours. Come on guys.

Spoiler

please tell us if you know if its due out this year at all in any way, please I'm dying over here

 

[jhmtehgamr20xx]

Until Nintendo gives us reason to believe else wise, assuming the NX will be something akin to the Wii U with Wii U like success is probably the safest best. Assuming a Nintendo home console will sell better than the the previous Nintendo console is quite a big risk.

This is part of the reason why I believe the NX Handheld will exist, to pick up the NX Console's slack (on top of cutting down on software droughts).

If they're expecting it to only be a Wii U level of success, then why are they even bothering with a console anymore? Honest question. At some point, like Sega, they have to look at those sales and say "this just isn't worth it", and focus on handhelds. And yes I understand Nintendo has cash on reserve but if they keep wasting it on consoles and diminishing handheld sales gen-over-gen that money will eventually run out or at the very least seriously make them reconsider putting in the effort for new consoles.

So part of me has to believe the NX console is going to be something actually appealing to people outside of those who purchased a Wii U, because at least in that case, Nintendo still has a place in the industry as a console manufacturer.

 

[Shikamaru Ninja]

This is part of the reason why I believe the NX Handheld will exist, to pick up the NX Console's slack (on top of cutting down on software droughts).

Well we know there will be a family of systems (at least two likely), and that the shared architecture will be what makes them part of the family. But we don't know to what extent the shared architecture will house the software. There are several scenarios including.

1. System User Interface. Account System.Virtual Console shared across hardware.
2. System User Interface. Account System. Virtual Console. eShop digital titles shared across hardware.
3. System User Interface. Account System. Virtual Console. eShop digital titles shared across hardware. Hand Held games also playable on Console but not vice versa.
4. All software playable across all hardware. (Possible but extremely difficult.)

 

[Neoxon]

hey If it sells and people buy games for it the developers will come. It is as simple as that. If Nintendo releases an e-reader but 20m people buy it and the attache rate is high you better believe the games would come in like a tidal wave.

It is not about specs so much as it is about consumer appeal.

And it's about the audience who buys the system. And thanks to numerous decisions made by Nintendo, the audience they have now doesn't really care about AAA western third party games. This is why I doubt that the NX Platform will see much from, say, EA or Bethesda early on.

Well we know there will be a family of systems (at least two likely), and that the shared architecture will be what makes them part of the family. But we don't know to what extent the shared architecture will house the software. There are several scenarios including.

1. System User Interface. Account System.Virtual Console shared across hardware.
2. System User Interface. Account System. Virtual Console. eShop digital titles shared across hardware.
3. System User Interface. Account System. Virtual Console. eShop digital titles shared across hardware. Hand Held games also playable on Console but not vice versa.
4. All software playable across all hardware. (Possible but extremely difficult.)

But you also have to consider one harsh truth about Nintendo. They can't support two separate gaming platforms on their own, anymore. The Wii U & the 3DS's software output made that abundantly clear. Throw mobile gaming into that pot, & you have a recipe for disaster in terms of software output (that's somewhat quelled by DeNA's assistance on the mobile front). And with the entirely real possibility of the NX Console not going far above the Wii U in sales, you'd think that Nintendo would want the bigger games in as many hands as possible. Granted, they'll probably get Japanese third parties & indies on board, but probably not the western side of things. If they can, awesome. But Nintendo needs to be prepare for the worst-case.

 

[Neoxon]

Oops, double post.

 

[MHWilliams]

This thing is going to be the Wii U all over again isn't it?

I won't call it a dreamcast because that actually got third party support.

Given third-parties general lack of trust in Nintendo, that's always going to be the case until a system changes the perception that non-Nintendo games can sell well on Nintendo platforms. Essentially, it'll take a large publisher putting a major multi-platform title on the NX and the NX version outselling or within parity of the PS4/PC/Xbox One versions.

It's hard to see that happening. Nintendo has trained their audience too well and the audience they'd be aiming for already has one of the other platforms.

I agree with Neo, that the handheld is going to do most of the leg work here.

 

[Shikamaru Ninja]

And it's about the audience who buys the system. And thanks to numerous decisions made by Nintendo, the audience they have now doesn't really care about AAA western third party games. This is why I doubt that the NX Platform will see much from, say, EA or Bethesda early on.

That's not true. The audience they have probably does care about AAA western third party games, they just don't buy them on Nintendo consoles because they tend to be the inferior versions. There is no doubt that Metroid Prime and The Legend of Zelda are probably in the elite tier of "core" AAA titles that could benefit being surrounded by the likes. That tends to be one of the main issues Nintendo deals with.

But you also have to consider one harsh truth about Nintendo. They can't support two separate gaming platforms on their own, anymore. The Wii U & the 3DS's software output made that abundantly clear. Throw mobile gaming into that pot, & you have a recipe for disaster in terms of software output (that's somewhat quelled by DeNA's assistance on the mobile front). And with the entirely real possibility of the NX Console not going far above the Wii U in sales, you'd think that Nintendo would want the bigger games in as many hands as possible. Granted, they'll probably get Japanese third parties & indies on board, but probably not the western side of things. If they can, awesome. But Nintendo needs to be prepare for the worst-case.

But all those three scenarios before the ubiquitous one, all do heavily bolster the console and efficiency of output. I think number 3 is actually the most plausible. Hand Held stays the same, Console gets console plus hand held software. Nintendo can definitely support 3 platforms, 3 successful platforms that generate revenue. They just aren't publishing Wii U games because the user base and market potential are non-existent world wide. The hand held is pretty much exclusively attached to a domestic audience.

 

[The_Lump]

It is entirely possible the company has dev kits at the other studios and maybe even that studio (they have a few game teams). So like I said dont get too worried. But I personally found it a bit odd that they were not aware and planning work for it.

I am still very excited to see what NX is/isnt and what games they have in store. They just sure as hell will not have a certain IP come launch ;)

Depends when they launch

 

[Neoxon]

That's not true. The audience they have probably does care about AAA western third party games, they just don't buy them on Nintendo consoles because they tend to be the inferior versions. There is no doubt that Metroid Prime and The Legend of Zelda are probably in the elite tier of "core" AAA titles that could benefit being surrounded by the likes. That tends to be one of the main issues Nintendo deals with.

But those are mainstay Nintendo franchises that appeal to the Nintendo audience. And even then, I don't recall Metroid Prime setting the world on fire in terms of sales (correct me if I'm wrong, that's just what I've gathered when discussing Metroid Prime sales with others). As for Nintendo fans having other consoles for those AAA games, that's one of the reasons why they won't care. The Nintendo fans who do care already have systems that satisfy those needs, & thus have no reason to get those third party games on the NX Console (especially with the online communities likely being bigger on PS4 & XB1).

 

[udivision]

If they're expecting it to only be a Wii U level of success, then why are they even bothering with a console anymore? Honest question. At some point, like Sega, they have to look at those sales and say "this just isn't worth it", and focus on handhelds. And yes I understand Nintendo has cash on reserve but if they keep wasting it on consoles and diminishing handheld sales gen-over-gen that money will eventually run out or at the very least seriously make them reconsider putting in the effort for new consoles.

So part of me has to believe the NX console is going to be something actually appealing to people outside of those who purchased a Wii U, because at least in that case, Nintendo still has a place in the industry as a console manufacturer.

You think Nintendo expected the Wii U to do Wii U levels of success? Intentions don't mean much when the rubber hits the road. I'm sure Nintendo and their shareholders expect great things. Until we see what that is, I just don't think it makes much sense to be optimistic given their history.

 

[Neoxon]

But all those three scenarios before the ubiquitous one, all do heavily bolster the console and efficiency of output. I think number 3 is actually the most plausible. Hand Held stays the same, Console gets console plus hand held software.

But again, in the very likely scenario that the NX Console doesn't sell much beyond the Wii U's numbers, they need to get those big games in the hands of as many people as possible. And in all likelihood, the NX Handheld will be the dominant NX device. You can't let the likes of Bayonetta 3 & Splatoon 2 be left to die on the NX Console. And even with Smash & Mario Kart (which are on both), what happens there? These are the reasons why I believe that it'll be just one pool of games that can be scaled depending on the device that's playing the game in question.

 

[Hiltz]

As long as Nintendo's next platform lacks the target audience that Sony and Microsoft have in abundance, then third parties will not really take NX seriously.

 

[MadOdorMachine]

Their core philosophy has been to make new console stronger than older ones? You seem to be under the impression that the PS4 is some powerhouse hard to attain standard when in reality it was outdated when it was released and is even moreso 2 years later

I'm basing my opinion on what I'm observing. They don't seem to be interested in the graphics race. It could be argued that the Wii, Wii U, DS & 3DS were all underpowered when they were released. So it really doesn't matter if the PS4 is underpowered or not. What I think they're more concerned about is price. Going off their past price points, the measures they had to take to save the 3DS and failing Wii U, I assume that they are likely targeting a $199 price point. They also expect to move a lot of inventory which adds to me leaning toward this opinion. I just don't see anything they're doing or have said that supports the idea that they are going to release a high powered console. Again, I think they'll probably release a handheld and console with nearly identical architecture and that the handheld will at the best have graphics equal or comparable to Wii U. I suspect the console may offer some slight improvements over Wii U, but they will be minimal.

 

[Neoxon]

As long as Nintendo's next platform lacks the target audience that Sony and Microsoft have in abundance, then third parties will not really take NX seriously.

This, & that's exactly why I believe the NX Handheld will pull most of the weight of the platform. In fact, I wouldn't be shocked if the Direct/Press Conference/Whatever focuses more on the NX Handheld. It would make sense, considering that the 3DS is basically on its deathbed at this point.

 

[10k]

At least in this case, the NX Handheld will sell decently enough to pull the weight of the platform.

Handhelds don't sell well anymore. The NX handheld will pull a vita.

 

[GamerJM]

This, & that's exactly why I believe the NX Handheld will pull most of the weight of the platform. In fact, I wouldn't be shocked if the Direct/Press Conference/Whatever focuses more on the NX Handheld. It would make sense, considering that the 3DS is basically on its deathbed at this point.

For some reason I haven't ever thought about this. I always kind of figured they'd focus more on the console in the US since that would make it seem like a bigger deal, but you're probably right.

 

[Neoxon]

Handhelds don't sell well anymore. The NX handheld will pull a vita.

The Vita failed because it was too powerful for its own good at the time of its release. It was an endless cycle of developers being apprehensive about the development costs for Vita games & consumers not wanting a Vita due to the lack of games for the system. If the NX Handheld is cheap enough, it'll do decently (or at least sell 2/3 of the 3DS's numbers). Plus with one pool of games, Nintendo can easily create a large enough library for both to encourage confidence in developers targeting the NX Handheld.

 

[Astral Dog]

Nomura is growing impatient with no NX development kits

 

[Sadist]

Arkam broke 10k

 

[Neoxon]

For some reason I haven't ever thought about this. I always kind of figured they'd focus more on the console in the US since that would make it seem like a bigger deal, but you're probably right.

That could still be the case for the sake of eye candy. But if Nintendo's gonna focus more on the device that will sell more, they'll probably put more of their eggs in the NX Handheld basket given their current situation.

 

[antonz]

Handhelds don't sell well anymore. The NX handheld will pull a vita.

That's a pretty bold claim. Nintendo Handhelds gets support from Inside Studios and Outside. 3DS is still looking at a 60+ million lifetime sales.

If anything depending on how the software system is if handheld and console share similar games scaled to device etc its possible Nintendo could in fact expand its audience. People might be willing to buy an NX handheld for the games while they wouldn't a Console because they have PS4 for instance.

 

[Serenitynow]

But again, in the very likely scenario that the NX Console doesn't sell much beyond the Wii U's numbers, they need to get those big games in the hands of as many people as possible.

How is this scenario "very likely" when we don't even know what NX is?

 

[maxcriden]

This thing is going to be the Wii U all over again isn't it?

I won't call it a dreamcast because that actually got third party support.

It's like nobody read my long rambling post on this page 😆

 

[Neoxon]

How is this scenario "very likely" when we don't even know what NX is?

Given all of the rumors & insider scoops we've received about the NX Platform, it's safe to assume that there will be some kind of home console component. And sans the Wii, each Nintendo home console sold worse than the one before it.

 

[TheOnlyOneHeEverFeared]

It's like nobody read my long rambling post on this page 😆

I read it. It was cool.