Particle Physicist
between a quark and a baryon
harSon said:
that seems like an ongoing mistake. he has to dumb down his sentences again.
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Obama talks race and gender in Philly...
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that seems like an ongoing mistake. he has to dumb down his sentences again.
Deus Ex Machina
Member
The "typical white person" is now being discussed outside of Fox News on MSNBC.
geez... That's all people are concern about is slip up's... I knew these weeks leading up to Pennsylvania would be tough but my God!
geez... That's all people are concern about is slip up's... I knew these weeks leading up to Pennsylvania would be tough but my God!
electricpirate
Member
dionysus said:
I just don't even know where to start.
Watch the speech yesterday, Obama talks pretty clearly about the pastor having very controversial views, saying controversial things. He didn't hear him say some very specific points, and there's no evidence that those points were iterated again and again.
The fundamental flaw of posts like these is the belief that everything Wright said, and everything in that church. Those were terrible things uttered, it doesn't mean that wright is a terrible person. In the speech Obama defends Wright pretty clearly on those grounds, suggesting that what he said aren't at the core of his beliefs.
Secondly, did you watch those videos, this isn't just some man saying terrible things as people look on uncomfortably. That church is rocking out in support of what he's saying, what Wright said is a symptom of problems in our imperfect union, not some kind of new generational hitler.
In this, Obama is acting like Christian, he won't help anyone by throwing wright under a bus, but by embracing Wright, and using his comments to illustrate to everyone the challenges of race he has a chance to help everyone.
Jason's Ultimatum
Member
Good luck with that considering this country reelected Bush, and as much as I want Obama to win the WH, I have a feeling McCain is going to win.
soul creator
Member
I guess Obama's next speech should be a version of Bernie Mac's from "Don't Be A Menace..."
"I hate the snow, because it's white. I hate albinos cuz they white. I hate milk cuz it's white. I hated my mama cuz she was white. I hate notebook paper cuz it's white. And most of all I hate my white ass teeth!"
"I hate the snow, because it's white. I hate albinos cuz they white. I hate milk cuz it's white. I hated my mama cuz she was white. I hate notebook paper cuz it's white. And most of all I hate my white ass teeth!"
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Slurpy said:
Darn right. And if a person wants to say something racial while swearing in, I'll feel like straight kicking that dumb b*tch straight in his dick.
"Typical"?! WTF. Some in the media have to feel dirty of hell pushing that bullsh*t. And some of GAF try to tell me America doesn't have that much racism going on anymore.
As a black man I can tell you this is the racism that we blacks see all the time at freaking work!!
typhonsentra
Banned
Even in context the comment was kinda inflammatory guys.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
harSon said:
Again, this harSon (I think you are black) is where I think the racism comes in. Isn't it soooo obvious what he said/meant?
It's ironic, because that's exactly the kind of sound-bite driven, dishonest discussion Obama was railing against in his speech on Tuesday. The same one everyone praised for helping to make for a more open nuanced discussion about race.Deus Ex Machina said:
And two days later, they're back to the old bullshit. Fucking media.
electricpirate
Member
GhaleonEB said:
Yup, it's the kind of thing that makes me want to throw my hands up and just walk away from the entire process.
Edit: I won't, but fuck if as soon as i see a canidate who is saying things that resonate with me in a way that improves the discourse, and the quality of the discourse brings him down.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
typhonsentra said:
WHAT IS?! How? Explain please!!
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
reilo said:
America is so sad. Dis f*cking country. Seriously. It kind of sucks in a way.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
As do I sadly.thekad said:The sad thing about it is, people watch his show and believe everything he says. I know those people
If this screws Obama's chances America deserves what it gets. If this turns Obama into an "unelectable" candidate America deserves Hillary or McCain.
We are obviously not the adults Obama thought, and we don't deserve the chance to make anything "right" in politics today.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Okay in about 3 minutes MSNBC will NOW talk about this "new" controversy with Obama saying "typical white person".
I serious, "damn America". I agree with Wright.
I serious, "damn America". I agree with Wright.
except for the GOD part. We are damning ourselves.
MSNBC is calling this pretty much an election "manufactured about secondary disputes" and that Obama will be fine - unless he has 6-7 more fuck-ups from now on.
Scarborough said it's like an airplane - over 10 things need to go wrong before it crashes.
Scarborough said it's like an airplane - over 10 things need to go wrong before it crashes.
Deus Ex Machina
Member
Deus Ex Machina said:
soul creator said:
People are assuming this is a every Sunday thing, some reports said that members was shocked as you were at his remarks at those two sermons back in 2003.
Particle Physicist
between a quark and a baryon
mckmas8808 said:
but msnbc is pro obama. they cant possibly say anything that would paint him in bad light. !! poor hillary.. with all these news media stations constantly attacking her...
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Deus Ex Machina said:
Yep. But some of that I blame on the Obama team. They should have that WHITE LADY that's a Minister on MSNBC, CNN, ABCNews, etc every freaking day.
Why not? You have 800,000 people that viewed her on Youtube, but 0 people that's heard her talk on TV. WHY? Why Obama. Put that damn lady out there on Tv.
reilo said:
The heck if they did. They never corrected on explained the statement. You still have dumbass voters out there that think MSNBC approves of the fact that Obama misspoke.
I personally don't think he mis spoke. I think some people are hearing it wrong.
maximum360
Member
Faux News has contributors just explaining away McCain's faux pas. According them, yes Al Quaeda is in Iran.
dionysus said:
Regarding point A:
What Obama was saying is that he wasn't aware of ALL of the things that Wright said, that he hadn't been in attendance at every single sermon of Wright's, and even if he had been, there is no way he could have stored in his memory every single point of every single sermon of Wright's.
And what does understanding your pastor's beliefs have to do with being a devout christian? I'm Jewish, so I'm not speaking as an insider, but how can someone's "Christian-ness" be measured by what his PASTOR says? Why does a "devout christian" have to know everything about his or her pastor's beliefs? Can you honestly say that you know all the beliefs of anyone other than yourself? Hell, can you say that you know definitively what YOUR beliefs are for every situation or scenario?
Regarding point B:
I don't know the exact wording Obama used, but I think it's safe to say that you're wrong about him contradicting himself.
What Obama meant was that there are legitimate reasons why Wright would say such things. While some of the things Wright was saying were wrong (such as the whole AIDS thing), others were true, and regardless of whether or not each individual point was a fallacy, you have to understand that Wright's experiences throughout his life have given him very legitimate reasons to have such passionate anger and frustration. He's not flip-flopping, he's saying that Wright was making some exaggerating and false statements, but that these rantings are fueled by Wright's legitimate emotions which result from his very legitimate experiences growing up in the 1940s and 50s. (Wright was born in 1941)
Regarding point C:
I think you're completely missing the point of Obama's statement. He was not trying to pull the family-card. He was making an analogy, that you can't just disown someone because they have different views than you that you might even find offensive. Especially if they're a close friend or relative of yours. Should Dick Cheney disown his daughter for being a lesbian? Should Obama cut all ties with his community, a community that has done many charitable events, a community full of his friends, family, and acquaintances? Should he cut all ties with one of his closest friends? Of course not, just like he shouldn't disown a relative such as his grandmother for her views.
You can love someone without agreeing with them, or even without liking them.
Likewise, Obama was also saying that if he dismissed Wright, he would be dismissing his entire community and would be doing it a great disservice. Forget about some of the incorrect individual statements that Wright has said, for a second. The emotions behind those statements are very real, and very justifiable, although the expression of those justifiable emotions may come out wrong. These concerns are held throughout the black community, and it is these feelings, not the permutations and combinations of words used to express these feelings, that should be investigated.
With regards to point d:
Wright was Obama's pastor, his religious mentor. I'd like to point out that pretty much all of the controversial remarks that Wright has made are of a political nature.
I would also like to point out that these topics of controversy are, what, maybe half a dozen, if even that, sermons out of THOUSANDS that Wright has given?
Are we really going to judge Wright by a handful of his sermons, rather than his full twenty years of sermons and actions within the community?
This is why I hate politics and the American media. After all the positivity in Obama's speech, all these idiots can do is take a tiny snippet out of his 38 minutes of talking and run some negativity with it? It's just flat-out disgusting.
Obama intended to bring races together with his speech, but you have these "spin doctors" trying to divide people by trying to hone in on something taken out of context. Ok, so now Obama's a radical, black racist? It's said that this is how the media is trying to paint him...
Obama intended to bring races together with his speech, but you have these "spin doctors" trying to divide people by trying to hone in on something taken out of context. Ok, so now Obama's a radical, black racist? It's said that this is how the media is trying to paint him...
I've been becoming increasingly furious at the media over the past few years, but this just blows my lid. Journalistic integrity has completely flown out the window to be replaced by an environment where everything is examined, dissected, and spun until the original message is now viewed as completely different than originally intended. Under the guise of a constant repeating of the same "questions" (e.g. "Is Obama part of a Muslim conspiracy to take over the government?") over and over, they attempt to maintain their impartial stance while in reality directing people to believe whatever they feel they can push for as long as possible, for the sake of ratings, and no doubt, ulterior motives.
They are using the validity effect to control public opinion however they see fit, and I'm sick of it. Does everything have to be PC, and "proper", fitting this image of this fictional, ideal citizen that has been created in the minds of the populace under the media's guidance? It's primary purpose is that of a business, where controversy sells. And now they've proven once and for all, that if they can't find new controversy, they can create it. Intelligent discourse on an issue is thrown under the rug to keep the controversy going, where anyone who isn't, in part at least, a "yes" man who will keep their game going is labeled as a loony or misguided.
Obama's speech was a rare instance of real, intelligent dialog by a major US politician- the
likes of which we haven't seen in years. The message to the media and the people to stop, take a step back and look at the ridiculousness of what discussion of major issues has become was truly powerful, and the only other major instance of this I can remember of something like this was Jon Stewart on Crossfire(how sad is this in the grand scheme of things?). Few have dared to tackle this kind of thing to avoid exactly the kind of media twist and spin that has become common place. And now we see, after a day of general praise for such a thing, it's coming back to bite Obama in the ass. The Daily Show hit the nail on the head with the image of 19th century media pundits spinning the Gettysburg Address.
Thus, once again, intelligent discourse will go silent until the next person has the balls to challenge the media stranglehold on public opinion.
F*ck you big media! F*ck you! *god I wanna smash my TV right now
*
They are using the validity effect to control public opinion however they see fit, and I'm sick of it. Does everything have to be PC, and "proper", fitting this image of this fictional, ideal citizen that has been created in the minds of the populace under the media's guidance? It's primary purpose is that of a business, where controversy sells. And now they've proven once and for all, that if they can't find new controversy, they can create it. Intelligent discourse on an issue is thrown under the rug to keep the controversy going, where anyone who isn't, in part at least, a "yes" man who will keep their game going is labeled as a loony or misguided.
Obama's speech was a rare instance of real, intelligent dialog by a major US politician- the
likes of which we haven't seen in years. The message to the media and the people to stop, take a step back and look at the ridiculousness of what discussion of major issues has become was truly powerful, and the only other major instance of this I can remember of something like this was Jon Stewart on Crossfire(how sad is this in the grand scheme of things?). Few have dared to tackle this kind of thing to avoid exactly the kind of media twist and spin that has become common place. And now we see, after a day of general praise for such a thing, it's coming back to bite Obama in the ass. The Daily Show hit the nail on the head with the image of 19th century media pundits spinning the Gettysburg Address.
Thus, once again, intelligent discourse will go silent until the next person has the balls to challenge the media stranglehold on public opinion.
F*ck you big media! F*ck you! *god I wanna smash my TV right now
*
typhonsentra
Banned
:lol Since when is Dobbs blonde?
Jason's Ultimatum
Member
maximum360 said:
Not entirely defending them, but Iran is a pretty big country or did they mean harboring them?
Shirokun said:I've been becoming increasingly furious at the media over the past few years, but this just blows my lid. Journalistic integrity has completely flown out the window to be replaced by an environment where everything is examined, dissected, and spun until the original message is now viewed as completely different than originally intended. Under the guise of a constant repeating of the same "questions" (e.g. "Is Obama part of a Muslim conspiracy to take over the government?") over and over, they attempt to maintain their impartial stance while in reality directing people to believe whatever they feel they can push for as long as possible, for the sake of ratings, and no doubt, ulterior motives.
They are using the validity effect to control public opinion however they see fit, and I'm sick of it. Does everything have to be PC, and "proper", fitting this image of this fictional, ideal citizen that has been created in the minds of the populace under the media's guidance? It's primary purpose is that of a business, where controversy sells. And now they've proven once and for all, that if they can't find new controversy, they can create it. Intelligent discourse on an issue is thrown under the rug to keep the controversy going, where anyone who isn't, in part at least, a "yes" man who will keep their game going is labeled as a loony or misguided.
Obama's speech was a rare instance of real, intelligent dialog by a major US politician- the
likes of which we haven't seen in years. The message to the media and the people to stop, take a step back and look at the ridiculousness of what discussion of major issues has become was truly powerful, and the only other major instance of this I can remember of something like this was Jon Stewart on Crossfire(how sad is this in the grand scheme of things?). Few have dared to tackle this kind of thing to avoid exactly the kind of media twist and spin that has become common place. And now we see, after a day of general praise for such a thing, it's coming back to bite Obama in the ass. The Daily Show hit the nail on the head with the image of 19th century media pundits spinning the Gettysburg Address.
Thus, once again, intelligent discourse will go silent until the next person has the balls to challenge the media stranglehold on public opinion.
F*ck you big media! F*ck you! *god I wanna smash my TV right now
This is the truth. It takes about 3 minutes for my blood to start boiling and my eyes to start rolling uncontrollably after turning on the TV to major news networks. Its just pitiful. There is a MASSIVE different in the depth, intelligence, and level of superficiality when it comes to American broadcasting vs European, and yes, middle-eastern broadcasting. I understand French and Arabic perfectly, and also watch european as well as middle-eastern news stations. There is absolutely no comparison. Regardless of your opinions of BBC for example, or al-jazeera and what you deem to be thei biases, there is no denying the level of discourse is infinitely higher on those 2 stations- on ANY topic.
"Journalistic integrity" is an absolute joke. The media has basically become a Jerry Springer-esque hub for news. Let's take small, extreme portions of what actually occured and try to use it to charicaturize the whole. They couldn't really find anything wrong with Obama, so here they are trying to paint him as the 'black candidate.'
And it says something about the general status of America when being known as the black candidate predestines you for failure. All the media needs to do now is to repeat clips of him shooting hoops and maybe show a few clips of Obama eating chicken with tabasco sauce.
And it says something about the general status of America when being known as the black candidate predestines you for failure. All the media needs to do now is to repeat clips of him shooting hoops and maybe show a few clips of Obama eating chicken with tabasco sauce.
maximum360
Member
This is great fodder for Lou Dobbs who was never impressed with Obama to begin with. Obama just needs to clarify this issue on Larry King tonight and then maybe at another public venue (just enough for or in hopes of the media bringing attention to it) and then leave it alone.
topsyturvy
Member
so what, olbermann pick on hillary all the time.harSon said:
Someone needs to call Lou Dobbs out on his blatant hatred for Obama, a day doesn't go by where he publicly hates on the man. I've been watching him for months and I personally have witnessed very little positives (If any at all) towards Obama.
I may have misheard but did Lou Dobbs just give Hillary the benefit of the doubt regarding NAFTA? :lol
I may have misheard but did Lou Dobbs just give Hillary the benefit of the doubt regarding NAFTA? :lol
maximum360
Member
topsyturvy said:
I think Olberman's beef with Hillary is that she's just disingenuous, opportunistic and doesn't seem to care much about the effects of her ambitions as long as she attains them. He also doesn't think very much about her current staff.
topsyturvy
Member
yea, noAniHawk said:
maximum360
Member
harSon said:
It's just a jab at Obama.
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