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Obama talks race and gender in Philly...

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GhaleonEB said:
wat

It was the media that kept this close while he piled on eleven straight wins, and the media that makes it sound like there's an even race, when it's almost impossible for Clinton to win; her only path is through super delegates, and to do that she needs Obama to be so damaged that he's not viable any longer.

Yes because the media HAS NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER shown any bias towards Obama over Clinton in this campaign. They have always been against him and all the shows bash him 24/7 while making Clinton seem like a God.

The media propped up Obama when they thought Clinton was going to end this early (think way before Super Tuesday) and they propped up Clinton during the winning streak of Obama to keep this going. They want ratings and to drag this out is the best for ratings. If Clinton was in the same position as Obama is right now the media would be making it sound like Obama still had a shot at winning as well.

And you people keep forgetting that the media kept this story off the airwaves other than Hannity ranting about this every day for the past year. If the media was really against Obama they would have shown this shit earlier but it didn't benefit them so they didn't show it. They have a 6 week span of NOTHING happening until PA so this story is the story they need to fill the gap and keep the ratings going.
 
NWO said:
Yes because the media HAS NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER shown any bias towards Obama over Clinton in this campaign. They have always been against him and all the shows bash him 24/7 while making Clinton seem like a God.
I don't recall saying that. I was talking about the way the media is largely ignoring the mathematical reality of the situation, while buying entirely into Clinton's narratives, even before Super Tuesday. (After a week of MSM coverage, I thought Clinton won that day. She didn't.)

The media propped up Obama when they thought Clinton was going to end this early (think way before Super Tuesday) and they propped up Clinton during the winning streak of Obama to keep this going. They want ratings and to drag this out is the best for ratings. If Clinton was in the same position as Obama is right now the media would be making it sound like Obama still had a shot at winning as well.

And you people keep forgetting that the media kept this story off the airwaves other than Hannity ranting about this every day for the past year. If the media was really against Obama they would have shown this shit earlier but it didn't benefit them so they didn't show it. They have a 6 week span of NOTHING happening until PA so this story is the story they need to fill the gap and keep the ratings going.

You're right that they are vested in a close race, and I wasn't paying as close attention two months ago as I am now, so I can't say how they treated Obama. Still, it's been a Clinton-love fest as of late.

Chuck Todd summed up the whole situation as well as anyone I've seen. (Not really directed at you, I just read it and thought it was worth posting.)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23679299/

WASHINGTON - Forget the pledged delegate issue that Sen. Hillary Clinton is facing; her real problem may be on the superdelegate front.

As many folks following this Democratic fight now realize, Clinton’s only shot at the nomination is to somehow make a case to the majority of the superdelegates that she’ll be the better nominee for the party.

But ask yourself, why does Clinton have less than half of superdelegates publicly behind her right now? Why isn’t her number higher?

At last count, Clinton had 253 superdelegates in her corner, not counting another dozen or so from Michigan and Florida.

But even including those folks, Clinton has fewer than 40 percent of superdelegates supporting her, and that's after more than a year of campaigning.

This is the wife of the former president, after all. Shouldn’t there be at least 400 party leaders who owe something to the Clintons on board?

This has been a campaign riddle that many of us have overlooked.

Clinton problems

One reason this has been brushed under the rug? Media-types don't realize the problems many rank-and-file Democratic activists have with the Clinton family.

Simply take a look at Bill Clinton's record from '92 to '00 and you’ll understand why they're having a harder time corralling party activists and elected officials to their side.

Remember, when his name was on the ballot ('92 and '96) the Democratic party lost Senate seats both times. Never mind the beating the party took in '94; a walloping often blamed on both Bill and Hillary.

Even in '98, which was, perhaps, the most successful Congressional election of the Clinton era, the party netted zero Senate seats and gained less than a handful of House seats.

It's not exactly something to brag about.

While there are plenty of unknowns about Obama’s ability to truly expand the base of the Democratic Party, there are plenty of superdelegates who think they know Clinton couldn't rise to that very same challenge.

The scars of the '90s are still rather prominent for some Democrats, particularly members of the House leadership who appear to be leaning Obama’s way (see Nancy Pelosi’s weekend comments).

The Clintons' up-and-down relationship with some Congressional Democrats in the ‘90s could become an issue when many of these undecided members of Congress (a.k.a. superdelegates)are asked to make up their mind.

In fact, that's not the Clintons' only rocky relationship. Key labor leaders also hold some grudges from that decade, when they felt like they had to capitulate more on certain things, like NAFTA. Some felt that it was beginning of what would be a long, hard fall from power in the '90s and early '00s.

So if Clinton has a pledged delegate problem (something that’s been well documented) and also has a superdelegate problem, then what’s her path to victory?

Believe it or not, it’s the media.


This is one area where Clinton has been running circles around Obama. As far as the media’s concerned, Obama may be the Democratic frontrunner, but Clinton is in the driver's seat.

Looking at the campaign narrative, it's hard to identify the frontrunner.

In fact, if you ignore the numbers and just examine the messages being lobbed back and forth between the two campaigns, one might assume Clinton was in the lead.


(This is something that could start being reflected in some national polls. On Monday, a Gallup poll showed that in a potential match-up, Clinton would best John McCain 51 percent to 46 percent. Obama would lead 49 percent to 47 percent. Surely, these numbers are giving Team Obama some serious heartburn.)

Since the unveiling of the "3am phone call" television ad, there hasn't been a news cycle or a storyline that hasn't been controlled by the Clinton campaign.

Whether it's downplaying Obama's momentum ahead of the March 4 contests, placing emphasis on the importance of the Pennsylvania primary, or shifting focus to the potential for re-votes in Michigan and Florida, the media narrative seems to be in Clinton’s favor.

This is a reality for a few reasons.

First, and most importantly, is the media's bias toward keeping the campaign going.

A boost from bias?

But it's more than that, it's also a bias rooted in history. Many a reporter believes that someone with the last name of "Clinton" should never be counted out. And that built-in bias is assisting the campaign, despite the Clintons history of antagonism with the press.

Longtime readers know that when I toss out the word "bias,” I never do so ideologically.

I believe most bias is based on experience or what I call the "been there, done that" disease. We're all prisoners of history and this Democratic nomination fight features two conflicting historical precedents.

The one that favors Obama throws back to the last two major Democratic nomination fights in '80 and '84. The candidate who was in Obama's position (Carter and Mondale, respectively) won, while the candidate in Clinton's position (Kennedy and Hart) lost.

Of course, that historical perspective is a bit warped since unlike this year, the establishment candidate stayed ahead in those two elections, while the outsider always trailed.

It's vice versa this year.

The second historical anecdote, which favors Clinton, is that last name of hers.

A Clinton always finds a way to survive, so goes the myth.

Bill Clinton has escaped political death more times than any politician in history. And profiles of Hillary Clinton are rarely written without the word "resilient" being featured prominently.

The irony to all of this, of course, is that while the mechanics of the Democratic nomination fight overwhelmingly favor Obama, the media is giving Clinton a huge lift. And this comes after a year of Clinton complaints that the media was doing them more harm than good.

Does Clinton have a path to the nomination? If this were a pure delegate fight, perhaps not and, frankly, I still have my doubts given what I think is a deeper superdelegate problem.

But anything is possible, and if Obama becomes unelectable for some reason over the next few months, Clinton will be there to pick up the pieces.

The trick for her is how to pick up those pieces without being the person to break Obama into pieces.

If her campaign goes completely "scorched Earth" in its efforts to make Obama appear unelectable, there may not be time to put the party back together for a run at John McCain.

The Rev. Wright stuff is the first major problem for Obama that the Clinton campaign smartly stayed away from.

It’s going to take another troublesome moment or two like this for Obama for the superdelegates to start re-thinking their nervousness about another eight years of a Clinton leading their party.

If this doesn’t happen organically, then it may not be a nomination worth having
.
 
McCain aide circulates Obama/Wright video, is suspended
An aide to John McCain was suspended from the campaign today for blasting out an inflammatory video that raises questions about Barack Obama's patriotism.

Soren Dayton, who works in McCain's political department, sent out the YouTube link of "Is Obama Wright?" on twitter at 12:31 today with the tag, "Good video on Obama and Wright." It has since been taken down.

Twitter is an online device that allows users to send out short messages and links en masse through computers or PDAs.

McCain and his campaign have repeatedly said that they would stay away from personal attacks on Obama, but the temptation has increased as Wright's words have dominated the race in recent days.

Last week, they included an op-ed that hammered Wright and Obama in their morning clip package emailed to reporters. The same day, a campaign aide they regretted doing so.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72B3tUAqpo4

Comments are batshit insane.
 
GhaleonEB said:
I don't recall saying that. I was talking about the way the media is largely ignoring the mathematical reality of the situation, while buying entirely into Clinton's narratives, even before Super Tuesday. (After a week of MSM coverage, I thought Clinton won that day. She didn't.)



You're right that they are vested in a close race, and I wasn't paying as close attention two months ago as I am now, so I can't say how they treated Obama. Still, it's been a Clinton-love fest as of late.
Air america (The most liberal station on the air waves) and comedy centrals shows is pro-obama. Point is, Even progressive radio stations and basic cable channels is pro obama. :/

I can't for the life of me pinpoint a pro clinton network at all. I would be happy if you point me in that direction since its more clear to you. I mean, SNL is the only thing i count as pro clinton.
 
Absinthe said:
What a colossal fuck up. As a white person, that definitely offends me.

Considering he's talking about his grandmother, I'm guessing he's talking about white people of that time. Which would for the most part be a valid statement to make.
 
topsyturvy said:
Air america (The most liberal station on the air waves) and comedy centrals shows is pro-obama. Point is, Even progressive radio stations and basic cable channels is pro obama. :/

I can't for the life of me pinpoint a pro clinton network at all. I would be happy if you point me in that direction since its more clear to you. I mean, SNL is the only thing i count as pro clinton.
I don't watch much TV, and don't have the cable networks. But going from the online coverage, and what I've seen/read, CNN is your station. MSNBC seems to be more favorable to Obama.
 
topsyturvy said:
Air america (The most liberal station on the air waves) and comedy centrals shows is pro-obama. Point is, Even progressive radio stations and basic cable channels is pro obama. :/

I can't for the life of me pinpoint a pro clinton network at all. I would be happy if you point me in that direction since its more clear to you. I mean, SNL is the only thing i count as pro clinton.

CNN outside of Jack Cafferty, Jamal Simmons, and Roland Martin is pretty Pro-Clinton.
 
GhaleonEB said:
I don't watch much TV, and don't have the networks. But going from the online coverage, and what I've seen/read, CNN is your station.
CNN is far and away the most moderate station there is. I have never viewed their coverage as biased.
 
Absinthe said:
What a colossal fuck up. As a white person, that definitely offends me.

As a Puertorican, I'm surprised he didn't just say "typical person". Hell, I've crossed many a street if I see a group of guys of any color walking towards me and it's late at night. I grew up poor though and crime was pretty much a common thing so you had to be wary in general.
 
GhaleonEB said:
You're right that they are vested in a close race, and I wasn't paying as close attention two months ago as I am now, so I can't say how they treated Obama. Still, it's been a Clinton-love fest as of late.

Do you remember when NH got called racist because polls before hand said Obama was going to win but then the results had Clinton? Yeah that was a major story that ran on every news station even though it was within the margin of error and that the undecideds moved towards Clinton in the last couple of hours. Olbermann who isn't even a fan of Clinton called the shit ridiculous and that the media was just trying to make shit out of it to get ratings.

CNN/Fox News also ran stories before NH saying that Clinton was going to fire her whole staff and bring in former Bill Clinton staffers even though the Bill Clinton staffers repeatedly denied it and requested the news station pull the stories. The news stations agreed and then hours lately ran the same story over and over.

And I can go on with stuff that the media did to Clinton to knock her down before Super Tuesday because they all thought Clinton was going to roll and they didn't want this contest to end early.

The media really doesn't give a shit who wins as long as they get ratings out of it. The worse thing for them is a quick primary election with zero controversy.
 
Obama's mistake was not saying "typical white person", it was assuming that people were coherent enough to understand. Unfortunately for him, they're not.
 
harSon said:
Considering he's talking about his grandmother, I'm guessing he's talking about white people of that time. Which would for the most part be a valid statement to make.

The thing is that he didn't specify. Not that I could tell at least. He said, "A typical white person," not "a typical white person from that time period". It's just a fuck up on his part. I'd say a pretty big one, too. That shit is a fuck up coming from any person, white or black.
 
Absinthe said:
The thing is that he didn't specify. Not that I could tell at least. He said, "A typical white person," not "a typical white person from that time period". It's just a fuck up on his part. I'd say a pretty big one, too. That shit is a fuck coming from any person, white or black.

He's obviously talking in terms of his grandmother's generation which would probably be anywhere from 1910-1930 judging from his age. I was able to pick that up, the fact that you couldn't is your problem and not Obamas.
 
harSon said:
He's obviously talking in terms of his grandmother's generation which would probably be anywhere from 1910-1930 judging from his age. I was able to pick that up, the fact that you couldn't is your problem and not Obamas.

He's a politician and he has to watch what he says. He did not make what he said clear. Others obviously feel the same way. If McCain said, "A typical black person..." comment and didn't specify what he was talking about then he would be receiving the same criticism. Don't make this about me when it's his fucking responsibility.
 
harSon said:
Considering he's talking about his grandmother, I'm guessing he's talking about white people of that time. Which would for the most part be a valid statement to make.

I think that is accurate.

anyhow, who here is man enough to go to the hood by themselves? live in the inner city.

eh? I'm sure most people stay the hell out.
 
Absinthe said:
He's a politician and he has to watch what he says. He did not make what he said clear. Others obviously feel the same way. If McCain said, "A typical black person..." comment and didn't specify what he was talking about then he would be receiving the same criticism. Don't make this about me when it's his fucking responsibility.

I agree, it's his job as a politician to baby the public due to their incompetence. I already said his mistake was not the comment itself but assuming that the American public was coherent enough to understand the statement in it's current context.

Edit: Is Hannity fucking defending Jerry Falwell?
 
harSon said:
I agree, it's his job as a politician to baby the public due to their incompetence. I already said his mistake was not the comment itself but assuming that the American public was coherent enough to understand the statement in it's current context.
This whole thing started because he pulled and forced race in this campaign with his pretty speech. :p

People bitched and complained about bill clinton saying "even jesse jackson won etc etc", and mccain calling his captures gooks. Lets not assume what he meant just because you magically get what he said. It totally sounded like it sounded.
 
Absinthe said:
What a colossal fuck up. As a white person, that definitely offends me.

Did you actually listen to it, or just read the headline from an ideological blog?

Actual quote, "she is a typical white person... if she sees somebody on the street, if she sees someone on the street she doesn't know, Theres a reaction that's been bred into our experiences that don't go away... Each generation feels a little less like that."

It totally sounded like it sounded.
Which isn't what the headline said.
 
ari said:
This whole thing started because he pulled and forced race in this campaign. People bitched and complained about bill clinton saying even "jesse jackson won etc etc", and mccain calling his captures gooks. Lets not assume what he meant just because you magically get what he said.

I'm not going to even bother arguing with someone who believes Obama forced race into this campaign. I'm not assuming what he meant, I know what he meant. As would any competent soul proficient in English.
 
ari said:
This whole thing started because he pulled and forced race in this campaign with his pretty speech. :p
Are you kidding me? Bill Clinton and Geralidne Ferraro were the ones who raised race and it was the media that made Wright an issue. Obama stayed out of the fray as long as he possibly could. And when he did comment he did it in a way that proves that he has by far the highest opinion of the intelligence of the American voter of any of the presidential candidates.
 
Black Guy Asks Nation for Change

Black-Guy-R.article.jpg

CHICAGO—According to witnesses, a loud black man approached a crowd of some 4,000 strangers in downtown Chicago Tuesday and made repeated demands for change.

"The time for change is now," said the black guy, yelling at everyone within earshot for 20 straight minutes, practically begging America for change. "The need for change is stronger and more urgent than ever before. And only you—the people standing here today, and indeed all the people of this great nation—only you can deliver this change."
 
jmdajr said:
anyhow, who here is man enough to go to the hood by themselves? live in the inner city.

eh? I'm sure most people stay the hell out.

Typically, most people would want nothing to do with the 'hood. Even the people that live there are trying to get the fuck out. Typically.


All this mess leads me to believe that McCain will be our next Prez. *sigh* Fuckin' typical.
 
harSon said:
I'm not assuming what he meant, I know what he meant. As would any competent soul proficient in English.

Really? You're not assuming? Let's not contradict ourselves, shall we?

Considering he's talking about his grandmother, I'm guessing he's talking about white people of that time. Which would for the most part be a valid statement to make.

People that know don't guess.
 
bob_arctor said:
All this mess leads me to believe that McCain will be our next Prez. *sigh* Fuckin' typical.

Well, yeah. The Dems are sharply divided between Hillary and Obama. Whichever one gets the nomination, the ugliness of the campaigns will cause the other's supporters to abstain in large numbers. The GOP's loving it. McCain in a landslide.

That said, McCain and Hillary are pretty similar in a lot of ways. I don't think there'd be much difference if either of them were elected, which pretty much means status quo. And that's a shame, because there's a lot that's broken in this country and I think that Obama has a better chance at doing something about that then Clinton or McCain.
 
Absinthe said:
Really? You're not assuming? Let's not contradict ourselves, shall we?



People that know don't guess.

The actual quote (Thanks electricpirate) is
"She is a typical white person... if she sees somebody on the street, if she sees someone on the street she doesn't know, Theres a reaction that's been bred into our experiences that don't go away... Each generation feels a little less like that."

The most important portion of the quote is his last line, "Each generation feels a little less like that." which obviously points to the fact that his previous statements were aimed towards the past, or more specifically, his grandmothers generation.
 
Absinthe said:
Really? You're not assuming? Let's not contradict ourselves, shall we?



People that know don't guess.

Wow you're taking this personally for some reason, like you're the only white person around here.:lol

I'm white and I'm not offended by it at all. It's the reality of it. If I'm walking around the slummy areas of Pittsburgh at night and I see a group of black people I tend to keep any eye of them more than a group of white guys. I'm not trying to be racist, but thats just the reality of it. I've gotten better at it recently, the more I do it, but it still happens.
 
Xeke said:
Wow you're taking this personally for some reason, like you're the only white person around here.:lol

I'm white and I'm not offended by it at all. It's the reality of it. If I'm walking around the slummy areas of Pittsburgh at night and I see a group of black people I tend to keep any eye of them more than a group of white guys. I'm not trying to be racist, but thats just the reality of it. I've gotten better at it recently, the more I do it, but it still happens.

It may be the reality of it, but if McCain or Hilary would have said the same thing then they would have been crucified.

It's like I said earlier. His preacher has placed him in a very, very shitty position and I don't see it getting any better. He's been placed under the microscope and he's going to receive scrutiny from here on out, thus Hilary is given a huge advantage.
 
SteveMeister said:
That said, McCain and Hillary are pretty similar in a lot of ways. I don't think there'd be much difference if either of them were elected, which pretty much means status quo.
I’m hardly a Clinton supporter, but that's just crazy talk.
 
Xeke said:
Wow you're taking this personally for some reason, like you're the only white person around here.:lol

I'm white and I'm not offended by it at all. It's the reality of it. If I'm walking around the slummy areas of Pittsburgh at night and I see a group of black people I tend to keep any eye of them more than a group of white guys. I'm not trying to be racist, but thats just the reality of it. I've gotten better at it recently, the more I do it, but it still happens.

You motherfucker, I lived in those slummy parts in Pittsburgh! In actuality, I don't blame you one bit. I lost several family members to that shit hole including my infant brother to a gang related drive by shooting.

Absinthe said:
It may be the reality of it, but if McCain or Hilary would have said the same thing then they would have been crucified.

It's like I said earlier. His preacher has placed him in a very, very shitty position and I don't see it getting any better. He's been placed under the microscope and he's going to receive scrutiny from here on out, thus Hilary is given a huge advantage.

How about responding to my post :)?
 
Absinthe said:
It may be the reality of it, but if McCain or Hilary would have said the same thing then they would have been crucified.

Isn't that the reality of it as well though? It's not Obama's fault he can speak more freely about race. Still, I'm sure he'll be crucified in the places that matter.
 
you know it all kind of sucks, but it's good in that we don't have to sweep these issues under the rug.

people are too afraid to talk about racism/prejudice these days when we know it still exists.
 
I really need to YouTube the speech. Everyone in the news has been heralding it, as well as everyone in my house.

I wish I could have seen it live.
 
I gotta say, if this comment sinks him then he deserves it. The Wright fall-out bothered me because he was being held responsible for things he never said. He should've known better here.
 
XxenobladerxX said:
Get the tampon out of your ass. You know damn well thats not what he meant..

He's overly sensitive, I noticed this during a discussion about Affirmative Action a few weeks back. Seems to be some deep rooted resentment or something :lol
 
Absinthe said:
It may be the reality of it, but if McCain or Hilary would have said the same thing then they would have been crucified.

It's like I said earlier. His preacher has placed him in a very, very shitty position and I don't see it getting any better. He's been placed under the microscope and he's going to receive scrutiny from here on out, thus Hilary is given a huge advantage.

Hillary can't win... PERIOD. Remember the math. There's no revotes in MI/FL and those delegates won't be seated as-is.

The only way she can win is by destroying the party and burning down Denver.
 
typhonsentra said:
I gotta say, if this comment sinks him then he deserves it. The Wright fall-out bothered me because he was being held responsible for things he never said. He should've known better here.

It was a damned stupid thing to say, and it's a perfect one liner to be played over and over and over and over and fuck.
 
typhonsentra said:
I gotta say, if this comment sinks him then he deserves it. The Wright fall-out bothered me because he was being held responsible for things he never said. He should've known better here.

I hope McCain conflating/confusing AQ and Shiite extremists on multiple occasions sinks his so I guess we've both got our dreams. I think you may have a better shot though.
 
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