Overwatch adds another LGBTQ Charcter.

Jul 23, 2018
158
116
160
Stating it as an inescapable escalation is very much equating it. Don’t try to be obtuse.

But I have to give it to you, you’re the first of all those dudes here stating they „don’t care at all“ being honest enough to openly state you oppose any Display of homosexuality in media.

Which,by the way, makes your first post in this thread rather disingenuous. As was expected.
Only when it is done for pushing an agenda, portraying being LGBT as something that makes a character great. As previously stated in this thread, I thought Philadelphia was a good movie. So I'm not against gays being in media. But they must have a purpose to improve the media itself, rather than catering to a loud minority.


And no I'm not equating pedophilia to being gay. If people want to be in a gay relationship, that's generally consensual and through free will. Pedophilia involves a child which is not yet capable of understanding the situation and is therefore a sexual victim. I do see and think that gayness being forced onto people through media has some parallels with pedophiles forcing their desires on children. The parallel is in the imposing & forcing. In Overwatch this isn't really the case apparently, since it's a separate backstory outside of the game itself. But this thread does give a certain impression...


Maybe my first post seems disingenuous, but it really wasn't. I asked why it's important to portray who is LGBT and who isn't... In other words, why are we focusing on sexuality yet again? If NONE of the characters had their sexuality mentioned, would that be a problem? Why must we specifically mention who is LGBT? Why are we pandering again?
 
May 16, 2005
1,194
221
1,145
germany
Maybe my first post seems disingenuous, but it really wasn't. I asked why it's important to portray who is LGBT and who isn't... In other words, why are we focusing on sexuality yet again? If NONE of the characters had their sexuality mentioned, would that be a problem? Why must we specifically mention who is LGBT? Why are we pandering again?

Well, for this question, you could just read the comic, then you have the context. For the rest of your post, I‘m really sorry, but I find your constant comparing and equating of homosexuality to pedophilia disgusting and in bad taste. Also, sorry, but stating you don’t equate those two and in the next sentence doing just that is quite... I don’t know. I‘m out of this discussion, this is just disgusting. You obviously just want to push your agenda.
 
Last edited:
Likes: mckmas8808
May 24, 2005
39,013
1,965
1,320
Personally not at all. I have never played a video game and thought or cared about what race or sexuality a character is. People that worry about these things generally aren’t gamers, but people looking to make a talking point for their agenda IMO.
I LOVED it when CJ from GTA: San Andres was black. Especially considering he was from "Los Santos" (L.A.) and the game was based in the early 90s. That mattered to me in a big way and it was awesome! Many of my friends also could attest to this.
 

ayumarcan

Neo Member
Dec 19, 2018
36
10
90
Duh, it's done so that the game sells well. There are only two lgbtq chars in the game and they're not even the "key" ones, so we can chill. Nothing major, it's only done so that Blizzard can get more cash.
 

Apexhell

Gold Member
Jan 17, 2013
4,535
59
550
Unfortunately, this isnt true. While the character is fun to play he's borderline useless in the current meta. His utility is practically zero with Hanzo, Ashe, and Mcree where they are right now.

It's a shame too bc he used to be really fun.
oh I only play casual overwatch never really got into comp thats a shame.
 
Nov 3, 2013
3,344
905
415
32
Can you provide an example of non-hetero representation in a game that that you didn’t feel was “forced?”
Bill from The Last of Us. Was PERFECT. So natural, so beliveable, so real. But nowadays LGFTIHIGHJAD+ only consider "representation" if that character goes all out "LOOK I'M GAY!!!" like in bioware games or in this case Blizzard with their "LOOK HOW COOL WE ARE WE MADE SOLDIER 76 GAY OUT OF NOWHERE!!!!".


Also you can't tell the sexuallity of most characters you see in a videogame. Who knows if Master Chief is gay? Or Cole Train from Gears of War. Or Sully from Uncharted. Shit even one of Link's iterations could be gay as fuck and you don't know it because he doesn't say shit about anything.
 
Nov 5, 2016
3,462
2,225
270
I don't care where (just far)
Theres too many barriers, armor, and shields in the game hampering his effectiveness too outside of his general lack of sufficient dps to compete with the aforementioned characters.
Yeah, I can’t argue. I still like playing him time to time but I’m only high plat/low diamond so it’s not like I’m in high level matches.

I am curious to see if they tweak him anytime soon.
 
Sep 17, 2005
2,329
194
1,175
I LOVED it when CJ from GTA: San Andres was black. Especially considering he was from "Los Santos" (L.A.) and the game was based in the early 90s. That mattered to me in a big way and it was awesome! Many of my friends also could attest to this.
That’s awesome, and I’m glad that it affected you in that way. Would you have not played it if you played as a Hispanic man, or a white dude?
 

strange headache

Fluctuat nec mergitur
Jan 14, 2018
1,136
4,300
465
I do see and think that gayness being forced onto people through media has some parallels with pedophiles forcing their desires on children. The parallel is in the imposing & forcing.
My god man, stop being so overly dramatic. Confronting people with gay characters is not any different than confronting them with straight characters. Your false equivalence and scaremongering aren't doing you any favors.
 
Jul 23, 2018
158
116
160
My god man, stop being so overly dramatic. Confronting people with gay characters is not any different than confronting them with straight characters. Your false equivalence and scaremongering aren't doing you any favors.
Actually, it is. I already explained this, but to repeat... Sexuality is the biological drive for reproduction. That means that the default is heterosexuality, biologically, because that is the only way for reproduction to truly work, which in turn develops into heterosexuality being the default culturally. That means that showing heterosexual behavior is seen as normal (within certain limits, obviously), and other forms will be frowned upon, justifiably so. Showing two heterosexual people kissing will not be seen as weird and is therefore not 'confronting', but all the others are, because they are not the biological and cultural standard.

Whatever everyone does with their sex life is their business, as long as they don't force it upon someone else. And the latter part is the most important part. Do you really think it is overly dramatic to complain about children being fed a bunch of sexual perspectives when that is not even relevant for their lives yet? It can mainly damage them. So speaking out about this is not being overly dramatic. It is being responsible.
 

Holgren

Neo Member
Dec 27, 2018
22
17
85
What I'm saying is in a game like this, why does it matter what their orientation is? What difference does it make if the character is straight or not? What does it add to the game? Their look? Does a gay person look gay? Do they have a different, specific look? And even if they do, what difference does it make to a game like overwatch? Do they shoot faster? Are they extra emotional and rage quick? I don't get it.
It adds and matters nothing, and that is exactly the message and the importance of creating this kind of lore into the game. It is a way of normalizing and integrating homosexuals without making any kind of stereotype or attitudes, or major fuzz (Blizzard is not making the fuzz here, you guys are). It goes to show how gay people are perfectly normal and can blend without much fuzz in a context (Here being the OW world).

Of course this for me, you and many other people doesn't make any sense and couldn't care less about it, since the game doesn't even push a story in its gameplay. But kids do, they love to investigate more about the game they love and this is what they will found out. And it's great! Whenever they hear anything gay-related, they can think about Soldier 76 and how he is and acts as a "normal" (as the social norm imposes) man.

This kind of news provokes no impact to us since we are adults, we know that gay people don't have specific manners of acting or representing themselves, but kids are just discovering this, and any kind of positive representation like this one plays a part. I mean fuck, OW being a shooty-shooty bang bang game just adds much more to the impact of it.

If anything I think this news is coming just way too late, it should have been done when it was in its prime.
 

Arkage

Gold Member
Sep 25, 2012
2,105
807
540
I do see and think that gayness being forced onto people through media has some parallels with pedophiles forcing their desires on children. The parallel is in the imposing & forcing.
So using your logic, everytime a man and women start kissing in media, it's "forced and imposed" upon the gay population. In other words gay people are forced and imposed upon exponentially more often than straight people ever are, as there is exponentially more heterosexual content than homosexual content in media.

Also, fucking lol at this insane viewpoint in general.
 
Last edited:
Likes: mckmas8808
Jul 23, 2018
158
116
160
Well, for this question, you could just read the comic, then you have the context. For the rest of your post, I‘m really sorry, but I find your constant comparing and equating of homosexuality to pedophilia disgusting and in bad taste. Also, sorry, but stating you don’t equate those two and in the next sentence doing just that is quite... I don’t know. I‘m out of this discussion, this is just disgusting. You obviously just want to push your agenda.
I'm not interested enough to read the comic. But I am interested enough to say that it is not ok to spread weird sexualities as if they are equally valuable and important to society. They aren't. But since this isn't specifically in your face in the game, it's whatever. But the people here praising it as some sort of gift from the heavens, sorry, I have a problem with that.
That being said. Deliberately hurting people for their sexuality is wrong, and I will never condone that. I have explained clearly the difference between being gay and forcing things upon others. That you don't like the correlation, well, I'm sorry. But it's the reality of the situation. And I'm still not equating anything. If I say that anger can cause people to both murder someone or punch someone, that doesn't mean I'm equating punching someone to murdering someone. That's absurd. I'm saying that the source of the action is the same. I have clearly stated that the imposing is the problem for both the LGBT community and now the pedophile community. But I'm not going to repeat myself. The ones that are willing to understand, will.


Let me put it this way... With a thought experiment. If every media out there was shoehorning flat earthers in their products, be it movies, music, tv series or games, and it is completely irrelevant to the product itself, but they put it in because they want to make flat earthers happy, because flat earthers feel so unaccepted and out of place in the world, would you have a problem with it?


So using your logic, everytime a man and women start kissing in media, it's "forced and imposed" upon the gay population. In other words gay people are forced and imposed upon exponentially more often than straight people ever are, as there is exponentially more heterosexual content than homosexual content in media.

Also, fucking lol at this insane viewpoint in general.
Here is your answer:

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/overwatch-adds-another-lgbtq-charcter.1470731/post-253700927
 

strange headache

Fluctuat nec mergitur
Jan 14, 2018
1,136
4,300
465
Actually, it is. I already explained this, but to repeat... Sexuality is the biological drive for reproduction. That means that the default is heterosexuality, biologically, because that is the only way for reproduction to truly work, which in turn develops into heterosexuality being the default culturally.
That is literally the dumbest thing I've read all week. First of all, sexuality doesn't only have a reproductive function, it also has a social one. Which is the reason why many mammals often engage in sexual acts without the need to reproduce. It strengthens relationships and interpersonal bonds. Bonobos for example use sex as a means to strengthen social cohesion and to deescalate conflicts.

Second of all, there are many cases of gay behavior which can be observed in the animal kingdom. So to say that homosexuality is biologically unnatural is not only wrong but is borderline intolerant. I'd expect the "sex is for reproduction" argument from religious fundamentalists, but not open-minded and educated gamers.

And the latter part is the most important part. Do you really think it is overly dramatic to complain about children being fed a bunch of sexual perspectives when that is not even relevant for their lives yet?
There's nothing wrong with confronting children with homosexuality, just as there's nothing wrong with confronting them with heterosexuality. Overwatch is a PEGI 12 game, by that age most children already had some form of sexual education, so there's absolutely nothing wrong with confronting children with the realities of human sexuality. Homosexual people exist you know. Nobody is "forcing gayness upon our children" as Overwatch is not advocating for people to turn gay. Your sexual preferences are something you are born with, it's not something that's so easily influenced by the media we consume.

Get that sh*t outta here!
 

Makariel

Gold Member
Jan 14, 2018
1,117
820
345
Does the charcter HAVE to look like you.
No.
Does the charcter HAVE to have the same sexual preferences.
No. In most games it doesn't even matter, since the characters don't have sex. And if they have I want to have the option to wear scuba gear.
Does the charcter HAVE to have the same personality style.
No. Otherwise I couldn't have finished 99% of shooters I've played.
Do you even need to relate to the charcter?
Only in RPG, and then I usually play a character with different gender, race, sexual orientation, etc. anyway.
Does any of this matter to you guys or do you just play and not think about it.
Doesn't really matter.
 
May 11, 2011
5,524
238
525
Australia
Its Overwatch, so of course Im not surprized that the devs made Soldier gay, but I am disappointed.
My ideal male characters are straight, white tough guys because thats what I am (except for the tough part) and I like having stuff in common with them.
 

Holgren

Neo Member
Dec 27, 2018
22
17
85
Its Overwatch, so of course Im not surprized that the devs made Soldier gay, but I am disappointed.
My ideal male characters are straight, white tough guys because thats what I am (except for the tough part) and I like having stuff in common with them.
You have literally a thousand games that represent you. How many white gay tough guys are represented in games? Name me five
 
Likes: JareBear
Oct 24, 2017
5,706
4,409
335
I LOVED it when CJ from GTA: San Andres was black. Especially considering he was from "Los Santos" (L.A.) and the game was based in the early 90s. That mattered to me in a big way and it was awesome! Many of my friends also could attest to this.
So you only cared about his skincolor and not how he and everyone else was basically a bad stereotype all the way regarding being a gangster and "gangbanger"? Pesonally I thought CJ was the worst GTA character not because he was black but because of the constant swearing. I do not mind swearing normally but man there was not one sentence in which he did not swear. Also I was really turned of by this gangster accent, To me CJ was even worse than Nico and I di not like him very much either
 
May 24, 2005
39,013
1,965
1,320
That’s awesome, and I’m glad that it affected you in that way. Would you have not played it if you played as a Hispanic man, or a white dude?
Most certainly would have played it, but it wouldn't have been the same level of awesomeness.

So you only cared about his skincolor and not how he and everyone else was basically a bad stereotype all the way regarding being a gangster and "gangbanger"? Pesonally I thought CJ was the worst GTA character not because he was black but because of the constant swearing. I do not mind swearing normally but man there was not one sentence in which he did not swear. Also I was really turned of by this gangster accent, To me CJ was even worse than Nico and I di not like him very much either
I mean it's not like there aren't actual gangsters and gangbangers in L.A. lol. CJ was literally voiced by a guy that's literally from that part of L.A. It's the most LITERAL way to showcase how people from Los Angeles or Los Santos actually sound. Like there is no GTA character that was more accurately voiced than CJ in GTA: San Andreas.

This is an interview the voice actor did (remember he is an actual rapper)
 
Last edited:
Jul 23, 2018
158
116
160
That is literally the dumbest thing I've read all week. First of all, sexuality doesn't only have a reproductive function, it also has a social one.
Whatever other function it might have, it is primarily a reproductive function, whether you like it or not.

Which is the reason why many mammals often engage in sexual acts without the need to reproduce. It strengthens relationships and interpersonal bonds. Bonobos for example use sex as a means to strengthen social cohesion and to deescalate conflicts.
Without the need to reproduce? What kind of vague statement is that? Sexual desire is for reproduction. For what other reason does a male get hard and a woman get wet when sexually aroused? Right. So they engage in an action that has a high potential for an offspring. Yes. There is such a thing as make up sex. But so what? It's still sex that can result in an offspring. The reason for the engagement is irrelevant. They can be argued to be biological tricks to increase the chance for reproduction.
That a dog also uses his piss to mark his territory, doesn't change the fact that the main reason for pissing is removal of toxins from the body.


Second of all, there are many cases of gay behavior which can be observed in the animal kingdom.
I never said there aren't.

So to say that homosexuality is biologically unnatural is not only wrong but is borderline intolerant.
I never said homosexuality is biologically unnatural. I said it is ineffective for reproduction. So technically, if there is such a thing as gay genes, they are biologically destined to not reproduce. You cannot deny that fact.

I'd expect the "sex is for reproduction" argument from religious fundamentalists, but not open-minded and educated gamers.
And I'd expect educated individuals to be able to read things objectively rather than creating strawman reactions based on emotional outrage.


There's nothing wrong with confronting children with homosexuality, just as there's nothing wrong with confronting them with heterosexuality.
... No comment.


Overwatch is a PEGI 12 game, by that age most children already had some form of sexual education,
Because that sexual education definitely enlightened them completely about who they are and what they want and need in their sexual lives...

so there's absolutely nothing wrong with confronting children with the realities of human sexuality. Homosexual people exist you know.
There's a difference between education and brainwashing.

Nobody is "forcing gayness upon our children" as Overwatch is not advocating for people to turn gay.
Aren't they? If every game put a flat earther in there and pretended they were oh so great characters/people, would you argue that they are not advocating to turn people into flat earthers?

Your sexual preferences are something you are born with, it's not something that's so easily influenced by the media we consume.
Really? Even adults have fallen for nonsense like feminism and the LGBT movement. And then there's extremes like this;
https://www.ntd.com/mother-forces-s...ights-at-risk-for-offering-choice_262028.html

Tell me that the mother was not influenced by media, and is negatively impacting the child. I dare you.

Get that sh*t outta here!
Right back at ya.
 

Arkage

Gold Member
Sep 25, 2012
2,105
807
540
No this isn't an answer. It's incredibly easy for me to make the argument, using your batshit logic, that children who will grow up to be gay are harmed by the constant imposition and forcing of heterosexual norms upon their life through media to a much greater extent than children who grow up to be heterosexual witnessing homosexual norms. It's a fact of the numbers.

You also claim homosexuality is "justifiably" frowned upon because it doesn't produce offspring. What the fuck does this even mean? That people who don't reproduce are unethical? How about we frown upon single people? Or people who use birth control? Or people who get married but don't have kids? Oh, probably because you'd have to be monumentally judgmental to feel justified in shunning people for their reproductive or sexual choices. You can't both say that sexuality is "their business" and then condemn gay sexuality. Sorry, but you're much less moderate than you're attempting to appear.

Additionally, your understanding of what "forcing" means is incredibly loose. A child seeing two people kiss in public, regardless of their future sexuality or of the gender of those kissing, is "forcing" sexual perspectives that are not relevant to a child's current life. If you were consistently against all forms of public affection to Save The Children then at least you would be rationally applying a moral code, even if it's an absurd one.
 
Last edited:
Jun 13, 2007
7,047
70
995
I don't know if it's only me but I don't care who or what I play as. Be it a white or black dude or women, straight or gay. I just want good game play and a good story.
 
Apr 24, 2011
1,580
243
495
Houston, Texas
I don't know if it's only me but I don't care who or what I play as. Be it a white or black dude or women, straight or gay. I just want good game play and a good story.
I don't either. I dont understand needing someone to share some superficial trait with me for me to be able to relate to, feel sympathy for, or be interested in them as a person or a character. We're all human.

I never once felt better about myself or more comfortable playing as a character because they were black. I don't need them to be the same race as me for me to be hooked or more engaged.
 

strange headache

Fluctuat nec mergitur
Jan 14, 2018
1,136
4,300
465
And I'd expect educated individuals to be able to read things objectively rather than creating strawman reactions based on emotional outrage.
Hey, you're the one triggered by an Overwatch character being gay, fearmongering that the mere representation of a homosexual character might "brainwash" our children into, well what exactly? Becoming homosexual? Listen to yourself.

Because that sexual education definitely enlightened them completely about who they are and what they want and need in their sexual lives...
Sexual education doesn't make value statements, it merely describes the nature of human sexuality of which homsexuality is a part of. Like it or not. Homsexuality might not be the "norm" but it's is normal biological behavior and there's really nothing wrong with it. Besides, what's wrong with media depicting something that doesn't adhere to the "cultural norm", it would make our entertainment rather boring if such were the case. So your whole argument about heterosexuality being the "cultural norm" doesn't even make much sense in the context of this discussion.

There's a difference between education and brainwashing.
You know, if you go back to my first statement in this topic, I was mostly indifferent to this whole controversy and dismissed it as silly pandering in the context of an arena shooter. Your comments make me seriously reconsider my original stance, maybe the Overwatch developers are doing us a favor by normalizing acceptance towards homosexual people. Seems to me I was wrong in assuming such tolerance was a given in the gaming community.

Aren't they? If every game put a flat earther in there and pretended they were oh so great characters/people, would you argue that they are not advocating to turn people into flat earthers?
False equivalence, your sexual orientation is an immutable characteristic, your convictions no matter how misguided are not. Many adopted children grow up with gay parents, that doesn't mean they become gay themselves.

Tell me that the mother was not influenced by media, and is negatively impacting the child. I dare you.
You are generalizing based on an inductive fallacy, please provide evidence that such isolated extreme cases have become the norm. At best this is the misguided attempt of a crazy mother trying to push her world-view upon her children. We all know this will end badly, but such bad parenting is hardly newsworthy and also happens with many other things. For example, should we outlaw religious depictions in media too because certain parents force their religious beliefs upon their children?

This is an odd statement
Oh look it's our resident flat-earther and devout believer who thinks that education is an illusion. I'm not the least bit surprised that you like what Ascend has to offer, merely confirming what I've just said. Or do you deny the fact that religious fundamentalists view sex as a mere act of reproduction, hence why they consider masturbation, fornication, artificial contraception and homosexuality a sin?
 
Last edited:
Jul 23, 2018
158
116
160
No this isn't an answer. It's incredibly easy for me to make the argument, using your batshit logic, that children who will grow up to be gay are harmed by the constant imposition and forcing of homosexual norms upon their life through media to a much greater extent than children who grow up to be heterosexual. It's a fact of the numbers.
Ok?

You also claim homosexuality is "justifiably" frowned upon because it doesn't produce offspring.
Here we go again with misrepresenting the argument.

What the fuck does this even mean? That people who don't reproduce are unethical?
I never said that.

How about we frown upon single people?
For what?


Or people who use birth control?
For what?

Or people who get married but don't have kids?
For what?

Oh, probably because you'd have to be monumentally judgmental to feel justified in shunning people for their reproductive or sexual choices.
Ok... So... Which is it? Are there children that grow up to be gay, or is it a sexual choice?

You can't both say that sexuality is "their business" and then condemn gay sexuality. Sorry, but you're much less moderate than you're attempting to appear.
I've explained this multiple times. I have no problem with gay people living their lives as gay people. I have a problem with idealizing and idolizing that way of life. It's really simple.

Additionally, your understanding of what "forcing" means is incredibly loose. A child seeing two people kiss in public, regardless of their future sexuality or of the gender of those kissing, is "forcing" sexual perspectives that are not relevant to a child's current life. If you were consistently against all forms of public affection to Save The Children then at least you would be rationally applying a moral code, even if it's an absurd one.
In an ideal world, that would indeed be the case, where we limit certain interactions in front of children. Children basically copy everything. We do not live in that perfect world where we can protect children from everything, but, that does not somehow justify adding more to it.
 
Jan 31, 2018
1,410
353
250
It’s a strange hypocracy to be for children being exposed to things of a certain nature ok yet in countries where younger people are given in marriage it’s considered backward and barbaric.

Oh look it's our resident flat-earther and devout believer who thinks that education is an illusion. I'm not the least bit surprised that you like what Ascend has to offer, merely confirming what I've just said. Or do you deny the fact that religious fundamentalists view sex as a mere act of reproduction, hence why they consider masturbation, fornication, artificial contraception and homosexuality a sin?
When we participate in any of those we’re squandering gifts given to us that have the ability to produce life so yes. I’m just as guilty as anyone else for some of those things listed but the repentance comes from turning away from those kinds of things. The world teaches us they’re ok. It’s not. What good comes out of masturbation, fornication, artificial contraception or homosexuality? Give me one good thing that isn’t rooted in self gratification or selfishness.
 
Last edited:
Likes: Ascend
May 2, 2006
9,174
467
1,065
In my own world.
m.youtube.com
I don’t really care about representation in games and it is not something I think about. I just like playing games that are fun. I will play as any character as long as it is a good game.
This is exactly how I feel. For me, it isn’t like representation is going to make the game any better for me. All I care about is if the gsme is fun.
 
Last edited: