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Overwatch's Laughably Convenient Ageism / Sexism
- Thread starter mindsale
- Start date
The only ones I can think of are a couple of "wise old woman" NPCs in Diablo II, which is hard to count because the sprites of NPCs tended to obscure details.
SwaggerMcDagger
Banned
It feels like blizzard deliberately chose not to show age in a significant manner, regardless of gender. Most characters exhibit very little signs of aging and those who do generally have a mask to cover it up.
If I recall correctly, the only vanilla skin'd character that shows age is the balding soldier76?
If I recall correctly, the only vanilla skin'd character that shows age is the balding soldier76?
John Rabbit
Banned
hadn't really gotten into the deeper lore of Overwatch so the examples in the OP regarding and Tracer and Mei are new to me; and absolutely ludicrous.
both 76 and Reinhardt have voice clips and/or animations that directly call their age into focus, i don't think they're necessarily hiding it.
You know, I hope so too, but, if Sombra does have an unmasked alt, I'd put my money on it being a "past" Sombra, or Sombra as she was when she was "alive" and young. Reaper's unmasked alt(Blackwatch Reyes) is a younger, non-"dead" version of him as well. In Reaper's default, if you look closely, his arm is considerably lighter now. Not sure exactly what that means but there certainly seems to be a physical change when he became Reaper. Only 76 has a non-young unmasked alt, but he's not supposed to be dead. Edit: Oh and Reinhardt too.
I would like to be wrong but an older, unmasked Sombra...don't see that happening =/
capylikesgames
Banned
Good thread. Tracer and Mei's backstory in particular are just waaay too convenient. And obviously, this isn't just a Blizzard thing; it happens in many other games. However, it seems like Blizzard is pretty open to criticism. As long as we keep the discussion active, I'm sure they'll catch wind of it eventually.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Yeah this is one of those things that can only be helped by more dialogue. Overwatch gets deserved credit for having women (and men) of various body types, which is something the industry has needed to get right for ages now, but the specific phenomenon the OP is describing is similar to a problem other hero based games like LoL and Dota often have where the male characters can run the full spectrum from "grizzled giant red axe man" to "rhinotaur" while the female characters are...mostly conventionally attractive and/or young? Its another permutation on the Naga Siren/Slardar problem
(these are supposedly from the same "race")
(these are supposedly from the same "race")
Oh ok, if it's more of a lore thing, then yea.
I disagree. I believe it's a natural result of human biology, being that women of a certain age range are the most fertile. Therefore men find those women most attractive. The same doesn't hold true in reverse, so it's not a concern for women.
Things that are instinctive aren't sexist or ageist. They are natural. You won't educate people out of finding young, fertile women more beautiful than older ones. This is where I tend to depart with liberal thinking, I suppose.
Do people feel Mercy doesn't actually look like she's 37? Please note again that I agree that the lack of 45+ year old women in problematic.
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She actually came in later actually. One of the stories was condensing 25 year time period without making it clear that it was and it confused quite a few people.
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She actually came in later actually. One of the stories was condensing 25 year time period without making it clear that it was and it confused quite a few people.
Scrub Mcgrubb
Member
The character designer of the game is Arnold Tsang of Udon... so the Capcom fighting game influences are pretty obvious.
Anyway the first post launch character is Sombra- who I believe is Pharah's mother... so this whole topic was kind of over before it even started.... She's a cyborg like Genji, but under the mask the character is technically an "old lady".
NoblesseOblige
Banned
Well you're free to use "prejudice towards age" or "age discrimination" however ageism is a much more convenient thing to say or type while getting across the same idea.
No I would have never guessed 37 from that or any images I've seen of her. Not saying 37 can't look like that, just that I wouldn't have assumed 35+.
Besides the dwarf, I never really thought about the ages in Overwatch, probably because until I read the OP, I had no idea about the story. There really hasn't been a game like Overwatch that I've enjoyed so much but also had zero interest completely in the story. Everyone just kinda looks like the same age.
With that said, good op. Pretty interesting info.
With that said, good op. Pretty interesting info.
Never even thought about this, but I'm sure it's the case. Anyone who plays League here who can confirm? When I stopped playing, the roster was pretty much exclusively younger women, as far as I can recall.
Although it's weird that there's no major black characters in Fury Road, the movie is set in Australia, which has a very small black population, so it's not too illogical. Don't know if there were any black people (or any non-white people in general) in the crowds.
As for an older female character that would be awesome, you could base someone off Helen Mira, Gillian Anderson, or Sigourney Weaver. All would be great templates for an older, hardened/wisened woman but would still check off their 'No Uglies' box.
Scrub Mcgrubb
Member
she's an Esports athlete... a pro Starcraft player to be exact.
She has an idealized young woman's body and no visible wrinkles or other age signifiers. She could plausibly be 37 but she never struck me as being as old as that. I would have assumed 30 or under like all the other "sexy" girls in the game
Garrett Hawke
Member
Just like how men need multiple partners, right?
How do gay people and lesbians fit in to your theory?
I talked a bit about it in another topic about Feminist Frequency some weeks ago:
I mean, we can have badass old men, but there aren't many badass old women in video games in general (fighting games are a good example). Even in LoL, which is a game that has many, many characters, there isn't any old woman.
So yeah, we need it.
I mean, we can have badass old men, but there aren't many badass old women in video games in general (fighting games are a good example). Even in LoL, which is a game that has many, many characters, there isn't any old woman.
So yeah, we need it.
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
Mei is 31?!
DannyDanger
Member
wow, you're right
Well, "impossibly" is exaggerating it. People on TV tend to be much more attractive than the average person you run into on the street, and the characters in Overwatch similarly so.
It's not a stretch to see attractive real people do great cosplays of those characters, but obviously the average person does not have the looks or the physique to pull it off.
I think the issue is that she's the one character who could look older...but of course doesn't.
It is certainly a bit jarring in comparison to the men. Hopefully Sombra has a maskless alt that doesn't de-age her.
She also has that emote where she checks her pulse and there's nothing there. There's definitely more to Mercy than meets the eye.
It comes from the official website, animated shorts, comics, and dialogue in game.
She also has that emote where she checks her pulse and there's nothing there. There's definitely more to Mercy than meets the eye.
It comes from the official website, animated shorts, comics, and dialogue in game.
slightconfuse
Banned
is all this lore in the game? blizzard needs to add some single player content a la hearthstone
Intheflorsh
Banned
It's a serious problem, especially in the workplace. Older workers have very weak protection under the law and can often be bullied out of holding a job and end up with no recourse. The EEOC knows that it is extremely hard to win an age discrimination case and barely tries. It's a very sad situation. Kind of OT, but yeah, ageism is a real thing.
Is she modeled after Tossgirl? Cuz I see it.
GinoFelino
Member
Good point, OP.
I think you're going to hit a nerve with many folks here, but your point is legit. It's one of those things you barely even notice anymore because it's so normal for older women to be wholly ignored in gaming/media.
I doubt Blizzard is even aware of it. They'll be the first to respond to the sentiment by designing a kick-ass mature female character, I bet.
Just goes to show we've got a long way to go, still.
I think you're going to hit a nerve with many folks here, but your point is legit. It's one of those things you barely even notice anymore because it's so normal for older women to be wholly ignored in gaming/media.
I doubt Blizzard is even aware of it. They'll be the first to respond to the sentiment by designing a kick-ass mature female character, I bet.
Just goes to show we've got a long way to go, still.
Can we just stop all of this pointing fingers garbage. We're guys and we notoriously like younger women. Why? Because biologically they produce better (or in some cases more frequent) quality off-spring.
Its not sexist its natural science, asking them to stop is asking all men to apologize for being men. Yes, guys can be sexist pigs but that's more of a personal choice not a biological pre-determined decision.
If you want your game to sell you have two choices.
Make a game with an amazing story and fluid mechanics (that make sense) -> Undertale
or
Make a game with a shitty story and "beautiful" women -> DOA: Extreme Volleyball
They both sell and that's the point, don't like it don't buy it.
Its not sexist its natural science, asking them to stop is asking all men to apologize for being men. Yes, guys can be sexist pigs but that's more of a personal choice not a biological pre-determined decision.
If you want your game to sell you have two choices.
Make a game with an amazing story and fluid mechanics (that make sense) -> Undertale
or
Make a game with a shitty story and "beautiful" women -> DOA: Extreme Volleyball
They both sell and that's the point, don't like it don't buy it.
She looks like she is in her 30's imo. People in their 30's typically do not look like they are 50 years old.
Interfectum
Member
Stopped a while ago too but yeah the roster was full of body and age diversity with males, but nothing of that with females. Lissandra might be a exception though it doesn't really fits right either.
Already Torn
Banned
It makes sense to me, nobody wants to play as an old person.