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[Pristine_Condition]

This is a new article that I thought deserved a new thread. I'd highly recommend yesterday morning's GAF thread by Mr. Luchador as a supplement to this one. It's pretty important, even if you never spend a dime, because 2K has basically now retroactively instituted a number of hoops in the form of online checks to implement this VC scheme that the gamer now has to jump through (and/or wait to be completed) to get to the game.

2K Sports seems to have escaped the kind of backlash Forza got by patching in the worst of their money-grab "features" after release, but the anger is building. In some ways, what 2K is attempting to do here may be, in fact, more insidious than Forza's blunt-force "just give us your moniez!" approach.

Some excerpts:

It’s somewhat startling to look back just a few weeks and see evaluations of NBA 2K14 that did not mention alarming tactics instituted by 2K Sports that would greatly affect consumers. The game for all intents and purposes requires an online connection and VC has been baked into almost every mode in a way that detracts from the enjoyment of the product. Of course reviews also didn’t bother to check how worthless the Online Leagues were and whether online even ran properly, and they wouldn’t have caught a roster that went nearly two months without an update and crashing problems that began occurring for many a week or two later.

The way VC has been implemented has brought about the most outrage and those feelings are justified. 2K14 is a full retail $60 purchase that is designed in a manner to push consumers to spend additional money on it. In many cases it is not optional, forces gamers to decide on a single mode to fully invest in rather than being able to play in the fashion they so choose, and ultimately appears to determine where 2K directs their development resources.

...

Design decisions have clearly been influenced by the presence of VC. Needing to constantly contact the 2K servers, to the extent that many of the features of the game can’t be played offline, is because of VC. Features like Online Leagues take a back seat because the company hasn’t figured out how best to monetize it or didn’t have time to implement VC in the fashion they would like just yet.

Forza 5 recently faced blowback on its microtransaction model, which was anything but “micro” considering one of the cars cost over $100 to purchase, and Turn 10 announced changes to the game’s economy would be made. 2K14 has not gotten the same level of publicity but discontent has begun to spread. Over on Reddit there is a huge discussion taking place about VC. Then there are even articles like this one from Cinema Blend that illustrate how reviewers either didn’t care about how VC is being put into use (which is distressing) or simply didn’t recognize what it meant for consumers (and that may be even worse).

http://www.pastapadre.com/2013/12/10/vc-implementation-threatens-the-future-of-the-nba-2k-series

 

[pastapadre]

The number of emails and tweets I have received about this, and the discussion threads in various places, is really significant. Just hasn't gained traction with the major media sites for whatever reason. Honestly I'm not sure if the reviewers or columnists at those publications - who usually aren't really fans of the genre or sometimes even sports in general - have been able to recognize what this VC system means to consumers.

 

[turnbuckle]

almost bought this game and then I saw a thread here yesterday talking about this. despicable behavior by 2K. I am basically afraid to pre-order any games anymore and would rather let a couple weeks go by to see what other people are experiencing. can't trust reviews, can't trust developers.

if Sony stretches too far on their micro transactions in the next version of mlb the show... I'll wonder what the point of having my ps4 is. hope there's enough backlash to dissuade developers from repeating this behavior but everyone thinks it's too late.

I hate this hobby right now

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Okay, I've played NBA2K14 for less than an hour total so I'm not really clear on how VC is integrated into this game. Article is vague on specifics in this regard. Are there cliff notes available somewhere?

this:

"In many cases it is not optional, forces gamers to decide on a single mode to fully invest in rather than being able to play in the fashion they so choose."

Seems particularly concerning, but I have no context to put that sentence in.

 

[backbreaker65]

Between Virtual Currency and needing an exterminator to fumigate this game the old fashion way of all its pests and there are many. I think Virtual Currency is well below post launch support. They through this game in the wild and didn't look back.

 

[pastapadre]

Okay, I've played NBA2K14 for less than an hour total so I'm not really clear on how VC is integrated into this game. Article is vague on specifics in this regard. Are there cliff notes available somewhere?

this:

"In many cases it is not optional, forces gamers to decide on a single mode to fully invest in rather than being able to play in the fashion they so choose."

Seems particularly concerning, but I have no context to put that sentence in.

VC is all pooled together regardless of mode. So if you spend VC in MyCareer, you'll be less able to proceed successfully in MyGM or MyTeam. In MyGM there are things you are essentially required to purchase. Meaning your pool of VC dwindles and you will have less to spend in another mode. Dilemmas will arise eventually.

If you stick to one single mode, and play all the games and perform well enough to bring in decent amounts of VC, you'll probably be alright. But the game is designed in a manner to push you to points where you feel the need to supplement with purchases of VC.

 

[coldfoot]

Fifa does it right, you only need them for FUT, which is a completely new and optional gameplay mode that I never visit anyway.

 

[Marauder Shields]

I normally play offline association in my 2K games. Does VC play a factor in that?

 

[Derrick01]

It's really hampered my enjoyment of what is a pretty fun game when you're actually playing. So much that I'm likely going to trade it in within the next week. Why am I being forced to grind in a series that sells like 10 million copies a year? It's never enough for these awful publishers.

 

[Mrbob]

I'm glad this is getting more notice. I absolutely regret buying this game now that online leagues are busted and the game is just a F2P money sink in a 60 dollar package.

 

[deftech sold out]

Okay, I've played NBA2K14 for less than an hour total so I'm not really clear on how VC is integrated into this game. Article is vague on specifics in this regard. Are there cliff notes available somewhere?

this:

"In many cases it is not optional, forces gamers to decide on a single mode to fully invest in rather than being able to play in the fashion they so choose."

Seems particularly concerning, but I have no context to put that sentence in.

If you play My Player, or My GM it is most prevalent. I've only dabbled in My Player, so someone will need to fill in the blanks on that mode but I know you have to use VC to buy clothes, change your jumpshot animation, etc. In My Gm, everything costs VC. Oh you want to give your player a pep talk because his morale is low? VC. Upgrade your facilities? VC. Train your players before the next season starts? VC, etc. etc. etc. It's a cash grab of the highest order.

 

[bishoptl]

Looks like I'll be sticking with 2K11 on my PS3 for the foreseeable future.

 

[Kintaro]

I got NBA 2K14 for free and I still feel ripped off because of that bullshit VC garbage.

 

[mechphree]

Media will chalk up any future micro transactions to just "uhh they're optional...etc"

 

[Jabba]

Maybe we can get Jay Schreier to look into this also if he has time.

@pastapadre

I don't play many sports games but that bad eh?


My next gen console purchase will be on hold and finish saving for a new PC. Just to see how all this plays out. Maybe get my laptop fixed for cheap if possible.

Just read article, very good.

 

[pastapadre]

Media will chalk up any future micro transactions to just "uhh they're optional...etc"

Can't deflect in that manner here. If you don't spend the VC in MyGM you'll suffer and eventually get fired.

 

[CartridgeBlower]

Good article. I cannot believe more publications don't cover this, and instead just go along with it. Then they complain when WE complain, and the entitled card gets played when it shouldn't.

Thought Mike Wang was one of the good guys, but he's been silent on this. I'm assuming it comes from the higher-ups, but there needs to be some blowback.

 

[Mrbob]

OP you should put the pastapadre link in your post:

http://www.pastapadre.com/2013/12/10/vc-implementation-threatens-the-future-of-the-nba-2k-series

Damn fine read. Hope this gets more traction. Everyone is screaming about Forza and GT6 yet VC/2K is easily the worst abuser of all. They should be raked over the coals for what they have done.

 

[shadow101]

There are people reporting issues with PSN and XboxLive account hacks through FIFA via EA's servers.

Did they come out and verify that yet ?

 

[ArcaneFreeze]

Welcome to Next Gen people. I've always been a huge fan of the 2K series but its getting harder and harder to justify ever buying it. Already needing to buy yearly releases for minimal upgrades and now they've added microtransactiosn to some of the most basic of functions? I'm really hating this trend of having to needle consumers for every penny just so they can enjoy the games that they've played for years.

 

[pastapadre]

I don't play many sports games but that bad eh?

There's never been anything even remotely comparable to what is taking place in 2K14. Until now revenue-driven modes have been isolated. For example Ultimate Team in EA's games are completely separate from the experience you can have in Franchise or Career for example. There isn't even a choice to spend money in other modes. VC though has infected pretty much every area of the game that 2K Sports deems important/popular.

 

[Xater]

Fifa does it right, you only need them for FUT, which is a completely new and optional gameplay mode that I never visit anyway.

Playing FIFA right now I have to say that they also hand out their currency pretty generously. It's nowhere near as hard to get stuff as in NBA 2K14. NBA is incredibly stingy and just playing MyCareer it took forever to get anything. Wanted to also play some MyTeam and then I saw the pack prices. How much would you have to grind to get a fun experience out of that mode? I really don't get how reviews did not mention this.

 

[chicagocubsfan]

Yep. VC is completely awful stuff. Will trade the game soon.

 

[pastapadre]

Playing FIFA right now I have to say that they also hand out their currency pretty generously. It's nowhere near as hard to get stuff as in NBA 2K14. NBA is incredibly stingy and just playing MyCareer it took forever to get anything. Wanted to also play some MyTeam and then I saw the pack prices. How much would you have to grind to get a fun experience out of that mode? I really don't get how reviews did not mention this.

MyTeam pretty much requires spending money to play consistently. Unlike Ultimate Team, where you can play and sustain a team without paying any cash though it won't be a powerhouse, you'll eventually hit a wall with MyTeam where you have no choice but to pay or be unable to play any further, or have to spend time playing games in other modes to gain enough VC to get what you need.

 

[Justagamer80]

Amazon just granted my request to let me return the game for a full refund.

 

[chicagocubsfan]

Amazon just granted my request to let me return the game for a full refund.

What? When did you purchase it?

 

[Pristine_Condition]

The number of emails and tweets I have received about this, and the discussion threads in various places, is really significant. Just hasn't gained traction with the major media sites for whatever reason. Honestly I'm not sure if the reviewers or columnists at those publications - who usually aren't really fans of the genre or sometimes even sports in general - have been able to recognize what this VC system means to consumers.

Thanks for writing about it. Didn't realize you were on GAF.

I think it's a real shame, certainly for the consumers, but a potential dropped ball from the publisher too. I know more than a few people who are not big sports gamers, and may not have owned a 2K Sports game in a long time, who are giving this title a shot because of the visuals. If this kinda thing is their lasting impression of sports games or 2K Sports, well, that's gonna make them think twice next time.

 

[BadAss2961]

I haven't had any problems with VC. You earn a good chunk of it after each game played. Due to the pay-to-win nature of it, i've actually been able to make my team better through features in MyGM than I used to in last gen's Association mode -- that's without spending a dime.

It's the always online part that's the problem.

 

[Justagamer80]

What? When did you purchase it?

Launch for the PS4 and have put about an hour of gameplay into it. After the new update I wasn't about to put anymore time into it.

 

[Snakeyes]

lmfao

Time for Nintendo to bring back their sports franchises like NBA Courtside. If there's one company that I still trust not to indulge in this monetization bullshit, it's them.

 

[epmode]

I'm sitting this console generation out for now and stuff like this obviously isn't going to change my mind.. I'll stick with developers and publishers that don't actually hate their audience.

 

[pastapadre]

Thanks for writing about it. Didn't realize you were on GAF.

I think it's a real shame, certainly for the consumers, but a potential dropped ball from the publisher too. I know more than a few people who are not big sports gamers, and may not have owned a 2K Sports game in a long time, who are giving this title a shot because of the visuals. If this kinda thing is their lasting impression of sports games or 2K Sports, well, that's gonna make them think twice next time.

That's the thing you see a lot of now. Companies looking for short term gain and neglecting long term customer satisfaction and retention.

 

[Korezo]

Im about to sell this garbage game on ebay.. The only reason I haven't is because I sold my other ps4 game and will have nothing else to play. I really hate the game because of the VC.

 

[Pristine_Condition]

That's the thing you see a lot of now. Companies looking for short term gain and neglecting long term customer satisfaction and retention.

Yeah. I can't imagine they are ignorant of the fact they've got a lot of new customers coming to the product. They are bound to have that data. That short-term mentality is unfortunate.

 

[QaaQer]

Maybe this will be the last generation of consoles.

 

[bigboss370]

Looks like I'll be sticking with 2K11 on my PS3 for the foreseeable future.

my man.


honestly, i wouldn't have bought 2k14 this year if i knew about this stuff, but i didn't see it mentioned anywhere beforehand.

 

[JohnDoe8865]

Great article Pastapadre. I really hope some of the other major sports gaming sites pick this up and we can get some REAL discussion going about the direction of 2KSports right now.

 

[boredandlazy]

Maybe this will be the last generation of consoles.

You sure they wouldn't attempt to have this same system on a PC version?

 

[QaaQer]

You sure they wouldn't attempt to have this same system on a PC version?

There would be hacks. PC is much harder to lock down unless you go the DIII route and have most of the stuff server side.

 

[RichyDevil]

Great article Pastapadre. I really hope some of the other major sports gaming sites pick this up and we can get some REAL discussion going about the direction of 2KSports right now.

Operation Sports forums have been ablaze with this for a few days.

There are no other sites - other than Kotaku with Owen Good - that pay any attention to sports at all other than cursory stories (which are immediately mocked in the comments). Which is one reason so many people are confused. Not a single review picked up on any of this.

 

[pastapadre]

Operation Sports forums have been ablaze with this for a few days.

There are no other sites - other than Kotaku with Owen Good - that pay any attention to sports at all other than cursory stories (which are immediately mocked in the comments). Which is one reason so many people are confused. Not a single review picked up on any of this.

There's also the Reddit thread I linked to in the article, which can be really influential to word of mouth. It's a shame that consumers aren't being backed by the bigger media outlets on subjects such as this one.

 

[Dead Man]

Jesus, that sounds like an utter clusterfuck cash grab. Makes Forza look reasonable, which is scarily impressive.

 

[DMczaf]

And y'all were laughing at FMT's NBA2K thread...

 

[TheGreyHulk]

Greed ruins everything. I hate the "future" of gaming

 

[Alchemy]

Glad I picked Lego Marvel over this for my free PS4 game from Amazon. Don't even want to show any interest in this series anymore. Really pathetic.

 

[CambriaRising]

It is absolutely shameful that the video game press did not warn customers about this. Nor do they even care about this in general. Don't bite the hand that feeds indeed.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

I tried to play a game yesterday and Kobe was missing. I was like "WTF he actually comes back in real life and you take him out of the game?" Does anyone know what this about? I tried to search but 2K's fucking UI and menu's are so goddamn awful and have been since the Dreamcast days. Seriously can't you guys hire a fucking designer?

 

[WhoaIsThatMars]

I've put plenty of time into this game and $0 into it. I've enjoyed every bit of it. The only difference I've noticed is that you can't take your virtual coins earned from online games and put them toward anything except clothes and some gear rather than everything like before.

I really don't understand why people are complaining. I've been playing 2K for years and sense no difference here. We've just been given the option to buy coins (which isn't its first appearance this year). The ONLY difference is that the coins aren't universal for all gametypes.

I understand the bitching about Forza, but this game is not even a tenth as bad as Forza.

edit: I should point out that the server stuff is bs lol. But yeah, the coin thing really isn't a big deal to me. Put your time in and earn your rewards. It really doesn't demand that much time to gain a significant amount of coins. k bye

 

[Gamecocks625]

That sucks. I never cared for the NBA series anyways but still....not a good sign for console sports games. FIFA seemed to do it right though.

Side note: Didn't realize pastapadre posts here. Welcome. Remember you from back when I posted at operation sports a number of years ago.

 

[alr1ght]

surprise surprise
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=728344

Take Two CEO:
"I think you'll continue to sell those high-end products as the entry point, and then you'll have in-game monetization for certain sold items and free items."


Please don't support this bullshit so it dies before it gets going. Tell them you're not buying their games/returning their games solely due to this.