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[studyguy]

People who play games run the gamut, there's always going to be an insufferable minority into any hobby. Just don't stress over them, why bother. If people ask I usually just say I play games, not to avoid saying "gamer" specifically, but the label always seemed irrelevant.

 

[Xilium]

For instance, men and women are almost equally likely to play games at all, according to the survey, with 50 percent of men and 48 percent of women saying they play. But men are much more likely to apply the "gamer" label to themselves: 15 percent of men versus 6 percent of women. That difference in self-identification may explain why 60 percent of all respondents thought most people who play video games are men, even though the survey's topline results don't really bear this out.

Wouldn't this be because people that play games exclusively on their cellphones almost never identify themselves as gamers?

And the complaints about the marketing being male-focused are almost always centered around AAA, big budget games (COD, AssCreed, Sports games, ect.) which in all likelihood, the playerbase is predominately male.

 

[Zornack]

Wouldn't this be because people that play games exclusively on their cellphones almost never identify themselves as gamers?

And the complaints about the marketing being male-focused are almost always centered around AAA, big budget games (COD, AssCreed, Sports games, ect.) which in all likelihood, the playerbase is predominately male.

Yeah, like how often does anyone say "oh, I was just playing a game" when talking about a phone game? Almost never, they say they were playing on their phone. Phone games and console/PC games are seen as different things by society.

 

[Kimawolf]

So the perceived notion of "gamers" being these angry basement dwelling white men is not completely true but more of people simply believing it to be true?

Who'd thought.

Spoken as a black gamer here.

 

[Langdon Alger]

Not really, other than most publishers excuses for avoiding marketing and developing games towards women continues to be bullshit.
.

I'm guessing people who identify as gamers spend more time and money on games then people who don't identify as gamers. So...

 

[More_Badass]

Yeah, like how often does anyone say "oh, I was just playing a game" when talking about a phone game? Almost never, they say they were playing on their phone. Phone games and console/PC games are seen as different things by society.

Depends on what kind of mobile games they're playing

 

[Doctoglethorpe]

The wording in the survey is really muddled and thus hard to take much real data from, but having said that, anecdotally it gets to about the right place I think. At least on the gender gap.

I see a lot of statistics thrown around that say theres no gender gap for gamers, but Ive long assumed the flaw in that claim is that anyone and everyone who plays any kind of game can be called a gamer. But I think its safe to say that most of us know theres a difference. Perhaps a better term would be gaming enthusiast. And when you get to that level, it really seems to be a male dominated affair. Yes women play games, but I truly believe less of them are actually enthusiastic about them, that follow industry news, play a variety of games, etc, compared to men. I see far less women really treat games as a primary hobby. Even my girlfriend could be called a gamer, she plays destiny and cod zombies, minecraft and even bioshock. But thats about it. She doesnt give one shit about industry news, she doesnt experiment with other genres or even spend much time playing the few games she does. She has no idea what most games even are. Shes not an enthusiast. She would have no reason to join this site. And its that enthusiasm and knowledge that a lot of us really connect to the term "gamer." Or at least I do. I think it loses its meaning otherwise and becomes as useless a label as "music fan" cause everyone listens to music but that doesnt mean you know or care much about the subject.

The gender gap has been slowly closing over the past decades for sure, but its still definitely there. Again though, I only speak anecdotally.

I guess I should just adapt and use the word enthusiast for now on though. Its probably much clear in definition to anyone who is outside that bubble.

 

[kavanf1]

Somewhat surprising that non-white males identified with the term more strongly.

There was a thread a while back asking GAF if they identified as gamer, people seemed to get upset that some didn't care for the term. I seem to remember accusations of shame and regret were a huge part of it.

I wonder if this discussion will turn out similarly.

The problem with that earlier discussion was that everyone had their own definition of "gamer". I went by the top result on the front page when you Google "gamer definition", which defines gamers as people who play games, especially computer games. Going by that definition, then like it or not, if you play video games, you are a gamer.

The survey being discussed in this thread gets a lot more specific though. It first identifies who plays video games, and then asks those who do if they consider themselves gamers based on a specific definition of the word.

It doesn't really surprise me that white males are the lowest population willing to call themselves "gamers". I would love to see more in depth analysis on this because based on what I read online, white males seem to be the demographic most keen to distance themselves from the traditional gamer stereotype. (Even when they fit the definition.)

 

[Pizza]

every time I hear "gamer" I remember this video in full. This is why I do not identify with the term. Also in my travels I have found that self-described gamers are the people from the portal comic up there

 

[silvermember]

Wouldn't this be because people that play games exclusively on their cellphones almost never identify themselves as gamers?

And the complaints about the marketing being male-focused are almost always centered around AAA, big budget games (COD, AssCreed, Sports games, ect.) which in all likelihood, the playerbase is predominately male.

I am sure you have ## to back up your claims, right? Your statement seems to back up the type of bias explained in the research.

 

[kavanf1]

Have read most of the report, I would really like to see them do follow up analysis on this with some further questions to give more context. For example, some stats on the amount of time people spend playing games and discussing gaming online would be really interesting to review against those who self-identity as gamers versus those who don't - would love to know if there is any correlation between the two.

 

[Mesoian]

I'm guessing people who identify as gamers spend more time and money on games then people who don't identify as gamers. So...

...I mean, there is an argument that people who self identify as gamers are the industry's whales. But depending on your scale, the number of people who self identify as gamers matters little when you're polling demographic numbers. Anyone who plays a game on any platform for any amount of time is put into a "user" category in such studies.

Which is why the breakdown per purchasing amount/month and/year is more interesting.

 

[PaulloDEC]

Interesting data. I especially like how the "non-gamers" and to an even larger degree "non-players" completely disagreed with everything the "gamers" agreed with.

 

[billy beane]

Gamers care way too much about an industry that does not give a fuck about them. It's sad. If people stopped giving a shit about which company is doing what, and just played video games every now and then they'd be a lot happier.

Unless you have a job in the industry you should not be dedicating so much of your life to it.

 

[KoopaTheCasual]

Wouldn't this be because people that play games exclusively on their cellphones almost never identify themselves as gamers?

And the complaints about the marketing being male-focused are almost always centered around AAA, big budget games (COD, AssCreed, Sports games, ect.) which in all likelihood, the playerbase is predominately male.

But you have zero data to back up your claim and rely entirely on stereotypes.

 

[Razzorn34]

I'm really surprised by this quote: Only 34 percent of self-described gamers felt that most games were "a better form of entertainment than TV."

I'll take a good game over anything on TV. Anytime.

 

[Mesoian]

I'm really surprised by this quote: Only 34 percent of self-described gamers felt that most games were "a better form of entertainment than TV."

I'll take a good game over anything on TV. Anytime.

Let's face it, save for a very very very small minority of games, the likes of which we've all almost certainly played, narrative in games is ass and TV is still the better place to go for it.

 

[L Thammy]

If I was in the US, I don't think I'd fit on that race list. Are there not a lot of South Asians in the US? I thought that there were a lot of Pakistanis.

 

[blame space]

I finally feel comfortable with myself enough to do this..

Mom, dad.. I'm a gamer.

 

[Daingurse]

I'm really surprised by this quote: Only 34 percent of self-described gamers felt that most games were "a better form of entertainment than TV."

I'll take a good game over anything on TV. Anytime.

There are many times when I want a more passive form of media like TV, movies, or audiobooks. Really depends on what I'm in the mood for.

 

[Dr. Buni]

It also really confuses me how someone could be on, especially have an account on a site like this and not identify as a 'gamer'. Like...you have no other hobbies? Why are you even...eh, people, huh?

What kind of question is this? Do I need to identify myself as ~gamer~ to play games and post on NeoGAF?

 

[MartyStu]

The main thing this tells me is that Non-White and Female gamers really should have more consideration when games are being made.

 

[Razzorn34]

Let's face it, save for a very very very small minority of games, the likes of which we've all almost certainly played, narrative in games is ass and TV is still the better place to go for it.

I play games for gameplay. Interaction is what makes it a better form of entertainment, not storytelling.

 

[Razzorn34]

There are many times when I want a more passive form of media like TV, movies, or audiobooks. Really depends on what I'm in the mood for.

I'm not saying I never watch anything on TV. But if I'm going to tell someone which I enjoy more, it's definitely going to be a good game.

 

[massoluk]

I am a game player.
Male, middle-middle class, Asian

Where am I on that graph :\

 

[cosmicblizzard]

Labels are stupid. Every debate on the term "gamer" seems to be exclusively a semantics debate.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

After #notyourshield I can't say I'm surprised. Income lines up too

The main thing this tells me is that Non-White and Female gamers really should have more consideration when games are being made.

The target demo for pretty much everything is still white male 18-35ish, not to mention the industry itself is still very lopsided. It's going to be a while.

 

[Roran Stehl]

Interestingly, I happily identify as a gamer, always have. I really feel that the past years have reinforced the stigma around the term itself (for many reasons, one of them being the conflation of the word with a narrow theoretical sub component). Note that the stigma around the medium is not new, and it's interesting to see a shift of negativity from the medium itself to the people using it (which is quite logical as othering issues related to a medium you yourself enjoy is always more comfortable).

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Gamers care way too much about an industry that does not give a fuck about them. It's sad. If people stopped giving a shit about which company is doing what, and just played video games every now and then they'd be a lot happier.

Unless you have a job in the industry you should not be dedicating so much of your life to it.

Film lovers care way too much about an industry that does not give a fuck about them.
Sports fans care way too much about an industry that does not give a fuck about them.
Food lovers care way too much about an industry that does not give a fuck about them.

etc
etc

(really, it's a silly thing to say. There's people that go crazy over star wars, mahvel, DC, whatever. That's true for any facet of entertainment.)

 

[Daingurse]

Labels are stupid. Every debate on the term "gamer" seems to be exclusively a semantics debate.

It's really isn't worth arguing about. It's just a nebulous term. Means too many different things to different people.

I'm not saying I never watch anything on TV. But if I'm going to tell someone which I enjoy more, it's definitely going to be a good game.

Think I'm mostly dictated by mood, but the highs of gaming may peak higher than my other hobbies or interests.

 

[Trogdor1123]

It means publishers should realize that they are leaving a lot of money on the table by not catering to women as well.

It also explains why there is a perceived notion that women don't play games. After all, women are 2 times less vocal than male about their self indication of being a gamer.

Hopefully, it means bad stereotypes like the fake GGirl is going to die soon, but I doubt it. I mean anecdotal evidence tends to hold more value than statistics in these parts.

It doesn't necessarily mean any of these things. I'm not disagreeing, just pointing out that you are drawing conclusions that may not be accurate.

 

[Clefargle]

What's with all you gamers not wanting to be called gamers?

Yeah for the life of me I don't understand it

 

[kiguel182]

Labels are stupid. Every debate on the term "gamer" seems to be exclusively a semantics debate.

What's with all you gamers not wanting to be called gamers?

It's not semantics. It's just that the term as a lot associated with it that some people don't want to be associated with. Others don't get that for some reason.

Also, it's a term that excludes people and some of us don't want to do that.

I play video games (quite a few video games too) and I don't call myself a gamer. The same I don't call myself stuff for every hobbie I have. Why would games have a word and my other hobbies don't?

Also calling myself a gamer implies I'm part of some sort of group of like minded people. Which I'm not since there is a lot of game variety and I don't relate to everything. Especially some stuff "gamers" like to defend.

 

[PaulloDEC]

Yeah for the life of me I don't understand it

From what I've seen (and this is with other "fandoms" too) it comes from not wanting to be automatically associated with the shittier people who use the label. Like, if the public perception of a "gamer" was some snotty little teenager who calls the SWAT team on strangers and spends their nights slinging racist slurs on COD, who would want to identify as being in that same group?

Some people take that attitude, while I guess others either don't care or want to show that you can be a regular, decent person and still be a "gamer".

 

[Roran Stehl]

From what I've seen (and this is with other "fandoms" too) it comes from not wanting to be automatically associated with the shittier people who use the label. Like, if the public perception of a "gamer" was some snotty little teenager who calls the SWAT team on strangers and spends their nights slinging racist slurs on COD, who would want to identify as being in that same group?

Some people take that attitude, while I guess others either don't care or want to show that you can be a regular, decent person and still be a "gamer".

This is my approach. I completely understand the stigma. But I am almost 40 and identified as gamer way before the hijack from a small subset of people. The term doesn't belong to them (although the hyperfocus of the game press who conflated the term with them may have reinforced this perception too; interestingly the press stepped back about the term since then). In itself, it is not exclusionary.
It really boils down to a term versus a qualifier associated with it. In my mind you have all kinds of gamers, including shitty ones.

 

[SonyToo!™]

Hopefully this means the trend of "white midle aged brown haired male" protagonist will at least shift to "non white".

As a white dude I'd love to a more diverse cast of PCs & NPCs, but imo one big reason why whites are the default choice is down to political correctness. The medium relies a lot on stereotypes (gamers want to shoot shit not spend 5 minutes learning a characters backstory) and white stereotypes like Nazi's and the British badguy are still socially acceptable.

Just look at the shit Capcom caught for setting Resi Evil 5 in Africa compared to RE4 set in Spain with stereotypical Spanish peasant zombies of which no one batted an eyelid.

 

[potatohead]

"Gamers" is just hipster for people who play Halo and COD only.

Rest of us just play games.

No reason to own such a trashy title, never cared for it.

It's not semantics. It's just that the term as a lot associated with it that some people don't want to be associated with. Others don't get that for some reason.

Also, it's a term that excludes people and some of us don't want to do that.

I play video games (quite a few video games too) and I don't call myself a gamer. The same I don't call myself stuff for every hobbie I have. Why would games have a word and my other hobbies don't?

Also calling myself a gamer implies I'm part of some sort of group of like minded people. Which I'm not since there is a lot of game variety and I don't relate to everything. Especially some stuff "gamers" like to defend.

This.

The term is exclusionary and reductionist.

I read the news a lot. Do I have to call myself a newsie or a newsiphile or some BS? No.

People who play games run the gamut, there's always going to be an insufferable minority into any hobby. Just don't stress over them, why bother. If people ask I usually just say I play games, not to avoid saying "gamer" specifically, but the label always seemed irrelevant.

Yep.

 

[Already Torn]

So the games industry should start targeting white people, of course!

 

[RichiRamjag]

I don't like to associate myself with the term because of all the stereotypes that come with it and also those who fulfill those stereotypes, especially over the last 10-15 years.

I simply don't like labels. I like to get down, but I'm not a dancer by any means. I'm just a fella who likes to do various things at various times

 

[The Faceless Master]

Makes sense that the people who are already used to the stigma of labels for an entire group are more likely to take another one on while the ones not accustomed to carrying that burden opt to avoid the weight.

 

[SonyToo!™]

Imo it's pretty sad that a gaming forum has so many members who won't label themselves as gamers and downplay their involvement to not only their peers IRL but among fellow gamers too.

I simply don't like labels. I like to get down, but I'm not a dancer by any means. I'm just a fella who likes to do various things at various times

Do you also post on a community forum for dancers? If you are posting here then gaming is your hobby and it's not only something you do but have an investment in aswell.

EDIT

Makes sense that the people who are already used to the stigma of labels for an entire group are more likely to take another one on while the ones not accustomed to carrying that burden opt to avoid the weight.

I'm a white guy but I've certainly had enough bad labels thrown at me in the past to be put off from using a mildly negative label like gamer

 

[cosmicblizzard]

It's not semantics. It's just that the term as a lot associated with it that some people don't want to be associated with. Others don't get that for some reason.

Also, it's a term that excludes people and some of us don't want to do that.

I play video games (quite a few video games too) and I don't call myself a gamer. The same I don't call myself stuff for every hobbie I have. Why would games have a word and my other hobbies don't?

Also calling myself a gamer implies I'm part of some sort of group of like minded people. Which I'm not since there is a lot of game variety and I don't relate to everything. Especially some stuff "gamers" like to defend.

It's semantics because there's no agreed on definition, so people end up arguing over what a word means and try to disassociate themselves from the negative aspects of it. This isn't an organized religion, there's no "no true Scotsman" argument. A good chunk of the time, people are probably on the same side, but end up arguing because they can't lock down a word's meaning, and that is completely pointless.

 

[Clefargle]

From what I've seen (and this is with other "fandoms" too) it comes from not wanting to be automatically associated with the shittier people who use the label. Like, if the public perception of a "gamer" was some snotty little teenager who calls the SWAT team on strangers and spends their nights slinging racist slurs on COD, who would want to identify as being in that same group?

Some people take that attitude, while I guess others either don't care or want to show that you can be a regular, decent person and still be a "gamer".

I guess I'm one of those types of people that understand how complex groups of millions can be. I get that gamers, atheists, and bisexuals are enourmous groups with lots of diversity. I understand what being in those groups means to other that are not and I'm ok with subverting their expectations one encounter at a time. I'm ok with someone not fully grasping the complexity of any of my personality traits because the labels are too broad. It saves enough time to associate myself with keywords because I meet so many people that not doing so would take up too much time for explaining myself. If you don't like the label then don't associate with it, if you like the label and don't like the perception, then change the perception.

 

[kavanf1]

I'm a 30-something white guy and I quite like calling myself a gamer as most people in my social groups think games are for children and I am therefore a manchild. I've outgrown any insecurities I may once have had about my hobby, and I feel absolutely no obligation to be an apologist for moronic minorities who give gamers a bad name by trying to distance myself from the label.

Saying I'm a gamer doesn't define who I am, but it's certainly a part of who I am. I don't feel bad about that.

 

[WhiteRabbitEXE]

What's with all you gamers not wanting to be called gamers?

I'm not a movier or a booker. I do watch movies and read books though.

Spoiler

Yes, I know there are real words more equivalent to gamer.

Also, people who latch tightly onto the "gamer" name tend to be more... problematic... than those who play games and don't stick to the label.

It's not semantics. It's just that the term as a lot associated with it that some people don't want to be associated with. Others don't get that for some reason.

Also, it's a term that excludes people and some of us don't want to do that.

I play video games (quite a few video games too) and I don't call myself a gamer. The same I don't call myself stuff for every hobbie I have. Why would games have a word and my other hobbies don't?

Also calling myself a gamer implies I'm part of some sort of group of like minded people. Which I'm not since there is a lot of game variety and I don't relate to everything. Especially some stuff "gamers" like to defend.

This.

 

[Roran Stehl]

I'm a 30-something white guy and I quite like calling myself a gamer as most people in my social groups think games are for children and I am therefore a manchild. I've outgrown any insecurities I may once have had about my hobby, and I feel absolutely no obligation to be an apologist for moronic minorities who give gamers a bad name by trying to distance myself from the label.

Saying I'm a gamer doesn't define who I am, but it's certainly a part of who I am. I don't feel bad about that.

Same here.

 

[Clefargle]

I'm a 30-something white guy and I quite like calling myself a gamer as most people in my social groups think games are for children and I am therefore a manchild. I've outgrown any insecurities I may once have had about my hobby, and I feel absolutely no obligation to be an apologist for moronic minorities who give gamers a bad name by trying to distance myself from the label.

Saying I'm a gamer doesn't define who I am, but it's certainly a part of who I am. I don't feel bad about that.

Pretty close to how I feel

 

[mclem]

Is there an identity for someone who talks about games more than actually plays them? Because I'm one of those.

Theoretical Gamer?

 

[More Fun To Compute]

Surprisingly the snobbishness against "gamers" boils down to class and wealth like most forms of snobbishness.

 

[Chaos2Frozen]

I guess no Asians play games huh :v