blankempathy
Member
I said before though is that really proper protocol? Trying to remove someone from a vehicle or trying to prevent them from driving away with physical force? That sounds incredibly dangerous to then officer and stupid to boot.
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Police officer shoots unarmed man to death in Cincinnati traffic stop
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Kid Kamikaze10
Member
I agree. Overseers is a way better comparison. That's pretty much where they "evolved" from.
Poop!
Member
Or a *reason* to pull them over in the first place regardless of what/why they want to pull them over. A violation like that gives them the right to pull you over.
Cincinnati sits on the Ohio river and borders Kentucky so just a 10 minute drive and you can be in another state that doesn't require a front plate. It is very rare in Cincinnati to get pulled over for a missing front plate as cops coming towards you assume you are from Kentucky.
There are a ton of Ohio plated cars driving around Kentucky and a ton of Kentucky plated cards driving around Ohio. This city it's very rare which makes this case very odd.
Velcro Fly
Member
I've driven in Illinois a ton and my Indiana car only has a back plate and I've never been stopped and never even heard of any of my friends or family being stopped. It's something that just doesn't really happen to my knowledge. I've lived 5 minutes from the Illinois border my entire life other than a few years of college. And no one I know has had that happen.
Now if the guy was drunk like it seems from the article that is something a cop is definitely trained to spot.
blankempathy
Member
Here in ca it rarely happens too. Depends on the cop. Ive driven my car for over 2 years with no front plate until an officer pulled me over and gave me a warning about it. Seems to just be something thats a very low priority.
Poop!
Member
Right, it was the official reason given. I've had people I know get pulled over because their license plate light was out. No joke. They can think you are drunk but they have to have an official reason to pull you over.
Euphoria14
Member
Would it be stupid? Absolutely. However, if you are about to be dragged, what would be your response? Not sure if anyone could really say for sure what they would do.
It just clear as day that the article is trying to feed the on going "police brutality/racism" plotline, so I think it would be advisable to wait first before people make claims.
Obviously the video is going to be released and the questions will be answered.
On the road you're generally not going to notice it.
About to be dragged?
You think the officer's dress or hair might have been caught in the door for some reason? Oh I see, that part about him falling to ground as he fired the shot.
It did read weirdly. I assumed he just emotionally collapsed but it didn't really make loads of sense.
If the police officer was caught in the vehicle...he'd say that wouldn't he. People think the media are leaving it out to fuel anti-cop clicks? Maybe some would. CNN though? If that happened, the officer would have damn well said so. I was about to be dragged!
SneakyStephan
Banned
What's wrong with you
Dooming yourself would be stepping in front of a moving train that doesn't have time to stop before running you over.
You can't justify the killing of someone who attempts to flee from the police.
That person's life had just as much value as yours or mine.
Euphoria14
Member
It says he fired the shot while falling. At this same time the driver was pulling away. If you reach into a car to possibly stop someone from driving away there are plenty of ways to get caught up.
I'm just trying to work with what we are given in the article and give another possible angle rather than just "white cop shot dude cause he was black".
Of course I can be 100% wrong, but I don't want to jump to conclusions like that and would rather wait for the evidence to present itself.
adamsappel
Member
I'm not really comfortable with cops shooting their guns as they are falling. If you don't have a clear shot, don't fire your weapon. And what is the cop aiming to hit, anyway. If a cop can aim and make a headshot at a driver in a speeding vehicle, he can shoot a guy on foot in the leg, too.
Yeah, no I see where you're coming from, the sentence after with him falling does throw things.
Yeah...if he was standing pretty close to pull that off, maybe he could have aimed for the tyres.
blankempathy
Member
What i was trying to say was its stupid to physically reach into a car and try to detain a suspect who might also have a seat belt on because now you have put yourself into a position where if the suspect drives off you can get caught on something inside the car and possibly be run over. Thats why the whole struggle that occured seems strange. If the driver was inside of the car how could a struggle occur if he never stepped outside? If he did step out then i think the article would of mentioned that. However since it that doesnt seem to be the case the only way a struggle could occured is if the officer got close enough to somehow get grabbed by the driver or he tried to physically detain the driver or stop him from speeding off. Which is foolish for the reasons i stated above.
Euphoria14
Member
The entire article is written strange.
I look forward to seeing the bodycam footage because you would think the cop would know better than to act in a malicious manner with something like that on his uniform.
blankempathy
Member
Its easy to notice actually. Big white plate with yellow letters missing from a black or other dark vehicle by someone sitting there scanning cars isnt hard to miss. Most dont care or isnt a big enough deal.
Kid Kamikaze10
Member
EDIT: sorry wrong thread.
Euphoria14
Member
It only mentions that the struggle happened after the officer asked him to step out of the vehicle, which is understood considering the guy handed him a bottle of alcohol.
The officer was probably trying to open the door to get him out of the car. This is likely what that "struggle" is.
The question is what happened between that time and the shot being fired as the driver tried to leave the scene.
This should be answered once the footage gets released.
blankempathy
Member
Ok but opening the door means he was possibly intending to do what i stated above. And yes until the video is out its all speculation. Until then though to me its looking like the cop messed up and put himself in a bad situation. Him firing a shot as he fell to the ground and his pants ripping sounds like he got caught in the car as the guy drove off. Firing a shot to save himself as he was being dragged and possibly about to be run over. Thats just my guess.
Link
The Autumn Wind
Cops are trained to always shoot to kill. So either he is an incompetent police officer, or he murdered the guy. Neither is a good look.
thiscoldblack
Unconfirmed Member
I agree. Plus, it's all recorded on camera.
Corronchilejano
Member
The vehicle was driving away.
Reading what the officer reported, he may have been worried about letting a drunk driver speed away.
That is, if it happened as the officer reported. :-/
outunderthestars
Banned
I know it is a cliche, but it really seems like we should waitfor the video to be released.
Nope, that's not what it is. Old MA plates have green lettering and you only required one so if you still have those you're grandfathered in. New plates have red lettering and you need both.
Yup, the whole Wanted-style headshot while falling its just so weird I wanna see it.
Come on. 13 children are certainly a lot, we could also discuss if too much, but this doesn't have much relevance for the topic at hand.
quickwhips
Member
You sound like a classy guy.
When people have a lethal option, you have to rely on perfect training and stone cold emotion control with rational thought to guarantee its not used. If the cop has had a bad day, is particularly tense, tired, glasses foggy, pissed, racist or believes stereotypes, just watched a movie where a cop was killed... Etc etc, then who can guarantee that they will always make correct decisions. And if they make the wrong decision, everyone gets fucked but the cop
It's fucked all around, but I don't know the solution. They are people. And while we assume or hope they should have perfect training and every cop should be perfect... One bad day can make something like this happen. No matter the training. People are too damn fucking complicated
Edit: So I guess what I am saying is it's time to activate skynet and let robots decide who lives and dies
It's fucked all around, but I don't know the solution. They are people. And while we assume or hope they should have perfect training and every cop should be perfect... One bad day can make something like this happen. No matter the training. People are too damn fucking complicated
Edit: So I guess what I am saying is it's time to activate skynet and let robots decide who lives and dies
Euphoria14
Member
In that case they will try to argue that he may have potentially saved many lives that day.
Hopefully the video makes things more clear.
Shuggananas
Banned
US cops are allowed to get away with it and that's why it happens so often there
Dot Matrix
Member
To who? Cops or Nazis?
The only thing I can think is he fired by accident since it was a single shot as he was allegedly falling to the ground, because he's going to have a tough defense saying he feared for his life or the lives of others. Only firing once is suspicious too.
If you aren't drunk driving, confrontational, or start a physical altercation things go pretty smoothly. Do you really think cops are going out on the streets with the intention of killing innocent people in the current environment where where they're under a microscope?
If you aren't drunk driving, confrontational, or start a physical altercation things go pretty smoothly. Do you really think cops are going out on the streets with the intention of killing innocent people in the current environment where where they're under a microscope?
crazygambit
Member
I read about that too in my local paper, not in the US mind you, so I was looking for the thread here, but couldn't find it.
Well, they should be killing people in life threatening situations, which the altercation this thread is about doesn't appear to be.
Amory
Member
Well we do know that he's been in trouble with the law at least 61 times, and that in this instance may have been driving under the influence and decided to try to run from the cops.
Was the officer justified in firing his weapon? We'll see once the video comes out, I guess. I do think it's a little funny to assume the worst of the cop and the best of the 60-time arrestee though.
Ugh. Just popped up on my local news. California police officer killed during what appeared to be a routine traffic stop
http://www.sfgate.com/crime/article/Hayward-police-sergeant-hurt-shots-fired-during-6399155.php
http://www.sfgate.com/crime/article/Hayward-police-sergeant-hurt-shots-fired-during-6399155.php
kame-sennin
Member
Everyone will say guns, but it's actually racism.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
In the case of a drunk I would hope getting them out of the car, by force in necessary, is protocol.
But...but...you we're supposed to be the good guys! You were the chosen ones!
You don't really want a drunk driver speeding off or causing a high speed chase endangering others, but I still don't see how this officer thought his best option was firing a shot either.
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