Don't fucking disrespect me by saying I don't want a common goal. Don't disrespect me by saying shit about me when you don't know shit about me yung. Don't. My goal is to have equality between my people and white people in America. To be treated the same. There really isn't much discussion to be had when all that I should say is "Treat me with respect and let Jamal get that job if he's the best candidate for it" I ain't the one who can educate cause I ain't got the fucking patience to deal with the bullshit on a daily damn basis. I repeat, don't fucking disrespect me yung. Much like I don't know you, you don't know me. Don't act like you do, and we'll be gucci.
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Post-Women's March: white women, working class, and people might need to reflect
- Thread starter Messofanego
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Man, people are breaking down mentally. As has already been said, the white women who voted for Trump were likely not the same white women that protested. People lashing out at the women at that protest, for that reason at least, are being completely irrational. That is anger speaking, not logic.
Forgiveness for what? What did you do wrong? Why are you responsible for your ethnic demographic. If you are doing the right things, and speaking out on these issues, then I don't see why you should apologize for anything.
News flash: it's old people. Old people are more likely to be racist, homophobic, and chauvinistic. They will die. The march of progress moves forward as the elderly are steadily buried.
Forgiveness for what? What did you do wrong? Why are you responsible for your ethnic demographic. If you are doing the right things, and speaking out on these issues, then I don't see why you should apologize for anything.
News flash: it's old people. Old people are more likely to be racist, homophobic, and chauvinistic. They will die. The march of progress moves forward as the elderly are steadily buried.
I think I quoted the wrong post but that's ok.
I think women who are marching are more open to their own growth, especially when looking at the number of how many white women voted for Trump. As I said in a previous comment, I think this is a critical moment for white feminist to reflect and broaden their umbrella of concern. Personally, I have already seen this happening among my friends, even with people I did not expect to embrace intersectionality.
And from the perspective of people of color, a racial rift is nothing compared to the daily experience of being dehumanized and disrespected by their white peers (among others, racism is not restricted to white people). Some may anticipate and fear a racial rift, other people see the continuation of genuine oppression and discrimination. Personally, I'll risk the racial rift.
Yeah, that is the glaring historical analogue and in so many ways it did not end particularly well for anyone.
Angelus Errare
Banned
All of you complaining about how unfair it is that women are being painted like this, I hope you have a post history being just as against how unfairly black people are painted when it comes to damn near everything...ESPECIALLY voting patterns.
And some of you are tilting the fuck outta me with this whole "making white people feel bad is causing a raical rift". THAT'S what's causing the great "Racial Rift" America? Not the 250+ years of racial inequality and lack of racial justice but because your feelings were hurt by your fellow white men/women and minorities no longer laying down and taking BS? Like get the fuck out of here; nah like seriously get out the thread cause ya'll just spewing some bullshit of the highest order.
And some of you are tilting the fuck outta me with this whole "making white people feel bad is causing a raical rift". THAT'S what's causing the great "Racial Rift" America? Not the 250+ years of racial inequality and lack of racial justice but because your feelings were hurt by your fellow white men/women and minorities no longer laying down and taking BS? Like get the fuck out of here; nah like seriously get out the thread cause ya'll just spewing some bullshit of the highest order.
You're right. I'm almost certain more than 75% didn't. Some older White Women I met drove from Florida to D.C. to participate in the protest. That's a lot of effort for elderly Women, one of them by herself, if they voted for Trump.
I even experienced some older White Women had me sandwiches at random. Me, a very clearly Black Male, was just told "Hey, would you like this Sandwich? You've probably been here a while and want something to eat." She then after that turned to my Filipino friend and asked her the same thing and gave her one too. She was so moved she cried as she ate it. This wasn't a one-time thing. There were tons of little instances of people going out of their way to help me and others out while we protested in D.C.
Yes, this discussion about the divide between White Women and Women of Color needs to be had, but I'm not going into it blaming and attacking White Women.
excelsiorlef
Member
http://www.straight.com/news/859366...nse-womens-march-organizers-following-erasure
Vancouver, BC chapter of the march didn't communicate with or include BLM in their march at all. Then when questioned they deleted facebook posts and refused to acknowledge or apologize for their actions.
Vancouver, BC chapter of the march didn't communicate with or include BLM in their march at all. Then when questioned they deleted facebook posts and refused to acknowledge or apologize for their actions.
Collective guilt is dangerous nonsense that should be rejected.
Mailenstein
Member
So you don't want to be disrespected, but at the same time you act as disrespectful as it gets to others in this thread? I reacted on stuff you wrote here and all you did is asking me in what fairy world I live in, without knowing what I've been through in life. Seriously now? If you want respect, treat others in a decent way - at least here. Apologizing for your behaviour here would be a good start. I have no problem with you on a personal level, but show some respect and you will have a positive outcome. Yes, I don't know you, but your anger won't help you in the long run.
The racial rift in America is hundreds of years old and white America created it. If white Americans feel shame or guilt it's because they already know that.
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
excelsiorlef
Member
Great, it still happened and the people directly involved on the local level still haven't taken responsibility for themselves.... so
I asked you what fairy tale world you lived in where two people can have a discussion and it will always be peaceful and always lead to a compromise. That's what I asked you. Not what have you been through, not what have you seen. But that.
Collective guilt is a disgusting trend that needs to be eliminated. I don't care if I'm being discriminated against, if I notice the kindness of someone to me and others I am not going to accept it then turn around and point the finger at them as being a problem. That's horrid and cowardly. If there are some White People that are racists to me (or anyone else) I have problems with them and them only, not everyone.
Mailenstein
Member
Is that a proper way to talk to somebody?
Wuthering_Heights
Banned
Yep. They don't seem to understand what got them 4 years of Trump in the first place.
Welcome to 8 years of Trump.
everyday math
Banned
Well said. I myself will fully admit that its really has only been the last couple years that Iv started speaking my mind to others. Part of that is I'm more educated on the subject and two Iv left that little bubble that was my parents house.
The factory I work at? We use radios to communicate on the large line. I heard this last month. "I can't wait for the police to have more military equipment to shoot those BLM protestors. Teach them a lesson." I saw red. Keep in mind I'm the only female on this side of the plant among 20 guys. This guy has 200 more pounds on me. Here I am starting a screaming match with this guy. Iv honestly never been so mad in my life. Long story short he no longer works here
.I have no regrets. You want to spew racist bullshit around me? Well prepare to deal with the consequences. I'm not gonna stand by as my fellow race spews this shit.
People need to grow a backbone and actually confront this racist bullshit.
I really don't care bro. I asked a question, you didn't give me an answer I guess because you saw Fairy tale world and took offense, and disrespected me
*yawn*
Zen_Arcade
Banned
The fact that you dont really care if you're being respectful, think it's alright to belittle someone elses opinion, and then get pissy when they disrespect you back is hilarious.
You're kind of proving his point.
Well it's not entirely wrong. If this is the kind of discussion we're having 4 years from now? The same discussion? We might be in trouble.
Keep the discussion civil in the thread. There is no need to call out other members to prove your point.
The thread has generally been a decent back and forth, but personal attacks against other members who are being open and honest aren't going to fly.
Im pissy because I've been in this topic all day dealing with people. Because when I asked a question, I ain't get an answer. Instead I got a life story I ain't ask for, because I had to ask again and still didn't get a damn answer. Because he assumed a lot of baseless shit of me. Something I aint do to them. Worst thing I said was "What fairy tale world you living in" in regards to how they view discussion. So excuse me that I am at the point of not giving a gosh darn
KO Traveling Hobo
Member
Well said. I myself will fully admit that its really has only been the last couple years that Iv started speaking my mind to others. Part of that is I'm more educated on the subject and two Iv left that little bubble that was my parents house.
The factory I work at? We use radios to communicate on the large line. I heard this last month. "I can't wait for the police to have more military equipment to shoot those BLM protestors. Teach them a lesson." I saw red. Keep in mind I'm the only female on this side of the plant among 20 guys. This guy has 200 more pounds on me. Here I am starting a screaming match with this guy. Iv honestly never been so mad in my life. Long story short he no longer works here
I have no regrets. You want to spew racist bullshit around me? Well prepare to deal with the consequences. I'm not gonna stand by as my fellow race spews this shit.
People need to grow a backbone and actually confront this racist bullshit.
Good on you.
WeirdoStalkerJr
Member
Both of yall need to chill. Hug it out. Come on guys, let me see some hugs.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
What got us Trump was there enough gullible and angry people to vote for him and not enough others to get off their asses and outnumber them, not people pretending not to understand white privilege and intersectionality. It especially loses impact to be told "this is why you got Trump" by people who toyed with the idea of voting for him themselves in addition to frequent, suspect posts in threads related to race and gender issues.
I don't think shit like what's in the OP is going to do anyone any long-term benefit but looking at the difference in responses from white men in here and white women in here says a lot.
I actually really really like these kinds of things. People do need to have more courage these days to confront these things and solve them, out in the open. Not post them on Twitter or Facebook but do nothing about it.Well said. I myself will fully admit that its really has only been the last couple years that Iv started speaking my mind to others. Part of that is I'm more educated on the subject and two Iv left that little bubble that was my parents house.
The factory I work at? We use radios to communicate on the large line. I heard this last month. "I can't wait for the police to have more military equipment to shoot those BLM protestors. Teach them a lesson." I saw red. Keep in mind I'm the only female on this side of the plant among 20 guys. This guy has 200 more pounds on me. Here I am starting a screaming match with this guy. Iv honestly never been so mad in my life. Long story short he no longer works here
I have no regrets. You want to spew racist bullshit around me? Well prepare to deal with the consequences. I'm not gonna stand by as my fellow race spews this shit.
People need to grow a backbone and actually confront this racist bullshit.
Maybe that's the case, I wouldn't know since I meant none of that criteria and I mean entirely what I say in that I think that we throw out generalizations to easily nowadays
But I'm not sure if NeoGAF is a good metric for what the difference in responses between men and women in the United States is since this Forum seemed to be pretty much in the majority against Trump. I think the the discussion needs to be had though and I've already been discussing that myself with people I know out in the world and that's where the majority of the discussion probably should be. Not on Twitter.
Zen_Arcade
Banned
Maybe take a break then? I'm not even saying that to be a dick. I'm just saying that your frustrations were getting the better of you there and you ended up doing exactly what he was talking about.
This discussion has been had for centuries
Mailenstein
Member
I gave you a straight answer, mate. Stop spinning it the way you just need it. Just learn to be humble, honestly. Wishing you all the best either way.
White women: I get what needs to be done
White men: This is why you got Trump, you'll get nowhere like this, the Dems are in trouble
Shit probably
Steeped in a Sea of Games
Member
Ironically, it feels like most people got bullied out of this thread. I don't know how anyone can expect this approach to be successful, especially when the ones people should actually be mad about are proud of being on the other side of everyone else. Even if there is a point here, it's delivered horribly.
Has it though? Maybe the basic tenets but the context has been radically different. And now with Twitter and Facebook allowing anyone to say whatever they feel that's even further radically changed the way these things are being talked about.
Honestly I think if you're really willing to try and get someone to work with you then you keep trying until you finally find something to connect on. But if you're really not willing after an amount of trying then you can't be faulted for giving up.
But one person not willing to see and recognize your aims isn't enough to write off everyone and say there can be no coming together. Also to be clear I'm not saying that you said or the opposite this. I'm just saying this in general.
I believe that no one in their right mind needs you to speak for them.
I believe that you are stanning for your own interest, not for the prospect of moving the communication forward.
I believe that the majority of people that showed up over the weekend won't be there when another minorities rights are stepped on, or another body drops. They will ghost.
I believe that you won't give less than one shit either way, because you're invested in your on ethnic troubles and needs, and can't see beyond that. And there will be Fire!! in some fashion... I guess.
I believe that when it's all said and done, those that are in this for all of us, and not just those upset about being slighted in the election, will be the ones bleeding, and carrying these changes through on their backs, and their children's backs.
I also believe that the economics of things will swing a lot of "allies" who became so-so allied because of a photo op, will swing them to the other side when shit stops being trendy, and that pink hat is fading. Or that "establishment" comes calling, and that feeling of being on an island and out of touch becomes so familiar.
Lord knows there are enough males screaming opposition at them to be actual human beings.
I also believe that most won't make a phone call to change shit in their districts, or be there for local elections because they really don't care that much.
Damned sure most aren't marching again if it ain't a pink pussy march.
What I want to see happen is those with means not fret about those means, and do what they should for themselves. Stop voting, holding close those, excusing those that did vote against all of our interests. Stop acting like black women are the enemy when they fucking raised us all thru this shit.
Action, not reaction.
Yeah, as another poster mentioned earlier, this specific tension, or the shadows of it, dates back to at least the mid-19th century: http://www.theatlantic.com/personal/archive/2011/09/frederick-douglass-a-womens-rights-man/245977/
Mailenstein
Member
It is if you actually understand what I wrote. You have to take a step forward to each other, something you are not ready to do yet; even here. Honest question, are you even trying? Saying I really don't care bro. doesn't get you anywhere. You want to be understood, others want that to.
I have read that post five times and still don't see anything but your background. Nothing about discussion and how sometimes two sides ain't fighting for the same thing and won't compromise.
Yes, it has and it will continue to be had. For example Trump winning is very similar to Nixon winning in the post-civil rights era.
Sure, but that was in a time when the voice of any specific group couldn't be individualized like it is now and communication took far longer.
In today's age you can have any ol' somebody say anything and if it's inflammatory it has a lot of potentially to do more harm than good.
My familiarity of that election is rusty so I'm not so good on remembering things but I can probably guess there's still a lot of differences between that one and this one still that are unique purely because of the environment we live in. Not saying there aren't things in common, but that the advent of fake news and the ability that information can be spread now was a big factor in Trump's election.
If that's the game we're playing: voter turn out was much lower amongst black people wasn't it? I guess Trump is their fault.
Mailenstein
Member
Well, I can't help you with that then. But you may give the word "why" some thought and you'll probably get the answer for it someday. Also, I think both sides want a future they can pass on to their children. Your are fighting for the same thing, you just don't listen to each other. Give it a thought.
Well said. I myself will fully admit that its really has only been the last couple years that Iv started speaking my mind to others. Part of that is I'm more educated on the subject and two Iv left that little bubble that was my parents house.
The factory I work at? We use radios to communicate on the large line. I heard this last month. "I can't wait for the police to have more military equipment to shoot those BLM protestors. Teach them a lesson." I saw red. Keep in mind I'm the only female on this side of the plant among 20 guys. This guy has 200 more pounds on me. Here I am starting a screaming match with this guy. Iv honestly never been so mad in my life. Long story short he no longer works here
I have no regrets. You want to spew racist bullshit around me? Well prepare to deal with the consequences. I'm not gonna stand by as my fellow race spews this shit.
People need to grow a backbone and actually confront this racist bullshit.
That's good. If any good has come from Trump's election, its people being more or less forced into their own journey regarding power and privilege along so many different axes. That, and a renewed discussion on what good citizenship looks like have been encouraging in the face of so much bleakness.
I mean sure, there are obvious differences in the ways in which the conversation is being carried out, but the core tension remains strikingly similar.
The parallels still remain.
Back to your point though, if we're still having this discussion who do you think that's on? If every bit of progress we have is immediately set back by white resentment undoing it then it's no wonder this conversation will be had over and over. That isn't definitely isn't on minorities.
Aight, I think I know where your coming from in your post, but discussion does not always have one side that is here and one that is there and the two meet and calmly talk things out. From my life experiences, I ain't the one to educate people on why my life matters. For one, it's not a debate, but second, because I have tried to educate racists in my life and it hasn't given me anything but mental anguish. So I save that shit for those with more patience than I. I'll say my peace and if you disagree, bye.
That's a nice belief but I personally just want everyone to be happy to the best that it is possible for another person to be happy without encroaching on another's happiness.
As for the other beliefs. That's fine, but they're your beliefs and they may be wrong as may mine. You should still believe what you want but know this.
I have volunteered for the last 3 elections (yes that includes the midterms) and gone door to door.
I've been an Election Officer for one of those.
I've been at probably to more protests than you.
I've probably been to more political meetings than you
I've probably faced more racial prejudice than you.
I'm probably far more angry than you.
I'm probably going to send my emails and letters to my politicians than you (if I haven't already)
This are things I MIGHT be wrong about but I doubt it. I think you're probably a fine person, you probably have a lot of interesting and respectable opinions. I hope you get everything positive you believe in too. But I don't think you're in the right here. I don't think you get to believe your superior to everyone because you're angry. And I don't believe you get to get angry, coy and posture because your frustrated in a thread on NeoGAF and try to turn it on someone talking to you.
It's not, your completely right in that it's not on us. But the answer to that isn't to lash out on Twitter repeatedly. The answer probably isn't any one thing either though.
All I know is for the last couple of years I've been talking to people about these issues because that's all I know how to do. On forums, facebook, in public, wherever. I've been trying to do that for a long time.
If people want to be angry I guess I can't stop them but I don't think it's conducive to a discussion if you start off angry and try to get the person you're trying to talk to angry at you. Chances are if they aren't angry with you if you're accosting them then they probably already agreed with you.
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
We're they just not told about it and expected an invitation? Did BLM Vancouver try and reach out but got rebuffed?
As noted they had POC and Indigenous speakers at the event.
I'm sure the Facebook conversation had more details inside, but it was deleted.
I hope BLM Vancouver is better than BLM Toronto.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
This kind of shit isn't even necessary
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