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Project Sonic 2017 now called Sonic Forces [Update: First Gameplay Footage]

ITT some people who haven't played past the god awful Adventure games offer their shitty hot takes.

Personally I'm glad that they're sticking with the boost gameplay. Go with what worked in Generations/Colors/Unleashed, and build upon it.
 
We want the Sonic from the Adventure style. Those games are old so any control/camera problems could be fixed in a modern game.

They'd be fixed by making Sonic control nothing like he did in the Adventure games. That was the core of the problem that everything else grew out from.
 
Seriously Eggman went too far this time he is like doing genocide

Eggman's at his best when he's evil as fuck. The Boom series and the recent games kind of made him far too bumbling - the version of him you see in, say, SA2 where he'll put a fucking gun to Amy's head, or in the Worlds Collide comic where he tries to murder Dr. Light - that's the Eggman you want.

Seems like they'll give Mike Pollock a little more to do with this one.
 
The 3rd style could be a lot more vertical or involve 3D platforming. I still feels like Sky Sanctuary 3D is the best 3D Sonic Level Sonic ever got.
 
Lol Generations/Unleashed/Colors gameplay seems incredibly safe and low risk. I had faith in them to try and succeed at something new. A tad disappointed. We're getting a 3rd gameplay style right, so there's still hope. I'll really lose hype if they don't fix Classic Sonic's physics, especially with rolling.
 
They'd be fixed by making Sonic control nothing like he did in the Adventure games. That was the core of the problem that everything else grew out from.
I meant control problems like light dash and spin Dash being the same button. Or falling through a stage.

I want Sonic to control exactly like either adventure game. I'm partial to Adventure 2 as its not as slow as Adventure 1. But either is better than what we have now.
 
Generations gameplay is the most solid 3D Sonic gameplay I've played so far, imo.

I'll gladly take that, safe but good at least. Hopefully this will be a longer game than Generations.
 
Oh hey they're doing exactly what I want, between that and Sonic Mania doing the other thing I wanted it's time to get back on track after that extended stay crashing into Boom territory.
 
Just looks like the same 3d Sonic theyve been making since Unleashed. Its a bit of a conundrum whats taken them this long to just make another one of those?
 
How so? Adventure fans keep bringing this up, but never provide any points of comparison in regards to well designed levels.
Im not sure what you want here?

City Escape in Sonic Adventure 2 is better than City Escape in generations.

Same stage different styles. I want the Adventure style.

Is that really hard to understand?
 
I remember a thread here praising the logos for Sonic games.

Funny since this one definitely look uninspired.
I kinda love it, haha. It's dark in a cheesy way.

I dig the whole vibe of this game, tbh. The music and logo set the tone for what looks like a really fun adventure.

Unless they Fuck up the 3rd gameplay element in this, this is the dream scenario for the franchise for me.

I meant control problems like light dash and spin Dash being the same button. Or falling through a stage.

I want Sonic to control exactly like either adventure game. I'm partial to Adventure 2 as its not as slow as Adventure 1. But either is better than what we have now.
If they have Adventure Sonic, I think the SA2 controls would be the way to go. Focus the gameplay around getting high scores through grinding rails, chaining homing attacks, etc.
 
I meant control problems like light dash and spin Dash being the same button. Or falling through a stage.

I want Sonic to control exactly like either adventure game. I'm partial to Adventure 2 as its not as slow as Adventure 1. But either is better than what we have now.

Like, I can appreciate we have our differing opinions over something as subjective as gameplay. But I'm VERY confident that any modern game under any IP that controls like Sonic did in the Adventure games, would be seeing some of the lowest reviews scores of that year, unless everything surrounding it was fucking astounding.
 
Im not sure what you want here?

City Escape in Sonic Adventure 2 is better than City Escape in generations.

Same stage different styles. I want the Advenature style.

Is that really hard to understand?

But how? What about the Adventure style makes it inherently better than the boost style? What about the level design makes it objectively superior to the design on display in Colors/Generations?

You keep saying "x is better than y" but aren't giving any sort of reasoning as to why you believe that to be the case.
 
Yes he is. I'm making this statement from prior observations of people trying to play it. Whether it be via boosts laid out through the level, or the incentivising of the spinach for instant high speeds, Sonic gets stupidly twitchy all the damn time.

So you haven't played it? I just played it right now and unless you're letting Sonic land on boost pads or using his spindash aggressively, you can make him walk easily or just guide him along to collect rings, I feel that's a fair trade off if you more direct at speedrunning. Sonic Adventure had plenty of issues but saying it had twitchy controls is a bit of an exaggeration.
 
To be fair, they've been working on Forces for 4+ years.

Again, it would be different if their tactic wasn't exactly the same as always: make a bunch of gameplay styles and mash them together. It just makes the product weaker.

This thread is just confirming that the Sonic community might be the most fractured fanbase in gaming lol. Too many people want different shit. There will never be another Sonic game that satisfies everyone.

ST got themselves into that mess and they won't do anything to move past it, so they just keep throwing a bunch of stuff that kinda worked before at a wall and hoping people will like it.
 
This thread is just confirming that the Sonic community might be the most fractured fanbase in gaming lol. Too many people want different shit. There will never be another Sonic game that satisfies everyone.
 
Just looks like the same 3d Sonic theyve been making since Unleashed. Its a bit of a conundrum whats taken them this long to just make another one of those?

Sonic levels are much bigger than they feel because the player is racing through them at high speeds.

Also they apparently made a new engine for this game.
 
To be fair, they've been working on Forces for 4+ years.
That includes building a new engine though.

Also, this thread is just laughable, just look at the past few Sonic games...

// Try something new
/// Reviews badly, sells badly

// Try something new
/// Reviews badly, sells badly

// Try something new
/// Reviews badly, sells badly

// Go back to style that was last praised and reviewed well
// NeoGaf "OMG YOU GUYS SUCK, CREATIVITY BANKRUPT, WHY DON'T YOU TRY SOMETHING NEW??"
 
But how? What about the Adventure style makes it inherently better than the boost style? What about the level design makes it objectively superior to the design on display in Colors/Generations?

You keep saying "x is better than y" but aren't giving any sort of reasoning as to why you believe that to be the case.

I'm going to hazard a guess that this is pretty much the Mario 64 vs Mario Galaxy argument. I think many people view level designs as being better simply because they're more open, even if there's just a lot of dead space where they're simply running over to a point of interest.
 
But how? What about the Adventure style makes it inherently better than the boost style? What about the level design makes it objectively superior to the design on display in Colors/Generations?

You keep saying "x is better than y" but aren't giving any sort of reasoning as to why you believe that to be the case.
I personally find the slower and more deliberate platforming to be superior to the almost racing game like qualities of Generations. This stems to both Adventure's controls and level design.
 
I wouldn't say the Boost formula is an example of a modern formula done right - or at least the extent of which Sonic could ideally be taken. They're fairly good games to play but modern Sonic games are more about making the player feel fast rather than allowing them to be fast - which isn't a bad thing in and of it's own, if a game feels good to play then that's a positive. But I will say that when you get so much speed at such simple moment's notice it doesn't make it feel like as much of a reward as it was in classic games where you maneuvered through cleverly placed obstacles. Designing levels for a formula like that is hard, and making them sizable enough with the speed given to you is even harder. It's why modern Sonic games try to fuse a whole lot of distractions into their game play like graphical set pieces that don't have any bearing on the gameplay or even it's story, because the games have to feel like there is something more to them.

I still maintain that the original Sonic Adventure had something of a decent baseline they could have utilized. Refine the jank, widen the levels out, allow you to curl into a ball to pick up momentum rather than spinashing at a moment's notice... you could make a good game out of that, provided the level design can back it up.

Boost games are fun but only in an ephemeral fashion. They don't really stick with me well after the fact. I have fun with them... but then I just kinda put them down and don't really return to them.

I must disagree Notliquid. When I play through a level the first time in these games I typically blast through whitout a care in the world like how you described, but with my subsequent playthrough I look for hidden routes and secrets I can possibly use to get through skillfully and then practice running through and hitting my preffered route. THEN when I feel confident enough I whip out the boost and speed on through a level going for best times and looking cool.

To me I feel great when I can run through a level and take the difficult but fastest routes and nail precise movements while moving at mach 7. I feel fast not just because I have instant boost, but because I'm able to execute crazy risky maneuvers and skip past portions of the stage with well timed boosts, jumps and hard practice. I still feel rewarded with speed when I finally learn a level be able to maneuver through it the best way I can with no mistakes. Maybe our tastes are different?
 
Crazy Gadget and the Chao Garden are the only parts of Sonic Adventure 2 that hold up.

Crazy Gadget is alright but it's one of the jankier Sonic stages in that game.

City Escape I'd say holds up well since you can very much see what would be the basis of inspiration for the better parts of Sonic Generations' level design, which is bullet points of platforming and challenges connected together with some speed sections.

It's still not my preferred way of playing Sonic but since there's more control in Adventure 2 than Generations I enjoy it.
 
But how? What about the Adventure style makes it inherently better than the boost style? What about the level design makes it objectively superior to the design on display in Colors/Generations?

You keep saying "x is better than y" but aren't giving any sort of reasoning as to why you believe that to be the case.
"Objectively"

Let me stop you right there. Obviously it's my opinion. I don't think it needs to be prefaced before every comment I make.
 
So you haven't played it? I just played it right now and unless you're letting Sonic land on boost pads or using his spindash aggressively, you can make him walk easily or just guide him along to collect rings, I feel that's a fair trade off if you more direct at speedrunning. Sonic Adventure had plenty of issues but saying it had twitchy controls is a bit of an exaggeration.
When talking about twitchy controls, Windy Valley comes to mind.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ssbknPnN1d4#t=1m22s
 
/// Reviews badly, sells badly

// Go back to style that was last praised and reviewed well
// NeoGaf "OMG YOU GUYS SUCK, CREATIVITY BANKRUPT, WHY DON'T YOU TRY SOMETHING NEW??"

I'm going through the net to see what people think, it ain't just gaf. I don't think people they sega is creatively bankrupt, the reaction is just kinda mild. Looks familiar.


I think we will get more hype when more gameplay and more stuff is shown. Or the game comes out and it happens to be good.
 
This thread is just confirming that the Sonic community might be the most fractured fanbase in gaming lol. Too many people want different shit. There will never be another Sonic game that satisfies everyone.
Because from Sonic Adventure to Unleashed they decided that each game needs like 10 different gameplay styles! It wasn't until Colors that they decided to just focus on ONE and make it work, they then advanced the formula in Generations. Hopefully this is Generations + in the sense that they do more of the same but better, maybe the 3rd gameplay will be something new? Well see.
 
Did people forget about Sonic Lost World and Sonic Boom? We haven't had a game with this kind of gameplay style since 2011, which was nearly six years ago.
 
So you haven't played it? I just played it right now and unless you're letting Sonic land on boost pads or using his spindash aggressively, you can make him walk easily or just guide him along to collect rings, I feel that's a fair trade off if you more direct at speedrunning. Sonic Adventure had plenty of issues but saying it had twitchy controls is a bit of an exaggeration.

What? Of course I've played it. I've played it to death... which is why I wouldn't use my own prowess for how controllable the games are. Just because we've become adept at handling Sonic's atrocious controls in those games, doesn't make them any less atrocious.

I was referring to seeing basically anyone that didn't grow up playing them try them today. The controls are unwieldy because if Sonic is running forwards at 200mph, then small adjustments to the direction held on the analog stick immediately convert that velocity wholesale to the new vector. It's terrible gameplay design for anything (not even character... any THING) a player is supposed to move at speed in a 3D space.
 
I mean when all 3 Adventures games are bad why keep trying? An d it wasn't accidental, Sega wanted to push it out. The games is buggy and a mess but even with a delay it would have been bad.

Let's not rewrite history

Adventure 1 was anything but bad. it wasn't perfect but it wasn't a bad game.

Adventure 3 was the only one game who was bad from start to finish.
 
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