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PS5 SSD May Not Necessarily Translate into Much Quicker Loading Times, Says Remedy Technical Director

-Arcadia-

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Aug 20, 2019
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As funny as the OP is, and I am legit rolling after a thousand SSD Defense Force threads...

The developer is talking about an unoptimized game. If a game is brought to market with massive load times, while everything else is at 1-2 seconds (or 6 for Series X, seems about right), that market will reward it aptly.
 
Mar 23, 2020
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Not sure why differentiating between expandable (it is expandable anyways for PS4 games playback and backup and for PS5 games storage/backup) and replaceable matters... oh yeah, I see back to the proprietary storage being the true pro consumer solution :rolleyes:.
Same with Series X, you can use expandable USB storage for legacy games or store your Series X games on it then move to the internal drive to play. But with PS5 you have to pretty much throw away your current PS5 SSD drive and then buy one more than the current drive to increase storage and keep that so called SSD advantage in speed.

Look at some of the prices here, these aren't even PCIE4 and nowhere close to 5500 mbps

The prices range from around $250-$750


When 2TB PCIE4 SSD drives that are capable of 5500 mbps come out they are probably going to be between $400-800
 
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Feb 14, 2010
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Please, PS5 is not special in any way whatsoever... please stop being excited, it is not the metric you need to care about. Congrats you found another article where if you squint real hard you can see bad news about PS5.

True PS5 fan, concerned about PS5 or... no, it cannot be an Xbox fan trying to post his n-th thread to create concern around PS5?!
Chill bruh. Just saw an article and posted it. I don't care about the specs. I'm not tech savvy to understand it all. I'm just waiting for games.
 

Evilms

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Dec 16, 2018
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No one is trying to downplay the PS5 SSD, however many people are greatly overstating the implications of it not only by itself but also against the Series X solution.

What does the date have to do with anything? What was true then is true now.
Nobody knew at that time that the SSD of the PS5 was custom PCIe 4.0 and different from the PC SSDs with 12 channels, 6 priority levels and a speed of 5.5GB/s.

So if it changes everything.
 

Barnabot

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Oct 16, 2018
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ah shit :LOL:

there's a sega saturn truth to be applied to ps5
 
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DynamiteCop!

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Mar 3, 2018
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Nobody knew at that time that the SSD of the PS5 was custom PCIe 4.0 and different from the PC SSDs with 12 channels, 6 priority levels and a speed of 5.5GB/s.

So if it changes everything.
Not for a developer who clearly knew exactly what it was...
 

Justin9mm

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May 9, 2018
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Ah Remedy, the developer who had a recent poorly optimised and performing game called 'Control'

It's true what was said but they are not good at squeezing out performance anyway. Some Devs are just better and more experienced then others. I believe at least the Exclusives made for PS5 will be crazy!
 

Hobbygaming

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Sep 30, 2019
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Yeh, show me where people are making duplicate threads of things that have already been discussed.


The level of desperation and anxiety around the PS5 SSD's potential strengths is palpable.

Xbox fans are too busy trying to downplay the PS5's SSD instead of enthusiastically talking about the Series X's strengths and what it will mean for games on the platform.

For shame.
Next generation is going to be a long one for them if they're thinking PS5 won't lead this time
 

Lionel Richie

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Jun 22, 2014
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Ah Remedy, the developer who had a recent poorly optimised and performing game called 'Control'
I'm playing Control right now and the game runs shockingly poor at times, but I'm not sure how much of that can be attributed to their "skills" and how much it's due to the insane level of destruction in the environment. There's just so much STUFF on the screen at all times, I'm not sure current tech could handle it any other way. You could be talking out of your ass on how poorly optimized it is.
 
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EDMIX

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As an insider, I can confirm Remedy is not being bought by Sony, as a secret source has confirmed to me today... /s

I think what they are saying is sorta moot. Of course any team that just isn't talented can make a really poorly optimized game that has load times based on the team just being "lazy".
 
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VFXVeteran

Industry Professional (Vetted)
Nov 5, 2019
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I agree to disagree with Remedy.

The framerate will drop long before the SSD will slow down to the speeds that are in today's consoles. In other words, the GPU/CPU will be the limit once they start trying to stuff larger datasets into RAM to be processed.
 

zcaa0g

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Sep 3, 2018
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The next generation won't be any different than the last generation.

The 3rdPersonStation 5 will still have the best 3rd person exclusives and the XBox Series X will still be the most powerful console with a vastly superior gamepad with a much larger game library due to BC.

So the answer still remains, both.
 

Justin9mm

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I'm playing Control right now and the game runs shockingly poor at times, but I'm not sure how much of that can be attributed to their "skills" and how much it's due to the insane level of destruction in the environment. There's just so much STUFF on the screen at all times, I'm not sure current tech could handle it any other way. You could be talking out of your ass on how poorly optimized it is.
Well it also depends how much time/capacity they had on optimising. There are busy games that don't perform as badly. When I read what was said and then looked back to Control. They sounded lazy or not as experienced. Just my opinion of course, but that's how I felt. You realise it ran poorly on PC right, high tier gaming rigs also had poor performance and issues with stuttering etc. so what does that tell you.
 

Lionel Richie

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Well it also depends how much time/capacity they had on optimising. There are busy games that don't perform as badly. When I read what was said and then looked back to Control. They sounded lazy or not as experienced. Just my opinion of course, but that's how I felt. You realise it ran poorly on PC right, high tier gaming rigs also had poor performance and issues with stuttering etc. so what does that tell you.
Maybe you're right here, I don't know. There are some bugs I noticed that really don't seem connected to anything that could affect performance, like some textures take forever to load and sometimes watching collectibles will take you out of the video screen and into a paused version of the game which is very jarring. Plenty of small stuff feel janky and I didn't know it also had issues running on a high tier PC. I won't pretend I have any idea of an explanation for those issues, maybe budget played a part in it, I just don't think you can label Remedy as incompetent. You mention busy games, Control could be the busiest game I ever played. So much happening in the screen at all times it's nuts.

I should mention I'm a huge Sam Lake fan lol.
 
Jan 29, 2019
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The fun thing is that I am trying to make his claim work in my mind, and I think that unless the game is designed to show a load screen for a while it should not load for very long.

16GB\5.5GB per second (9 with compressed data).... loading should not take more than 2 ou 3 seconds (instead of 5 / 6 on the sx).

substract some RAM area for the OS and you may end up with below 1sec loading. It would be neat if games were designed like web sites to be usable ASAP... I see games on the PS5 just opening in 100ms - bang you're in the game. by the time the OS fade to black animation is done you can either interact with something, or at least you see the title screen.

Obviously loading may require the CPU to setup the scene, etc. so that adds to loading times too.... that may be enough to hide any benefits a faster SSD may have.
 

Neo_game

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It depends on the devs I guess. Remedy I think are more into PC. I was hoping they will optimize their game on consoles. If I remember Alan Wake was some 576p with screen tear. Thier other games too do not use console in most efficiently way.
 

OSC

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Jun 16, 2018
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Obviously loading may require the CPU to setup the scene, etc. so that adds to loading times too.... that may be enough to hide any benefits a faster SSD may have.
Maybe in sloppy code, but spiderman showed the real possibility of under one second loading. It is possible that cpu scene setup is what kept it from loading 100x faster as the ssd is.
 

Pallas

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Yeh, show me where people are making duplicate threads of things that have already been discussed.


The level of desperation and anxiety around the PS5 SSD's potential strengths is palpable.

Xbox fans are too busy trying to downplay the PS5's SSD instead of enthusiastically talking about the Series X's strengths and what it will mean for games on the platform.

For shame.
Why are you only pointing out the Xbox fans? Sony fans are pretty much riding Jason’s tweets about downplaying the TF differences. Shit goes both ways, these threads are getting more ridiculous too.
 
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Goliathy

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One thing people don't bring up much with the PS5 SSD situation is that it may be user replaceable but it's not user expandable.

PS5 does not have an expansion port, you literally have to REMOVE the current drive and replace it with a bigger drive to increase storage.

If you have a Series X and you want 2 TB of storage you buy one of the 1TB expansion cards and plug it in

If you have a PS5 and want 2 TB of storage you have to buy a 2TB PCIE 4 SSD that is capable of 5.5 gbps, that is going to cost near as much as the PS5 itself for at least a few years. Those drives aren't even out yet.

For all practical purposes you are pretty much locked into the 825 GB you get with the PS5 unless you want to wait for drive to come out and spend a fortune.

This is a major flaw in Sony's design
Wait... is this true?
Sony’s messaging has been so confusing. We haven’t even seen the console yet, so is this really true?
I thought you can add storage and have basically then 2x SSDs?
 

-kb-

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Jun 17, 2019
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Wait... is this true?
Sony’s messaging has been so confusing. We haven’t even seen the console yet, so is this really true?
I thought you can add storage and have basically then 2x SSDs?
We dont know the answer to that yet, additionally its not a 5GB/s SSD you need, its closer to 7.
 
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ZywyPL

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Same with Series X, you can use expandable USB storage for legacy games or store your Series X games on it then move to the internal drive to play. But with PS5 you have to pretty much throw away your current PS5 SSD drive and then buy one more than the current drive to increase storage and keep that so called SSD advantage in speed.

Look at some of the prices here, these aren't even PCIE4 and nowhere close to 5500 mbps

The prices range from around $250-$750


When 2TB PCIE4 SSD drives that are capable of 5500 mbps come out they are probably going to be between $400-800
I can see the manufacturers who will pass Sony's certification process to actually bump the price for such drives, to capitalize that "PS5 compatible" label they will undoubtedly put on the box.
 

A2una1

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Oct 26, 2017
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Maybe, this is more PC related. Most Games now are Multiplattform and not everybody is installing their Games on a SSD on PC. So the Game Architecture still needs to support normal loading.
But I'm just thinking out loud ;)...
 

GHG

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Nov 9, 2006
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Why are you only pointing out the Xbox fans? Sony fans are pretty much riding Jason’s tweets about downplaying the TF differences. Shit goes both ways, these threads are getting more ridiculous too.
I agree and I've said as much in the other ridiculous spin threads that have popped up.

Everyone just wants to fight instead of talk about what gaming possibilities there will be with the new hardware. It's a sad state of affairs.
 

thelastword

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Apr 7, 2006
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Well I'm not sure what can help Remedy, pretty much any hardware you give them will bottleneck their games...….Their games are always low rez, lots of performance issues on consoles and even PC...…..Perhaps they should focus on removing the bottlenecks and cobwebs in their development cycle first....
 

FranXico

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Dec 7, 2010
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I agree and I've said as much in the other ridiculous spin threads that have popped up.

Everyone just wants to fight instead of talk about what gaming possibilities there will be with the new hardware. It's a sad state of affairs.
7 years of built up anger. Tribalism taken to the extreme. You can thank both of these corporations for encouraging this, especially MS.
 

Shmunter

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5.5 gig/sec = 3 sec memory full. That’s uncompressed.

What loading time??

Perhaps he means some cpu related processes may take up time.
 

GymWolf

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Jun 11, 2019
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other devs are not excited about loading times but for some innovative level design stuff that can be made with SSDs.
but only sony first party are gonna use the most speedier ssd on ps5, for third party devs doens't change much between sex and ps5. (better res and framerate on sex, faster loading times on ps5 are gonna be the most probable differencies)
 
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Handy Fake

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Huh.

I just presume he means that with the tech they can do a load more with it which will amount to bigger, more detailed games but would obviously increase loading times with it.
like this gen when we had much better TERRRAAAAFLOOOOOPS but still only had 30fps because devs used the power in other ways.
 

CatLady

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As an insider, I can confirm Remedy is not being bought by Sony, as a secret source has confirmed to me today... /s

I think what they are saying is sorta moot. Of course any team that just isn't talented can make a really poorly optimized game that has load times based on the team just being "lazy".
Sorry to break it to you but the PS warriors favorite insider, PS5 13.3flops Tommy Fisher, told us MONTHS ago that Sony had already bought Remedy.

YOU are a fake insider! :messenger_winking:
 
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carloseduardoxp

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The fun thing is that I am trying to make his claim work in my mind, and I think that unless the game is designed to show a load screen for a while it should not load for very long.

16GB\5.5GB per second (9 with compressed data).... loading should not take more than 2 ou 3 seconds (instead of 5 / 6 on the sx).

substract some RAM area for the OS and you may end up with below 1sec loading. It would be neat if games were designed like web sites to be usable ASAP... I see games on the PS5 just opening in 100ms - bang you're in the game. by the time the OS fade to black animation is done you can either interact with something, or at least you see the title screen.

Obviously loading may require the CPU to setup the scene, etc. so that adds to loading times too.... that may be enough to hide any benefits a faster SSD may have.
There are 2 ways for loading: static and dynamic.

Static loading is when the gameplay "stop" to wait. It´s something like when you see a cut-scene, or the classic loading you may know.

Dynamic loading is the streaming process presented by Mark Cerny in "road to PS5".

I mean that you will have only one static loading on game init. And then, many dynamic loading times occurring in gameplay.

Certain this is a massive new way to design games.
 

hemo memo

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So he’s saying new gen is old gen basically. At least 1st party games are going to be very optimized.
 
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EDMIX

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Sorry to break it to you but the PS warriors favorite insider, PS5 13.3flops Tommy Fisher, told us MONTHS ago that Sony had already bought Remedy.

YOU are a fake insider! :messenger_winking:
I mean ....yea, thats why it had a "/s" at the end.. of it....like....a joke, like ha ha funny..

 

CatLady

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I mean ....yea, thats why it had a "/s" at the end.. of it....like....a joke, like ha ha funny..

I know.
My reply was also a joke hence the :messenger_winking: at the end of my post.
 
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EDMIX

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I know.
My reply was also a joke hence the :messenger_winking: at the end of my post.
We was both about the lolz then! lol

On a side note, I wonder if it means the so called insider was wrong, or if Sony was going to buy Remedy and didn't after looking them over. Sorta how that rumor of PS4 being 4gigs was actually true and Sony on advice from developers put in 8gigs. What if thats what happened and the person was correct they where being bought, but didn't know it feel threw or something?
 
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Redlight

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What the Remedy guy says makes a lot of sense. We've been through plenty of generations where people have assumed that new tech would mean must faster framerates only to find that more detailed graphics/textures etc cancel out the power advantage and we're back to 30fps (and below). SSD's will definitely be better, but demoing them with current gen software is pretty misleading.