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[DeepEnigma]

Am I? It's pretty evident and we even have people here trying to figure out why by reverting to pre-patch. Stating the game looks blurry except on the X is not a stretch by any means.

It is nice and clean on the base PS4 (so not all), due to being locked in native 1080p resolution, even on 4K sets with decent scalers due to the even integer.

Now if you play the game zoomed in like the DF screenshots, then I can see the comparison.

Same thing with God of War. I have yet the need to upgrade the base model (since it is now getting close to next gen), since that was locked 1080p/30, and the IQ was impeccable.

 

[AgentP]

To be honest it isn't "sharp" on the X either. It looks great, but with the temporal AA and post-processing you lose a lot of sharpness like you see in the first RDR via BC.

 

[Musky_Cheese]

Because it would be more believable. GOW has a legitimate shot at game of the gen or game of the year. Spider-Man is hollow hype. Sorry, but my disappointment level after that lame boss fight with Rhino turned me off the game. Hopefully Insomniac can improve for the sequel. Suspect they were rushed.

Meet in the middle with Knack?

 

[Redneckerz]

It is nice and sharp on the base PS4 (so not all), due to being locked in native 1080p resolution, even on 4K sets with decent scalers due to the even integer.

Now if you play the game zoomed in like the DF screenshots, then I can see the comparison.

Same thing with God of War. I have yet the need to upgrade the base model (since it is now getting close to next gen), since that was locked 1080p, and the IQ was impeccable.

I mean... yeah. I would wager something like stipulated shadows on Base XBO would be criticized much more than a blurrier image on Pro.
I mean, its 1920x2160, and X also looks a smidge sharper due to textures (extra RAM/GPU horsepower). Does not mean the Pro is any less great though, or atleast thats the sentiment i am getting here purely because the output image is less sharp than the X.

Even for DF threads that's reaching imo.

To be honest it isn't "sharp" on the X either. It looks great, but with the temporal AA and post-processing you lose a lot of sharpness like you see in the first RDR via BC.

I would imagine the local fog's also don't help.

Despite all that though, the game is technically stellar on all platforms - Yes, even on XBO, despite being less than even the PS4. That DDR3/ESRAM combination really is hurting the machine towards the end of this gen, though even XBO base still is equally well as GTA V - And that was perfectly respectable.

 

[wvnative]

To me the game looks poor on my E7 oled. SDR looks dark even with brightness cranked all the way up. HDR looks good in darker areas but in any amount sunlight the screen looks like its bathed in Vaseline.

PS4 Pro. Hope improvements can be made. But the graphics look great.

 

[Raven117]

Am I? It's pretty evident and we even have people here trying to figure out why by reverting to pre-patch. Stating the game looks blurry except on the X is not a stretch by any means.

Blurry doesn't mean as sharp as xboxX. Glad you are enjoying playing on your system of choice. (It looks to be a bit better).

 

[Elenchus]

Meet in the middle with Knack?

Deal.

 

[Stuart360]

Just read through the thread, noticed a few overly giddy Xbox fans got banned, yet 'you know who' continues to be free to say what he wants. I mean granted he hasn't said anything bad in this thread (because he simply couldnt), but the point stands and he will get away with his fanboy shit going forard like he always does. You know there is a problem when even Digital Foundry staff members are taking the piss out of him, i dont think NeoGaf staff realize how much he pulls this forum down reputation wise.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

The two posts that led to two temporary bans were pretty much just the exact opposite of what valid discussion should look like. (In my opinion)

i dont think NeoGaf staff realize how much he pulls this forum down reputation wise.

Seriously?

TLW takes the PS4 Pro passion a little too far sometimes but I mean, is it that serious?

Honestly this whole thing is so stale. I wish we could take a "two wrongs don't make a rightL approach and move on.

 

[Stuart360]

The two posts that led to two temporary bans were pretty much just the exact opposite of what valid discussion should look like.



Seriously?

TLW takes it a little too far sometimes but I mean, is it that serious?

Honestly this whole thing is so stale.

I see his name mentioned all the time elsewhere, and not in a good way. Its people like him that causes the whole 'SonyGaf' shite, especially when he seems to have a free reign on here. And like i said, you have Digital Foundry staff members taking the piss out of him, its not a good look for this forum imo.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

I just deleted and reinstalled the game without the patch just to see if it made any difference. I don't know if it's just my eyes, but I think there might be a minimal change to the picture. The image is a bit darker after patch and maybe a tiny bit lower res, maybe.

I'm sure if D dark10x tried it he'd have the definite answer.

It was me, I was trying to figure it out last night. I can't put my finger on what has changed, it is not placebo. I think it's something to do with AA and HDR. Without the patch and HDR disabled the game looks so much cleaner. I also noted the Sharpness slider is introduced in update version 1.02, it is not available in 1.00




That's a shame, would of been interesting to find out if me and TLZ are going nuts lol

Ive continued to play the game without updating, it seems the game is nicer to look at without it until R* address the issue.

Are you both rocking it un-patched moving forward? I am tempted to go get a physical copy

 

[Angelsx]

To me the game looks poor on my E7 oled. SDR looks dark even with brightness cranked all the way up. HDR looks good in darker areas but in any amount sunlight the screen looks like its bathed in Vaseline.

PS4 Pro. Hope improvements can be made. But the graphics look great.

Same here.B7 and pro and picture doesn't look sharp at all.

 

[carsar]

Just a little investigation how other games can look with 4100000m pixels and taa.
4K

2688x1514p

1080p

1514p looks much better than 1080p on my 4k TV. So, I hope we'll see same resolution for RDR2 on ps pro.

 

[Ptownrich]

The two posts that led to two temporary bans were pretty much just the exact opposite of what valid discussion should look like. (In my opinion)



Seriously?

TLW takes the PS4 Pro passion a little too far sometimes but I mean, is it that serious?

Honestly this whole thing is so stale. I wish we could take a "two wrongs don't make a rightL approach and move on.

Passion for Playstation is fine. It's a great console. It's his trolling of Xbox that's problematic. He actually spends the majority of his time posting about Microsofts machines. Weird. Every time he talks about PS4 its always in relation to the Xbox. Everything is a competition and nothing (Xbox) can be judged on its own merits. Whatevs.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

Just a little investigation how other games can look with 4100000m pixels and taa.
4K

2688x1514p

1080p

1514p looks much better than 1080p on my 4k TV. So, I hope we'll see same resolution for RDR2 on ps pro.

Is that BF2? I never played it, but that looks pretty.

 

[EtherMagic]

1920x2160 is 4.147200 pixels, Rockstar had other options with same performance budget:

2560x1440 - (3.686400 pixels) they would get better perf and less artifacts on screen

2715x1527 - (4.145805) is the resolution I would use, render it raw (no cb) with good upscaling and 4K hud. This option retains same performance, has correct aspect ratio of pixels and no cb artifacts.

I think base PS4 version is better than Pro version in IQ department thanks to strange decisions of developers.

I don't think it was RockStar making the "Strange" decision in regards to resolution, i really think it was Sony and their decision to make sure they could market the game as a 4K experience. Sony knew what they were up against with the One X, they had to have an answer to not feel left behind. I'm figuring if the Pro version was atleast half 4k (horizontal), Sony would be able to get away with marketing the game as 4K with the comfort that the average consumer would look at the One X and Pro versions both having 4K on their boxes. IMO it wasn't RockStar that f**ked up, it was Sony's demands for their own marketing campaign.

 

[carsar]

Is that BF2? I never played it, but that looks pretty.

This is SW BF 1

 

[thelastword]

Just a little investigation how other games can look with 4100000m pixels and taa.
4K

2688x1514p

1080p

1514p looks much better than 1080p on my 4k TV. So, I hope we'll see same resolution for RDR2 on ps pro.

Great post on the topic at hand, showing the actual visible differences we see at varying resolutions with TAA on top....MightySquirrel had a great post as well, only that time with CB vs Native.....This here is just as good, since it shows native vs native with TAA on.....So if there is no reprojection going on with RDR2 on PRO.....then normal rendering on a 16:9 ratio should prove better over botched CB.....Yet, I do think they're trying to CB here....., if not, that aspect ratio is not playing nice with TAA....not in the least bit....

I don't think it was RockStar making the "Strange" decision in regards to resolution, i really think it was Sony and their decision to make sure they could market the game as a 4K experience. Sony knew what they were up against with the One X, they had to have an answer to not feel left behind. I'm figuring if the Pro version was atleast half 4k (horizontal), Sony would be able to get away with marketing the game as 4K with the comfort that the average consumer would look at the One X and Pro versions both having 4K on their boxes. IMO it wasn't RockStar that f**ked up, it was Sony's demands for their own marketing campaign.

They are the devs, I think it was their decision....Let's be honest though, even if Sony said they wanted Rockstar to hit 4KCB, it was definitely within reach and not some aeronauatical demand......If the XBONEX can do 4k Native, the PRO can do 1620p-1800p native (as per spec), yet, 4K-CB demands a lower footprint than both of these resolutions, and the image may be sharper than 1620p or 1800p native with perf uplifts ontop, I think that's a reasonable request for such a reknowned dev....In any case......If Sony wanted 4KCB for PRO, I'm pretty sure they thought Rockstar could handle it with aplomb, as many third parties have shown to do, across many 4KCB titles on PRO at the minute........

 

[wolgoen]

Are you both rocking it un-patched moving forward? I am tempted to go get a physical copy

I am for now, it's difficult to find a good way to measure the differences between patched and unpatched. I'm fairly sure you cannot have a digital copy and physical copy of the same game on one console so you cannot easily swap between the two and compare. You have to delete and reinstall each time which is a ball ache.

I think framerate is worse in the unpatched version which would explain the alleged drop in visual quality after patching. Quality was reduced to compensate for frame drops. I think my Pro's fans are louder when running unpatched which may be an indicator the visuals are better and it's working harder to run the game. Unfortunately as I said, I 'think' frame rate is not as smooth unpatched.

It's a difficult situation to experiment with due to the time consumption deleting and reinstalling each time. The only bonus is save games are not affected so you can reload a checkpoint and try to identify the differences.

Give the physical version a whirl, just don't shout at me when you maybe don't see any differences and wasted money lol.

But yeah, for now I'm sticking with unpatched and the occasional frame drops as my eyes say it looks better visually. Each to their own etc etc

 

[EtherMagic]

Great post on the topic at hand, showing the actual visible differences we see at varying resolutions with TAA on top....MightySquirrel had a great post as well, only that time with CB vs Native.....This here is just as good, since it shows native vs native with TAA on.....So if there is no reprojection going on with RDR2 on PRO.....then normal rendering on a 16:9 ratio should prove better over botched CB.....Yet, I do think they're trying to CB here....., if not, that aspect ratio is not playing nice with TAA....not in the least bit....

They are the devs, I think it was their decision....Let's be honest though, even if Sony said they wanted Rockstar to hit 4KCB, it was definitely within reach and not some aeronauatical demand......If the XBONEX can do 4k Native, the PRO can do 1620p-1800p native (as per spec), yet, 4K-CB demands a lower footprint than both of these resolutions, and the image may be sharper than 1620p or 1800p native with perf uplifts ontop, I think that's a reasonable request for such a reknowned dev....In any case......If Sony wanted 4KCB for PRO, I'm pretty sure they thought Rockstar could handle it with aplomb, as many third parties have shown to do, across many 4KCB titles on PRO at the minute........

I disagree with this, Sony has always had high demands for their consoles, especially on developers, and especially on developers they are paying a ton of money to market the game for their console.

One developer said on another forum... "All the Tree's and Foliage take such a tax on the hardware compared to just stationary objects, such as buildings (Spiderman), because they need to MOVE with the climate! Stationary objects like buildings, statues in time square, are easy for the system to procees, once you have all these things moving at once it becomes a challenge."

I have a hard time believing RockStar made this decision on their own (They are too good at their craft, optimizing, ect), especially with how the game looks on the Pro, Sony is definatly involved in one way or another, as far as demands are concerned. There is NO WAY IN HELL RockStar would have left the Pro version looking the way it does without involvement from Sony demands, there are a million other ways they could have made the game look better without adding any 4k what-so-ever!

 

[CrustyBritches]

Does anybody have any evidence to suggest a downgrade from the original footage shown, or is it possible that now that everybody has seen the uncompromised 4K version, the Pro doesn't look so hot?

 

[DeepEnigma]

Does anybody have any evidence to suggest a downgrade from the original footage shown, or is it possible that now that everybody has seen the uncompromised 4K version, the Pro doesn't look so hot?

Videos are usually captured from the frame buffer. There does not appear to be any downgrade, at least not anything mentioned by DF.

Maybe D dark10x can comment further if they noticed anything?

 

[[Asmodean]]

I could be in the minority here, and I'm not intending to start a 'debate', but I am curious what others think of R*s chosen scaling method for the Pro?.

I genuinely think the combination of imbalanced XY pixel count, and the recontruction used leaves the Pro looking very poor. Imo, the base PS4 version looks cleaner on a 4K display..

Edit: I'm guessing seeing as they didn't need to use it for any of the other console versions, that not as much effort was put in.. They probably didn't want to spend resources on a good checkerboard from 1440p solution as it was only for the Pro.. Both base consoles use 1080p, and the X is native.

 

[thelastword]

I disagree with this, Sony has always had high demands for their consoles, especially on developers, and especially on developers they are paying a ton of money to market the game for their console.

One developer said on another forum... "All the Tree's and Foliage take such a tax on the hardware compared to just stationary objects, such as buildings (Spiderman), because they need to MOVE with the climate! Stationary objects like buildings, statues in time square, are easy for the system to procees, once you have all these things moving at once it becomes a challenge."

I have a hard time believing RockStar made this decision on their own. (They are too good with this sh*t, optimizing, ect), especially with how the game looks on the Pro, Sony is definatly involved in one way or another, as far as demands are concerned. There is NO WAY IN HELL RockStar would have left the Pro version looking the way it does without involvement from Sony demands, there are a million other ways they could have made the game look better without adding any 4k what-what-so-ever!

Yet, 1920 x 2160p is not native 4K, neither is 4KCB......Even if the game rendered at 1440p/1620p, persons would still refer to it as the 4K mode because that would be geared to persons with a 4K tv......Obviously, in a tech thread we know what's superior, but marketing could just say that RDR2 outputs at 2160p for any of these modes as usual.....As I said, I think Sony actual wanted 8,294, 400 pixels, (but through CB), which is reasonable and what PRO was built for......If they demanded something, it's not like they demanded something outrageous......It was actually something quite reasonable...

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

I could be in the minority here, and I'm not intending to start a 'debate', but I am curious what others think of R*s chosen scaling method for the Pro?.

I genuinely think the combination of imbalanced XY pixel count, and the recontruction used leaves the Pro looking very poor. Imo, the base PS4 version looks cleaner on a 4K display..

Edit: I'm guessing seeing as they didn't need to use it for any of the other console versions, that not as much effort was put in.. They probably didn't want to spend resources on a good checkerboard from 1440p solution as it was only for the Pro.. Both base consoles use 1080p, and the X is native.

As DF said, the scaling method for the Pro seems "botched." I agree with what you said about base looking cleaner than Pro

I definitely don't think you're in the minority

 

[Stuart360]

Would the Pro version actually look better on a 1080p display?

 

[EtherMagic]

Yet, 1920 x 2160p is not native 4K, neither is 4KCB......Even if the game rendered at 1440p/1620p, persons would still refer to it as the 4K mode because that would be geared to persons with a 4K tv......Obviously, in a tech thread we know what's superior, but marketing could just say that RDR2 outputs at 2160p for any of these modes as usual.....As I said, I think Sony actual wanted 8,294, 400 pixels, (but through CB), which is reasonable and what PRO was built for......If they demanded something, it's not like they demanded something outrageous......It was actually something quite reasonable...

No it's not 4K, but half of it is, and that's my point, that's what i feel Sony demanded for their marketing just to be able to put 4K on the box. You have some good points, but i just don't feel you are thinking from a business standpoint here, your thinking strickly technical.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

Would the Pro version actually look better on a 1080p display?

This is what I was trying to figure out yesterday.

On a 1080p display I kept going back and forth with supersampling turned off and on. It wasn't a big difference either way but it really seemed like I was getting a cleaner image with SS off, which I assume would be the standard PS4 base output with maybe just better FPS from the extra Pro power

 

[Damian Monroe]

I don't think it was RockStar making the "Strange" decision in regards to resolution, i really think it was Sony and their decision to make sure they could market the game as a 4K experience. Sony knew what they were up against with the One X, they had to have an answer to not feel left behind. I'm figuring if the Pro version was atleast half 4k (horizontal), Sony would be able to get away with marketing the game as 4K with the comfort that the average consumer would look at the One X and Pro versions both having 4K on their boxes. IMO it wasn't RockStar that f**ked up, it was Sony's demands for their own marketing campaign.

This. The Sony adverts on UK tv are saying 'play red dead 2 in 4k on playstation'

 

[CrustyBritches]

Yet, 1920 x 2160p is not native 4K, neither is 4KCB...

This game is 4KCB on PS4 Pro.

 

[TLZ]

Are you both rocking it un-patched moving forward? I am tempted to go get a physical copy

Yeah for now I will. Until this whole situation is addressed or we have a patch or whatever. Not in a rush.

 

[Strife In a Teacup]

I disagree with this, Sony has always had high demands for their consoles

If only Sony had the same respect they do the fans of their brand/consoles as they did for the FANS within their consoles itself.

Maybe they can partner with Dyson for the PS5.

 

[TLZ]

I am for now, it's difficult to find a good way to measure the differences between patched and unpatched. I'm fairly sure you cannot have a digital copy and physical copy of the same game on one console so you cannot easily swap between the two and compare. You have to delete and reinstall each time which is a ball ache.

I think framerate is worse in the unpatched version which would explain the alleged drop in visual quality after patching. Quality was reduced to compensate for frame drops. I think my Pro's fans are louder when running unpatched which may be an indicator the visuals are better and it's working harder to run the game. Unfortunately as I said, I 'think' frame rate is not as smooth unpatched.

It's a difficult situation to experiment with due to the time consumption deleting and reinstalling each time. The only bonus is save games are not affected so you can reload a checkpoint and try to identify the differences.

Give the physical version a whirl, just don't shout at me when you maybe don't see any differences and wasted money lol.

But yeah, for now I'm sticking with unpatched and the occasional frame drops as my eyes say it looks better visually. Each to their own etc etc

In the same boat as you. I do feel the framerates jumping all around but nothing bad. Pretty obvious why it's patched imo.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

In the same boat as you. I do feel the framerates jumping all around but nothing bad. Pretty obvious why it's patched imo.

Kind of makes me wish that more games/all games took the approach of Nioh, the last two Tomb Raider games, GoW, etc and gave performance vs resolution options

 

[EtherMagic]

Would the Pro version actually look better on a 1080p display?

My only guess is when put in 1080p, it puts the game in base PS4 mode, which many think looks better then the Pro as it takes all the extra weird fluff added in the Pro version off the top.

 

[TLZ]

Kind of makes me wish that more games/all games took the approach of Nioh, the last two Tomb Raider games, GoW, etc and gave performance vs resolution options

Yeah. I thought this was a given tbh.

How do I put the game in 1080p mode btw? Do I run the game then switch display to 1080p in PS4 settings? Because I tried that and I didn't notice any difference. That made me think the Pro was maybe running in 1080p to begin with. Dunno.

 

[Nikana]

The two posts that led to two temporary bans were pretty much just the exact opposite of what valid discussion should look like. (In my opinion)



Seriously?

TLW takes the PS4 Pro passion a little too far sometimes but I mean, is it that serious?

Honestly this whole thing is so stale. I wish we could take a "two wrongs don't make a rightL approach and move on.

The whole point is that Gaf is supposed to be a place where intelligent conversation is a thing. That was supposed to be the reason why it exists and is hard to get into.

Istead the moderators just wait for "trigger" words and people like TLW know it. So they tip toe around everything .

 

[Stuart360]

Just a little investigation how other games can look with 4100000m pixels and taa.
4K

2688x1514p

1080p

1514p looks much better than 1080p on my 4k TV. So, I hope we'll see same resolution for RDR2 on ps pro.

Man Battlefront 1 and 2 dont get enough credit for their graphics imo, in fact parts of the campaign on Battlefront 2 look better than any other game i have seen, on PC anyway.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

Yeah. I thought this was a given tbh.

How do I put the game in 1080p mode btw? Do I run the game then switch display to 1080p in PS4 settings? Because I tried that and I didn't notice any difference. That made me think the Pro was maybe running in 1080p to begin with. Dunno.

My understanding is set Pro output to 1080p and turn off SS. Honestly I don't know for sure if anything makes a difference for the Pro

 

[WouldYouKindly]

You people are nit picking fucking HARD i just started the game up for the first time and it looks gorgeous on my pro like holy fuck. You guys made it seem like the pro version was ps3 levels just lol. I will say tho shadow of the tomb raider, god of war and spiderman all do look better then this.

 

[RoyBrown7777]

Shock, console with better hardware produces a prettier version of the game. Euro gamer must hate the difference being so obvious. I was more interested last gen when it came down to how much effort was put into Sony's shitty CPU.

 

[RandallFlagg]

I have no idea what this "vaseline" stuffs all about. It looks amazing on my Pro. Not blurry, not as clean as GOW but GOW is no where near as big as a game as RDR2 is so whats the deal?

 

[dark10x]

Videos are usually captured from the frame buffer. There does not appear to be any downgrade, at least not anything mentioned by DF.

Maybe D dark10x can comment further if they noticed anything?

I don't think it was downgraded at all. We noticed all the same Pro issues in the trailers!

 

[IbizaPocholo]

 

[Kagey K]

.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Damn man that's sounds racist as fuck. The saying is nit picking. It's a term for picking out lice. For example; I had to nit pick her hair tonight because she didn't go over it with a fine toothed comb.

Just so you know baby lice are called nits.

Not sure what nip pick would mean. Either you are tearing round skin tags off of other people's chests, or you think Asian people are small enough to grab and pick up.

Huh? I think you are fighting windmills here...

 

[Kagey K]

.

 

[Panajev2001a]

It was a correction of a typo is all, or a correction of a saying.

Nip= The N word of Asian ppl. They were called Nippers for a long time around where I am. I have always associated it as being just as bad as the N word.

I'm not calling that person racist, I just said it sounded like a racist term to me.

Again depending if it's used as a verb or a noun. I can go nip a branch off my tree vs. I don't hate the Nip that lives next door to me.

Maybe it's local slang (I honestly don't know) and that's why it feels foreign to you.

I did not know if that use of the word was racist, did not personally hear it in the kind of racist context you mentioned before.

Still, was it more likely that the person was saying something racist (which is kind of saying someone is racist) or that a typo was made?
I think the latter is much much more likely and thus maybe jumping in raising the racist card seems to me kind of odd.

 

[Kagey K]

.

 

[David Ricardo]

I was playing in 1080p no supersampling with my PS4 pro because I had heard that when supersampled the image looked softer, but I just tried it and it apparently looks pretty good. What graphical downgrade should I notice when playing SS compared to native 1080p? I don't see any.