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Reverse racial discrimination - paging Lawyer-GAF
- Thread starter DigitalDevil
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DigitalDevil
Member
I have seen three other managers at my level demoted in the last five years. None of them have been promoted again. So, yeah, it's likely. Unless I leave that is.
Dreams-Visions
Member
Or maybe they just like him more.
Already been said countless times, OP, but unless you really know that manager and his situation...it's pretty fucking insulting to simply point to race and say, "hey, that must be it!"
But if you want to find out for sure either way, you should press the issue with HR or see a lawyer. Risky play, though. Considering how little information you have.
GoldenEye 007
Member
Of course intangibles are important. But how much should they be weighed? Of course if someone is an asshole and impossible to work with, I would understand (that could very well be possible in this case). But if they can get along with others, do better, but just not kiss as much ass, that definitely sucks. Unless of course the chief ass kisser can also outperform the other person.
I see. Well, they didn't cut your pay so I would just suck it up until you can find a new job. That's the real path to advancement anyway
crimzonflame
Member
Were black people involved in those situations as well?
This is the long and short of it. Anything further is just reddit-grade masturbatory nonsense from a privileged person who wants to feel slighted.
DigitalDevil
Member
I do know that manager, we worked together every day. He has dodged bullet after bullet, always getting moved instead of fired. A previous boss told me point blank he had wanted him gone for years but HR had told him to make sure his case was "bullet proof" because of potential issues. He walks around the office cracking jokes about "that's because I'm black". He was told publicly on a conference call that he was basically a cunt hair away from termination due to performance. Yet, he just gets a transfer, and I'm demoted. I am not imagining this!
ReBurn
Gold Member
Then leave, because that's really your only remedy. Sometimes the only way to continue moving up the ladder is to change ladders.
piratepwnsninja
Member
I'd guess its just politics. Someone knew someone and did them a favor, which sucks for you. I've had it happen to me before in retail.
I was actually managing two EBGames stores at the same time due to a manager getting fired and kept both well above district averages in both presales and memberships, etc (was actually #1 in them often). This was with one of the stores being in a mall that was going to be demolished to make way for a strip mall, in which a new EBGames would be, but 6-8 months later. Well, instead of just making me manager of the store that was staying open, the district manager had a friend that was looking to move out of Detroit and had worked with him when he was a manager at Foot Locker. So he made her manager of that store and I was demoted back to assistant manager in both title and pay, a month before Christmas. This was 'only until the new store was built and reopened' but I actually told them that wasn't cool with me and left.
Much respect to the person they did bring in though. She wasn't even aware of the situation and when I told her she admitted it was bullshit that it happened that way.
I was actually managing two EBGames stores at the same time due to a manager getting fired and kept both well above district averages in both presales and memberships, etc (was actually #1 in them often). This was with one of the stores being in a mall that was going to be demolished to make way for a strip mall, in which a new EBGames would be, but 6-8 months later. Well, instead of just making me manager of the store that was staying open, the district manager had a friend that was looking to move out of Detroit and had worked with him when he was a manager at Foot Locker. So he made her manager of that store and I was demoted back to assistant manager in both title and pay, a month before Christmas. This was 'only until the new store was built and reopened' but I actually told them that wasn't cool with me and left.
Much respect to the person they did bring in though. She wasn't even aware of the situation and when I told her she admitted it was bullshit that it happened that way.
CrushDance
Banned
Well said. I'd be confident in saying that we all know someone in our place of work who is still around.
DigitalDevil
Member
I'm not a bigot, this is a real situation I've found myself in. I don't have anything against black people or any people, period. I do have something against being demoted versus an underperformer because I'm less likely to cause a stink. Apparently they were right that nothing will happen, though. I mean I'm just an angry privileged white guy who apparently is a huge racist, right? This can't possibly be a real thing that is happening! I must just be a bigot! Fuck.
DigitalDevil
Member
This is neogaf. What the fuck was I expecting? Thanks for the vent session.
CrushDance
Banned
Um. Did anyone say that alone? What people said was to just be careful and confront the people in charge about it when you have a backup.
You've made a lot of assumptions and you haven't shown they were reasonable. That's why you're getting flack.
Is this what the bitter, overlooked and jobless tell themselves?
user8503492
Banned
I just got passed over for a job with Comcast cause, as the guy said, I didnt seem "Urban enough"
Basically a safety concern from what another employee at another location told me, they dont like to send white guys, who look like me, out into Trenton as a tech :/
Basically a safety concern from what another employee at another location told me, they dont like to send white guys, who look like me, out into Trenton as a tech :/
CrushDance
Banned
You don't think favouritism exists?
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
It's do with motivation. Affirmative action isn't racism because it seeks to counter act the results of discriminatory practices. The act is discriminatory based on race, but the intended outcome is one of equality - all races are treated equally. At the individual level though it is possible to discriminate based on race in the same manner but with the outcome not being equal. If you want to call discriminating based on race to correct perceived racial inequality 'racism' that is fine, but trying to distinguish between the two is not a bad thing in my book.
Bay Maximus
Banned
You're just bitter and upset about your situation so you need an enemy or some unfair circumstances to resolve the cognitive dissonance. After all, it can't possibly have anything to do with you that you got demoted. I think if we're being sincere, everyone has tried to blame others for their own failures at some point. Doesn't make you racist, just makes you human.
Then why the thread title?You injected racism from the beginning.
Wait if you have such a negative opinion about Neogaf then why even post.
teacupcopter
Banned
So my boss took my co worker out for coffee the other day. My Co-Worker is Greek I'm caucasian.
Thing is, I was going to go out for coffee afterwards to have a chat but I was busy when she got back... then she makes up this other thing like about how she had to go and hoped I had a really good day and anything I want to chat about call her.
Fuck this shit, clearly I didn't get a coffee because I'm white.
Thing is, I was going to go out for coffee afterwards to have a chat but I was busy when she got back... then she makes up this other thing like about how she had to go and hoped I had a really good day and anything I want to chat about call her.
Fuck this shit, clearly I didn't get a coffee because I'm white.
This would have been helpful in the OP.
Anyway, as others have said, get your resume out there to start working up another ladder. At this point, you trying to get justice for perceived or actual discrimination will only hinder your career and personal growth. Ya, it may make you feel better to try and fight this, but what other increasingly litigation averse HR departments will see is someone who causing trouble for their previous employer. Get out of there as others here have pointed out, things are going downhill for the company anyway. If there are people you feel bad about leaving behind, maybe you'll get lucky and find a place you can pull them along with you.
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
See the problem is OP, you injected race into this.
This has nothing to do with racial discrimination against you. It has nothing to do with racial discrimination whatsoever.
So when you say its racial discrimination, not only do you incense those who recognize actual patterns of racial discrimination in the workplace, you also come of like slighted anrgy white man who immediately runs to racial discrimination as a way to whine about how people of color are getting one over on him, when in your case, it's not apt.
Is your black coworker and idiot? Yes. Does your black coworker also not understand that he is fucking things up for other people of color down the road who may have real, legitimate issues with race and the workplace? Fuck yes.
You got fucked by upper management who are too weak to handle their shit.
This has nothing to do with racial discrimination against you. It has nothing to do with racial discrimination whatsoever.
So when you say its racial discrimination, not only do you incense those who recognize actual patterns of racial discrimination in the workplace, you also come of like slighted anrgy white man who immediately runs to racial discrimination as a way to whine about how people of color are getting one over on him, when in your case, it's not apt.
Is your black coworker and idiot? Yes. Does your black coworker also not understand that he is fucking things up for other people of color down the road who may have real, legitimate issues with race and the workplace? Fuck yes.
You got fucked by upper management who are too weak to handle their shit.
oneils
Member
Ok. But, what I find weird is that your old branch was closed down. What happened there? Maybe they just consider you to be fallout.
Whatever it is, I think the writing is on the wall and that you should be looking for another job.
Oh so you make a thread and jump to conclusions about how "it's cus hes black lol" without any actual reasonable evidence for it and you expect not to get flack?
You said a bunch of other people went through the same thing as you. Did their scenario also involve black people? Have you ever considered that maybe this black guy had connections that you don't have due to him being there for much longer than you? You said you aren't a kiss-ass. Have you ever considered that maybe he is and that's why he kept his position and you lost yours? Have you ever considered that maybe they just don't like you?
There's a huge possibility of things here, but the first thing you mention is that it's because he's black.
Yeah I could see why you lost your position.
For someone so fired-up, I find it really odd that you would leave out something THIS relevant to the situation. Maybe you should put this in the OP so people won't think you are just making stuff up.
Deified Data
Banned
Probably nothing racial going on, but if there is there's really nothing you can do about it. Suck it up or move on, regardless.
I don't even know where to begin with this thread...
OP, I know it's easy to place the blame on external factors not related to yourself, but could there be any reason, any reason at all, that you were demoted among the three? It might be easy to just accept it though- nothing good comes out of ill will.
And if need be, start looking for another job. Beef up your resume and then go at it.
OP, I know it's easy to place the blame on external factors not related to yourself, but could there be any reason, any reason at all, that you were demoted among the three? It might be easy to just accept it though- nothing good comes out of ill will.
And if need be, start looking for another job. Beef up your resume and then go at it.
Yeah the company I work for measures your and "performance and values" and plot it on a somewhat xy chart.
Also you did not give enough info. You say you blow him out the water, which is just a blanket statement. Is the guy a bad performer or does he get the job done? Just because you outperform him doesn't mean he doesn't meet the requirements.
Middle Management is not about performance. It's about knowing the right people, laughing at the right jokes and being reliable; more than anything it's about just being good enough. I've been navigating through office politics for a long time and guys like the OP that think companies are true meritocracies always crash hard when they start aiming for the top positions.
It's a game you gotta play, and of course race plays a role in it, so you gotta play to your strenghts. Same thing with "femme fatales" rising through the ranks, or kids from important families. It's not fair but they'd be dumb to not use whatever edge they have to advance their careers.
It's a game you gotta play, and of course race plays a role in it, so you gotta play to your strenghts. Same thing with "femme fatales" rising through the ranks, or kids from important families. It's not fair but they'd be dumb to not use whatever edge they have to advance their careers.
Rice-Eater
Member
My younger brother got the short end of stick to. He and this other girl ran a line at there company. She was the lead and he was the floater or co-lead(or something like that). Basically he did everything from running around and helping people to fixing machine problems while she didn't do anything nor does she know anything at all. My bro had a conversation with her about work, she really doesn't know shit. She just happens to be the daughter of the plant boss and because of that she can do whatever she wants. A new line opened up and she got moved there instead of my bro, but he's ok with it because he's just glad that she's gone. But even the supervisors there wouldn't dare speak ill of her because of who she is and have on more then one occasion complimented her on her great work ethic.
So basically, it fucking sucks how most companies are run. Having connections or being friends with the bosses seems to matter more than performance most of of the time from what I've read and experienced myself. At almost every place I've worked at, I've recalled my fellow employees complaining about how this or that guy gets it so good because he/she is related to a higher up in the company or get along with the boss very well.
So basically, it fucking sucks how most companies are run. Having connections or being friends with the bosses seems to matter more than performance most of of the time from what I've read and experienced myself. At almost every place I've worked at, I've recalled my fellow employees complaining about how this or that guy gets it so good because he/she is related to a higher up in the company or get along with the boss very well.
I think I would have a better case against my neighborhood Popeye's. My ex girlfriend was doing the ordering one time and she sounded like an obnoxious valley girl. My three piece dark dinner was all wings and half a container of red beans and rice.
I never seem to have a problem when I order though.
I never seem to have a problem when I order though.
Maybe you don't do a good enough job of communicating what you do with the higher ups
Maybe you communicate too much over things that are not of much importance to those in charge
Maybe you do not communicate well at all
Maybe you are not as popular with the people making the decisions
Maybe you were getting paid more than he was
Maybe you have skills that are more in line with someone lower in the hierarchy
Maybe you socialize with other co-workers and management feels that your relationship with them can cloud your judgement
Maybe you made a poor first impression on someone in power
Maybe you have an overly optimistic view of the quality of your work
Maybe you have a tendency to blame others for your own failings, a quality that those in charge do not encourage
Maybe a thousand reasons, but the one you went for was "affirmative action"
DigitalDevil
Member
No, my branch was doing great. We ran a 30% profit margin last year which was great for a branch my size and far above my budgeted target. They are reducing the brick and mortar locations company wide, there were over fifty branches closed, and it wasn't due to performance. They are trying to streamline the organization.
Yeah and the thing is he seems so convinced about it.
Lace up your boots and keep up the hard work don't become a disgruntled employee. I supervise over a couple employees and there is always a couple that feel like there is a conspiracy or that they should be entitled to every new position that arises. I go to all thier annual reviews and their overall rating isn't what they think it is.
Supermanisdead
Member
Tbh, just by reading this thread, I'd rather promote someone else.
TUROK
Member
Funny you should point that out, considering nobody here has done that.
I love these types of threads. They always make other people's biases very easy to spot.
I especially like how everyone acts like racial reasons are the least likely reason this happened. It's like, "nah OP, you probably just weren't as good as you thought you were."
This may not be the OP being discriminated against racially, but it really sounds like they just won't fire the guy because they're afraid of him playing the race card once he is terminated. So assuming what the OP says is true, race definitely plays a hand in this, although it's because of the weaksauce upper management.
DigitalDevil
Member
It's not like the first thing I did after finding out was post on GAF. I've been thinking about this for weeks.
DigitalDevil
Member
What would you say your weaknesses are?
(Having an answer to this prepared will be helpful if you decide to look for a new position.)
That about sums it up.
Office politics are the absolute worst but NOTHING can be worse than jumping to conclusions without knowing for an absolutely FACT that you are right.
I would definitely ask why you got passed up and demoted. I think even unreasonable managers would give you some kind of answer. Obviously you want to phrase it as so you can improve yourself.
Having "friends" in higher places even if its in places you don't know about makes all the difference in the world. Seniority even if it didn't seem like that was taken into account. Obviously the likability etc etc.
No job place will pass you up for being white because they were scared of a black person suing them if they have as easy tracked job metrics like you are saying. Especially if the difference was as large as you are insinuating.
What it all comes back down to is that you HAVE to ask why were passed up. Even if its a bullshit excuse they have to give you something and maybe it might give you a hint towards why.
I would definitely ask why you got passed up and demoted. I think even unreasonable managers would give you some kind of answer. Obviously you want to phrase it as so you can improve yourself.
Having "friends" in higher places even if its in places you don't know about makes all the difference in the world. Seniority even if it didn't seem like that was taken into account. Obviously the likability etc etc.
No job place will pass you up for being white because they were scared of a black person suing them if they have as easy tracked job metrics like you are saying. Especially if the difference was as large as you are insinuating.
What it all comes back down to is that you HAVE to ask why were passed up. Even if its a bullshit excuse they have to give you something and maybe it might give you a hint towards why.
Half and half
Member
Do you spill the beans in real life like you do in this thread? You should focus on that first before looking to blame others.
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